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WiVoter

(946 posts)
Wed Apr 3, 2024, 10:50 PM Apr 3

Joyce Vance Thinks Jack Smith Has Already

Gone to the Solicitor General about Judge Loose Canon, and is ready to go with mandamus, so this is not an idle threat by Jack Smith.. (If that is the correct word to use. I’m not a legal expert or even close). He is waiting (not for long) for her to respond. Neal Katyal was on with her (I like him). He said if it goes to the 11 Circuit, they will make their decision fairly quickly. And even though it is rare for a solicitor general to go ahead with something like this, both Joyce & Neal said they think this will likely happen here (11th Circuit remove her from the case, based on their two earlier slap downs of Canon). When asked if this case could still happen before the fall election, Neil said it absolutely could.

Saw this on Lawrence O’Donnell with Ali Velshi filling in. Sorry for the amateur paraphrasing, but seeing this gave me a little hope.


Edited to add that it was mentioned that once a jury is seated, she could essentially end the case and set TSF free, and there would be nothing Jack Smith could do because of double jeopardy.

34 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Joyce Vance Thinks Jack Smith Has Already (Original Post) WiVoter Apr 3 OP
Thanks for the summary. I hope they are right. Nt spooky3 Apr 3 #1
Did you mean to post this twice? Nt Fiendish Thingy Apr 3 #2
No. I'll Fix That WiVoter Apr 3 #5
To delete a duplicated post, use the powers button. sheshe2 Apr 3 #9
Thank You WiVoter Apr 3 #10
You are welcome, WiVoter. sheshe2 Apr 3 #11
I jusy heard her say it. Joyce doesn't sensationalize. lindysalsagal Apr 3 #3
She really doesn't. She is always careful and I believe her too. onecaliberal Apr 4 #33
to seek 'authority' from solicitor general to seek mandamus order, elleng Apr 3 #4
Thank You WiVoter Apr 3 #6
I'd like to rewatch, to see if I think she and he have gone so far. elleng Apr 3 #8
Yes and because he put that in his filing is why Vance said he would have already discussed with Bev54 Apr 3 #12
Yes, thanks. elleng Apr 3 #13
Nice summary, thanks. UTUSN Apr 3 #7
Ditto, AverageOldGuy Apr 4 #14
Many people, including myself, are tired of Judge Canon acting like Donnie Trump is her boyfriend. chouchou Apr 4 #15
Right. H2O Man Apr 4 #17
Recommended. H2O Man Apr 4 #16
Double jeopardy VGuerra276 Apr 4 #18
I have been wondering why Saoirse9 Apr 4 #19
He Is Baiting Judge Merchan & Others WiVoter Apr 4 #20
Of course he is Saoirse9 Apr 4 #21
Thanks for sending me a smile and a sigh. Oopsie Daisy Apr 4 #22
By advocating for a defendant The Wizard Apr 4 #23
That last bit Alliepoo Apr 4 #24
This errant judge needs to be thrown out the courts, and in turn, charged w/ aiding and abetting crimes, by those SWBTATTReg Apr 4 #25
Jack must rattle her cage every chance he MOMFUDSKI Apr 4 #26
He may not do anything yet.... getagrip_already Apr 4 #27
So, let's say they remove Cannon. When would the "new" trial begin-- 2025, 2026, 2027? Silent Type Apr 4 #28
If Smith gets her removed, please, please, please BlueKota Apr 4 #29
I thank you for the synopsis. But boston bean Apr 4 #30
Same Here WiVoter Apr 4 #34
The issue is her asking the litigants their view on her asking the jury to interpret the law bucolic_frolic Apr 4 #31
There really needs to be a policy in place, Mr.Bill Apr 4 #32

WiVoter

(946 posts)
5. No. I'll Fix That
Wed Apr 3, 2024, 10:58 PM
Apr 3

Try to anyway. I don’t see the delete button. I’m not that much of a techie and I admit I’m a little embarrassed about that.

elleng

(131,854 posts)
4. to seek 'authority' from solicitor general to seek mandamus order,
Wed Apr 3, 2024, 10:58 PM
Apr 3

I think is the way it goes. I've never seen it, but never was in close proximity to such matters; hence I enjoy listening to these guys, with such experience.

WiVoter

(946 posts)
6. Thank You
Wed Apr 3, 2024, 11:02 PM
Apr 3

And Joyce seemed to think Jack Smith has already done that. I thought that was pretty interesting.

Bev54

(10,156 posts)
12. Yes and because he put that in his filing is why Vance said he would have already discussed with
Wed Apr 3, 2024, 11:44 PM
Apr 3

the solicitor general. Neal Katyal said they are rarely done and he only had one during his time (for all 50 states) and seems it was Joyce Vance's case. She said that the 11th circuit did remove the judge in that case, as they felt it is difficult for a judge to change their thinking when their order is overturned.

AverageOldGuy

(1,597 posts)
14. Ditto,
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 12:05 AM
Apr 4

My high-powered DC lawyer daughter had knee replacement Monday so I’m in her Capitol Hill townhouse with her for couple of weeks .

She said the same thing in response to Joyce Vance and Neil Katyl tonite. She thinks Smith is ready to go to the 11th circuit who will remove Judge Loose Cannon, replace her with real judge, and go to trial well before November .

chouchou

(700 posts)
15. Many people, including myself, are tired of Judge Canon acting like Donnie Trump is her boyfriend.
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 12:13 AM
Apr 4

Frankly, it wouldn't surprise me if Donnie has had words with her in the past few weeks.

H2O Man

(73,913 posts)
17. Right.
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 12:16 AM
Apr 4

I don't think the defendant communicates quite that openly though. By recently appearing in a court hearing he was not required to attend, he was sending a signal that if she is fully on his team, he will appoint her to the USSC. It would be an associate that communicated with her in a more direct manner.

H2O Man

(73,913 posts)
16. Recommended.
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 12:13 AM
Apr 4

Thank you for this.

I have great respect for Joyce Vance. And a high opinion of Lawrence. And a heck of a lot of people think that Mr. Smith has just put the case back on track.

VGuerra276

(21 posts)
18. Double jeopardy
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 01:01 AM
Apr 4

Once the jury is enpaneled, a judgement of dismissal by Loose Cannon means double jeopardy would attach and Bozo could not be retried. Jack Smith is smart.

Saoirse9

(3,698 posts)
19. I have been wondering why
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 12:38 PM
Apr 4

it took Smith so long to respond to Cannon’s batshit crazy jury instructions. Maybe the reason is that he was going to the solicitor first.

This is encouraging news thanks for posting.

WiVoter

(946 posts)
20. He Is Baiting Judge Merchan & Others
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 01:01 PM
Apr 4

That’s a fact. I’m sure there are a myriad of reasons why he’s doing that, with delay being the number one reason.

Saoirse9

(3,698 posts)
21. Of course he is
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 02:57 PM
Apr 4

He always has and always will.

He's like a machine. In capable of making rational decisions, even to protect himself. He will test the judges until they lock him up.

The Wizard

(12,577 posts)
23. By advocating for a defendant
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 04:43 PM
Apr 4

in a case where she presides she perverts the rule of law. But hey, it's OK if you're a Republican

Alliepoo

(2,248 posts)
24. That last bit
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 04:58 PM
Apr 4

About the jury being seated and Cannon dismissing the trial worries me. How in the world could she do that?

SWBTATTReg

(22,442 posts)
25. This errant judge needs to be thrown out the courts, and in turn, charged w/ aiding and abetting crimes, by those
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 05:56 PM
Apr 4

she favors. A judge is supposed to be impartial, equal footings and justice for ALL.

getagrip_already

(15,245 posts)
27. He may not do anything yet....
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 06:20 PM
Apr 4

He may not have even a good case for mandamus according to some.

Loosely defined, it's suing the judge to do her job and issue rulings she is required to issue.

Sure, she is kicking cans down the road, but is she at the point of legally being legally behind?

Dunno. Not a lawyer. But I'm not telling jack what he should do. I don't know jack.

BlueKota

(2,027 posts)
29. If Smith gets her removed, please, please, please
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 07:00 PM
Apr 4

let it happen, and the trial goes on, will it be effected by whatever the SC decides on the immunity issue?

I have heard some say it wouldn't have bearing on this document case because he was no longer President when he defied the law to return them and the SC is only deciding whether a President has full immunity while in office?

Is this correct?

bucolic_frolic

(43,841 posts)
31. The issue is her asking the litigants their view on her asking the jury to interpret the law
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 07:36 PM
Apr 4

She is the judge. She's supposed to know the law and explain what the law means. The jury has to sort the facts and see if they fit the law. As I understood all the tv explanations.

Mr.Bill

(24,438 posts)
32. There really needs to be a policy in place,
Thu Apr 4, 2024, 07:43 PM
Apr 4

or law if you prefer, that says no judge can preside over a case where the defendant is the one who appointed that judge. Sounds like that would just be common sense.

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