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RDANGELO

(3,435 posts)
Sun Jan 19, 2020, 01:46 AM Jan 2020

I read the managers report to the Senate, and then I read Trumps lawyers report.

The managers report took me about an hour to read. It makes a strong case and is very detailed. Trump's report took me at the most 15 minutes to read. It is full of bluster with very little to substantiate it. They start out by calling the impeachment an attempt to overturn the election of 2016. No, it is an attempt to hold Trump accountable for his actions. Since the current rules of the DOJ are that a sitting president cannot be indicted, it is the only way to do so.

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I read the managers report to the Senate, and then I read Trumps lawyers report. (Original Post) RDANGELO Jan 2020 OP
point of order Grasswire2 Jan 2020 #1
And a memo never tested in court. Pacifist Patriot Jan 2020 #10
yes nt Grasswire2 Jan 2020 #12
I read part of Trump's lawyers' report..... Sogo Jan 2020 #2
Self respecting is a relative term. Caliman73 Jan 2020 #3
And his lawyers are looking forward to a lifetime of wingnut welfare LastDemocratInSC Jan 2020 #4
I'm sure he was looking over their shoulders while they were writing it. RDANGELO Jan 2020 #7
As An Attorney, I Can Tell You That Most Of The Time, You Are At The Whim Of Your Client ChoppinBroccoli Jan 2020 #15
So, no president can ever be impeached because it will overturn the results LastLiberal in PalmSprings Jan 2020 #5
Good point! BigmanPigman Jan 2020 #6
Isn't What Trump Did In 2016 With The Help Of The Russians..... global1 Jan 2020 #8
Since Trump got 3M votes LESS than Clinton, DeminPennswoods Jan 2020 #9
Further -- look at it from this aspect. Grasswire2 Jan 2020 #14
That does not support their Hunter Biden angle either Generic Brad Jan 2020 #11
drumpf's team could submit the script of Ishtar......... Takket Jan 2020 #13
Spam deleted by MIR Team Prenticee Jan 2020 #16

Grasswire2

(13,571 posts)
1. point of order
Sun Jan 19, 2020, 01:50 AM
Jan 2020

It isn't a DoJ "rule" that prevents the indictment of a sitting president, but simply a memo.

Sogo

(5,006 posts)
2. I read part of Trump's lawyers' report.....
Sun Jan 19, 2020, 01:52 AM
Jan 2020

It sounded like something he would have dictated to them. I found myself wondering how any self-respecting attorney would put his name on such an idiotic document.

Caliman73

(11,755 posts)
3. Self respecting is a relative term.
Sun Jan 19, 2020, 02:04 AM
Jan 2020

They get a big paycheck and they are touted as "geniuses and heroes" by a small but very vocal group of people. To some people, that imparts at least a semblance of respectability.

I agree that the statement is vacuous and ridiculous, but they likely justify it through ideology and the support they get from inside the bubble.

RDANGELO

(3,435 posts)
7. I'm sure he was looking over their shoulders while they were writing it.
Sun Jan 19, 2020, 05:44 AM
Jan 2020

It is all his logic put into writing by someone who has that ability.

ChoppinBroccoli

(3,784 posts)
15. As An Attorney, I Can Tell You That Most Of The Time, You Are At The Whim Of Your Client
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:36 AM
Jan 2020

Now, most GOOD attorneys know how to explain things to their client in such a way that leaves no doubt that even though I represent YOU, and YOU make the final call on most matters, you hired me for my experience and expertise, and I strongly suggest you trust my judgment on this one. However, when you've got an egomaniac like Trump as a client, who I'm absolutely CERTAIN thinks he knows more than everyone in the world (including his own lawyers), he probably demanded that they include that stupid language.

That's the thing when you represent someone: you work for them and do what they tell you to do. If they demand to take the stand over your objection, they take stand. The only way you can refuse to do what a client asks is if it violates the law and/or ethical/professional standards, in which case you need to withdraw as counsel. In purely tactical and strategic disputes, the client always has the final say.

So I'm guessing that language is in the report because Trump's ego demanded it be included. Or maybe it's simply all they've got to hang their hats on.

5. So, no president can ever be impeached because it will overturn the results
Sun Jan 19, 2020, 02:51 AM
Jan 2020

of the previous election. It's good to know the Founding Fathers didn't consider that unintended consequence when they drafted the Constitution.

global1

(25,285 posts)
8. Isn't What Trump Did In 2016 With The Help Of The Russians.....
Sun Jan 19, 2020, 05:59 AM
Jan 2020

Last edited Sun Jan 19, 2020, 08:28 AM - Edit history (1)

a brazen and successful attempt to overturn the election results? Wasn't he attempting to do the same in 2020 only this time with the help of the Ukrainians and the Chinese?

Bottom line - wasn't what Trump did - the depriving Americans of their votes? And from a Party that is very adept at voter suppression; cheating and stealing of votes; gerrymandering districts and other shenanigans on the day Americans vote.

DeminPennswoods

(15,292 posts)
9. Since Trump got 3M votes LESS than Clinton,
Sun Jan 19, 2020, 06:59 AM
Jan 2020

he wasn't actually elected by Americans who voted, but by a quirk of the Electoral College.

Grasswire2

(13,571 posts)
14. Further -- look at it from this aspect.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:17 AM
Jan 2020

48.3 percent of total votes cast were for Hillary.

5.7 percent of total votes cast were for OTHERS (Stein, Bernie, write-ins)

Total of the two is 54 percent of the total votes

54 percent voted AGAINST TRUMP

And that 54 percent were disenfranchised by his Russian-aided manipulation of Electoral College

Generic Brad

(14,276 posts)
11. That does not support their Hunter Biden angle either
Sun Jan 19, 2020, 09:52 AM
Jan 2020

If this is about overturning the 2016 elections, how does the phony claim that Hunter Biden enriched himself courtesy of his family name contribute to that? Their logic escapes me - most likely because there is none.

Takket

(21,655 posts)
13. drumpf's team could submit the script of Ishtar.........
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:15 AM
Jan 2020

and the rethugs wouldn't even notice, because they won't be reading it, just voting to acquit.

Even if they did read it they would agree with using the script saying the Democrats argument is so absurd it doesn't deserve to be dignified with a response.

Response to RDANGELO (Original post)

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