Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Nevilledog

(51,201 posts)
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 12:28 PM Apr 23

A Christian ministry urged the Supreme Court to criminalize homelessness

https://www.friendlyatheist.com/p/a-christian-ministry-urged-the-supreme

Yesterday, the Supreme Court heard a case that centers around how cities should deal with homelessness. One of the most striking revelations, however, may have come from a Christian ministry that insisted the homeless need to be converted or punished.

The case involved the city of Grants Pass, Oregon, where there are more homeless people than available beds in shelters. City leaders have chosen to address the problem, not by building affordable housing or additional shelters but rather by fining people hundreds of dollars for using blankets, pillows, or cardboard boxes on the streets. When homeless people accrue multiple fines, they can be banned from public property… literally leaving them with nowhere to go. And if they remain in the city, they can be criminally prosecuted.

A previous legal case already declared those kinds of penalties unconstitutional, amounting to cruel and unusual punishment. So with the help of an attorney, a group of homeless people in Grants Pass filed a lawsuit against the city, saying local ordinances that punished them for basically existing were illegal. After all, they said, they weren’t choosing to live on the streets. There were no other options available to them.

Despite winning their case in lower courts, the city repeatedly appealed the decisions all the way up to the Supreme Court. The question in front of the justices is whether the city should be allowed to criminalize homelessness. It would be a disaster—and just another layer of cruelty—if SCOTUS rules in favor of Grants Pass.

*snip*
22 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
A Christian ministry urged the Supreme Court to criminalize homelessness (Original Post) Nevilledog Apr 23 OP
When did "Christian ministry " become an oxymoron? LakeArenal Apr 23 #1
About 2000 years ago Johnny2X2X Apr 23 #5
Good one. LakeArenal Apr 23 #19
'Christian' my ass. spanone Apr 23 #2
Seriously? NanaCat Apr 23 #14
Perhaps the proceeds from the collection plate should help the needy. pandr32 Apr 23 #3
They don't think about what the money goes to NanaCat Apr 23 #15
What a joke... Mike Nelson Apr 23 #4
Yeah, it is Christian NanaCat Apr 23 #16
Excellent point. LakeArenal Apr 23 #20
Wow! Such caring people. LiberalFighter Apr 23 #6
Is the sheriff of Grants Pass the character from the first Rambo? Hotler Apr 23 #7
So do a bunch of the other sects NanaCat Apr 23 #17
"Yes, that's right, Governor Pilatus; we found this homeless guy. Claims to be a rabbi. Aristus Apr 23 #8
Thanks for these details. h2ebits Apr 23 #9
First Division of the multigraincracker Apr 23 #10
And once they're criminally prosecuted we provide them food & housing. CrispyQ Apr 23 #11
Thomas Paine and John Locke may have some say in the matter crud Apr 23 #12
the key here is "Converted". The Christian Nationalist and other yellowdogintexas Apr 23 #13
So . . . if and when homelessness is criminalized . . . peggysue2 Apr 23 #18
very... myohmy2 Apr 23 #21
ugh... progressoid Apr 24 #22

NanaCat

(1,266 posts)
14. Seriously?
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 03:31 PM
Apr 23

A sizeable contingent of them have been this way for centuries now.

Why act like being cruel is new for them?

pandr32

(11,617 posts)
3. Perhaps the proceeds from the collection plate should help the needy.
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 12:37 PM
Apr 23

I thought that was the reason people give money to 'the Church'.
In the past, the minister/pastor used to live in a modest house next to the church.

Mike Nelson

(9,968 posts)
4. What a joke...
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 12:37 PM
Apr 23

... this "Christian ministry" is not Christian. AND, most of the people coming across the southern border ARE already Christian, so they would not have to "convert."

NanaCat

(1,266 posts)
16. Yeah, it is Christian
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 03:34 PM
Apr 23

It's typical behaviour for a broad swath of them for centuries now. It's a religion that extolled poverty for the peons while they built massive gold-encrusted churches and their clergy lived in luxury.

Anyone who thinks this is something aberrant for a substantial portion of them is blind to reality.

Hotler

(11,445 posts)
7. Is the sheriff of Grants Pass the character from the first Rambo?
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 12:41 PM
Apr 23

Conservative Christians practice selfishness.

NanaCat

(1,266 posts)
17. So do a bunch of the other sects
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 03:48 PM
Apr 23

It's not exclusive to any one group of them. After all, this is not a conservative evangelical church (CofE):



Or this one (Lutheran):

Aristus

(66,467 posts)
8. "Yes, that's right, Governor Pilatus; we found this homeless guy. Claims to be a rabbi.
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 12:42 PM
Apr 23

He's been surfing people's couches for the last three years. No fixed address. Hangs around with a gaggle of unemployed fishermen. He's been going around claiming Caesar is not the real god. I think you should nail him up, sir. Set an example..."

h2ebits

(646 posts)
9. Thanks for these details.
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 12:45 PM
Apr 23

Yesterday, there was a DU post with Justice Sotomayor comments. I thought she was talking about the State of Oregon rather than a town.

Hopefully, the jurists on the Supreme Court will come together on this issue FOR THE PEOPLE and quash the city ordinance.

The cruelty and deliberate inhumanity in our country has grown to unimaginable size under Trump and his minions.

CrispyQ

(36,526 posts)
11. And once they're criminally prosecuted we provide them food & housing.
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 01:00 PM
Apr 23

Right?

Why can't we just do that before we make them jump through hoops & then take away their liberty?

Personally, I think we should have a citizen's survival package issued to every adult, which includes:

> three hots & a cot
> basic health care, including dental, mental, & vision
> child care/elder care
> basic education K-college
> high speed internet across the land
> a comprehensive public transportation system so one can get around the US & US cities & towns without a car or plane

IDK how we do that but I'll bet if we funded a bunch of working mothers it would get done & on budget.

Years ago I posted something similar on a friend's FB page & someone he knew responded with a picture of a blank sheet of paper & the text, "This is what you were promised when you were born." Our governments are being hijacked by some of the meanest, most punitive & closed-minded assholes imaginable. They don't value community & the communities they are a part of are very exclusive, not inclusive. That rugged individualist crap really infected a lot of people.

crud

(627 posts)
12. Thomas Paine and John Locke may have some say in the matter
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 01:09 PM
Apr 23

The natural rights of man... Life, liberty and property. If you're born in to existence you have the right to occupy the planet. The homeless have rights, not based on income or property or citizenship, but just from the fact that they are here.

yellowdogintexas

(22,271 posts)
13. the key here is "Converted". The Christian Nationalist and other
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 01:49 PM
Apr 23

conservative groups/denominations believe they must convert every person they meet. So they want to be able to only serve those who have bowed down to their religious dictates.
I have heard this before about some of the church sponsored shelters here and there. Depends on the sponsoring groups.

Many churches require "conversion" to receive services and support from their outreach ministries. I belong to a United Methodist Church and our mission never turns anyone away. We have a food bank, a clothing bank, sack lunches and some assistance with navigating the system. No one is obligated to do anything remotely religious to receive services. We also distribute infant formula to mothers who have been approved for WIC but are in the holding pattern for that benefit to start. They are referred to us by WIC.

There are several other large churches in the area which offer services without a 'conversion' demand

peggysue2

(10,842 posts)
18. So . . . if and when homelessness is criminalized . . .
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 03:56 PM
Apr 23

Will all the homeless be imprisoned? What is the endpoint here or is Grants Pass going with Agent Orange's solution: detention camps for all homeless Americans.

And no, Justice Thomas, homelessness and camping are not the same. It involves the word you and your conservative justices hate the most:

CHOICE.

My older son is a dedicated through hiker and wilderness guide. Thus, he does a good amount of 'camping out.' When the hike is finished, he flies home and resumes life. In his house.

Big frigging difference.

myohmy2

(3,177 posts)
21. very...
Tue Apr 23, 2024, 04:39 PM
Apr 23

...Christian...

...this is not good advertising...why would anyone join or follow the beliefs of such nasty evil people...??

...what hapened to, "...life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness -- land of the free, home of the brave...??"

...'converted or punished'

...me thinks being converted is being punished...

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»A Christian ministry urge...