General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsGov Cumo said it best: Violence obscures the righteousness of the message
onetexan
(13,074 posts)gratuitous
(82,849 posts)If it's violence, that's their excuse for not listening. If it's taking a knee during the national anthem, that's their excuse. People who don't want to hear the message always have an excuse. Jesus called it two thousand years ago: Luke 7:33-35.
Blasphemer
(3,261 posts)StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)still_one
(92,481 posts)demosincebirth
(12,549 posts)still_one
(92,481 posts)those people who will be out of work because the business where they worked is burned to the ground, sure feel they deserved what they got coming
gratuitous
(82,849 posts)Was it those demonstrating against George Floyd's murder, or some folks who came to stir up trouble? Because there is a lot of video evidence running around that it was undercover cop provocateurs and white supremacists. Make sure you're holding the right folks responsible for creating the breakdowns.
still_one
(92,481 posts)Caliman73
(11,756 posts)His business was burned to the ground and he said, "Let my business burn, we need justice".
I am not getting why people are having such a difficult time understanding the situation.
I haven't seen anyone who is a serious person, cheering on the destruction that is taking place. What I have seen is people in rage, hurt, feeling voiceless and powerless, doing things irrationally to express those feelings.
I have also seen people taking advantage of a tense and difficult situation, trying to provoke and stoke up racial animus AND trying to blame Black people for their own abuse and for that irrational expression.
I have not seen people saying that people whose businesses were destroyed, "had it coming".
People want to see the violence end. No one wants people to burn down their own communities.
We also need to stop watching from the sidelines, scolding people and judging them, especially for experiences that many of us have not had in this society. Saying that it isn't "politically expedient" or "it doesn't help ... message"
If they don't react, then good, they can just keep killing them. If they protest peacefully, they find a way to dismiss them of fuck with them. If they protest violently, well then they are just animals and need to be put down. There is NO way in this society that Black and Brown people can express their anger and need for justice, that isn't going to be criticized by the people who want them to just shut the fuck up and stay in their place.
They need justice and it is up to those of us with more privilege and power to help them achieve it. It isn't up to them to "ask nicely, in a way that we approve of".
still_one
(92,481 posts)I am sure that one person represents all the businesses
Caliman73
(11,756 posts)Looting and some of the property destruction are definitely not part of the protest and I will say again, no one is saying that they are positive things.
It is good that protesters like the gentleman from the story and people like Killer Mike are trying to work from within the communities to quell the situation and call out the bad actors.
When people feel heard or they have expressed their rage, then the protests will end and the rebuilding can begin.
Like I said and will keep saying. People like us who are removed from the situation, who don't live in fear of police killing us daily, who are watching and judging, and telling people how they should be protesting or expressing themselves, that is what is irritating me.
I can see how violence is not "tactically" a good thing. How it "reinforces" stereotypes. How it "might give Trump something to run on"
I have also been close enough to situations with authority figures abusing their power, to know that getting "no justice" made me want to wreck things, though I have never been so powerless and held down to think that it was the only way I could express that rage. That is MY privilege, so I am not judging people with less privilege and power than myself.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)cayugafalls
(5,646 posts)It is a sad and disturbing reality that it has happened. A lot of the violence has been spurred on by outside instigators that have inflamed the angry youth and caused them to lash out at objects.
For decades they have had boots to the neck and bullets to the heart and they are tired and angry as well they should be. They are afraid when they walk to school, afraid when they walk home, afraid when they get pulled over...living afraid all the time that some white racist is going to end their life today.
These are just buildings and stuff, material things, and while I feel for the owners and people whose lives will be disrupted, I can understand the anger and frustration that leads to lashing out when coerced or manipulated by instigators.
I am not condoning the actions of the rioters. I am just trying to add perspective.
400 years...nothing has changed and the cockroaches have come out of the darkness and set their sights on Americas people of color and differing sexual orientation.
still_one
(92,481 posts)justice, not only for George Lloyd, but for all the African Americans who have not be treated fairly
cayugafalls
(5,646 posts)My son is deathly afraid of this country and the racist and homophobic people that inhabit it. He is angry and stands with all the protesters. While he does not approve of the violence and looting he understands it.
I know it clouds the message and so does my son, but last night when I was talking to him and he told me that he and his friends were so angry and afraid that they might die at any minute because someone does not like the color of their skin or their orientation, his voice was shaking and there were tears in his eyes.
Like that man who so eloquently said in the video you posted, "We just want to walk down the street not afraid..." I get it.
Thank you for your reply...
still_one
(92,481 posts)and BLM.
Of course we must fight against racism and bigotry in all forums
Voltaire2
(13,232 posts)cayugafalls
(5,646 posts)I heard that shouted from a building while watching a live stream...
Just saying.
rockfordfile
(8,708 posts)still_one
(92,481 posts)were already struggling to survive from the Covid crisis, are probably gone.
cayugafalls
(5,646 posts)A lot.
For two nights the police were virtually absent in Minneapolis. Not sure how you would arrest people who did the looting if you never saw them do it. Sure there might be cameras and such, but lots of masks and facial recognition is not all it has cracked up to be, especially if you are trying to identify people who have never been arrested before.
I am not condoning it, I am just pointing out what I saw.
rockfordfile
(8,708 posts)Sugarcoated
(7,735 posts)and it makes me very sad.
manhattan123
(302 posts)Every time a riot develops, it helps George Wallace.
malaise
(269,237 posts)400 years