General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsIran did not attack Israel to cause damage.
They sent 300 missiles and drones. That's it. They telegraphed this 72 hours in advance. They could have used their proxies to send more than 30,000 missiles in with no notice from countries bordering Israel that would have taken way less time to get there and overwhelm their defense. This is a given. Israel could not defend against such an attack even with help from the US and others. Iran is our enemy but don't disregard what they can do to our allies in the ME.
rampartc
(5,421 posts)and for their allies/clients.
the entire event was probably well negotiated .
wnylib
(21,505 posts)is thoughtful, considerate, and polite. After they fund and arm three terrorist groups (Hamas, Hezbollah, and Houthis) to attack Israel, they are so nice that they don't use their full arsenal when they make direct strikes on Israel themselves. I suppose the Nobel peace prize for Iran is next and Putin will nominate them.
OTOH, a more realistic view is that Iran feared the consequences from the US and our allies if they launched those attacks or larger ones by surprise, without US advance knowledge. Instead of a noble, restrained action, Iran performed a CYA version of brinkmanship.
Eko
(7,326 posts)"Iran feared the consequences from the US and our allies if they launched those attacks or larger ones by surprise, without US advance knowledge."
That could be why they limited their response.
As far as " Instead of a noble, restrained action," I never said that at all and its pretty insulting for you to say that to me. Iran is our enemy as I stated in my post and you insinuated that,,,,, whatever. If you are unable to have a conversation without resorting to straw man then thats on you. Thanks.
RipVanWinkle
(228 posts)It was designed to test the Israeli defense. The real attack will come later.
stopdiggin
(11,320 posts)that Iran is not afraid of escalation. (and particularly with Israel in its current dynamic)
This is meant to counter the widely held belief that did not have the will for a real fight.
It's to be hoped that perhaps both sides have gotten across a clear message they were attempting to deliver.
Beastly Boy
(9,377 posts)Otherwise, why not escalate?
stopdiggin
(11,320 posts)Working out just fine for them so far ... And it's by far the smarter play.
Beastly Boy
(9,377 posts)Iran engaged in a dumb move to stage a fake escalation just to show they have no fear of escalating? And then, to remove all doubt, demonstrated to the whole world, including their proxies, that their move to fake an escalation was indeed dumb and that it resulted in a real humiliating defeat? And then, after suffering a humiliating defeat, pledged no further attempts at escalation?
This only sends two messages to Israel: that Iran is not afraid of being dumb; and that after learning their lesson they are not afraid to reconsider being dumb when faced with the prospect of real escalation. Which somewhat mitigates the perception Iran created in Israel of being dumb enough to stage a fake escalation in the first place.
stopdiggin
(11,320 posts)albeit with a fair amount of hyperbole. My own take is that this was not quite the 'puff piece' that some are trying to spin.
I don't think Iran necessarily wanted to start a war - but I do think there was message within this action - and further, I think it probably came across.
(and I hope you're not interpreting criticism of Israel withing these remarks. because if you are, you're well wide ... )
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PCIntern
(25,558 posts)How simplistic.
Fact is, if Hezbollah terrorists fired rockets wholesale, that portion of Lebanon would look like Downtown Dresden in 1945. The country showing restraint is Israel at the moment. Ask the Hamas terrorists what happens when they overstep.
Eko
(7,326 posts)sarisataka
(18,679 posts)I think if I was on the receiving end of 300 missiles I would not think it was a just for fun message.
Iran could have sent the same message with just 200 cheap drones, or even 100. The coordinated launch of cruise and IRCBMs indicates this was a serious attack. It failed.
republianmushroom
(13,623 posts)Happy Hoosier
(7,336 posts)Clearly they were just playing patty-cake.
Hard to stomach some of the apologetics happening here.
If some nation launched 300 drones and missiles at us, I don't think we'd say "oh, they were being nice."
Also, the US denies that any 72 hour notice was given. Why are you accepting Iran's word for it.
Sweet Jeebus.
ripcord
(5,436 posts)Xolodno
(6,396 posts)Who promptly informed the USA, who promptly informed Israel. Why do you think Biden quickly went back to the Whitehouse and had assets waiting to take down everything. They even got the UK and Jordan on board. And the targets that did land were miniscule and designed for minimal damage. Iran could have done a lot worse and chose not to.
This was a message to Bibi, saying WE CAN hit you. Stop the escalation with them.
ripcord
(5,436 posts)One senior official in U.S. President Joe Biden's administration denied Amirabdollahian's statement, saying Washington did have contact with Iran through Swiss intermediaries but did not get notice 72 hours in advance.
"That is absolutely not true, the official said. They did not give a notification, nor did they give any sense of ... 'these will be the targets, so evacuate them.'"
Tehran sent the United States a message only after the strikes began and the intent was to be "highly destructive" said the official, adding that Iran's claim of a widespread warning may be an attempt to compensate for the lack of any major damage from the attack.
Xolodno
(6,396 posts)The USA and Iran do not have direct relations (for a very long time, maybe you should look that up?) and a simple google search will show that Iran did indeed inform Turkey, who promptly informed us. This is just posturing for the world stage, you can go down the strict road all you want, but, they did give a heads up, and the best they could do since we are not talking to each other (no thanks to the previous jerk). And the Swiss facilitating contact during and after the operation only proves they were already communicating via intermediaries.
Unless of course, you have a blind devotion to "Iran is evil" and "bomb the hell out of them" type of attitude. In which case, we have nothing further to discuss. For me, Bibi crossed a red line and they in turn crossed one as well. He fucked up, but that doesn't surprise me given his house of cards has come crashing down, he's looking for anything to save his legacy at minimum. We are talking about the guy who said, at his funeral, he could have beaten Rabin in an election and was upset that he was now a martyr. Some serious low class there.
TheKentuckian
(25,026 posts)Eko
(7,326 posts)sending missiles, drones, and rockets to Israel. They most certainly were not loaded with flowers but I guess you do you.
TheKentuckian
(25,026 posts)to a Jon Lovitt recurring gag on SNL.
I am in no way down playing acts of terrorism and am a supporter of Israel as my posting history should make abundantly clear.
Sorry for any confusion or hard feelings.
Eko
(7,326 posts)Jon Lovitt doing the "Thats the ticket". Thanks for replying back, I appreciate it.
Eko.
BannonsLiver
(16,403 posts)It will be up to others to decide your motivation.
Eko
(7,326 posts)If your proxies in a country right next to the country you are attacking have 300,000 missiles and rockets and you send just 300 over multiple countries some of which have US military bases where it would be easy to shoot them down, much, much easier than the 300,000 right next to your target I would assume and have done so that they weren't trying to cause destruction but had other reasons. My motivations were logic, reasoning and knowledge of military tactics and strategies. Of course its just my opinion and like anyone else's it could be wrong. I felt like sharing it and you felt like sharing yours. Thanks,
Eko.
scipan
(2,351 posts)Don't think there was a 72 hour warning, at least I haven't seen good evidence.
Drones, UAVs, ballistic missiles all timed to arrive simultaneously.
They figured that they would overwhelm Israeli defense systems IMO.
EX500rider
(10,849 posts)And they might well have asked Hezbollah to fire 1,000's of rockets but they prefer to continue breathing and said No thank you.
Mountainguy
(537 posts)"They only launched 300 missiles."
What would be the response from the US if somebody launched 1 missile toward us?
Oh, and their proxies were launching missiles too.
It's very clear that some will twist themselves into a pretzel to frame anyone who opposes Israel as a good guy.
Eko
(7,326 posts)" Iran is our enemy ".
ripcord
(5,436 posts)Eko
(7,326 posts)My guess is that it will be a cyber attack or an attack against Iran's proxies. Israel will not send 300 missiles, drones and rockets at Iran.
Coventina
(27,129 posts)Those drones and missiles are filled with flowers and candy!!
Eko
(7,326 posts)Well, you did but I have to assume you are being sarcastic. A very interesting man once said war is not merely a political act but a real political instrument, a continuation of political intercourse, a carrying out of the same by other means". I think understanding Iran's actual capabilities vs what the response was bears discussion. Make no mistake Iran is our enemy and I for one would rather not underestimate their capabilities. Thanks for you response, it was funny.
elias7
(4,012 posts)Second,WTAF do people expect a sovereign nation to do when another sovereign nation shoots 300 missiles at it? Israel has every right to respond and should not be held to a different standard than any other country. And if people try to blame Israel for this attack because of an attack on the Iranian consulate in Syria, they should do a little bit more digging as to why Israel did that.
TheKentuckian
(25,026 posts)The underlying premise is that Israel should not exist so any and all attacks on them are justified and any response other than a stiff upper lip is unadulterated wickedness and preferably the response should be to lie down and die.
This is why the bullshit narrative is Mandela like freedom fighting and "Nothing justifies this response!!1!!!1!", because no response is justifiable to their idiotic reckoning.