god damn these people. Howard was a great guy. I sure would've voted for him.

Last edited Sun Jun 10, 2018, 02:04 PM - Edit history (1)

Gosh he was so fired up and rolling. ugh. He was my guy! We were on a roll. Egggayhhh!!! F YEah. We've been robbed thrice since they screwed Gore in 2000. We beat them in landslides when they count the votes.

the he would look at preventing media consolidation. The media companies' owners were terrified, I'm told.

And the only excuse they needed. We could run the Pope as a candidate and they would find fault.

Trump could kill Comey AND rape a teenager and they wouldn't care.

He could shoot Comey and rape the Pope, and they would STILL love him.

...he’s already done one of those things..

Which is why I said it. They have no morals and do not care one bit about what he does.

And it's still stupid people who are supporting trump. We still haven't learned to question what is on TV, social media, etc.

the truth but it didn’t fit everyone else’s narrative so it was squashed.

Anyone who cared would have seen that.

..... to the "Movers" and "Job Creator" class. So they waited for some excuse to present itself, blew it all out of proportion, had their minions in the media magnify and amplify the non-issue. Which sought to put Dean in the unbalanced/unstable category, and harped on this issue incessantly until he was washed up. They went so far as to manipulate the scream video to make it appear way way worse than it really was.

Presto-changeo the populous candidate Dean threat to the status quo and TPTB faded away to become a non-threat like magic. He was successfully block from ever being on the ballot for US President because it was feared he would rock the boat with policies in the favor of the lower and middle classes, to the detriment of the rich and extremely rich classes.

Poof - with the media under their control they could engineer by design for the threat to disappear. Bye-bye Dr. Dean.

Perception Management and Political Propaganda are powerful tools that can be easily weaponized and are the bane of a vibrant Democracy. Think Cambridge Analytica about ways the political landscape can be manipulated to achieve specific desired results by deceptive and stealth means. Fascist realize this and are eager to exploit this weakness to the detriment and ultimate continuance of our Democracy.

Some people dig that.

and it's powerful impact on very easily manipulated, non thinking Americans.

Dean is terrific; some years back I met him at a small political affair.

he used to travel the country stumping for dems all the way down the ticket.
he is a great guy. the whole thing was amazing, including how many here jumped on the bandwagon to hell.

and Dems. god knows...

Many people here hate Chris Matthews but sometimes he blurts out something that's the honest truth.

I remember in 2012 I think, Chris asked why ex-Dem. pres. candidates are not reused- but sent 'out to pasture' so to speak. Meaning talent like Gore, Dean and others, while the GOP keeps trotting out the same clown car year after year. What a shame and stupid practice...

dfa continues to do good work in a lot of places.
and i love to see him on the teevee machine.

but it would have been great to have him run again. for something.

who should be more visible, and on TV as you say. Dean has the forcefulness, background and charisma needed to hold office for sure.

it was neat to see the clip from inside the hall he was speaking and how you literally couldnt even hear him there. To people there they had no idea what happened. And I've often thought about that in the era of Trump. How he supposedly didnt have the "temperament" to be Pres and this scream fit the image of him being cast as short tempered and a little nuts.Here's the video that ESPN did on it.
[link:http://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=14697936|

He tried to go “scorched earth” on Kerry after that, which in my humble opinion alienated him from primary voters.

Honestly I am more troubled by the alleged “progressives” who continuously smear him currently. I wish he was DNC chair today. But no, they had to smear a solid outspoken Dem as an “evil neon-liberal corporoapparatus” or whatever the jargon catchphrase of the day is.

JMHO, YMMV

It's hard to recover from that.

They are the ones that railroad liberal Senators out of power and destroy democratic candidates while a dangerous demagogue like Shitler get a pass on his LIFETIME of lies, corruption and racism!

For reasons most on here know.

I will state that Howard freely admits he and his team in 2004 "didn't know what the hell we were doing." His was a fast on-the-job learning experience as DNC chair, and he was by far the most effective one we have had since--an unbeatable combination of intellect and dynamism. He said in 2015 that by now he felt he could do the job (of president) perfectly well, but was too old for it (he was 67 then--will be 70 this November), and besides, Judy had pretty much put her foot down in his having a job with full time national/international responsibilities any more. That is one of the reason he threw in with Hillary early. He was uncomfortable with her age, but saw no one else on the horizon at the time he made his decision. Who knows what might have occurred if O'Malley had reached out to Howard earlier, but he didn't, and that was that.

Howard was always a family man, and he respects his responsibilities as a husband/father far more than he lets on publicly (he'd rather talk policy when the cameras are on). He feels his time as a candidate for national office has passed, and he is perfectly content to do exactly what he said in February 2009 that he'd be doing: raising hell for causes he believes in, and they are many. He was invited to the 2009 Davos conference as a speaker on environmental issues, for example. I wonder how many people here know he organized and participated in a march from Bangkok to the Burmese border to call attention to human trafficking? He's doing just what he said he'd do. Typical Howard. I take him at his word that he won't run, and I believe him, but DAMN I would have loved it if he changed his mind.

Did he call for publicly funded elections, or for equal time law to be reinstated, or what was it?

At the time it was clear that they took him down for that, at least to me.

And now in a Cheeto haze I don’t remember what it was.

If there were no scream, the two stories would have been Dean's implosion and Kerry's win -- instead of Dean's scream and Kerry's win. Kerry still would have gotten the lift he needed to win NH.

I was in Iowa then and of course followed the race closely. Dean fizzled out and Kerry kicked ass.

..but I believe he could have made a comeback....if the media had not driven the "scream" over the cliff...

Belittle him and take him out.

media to cow them into believing things are a bigger deal than than they are. The same thing happened in the "touching" controversy involving Sen Franken. Dems are easily swayed into shooting themselves in the foot...

Thank you very much, Howard Dean, for that little yell. I reckon it scared many a slavery-loving reb, during the Civil War.

Not a sex scandal. Not collusion with Russians. Not bragging about being a sexual predator. Plagiarism of a speech.

the media works against the Democrats and for the Rs at every opportunity.

Kerry got 38%, Edwards got 30%, Dean got 18%.

Imagine there was no Dean scream, the topic of the evening would have been alternating between Kerry's unexpected to the national media win and Dean's implosion. Instead .. it alternated between the Dean scream and Kerry's win - with more on Dean. I don't think the difference changed anything.

In NH, Dean's numbers had gone down when Wes Clark joined the race. Shortly before Iowa, Wes Clark imploded and his supporters mostly went to either Kerry or to undecided. Like any win in Iowa, Kerry was helped by that in NH. In some cases, he won many people who liked him for years, but bought the media common wisdom that he would likely drop out after losing Iowa and NH. If you looked at the Dean numbers in NH, it is not that he lost those supporting him -- it is that he gained almost none of the large undecided vote. It went to Kerry and Dean lost.

To make matters worse, before Iowa, Dean had by far the most money -- even after Kerry lent his campaign $6 million. However, his campaign went through that money like water in Iowa and NH - and ended with little to show for it. Given that situation, after Iowa, Dean decided to gamble that Kerry would do poorly in the upcoming multiple race Tuesday - with DE, AR, NM, MO, SC, OK and ND. Dean announced he would NOT actively work that set of state's that were hard for New Englanders, and concentrate on later races. Had Clark and Edwards split those events, there would be no real frontrunner. This would allow Dean to become that leader by winning the next group of states.

However, Kerry won 5 of the 7 - losing SC to Edwards and OK to a Clark, who narrowly beat Edwards (both had 30%) and Kerry 27%. Those results made Kerry even more the front runner.

Blaming the scream - which Dean himself doesn't - ignores that Kerry ran a fantastic primary race - winning with very little media support.

Just before his acceptance speech the Microphone was switched out for a Noise Canceling Mike.

...Gary Hart got set up with Donna Rice sitting on his lap. On a boat called the Monkey Business...

it was ON PURPOSE by the MEdia.

to a presidential candidate who admits to sexually assaulting women and getting away with it, and it does not hurt him one iota.

May have even INCREASED his support.

were different then, it will be interesting to see if there is anything unacceptable in future campaigns.

A circus peanut reality star can talk about his dick and grabbing pussy and "win" the election. Oh, yeah. That happened honestly.

In doing so

Kerry was one of the most liberal members of the Senate. Iowa Democratic caucuses tend to go for the more left candidates. That’s what happened that year as well.

Dean is great but let’s stay fact based.

The first presidential candidacy cruelly destroyed by a meme.

The Dean Scream: What Really Happened
By FiveThirtyEight
FEB. 4, 2016
http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-dean-scream-what-really-happened/

Twelve years ago, just after the 2004 Iowa caucuses, Democratic candidate Howard Dean raised his voice, balled his fist and entered political history as a man whose immoderate speaking style cost him a career. That’s the accepted narrative, at least, of what happened in that year’s presidential race. But the truth is not always what the crowd remembers. In this short film, produced by FiveThirtyEight and ESPN Films and directed by Bryan Storkel, Dean and others who know the race well recall what really happened. It’s the first film in this year’s FiveThirtyEight Elections series. And be sure to listen to the companion podcast documentary about why the Dean Scream sounded so different on TV.

did our side just lay down and let the whole organization go under? Because it made the white wingers mad and we can't ever fight back?

The yell was an easy excuse (Nb . - I’ve heard him talk about this and he doesn’t blame a rigged sound system). Dean’s problem was that he ran a lousy campaign the couldn’t turn rally crowds into voters. He came in a mediocre third in Iowa before the Scream, and they following weekend I was in New Hampshire and could see his campaign team disn’t Have it’s act together.

People on the ground in Iowa reported there was little direction and volunteers were left to their own devices and were freelancing.

Then it was on to New Hampshire where polls consistently showed Kerry in the lead. Dean lost there too.

I think to say that Dean was forced out with one "Yeee-Haw!" is inaccurate and ignores the problems the Dean campaign foisted upon itself.

I was a member of the Dean forum from when there was great excitement and hope and watched that change to anguish and disillusionment. I was one of the few left at the forum when one day the lights went out.