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SidDithers

(44,228 posts)
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 12:56 PM Jan 2018

The bizarre rise and dramatic fall of Louise Mensch and her Blue Detectives

https://thinkprogress.org/blue-detectives-collapse-trump-russia-a42a94537bdf/

A year ago, as Donald Trump prepared to take office, a new crop of self-proclaimed investigators burst forth to unspool the Russian conspiracy they claim launched Trump into the White House. Leaning on Twitter as their preferred platform, these voices worked to unwind the Kremlin ties that, in their mind, cost Hillary Clinton the election.

Led by British gadfly Louise Mensch (269,000 followers on Twitter currently) and going by a handful of names and hashtags — including #TeamPatriot — this coterie largely avoided any kind of original reportage, instead opting to try to piece together open-source information that they believed journalists elsewhere had overlooked. In the early days of the Trump administration, they were, as BuzzFeed’s Charlie Warzel wrote, a “mooring force” for the anti-Trump “Resistance.” With Mensch’s 2017 op-ed in the New York Times on Russian hacking, this group — which Warzel termed the “Blue Detectives” — appeared ascendant.

A year on, though, the group is in tatters, roundly mocked by experts on Russian-American relations, ignored by Special Counsel Robert Mueller and his staff, and barreling quickly toward irrelevance. Where these “Blue Detectives” once looked like they may unearth some kind of smoking gun linking Trump and the Kremlin — or could at least help fill in certain missing pieces of the puzzle — they are now as derided, and derisive, as their earliest critics pegged them. They have become, as Deadspin noted, “the InfoWars of the left.”

At the outset of the Trump presidency, this crew looked like it might have something to add to the conversation: on national security, on America’s degraded democracy. But one year later, they look little better than their target in the White House — especially when it come to peddling the conspiracy theories that provide comfort to both ends of the political spectrum.


Malcolm Nance had her pegged from the very beginning.

Sid
43 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The bizarre rise and dramatic fall of Louise Mensch and her Blue Detectives (Original Post) SidDithers Jan 2018 OP
It is a shame she/they fooled so many without any shred of proof for their tall tales. LonePirate Jan 2018 #1
Wait a sec. There is a huge conspiracy with the Russians. We do know that. Mueller is not... brush Jan 2018 #37
This Just In: Russian Funding of Mensch Fake News Group Uncovered MineralMan Jan 2018 #2
:) Good but you forget to include the typical two names to Hortensis Jan 2018 #31
#TeamPillowForts is one of the best hashtags ever. demmiblue Jan 2018 #3
Umm. Claude Taylor's been on an amazing one man mission to elect local & State Dems Wwcd Jan 2018 #4
Fraude is a grifter... didn't read beyond the title. n/t demmiblue Jan 2018 #8
Well that's your problem right there then Wwcd Jan 2018 #9
Lol... still didn't read beyond the title. demmiblue Jan 2018 #13
Proved the article premise with their idiotic response grantcart Jan 2018 #18
you no credibilty gabeana Jan 2018 #29
Not a fan of Mench myself, but this is a spurious argument.... dixiegrrrrl Jan 2018 #21
This is a narrative being pushed by pro-Trumpers triron Jan 2018 #27
Joy calls out BULLSHITE.. She's Brilliant. Cha Jan 2018 #36
Duncan Black (Atrios) also had her pegged. He knew of her from when he lived in the UK. Demit Jan 2018 #5
Russia publishes its Top Ten Global List of anti-Putinists L. Coyote Jan 2018 #6
The Kremlin went after Mensch & her fellow independents Wwcd Jan 2018 #11
Wow, glad that many DUers were dubious flamingdem Jan 2018 #7
And so many fell for her nonsense. I was amazed. Tipperary Jan 2018 #10
And the rest fell for MSM's corporate investors Wwcd Jan 2018 #12
yep triron Jan 2018 #28
OTOH, Michael Flynn Jr. hates Mensch and loves the Think Progress article in the OP. pnwmom Jan 2018 #34
She's a bloody Tory. Why would I believe her? n/t mwooldri Jan 2018 #22
Yep, and a fan of Toby Young: demmiblue Jan 2018 #43
Including Seth Abramson tammywammy Jan 2018 #14
Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2018 #15
Who were you before? uppityperson Jan 2018 #38
Shocked to hear that! When did that happen? marble falls Jan 2018 #39
This story looks long in mockery and short in specifics. pnwmom Jan 2018 #16
Thats my take on it. The NRA crap may be a very imprtant thing. The Russians certainly don't ... marble falls Jan 2018 #19
I just found an early tweet of Mensch's about Clarke in Russia -- dated February 2017. pnwmom Jan 2018 #20
Good stuff - did you see this? Echoes what Mensch said almost a year ago....... marble falls Jan 2018 #23
Good catch. Kingofalldems Jan 2018 #24
either did I gabeana Jan 2018 #32
Thanks Sid grantcart Jan 2018 #17
What does "ignored by Special Counsel Robert Mueller and his staff" mean? More_Cowbell Jan 2018 #25
+1 uponit7771 Jan 2018 #42
yeah, i'm to the point when i'm on a jury lapfog_1 Jan 2018 #26
Should stick to posting possibly overlooked open source info Bradical79 Jan 2018 #30
You and Michael Flynn Jr. both like that same Think Progress article. pnwmom Jan 2018 #33
The writer of that article, Casey Michel, has an interesting background. pnwmom Jan 2018 #35
Yeah but she was right a couple times so, ya know, that makes her like, credible or something. progressoid Jan 2018 #40
Their Target In The WH Me. Jan 2018 #41

brush

(53,978 posts)
37. Wait a sec. There is a huge conspiracy with the Russians. We do know that. Mueller is not...
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 06:33 PM
Jan 2018

just whistling Dixie. Let's see what he reveals.

Not saying Mensch was correct on the details but on the big picture, yes.

MineralMan

(146,351 posts)
2. This Just In: Russian Funding of Mensch Fake News Group Uncovered
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 01:01 PM
Jan 2018

Details to be released second Tuesday of next week.

demmiblue

(36,920 posts)
3. #TeamPillowForts is one of the best hashtags ever.
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 01:22 PM
Jan 2018
to Malcolm Nance!

It is really discouraging to see these people and their tweets seriously discussed on DU. Mensch, Counterchekist, Schindler, Claude Taylor, Rick Wilson, Dena Grayson, Palmer, etc. I also question Joy (still love her show) giving Dworkin face time.
 

Wwcd

(6,288 posts)
4. Umm. Claude Taylor's been on an amazing one man mission to elect local & State Dems
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 01:44 PM
Jan 2018

Last edited Sat Jan 20, 2018, 02:18 PM - Edit history (1)

I have no idea who wrote this bullshit but they seriously have not followed the group.

The bashing has been going on since they began their campaign against Wiki, Russia, & Trump.

They have bedn doxxed & trolled & botted besause of who they have taken on.

Unless this author is reading & has been following these people daily from the beginning, then they have ZERO credibility and it becomes suspect just who they are in it for.

This is just another in the long line of those who don't want the anti Kremlin /Trump message known.

Oddly, it was twice now that even Joy Reid & Malcome Nance, has reported 'breaking news' only to have already read that news reported by those you mention above.

Yes. They outed the story & damned if MSNBC didn't report it as their own later on.
Go figure.
They asked MSNBC/Joy Reid to credit them with the report since they broke it, but no.

The issue here is that MSM is regulated as to what is allowed to be said on air. They have a Corporation to answer to afterall.

The amazing indepents of this twitter group, do not. They answer to each other.

That is why MSM would like to control what they report.
Not happening.
They are a great group of independents, and I'll stick with their reporting more than I'll bet on the sanitized news of MSM that gleefully gave us Donald Trump, cuz, well the profit margin soared!!$$$$

Sounds like another hit job to me from Corporate cash against the independent reporters.

Believe what you want. I refuse to be taken in solely by MSM's cash cow.

 

Wwcd

(6,288 posts)
9. Well that's your problem right there then
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 02:28 PM
Jan 2018

Don't bash what you know nothing about & refuse to find out for yourselves.

MSM couldn't give Trump enough coverage.
Why on earth would now I believe they're suddenly on the side of our nation's survival.

This thread is a hit job against anyone but MSM & their cash cow.

I'll stick to the unsanitized news media & do enough research & trust my own feee thinking before I buy the lying self serving$$$ MSM ever again.
We have this disaster Admin because the media refused to do what the independents did.

Money & Media. You live by it if you choose to.. I don't have to.
I saw enough of how the bull sh of MSM played us in 2016.

Later..



gabeana

(3,166 posts)
29. you no credibilty
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 04:37 PM
Jan 2018

just like those reviewers on amazon that rip a book without even reading it, because the desired political agenda is a odds

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
21. Not a fan of Mench myself, but this is a spurious argument....
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 03:36 PM
Jan 2018

I find Mensch to be off the wall and have difficulty understanding the way she writes..not her ideas as much as her thought process. have not followed her much. She has a lot of critics..

However, this criticism seems biased:

Mensch — called a “conspiracy queen” by the Daily Beast, and a prolific romance lit writer — has no background in Russian studies, nor a “degree in any subject that would grant her anything close to expertise on Russian politics.”

the same could be said of MSM news readers.

Russian studies and degrees in Russian are hardly needed to understand why Trump firing Comey was a legal problem for him,
or why we needed a special prosecutor, etc.

so I looked to see why Casey Michel would focus on that, and found this:

He writes for the Hudson institute, a rather powerful conservative think tank that has people like Scooter Libby, Alexander Haig, Kissinger, Robert Bork, etc. connected to it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hudson_Institute

as well as
the Harriman Institute, the first academic center in the United States devoted to the interdisciplinary study of Russia and the Soviet Union, was founded at Columbia University in 1946, with the support of the Rockefeller Foundation, as the Russian Institute.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harriman_Institute

So his bias is showing in his comment about people who do not have his background being unreliable writers.

Josh Marshall over at TPM does a lot of investigative writing, has no Russian Studies background. Guess his take on RussiaGate
is not valid either.

L. Coyote

(51,129 posts)
6. Russia publishes its Top Ten Global List of anti-Putinists
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 01:47 PM
Jan 2018



FBI has FISA warrant for Trump secret server connected to Russia.

........... http://heatst.com/world/exclusive-fbi-granted-fisa-warrant-covering-trump-camps-ties-to-russia/
By Louise Mensch | 10:18 pm, November 7, 2016

Two separate sources with links to the counter-intelligence community have confirmed to Heat Street that the FBI sought, and was granted, a FISA court warrant in October, giving counter-intelligence permission to examine the activities of ‘U.S. persons’ in Donald Trump’s campaign with ties to Russia.

Contrary to earlier reporting in the New York Times, which cited FBI sources as saying that the agency did not believe that the private server in Donald Trump’s Trump Tower which was connected to a Russian bank had any nefarious purpose, the FBI’s counter-intelligence arm, sources say, re-drew an earlier FISA court request around possible financial and banking offenses related to the server. The first request, which, sources say, named Trump, was denied back in June, but the second was drawn more narrowly and was granted in October after evidence was presented of a server, possibly related to the Trump campaign, and its alleged links to two banks; SVB Bank and Russia’s Alfa Bank. While the Times story speaks of metadata, sources suggest that a FISA warrant was granted to look at the full content of emails and other related documents that may concern US persons.

The FBI agents who talked to the New York Times, and rubbished the ground-breaking stories of Slate ( Franklin Foer) and Mother Jones (David Corn) may not have known about the FISA warrant, sources say, because the counter-intelligence and criminal sides of the FBI often work independently of each other employing the principle of ‘compartmentalization’.

............
 

Wwcd

(6,288 posts)
11. The Kremlin went after Mensch & her fellow independents
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 02:43 PM
Jan 2018

..via Assange etc and she's got the trail linking their trolls back to the Kremlin sources.

As do all the others listed above.

Why, for the life of me, would anyone speak for the MSM, who are also connected to bought by their corporate owners & investors.

I'll sstick with these independents who have given us far more intel than we've gotten from MSM in the last 3 years.

There is a certain reason this group was targeted & discredited by the Kremlin and fking Assange.

People would know this had they followed what was taking place on their twitter accts.

They certainly were a threat to MSM's sanitization of the news by their corporate owners & investors.

They all made a fortune by their 24/7 promotion of Putin's pick, Donald Trump.

No wonder this group was so targeted.
It was because they opened the door to Putin's coup & have never let up.

MSM owns the fake news award for their roll in 2016.
Not the members of the group that gave us an insight as to what dangers lay ahead for this country.

MSM is $$$$ & beholden to their corporate investors.
They proved their credibility in 2016.

Thanks for your post

flamingdem

(39,342 posts)
7. Wow, glad that many DUers were dubious
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 01:50 PM
Jan 2018

since when in the desert everything looks like water. We wanted someone in the know. The ruskies understand way too much about American political mentalities.

 

Wwcd

(6,288 posts)
12. And the rest fell for MSM's corporate investors
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 02:45 PM
Jan 2018

2016, proved their credibility.
24/7 Trump.

Amazing how many still defend the fortunes made by that propaganda for profit business..

tammywammy

(26,582 posts)
14. Including Seth Abramson
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 02:59 PM
Jan 2018
Over the past few months, other outlets have begun picking up the ball and voicing their criticism of Abramson. For Fast Company, Abramson “operates… [by] making grand generalizations about news already reported, but misconstruing even the easiest-to-understand parts in the name of an ideological goal.” For Slate, “[Abramson’s] schtick is less credulous fabulism than hyperbolic sleight of hand.” And for the Washington Post, “Abramson’s tweets link copiously to sources, but they range in quality from investigative news articles to off-the-wall Facebook posts and tweets from Tom Arnold. The New Republic and Atlantic have both dismissed the professor as a conspiracy theorist.” GQ, Deadspin. The Outline, and Vice have also publicly called out Abramson’s conspiracy-mongering.

When it comes to Abramson’s continued ability to land media appearances — as opposed to Mensch — Weindling pointed to Abramson’s willingness to bend facts to fit his narrative, rather than craft new realities wholesale.

“As far as why [Abramson] has outlasted Mensch, he gets basic details in stories wrong where it’s easy to muddy the waters, while she says that the Grand Wizard of the Supreme Court is going to execute Steve Bannon,” Weindling told ThinkProgress. “My hope is… that he’s been taken for the spectacle that he is, rather than the reporter that he claims to be.”


Good article.

Response to SidDithers (Original post)

pnwmom

(109,025 posts)
16. This story looks long in mockery and short in specifics.
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 03:12 PM
Jan 2018

For one thing, it conflates the work of three different people, and Seth Abramson has nothing to do with the other two, other than that he posts on Twitter. He is the only one who claims to use only open-source information for his stories. Mensch and Taylor have done original reporting. Taylor has claimed to have US sources and Mensch, who was an MP in Britain, claims British sources.

The article accuses Mensch of being duped by the same hoaxer as Taylor, though she wasn't. She says she only has used sources she personally knows and they are British, not American.

And this story comes just after McClatchy reported on the connection of the NRA, Sheriff Clarke, and the Russians -- something Louise Mensch reported on several months ago. Interesting that someone would want to discredit her now.

marble falls

(57,555 posts)
19. Thats my take on it. The NRA crap may be a very imprtant thing. The Russians certainly don't ...
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 03:20 PM
Jan 2018

anything like the NRA, why would they be so interested in the NRA?

pnwmom

(109,025 posts)
20. I just found an early tweet of Mensch's about Clarke in Russia -- dated February 2017.
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 03:27 PM
Jan 2018

It took the rest of the media a while to catch on, and they still haven't forgiven her.












And she wrote this in December 2017 -- weeks before the McClatchy story came out -- based on her June reporting on Patribotics.



More_Cowbell

(2,192 posts)
25. What does "ignored by Special Counsel Robert Mueller and his staff" mean?
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 04:17 PM
Jan 2018

How would the author know? What indications would Mueller and his staff have given? I haven't seen them mention any members of the media. And I wouldn't expect them to.



lapfog_1

(29,243 posts)
26. yeah, i'm to the point when i'm on a jury
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 04:27 PM
Jan 2018

on someone pushing her fairy tales, I'm inclined to hide it.

 

Bradical79

(4,490 posts)
30. Should stick to posting possibly overlooked open source info
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 04:47 PM
Jan 2018

They're rather shit when it comes to connecting the dots or any attempt at actual original reporting.

pnwmom

(109,025 posts)
35. The writer of that article, Casey Michel, has an interesting background.
Sat Jan 20, 2018, 06:05 PM
Jan 2018

He also writes for the conservative Hudson Institute -- and he has lived in the former Soviet Union, where he was also a journalist.

I would take anything he said about Mensch with a shaker full of salt.




https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hudson_Institute

Hudson Institute

The Hudson Institute is a politically conservative,[6] 501(c)(3) non-profit American think tank based in Washington, D.C. It was founded in 1961[1] in Croton-on-Hudson, New York, by futurist, military strategist, and systems theorist Herman Kahn and his colleagues at the RAND Corporation.

According to its website, the Institute is committed to innovative research and analysis that promotes "global security, prosperity and freedom."[7] It promotes public policy change in accordance with its stated belief that "America's unique and central role in the global system offers the best foundation for security, the defense of liberty, and assuring economic growth."[
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