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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsHave you read the initial reports from Forensic Pathologists in Israel?
These were the innocent civilians on 10/07
Hamas torture confirmed as Israeli forensics institute identifies victims
Stifling the urge to retch became a difficult task as I walked through the lower levels of Israels National Center of Forensic Medicine (Abu Kabir) in Tel Aviv. The smell of rotting human remains, much of which was completely unrecognizable as human due to the brutality of the attack, was at times too much to bear.
snip
During the initial press conference, the forensics team showed images from their investigations. Among the images were those of charred hands with marks that revealed where the victims hands were bound behind their backs with metal wire before being burned alive.
Perhaps the most disturbing image in the slideshow was a completely charred mass of flesh, which at first glance could not be seen as ever having belonged to a human. It was only after a CT scan was done that experts could see the inhumanity of the image.Two spinal cordsone belonging to an adult, one to someone younga parent and child bound together by metal wires in a final embrace before being set alight.
snip
Kugel also explained that the age range of the victims spans from 3 months to 80 or 90 years old. Many bodies, including those of babies, are without heads.
More: https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/article-769339
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Further study showed most were burned alive because they found soot in their lungs.
This was what started the war. Hamas brutally attacked women, babies, innocents on 10/07.
Hamas started a war, long range missiles are taking them out and it breaks my heart that more are dying. However the pure evil that started all that is happening now is unforgivable. Hamas made it up front and personal after breaking the ceasefire agreement.They tortured, raped, beheaded, watched, cheered, took photos and posted with the victims camera. They paraded their victims through town.
War really sucks. Sad thing is, Hamas made sure one would happen. They had a lot of help from Russia and Iran.
Hamas wants this and frankly doesn't give a ra about Palestinians.
marybourg
(12,637 posts)What country would not react with vengeance to such treatment of its citizens? Hamas was then prepared with a cadre of agitators to stir up the disaffected left on behalf of, not the victims of this depraved violence, but the failed state that loosed them upon the world.
It was planned and was orchestrated by Hamas and their comrades. They wanted maximum effect. They outdid themselves with their brutality.
It was planned by Iran.
Instead, President Vladimir Putin blamed US policies for the current Middle East crisis. He compared Israels blockade of Gaza to Nazi Germanys siege of Leningradone of the most traumatic events in Russias history.
In this context, Putin offered to serve as a mediator between Israel and the Palestinians, while Hamas, according to Russian press reports, praised Putins position on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Russia has had a longstanding and well-documented relationship with Hamas. Still, Moscows response to the Hamas attack shows that it is aligning more explicitly with the global south as it seeks to erode the US-led liberal world order, what Putin claimed in June to be an ugly neo-colonial system coming to an end in favour of a multipolar world.
snip
There is no direct evidence that Moscow was involved in the 7 October attack or knew about it and looked the other way. But Putin benefits from the resultant chaos, including Western distraction from his war on Ukraine.
He is likely to use the opportunity to exacerbate this situation, including through cyber operations against US forces, disinformation campaigns, and the use of Wagner to support other anti-American actors in the Middle East. Most recently, Hamas reportedly gave access to an RT journalist to the tunnel network nicknamed the Gaza Metro. This shows the Kremlin will have added opportunities to shape the narrative with Arab audiences to fit Russias state objectives.
https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/russias-relationship-hamas-and-putins-global-calculations
AZLD4Candidate
(5,769 posts)Pogroms.
Mossfern
(2,557 posts)from the time I was a small child.
Irish_Dem
(47,446 posts)They fooled the CIA and Mossad, the greatest intel agencies in the world.
They do not have the funds or brain power to pull this off on their own.
Has Iran and Russian fingerprints all over it.
Putin knew Biden would get involved and wanted to damage Biden's election chances.
Fortunately Biden was smart enough to be careful.
brer cat
(24,614 posts)It sickens me to see the support they have gained in this country.
sheshe2
(83,926 posts)I do believe many of these people are paid actors.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,769 posts)And the UN has become Hamas' PR company, reporting as fact anything they say. And the US media has no problems reporting this.
The Jews won't replace us.- American right
Israel is a nazi like apartheid state, so let's target Jewish university students
We Jews have been, are, and will forever be completely alone.
betsuni
(25,640 posts)against the Evil West because it started during the Obama administration.
Obama-drones-drones-drones-drones, he enjoyed murdering innocent children at wedding parties with drones (sometimes if you said something nice about President Obama you'd get a nasty reply that you didn't care about dead children -- same as now!) as if by participating in NATO attacks against terrorists the U.S. was doing forever imperialistic wars unilaterally in a diabolically evil plot.
Snowden/Occupy Wall Street. Capitalism bad, U.S. (as long as it was a Democratic administration) bad, Russia good. Then of course from 2015 the vicious attacks against Democrats as immoral racist corrupt warmongers really took off. No surprise that horribly violent religious fundamentalist terrorist groups who don't care if their own people die because that's good for fundraising and support are the good guys now and a Democrat is "Genocide Joe."
Irish_Dem
(47,446 posts)Divide the US. Damage the liberals.
Damage Biden's re-election chances.
Biden is smart and has been careful.
Aussie105
(5,436 posts)Revenge and retribution definitely required!
Backing down now is NOT an option!
Israel bombs Hamas/Palestine/Palestinians out of existence, bordering Middle Eastern countries take umbrage and similarly wipe Israel out of existence, the US sends in the ground troops, Russia and China get involved, as does most of Europe and the Earth is pockmarked with the Fires of Hell in different places for the next 10 years.
The media will be filled with today's locations and numbers of those killed.
(More news updates at 11 pm.)
WW3, here we come!
Cha
(297,705 posts)WERE GANG RAPED AN SLAUGHTERED.
Your attempt at Distraction is Not Working.
You are correct.
Late. I will be back tomorrow.
Cha
(297,705 posts)Sky Jewels
(7,146 posts)Cha
(297,705 posts)innocent babies, Children, men and Women If you don't want all Hell to break loose.
Hamss wanted this and engineered it to "Chage the status quu".. Well Fuck them.
Don't sneak attack and fuck up so many innocent lives with their Gang Raping , Mutilation, and Slaughter UP Close and Personal
Are the Hostages dead or Alive that they Stole form their homes where they killed loved ones in front of their families.
Sky Jewels
(7,146 posts)He doesn't give a fuck about the hostages. He just wants to wipe out the Muslim population and level Gaza so Israel can do what it wants with the land. And he has turned the entire world against Israel, making its status in the world even more tenuous and endangering Israelis even more. If I were an Israeli, I would be absolutely furious with him. He will go down as one of the biggest monsters in history. He's obviously not on a level with Hitler and Stalin and Pol Pot , etc., but he's in a somewhat lower tier, and the company ain't good.
betsuni
(25,640 posts)AZLD4Candidate
(5,769 posts)1200 Jews were slaughtered in one day and Israel should do nothing. Hamas started this war without caring about the Palestinian people at all.
They wanted a war and that FAFO. We Jews don't back down anymore. When we did, six million of us were exterminated.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,769 posts)Except in 1967, where they didn't wait to get attacked and went on the offensive knowing that the attack was coming.
When Israel is attacked, the would yawns. When Israel was losing, no one said cease fire. When Israel starts winning, then it's cease fire time.
Enough is enough. Israel, and Jews worldwide, have the right to defend themselves. Last time we didn't, six million were exterminated.
"So now Israel can use those tactics." ISRAEL WAS ATTACKED!!! That's the fucking point. Hamas fucked around and found out. But Israel is wrong for fighting back. In fact, Israel should disengage, take down their flag, and disappear.
I'm so God damn tired. It's similar to a beaten wife killing her husband. You'd say the husband deserved it. 75 years of terrorist attacks and 1200 slaughtered in one day. . .Hamas wanted a war, the Palestinians in Gaza celebrated on the days that followed, now complain about the war Hamas started with the Oct 7 attacks that people in Gaza celebrated. They fucked around and found out this isn't 1933 and they aren't Nazi Germany.
Kill Jews, target Jews and we will fight back.
We Americans did in 1941 after Pearl Harbor and Japan fucked around and found out.
Hekate
(90,829 posts)betsuni
(25,640 posts)"Palestinian children are Hamas's secret weapon. ... They had to have factored in from the start that Gaza City above them would be leveled by the Israels. So be it. Hamas's premise for war both accepted and approved that civilians would be sacrificed in horrific numbers. It is also an integral part of the war plan to use their dead bodies as a strategic weapon against Israel."
http://malcolmnance.substack.com/p/hamas-needs-children-to-die
"Ruined buildings are PERFECT firing positions. The nature of terrorists is to creep slowly back into cleared areas using the civilian population as a shield. If there are gun battles or airstrikes near, it is because Israeli soldiers were fired upon from those sites. Your family may not be involved but Hamas doesn't care. They are fighting around and through civilians."
"Hamas chose Gaza as its Stalingrad and that's what they got. THEY PLANNED FOR THIS WAR. THEY GOT THIS WAR. Hamas is Palestinian ISIS with Russian/Wagner & Iranian IRGC supplying them."
Cha
(297,705 posts)Last edited Wed Apr 24, 2024, 03:24 AM - Edit history (1)
This is what that idiot at the UN is ignoring and all these so called progressive women "who Deny it ever happened .
HandmaidsTaleUntold
(237 posts)What does that have to do with killing over 30,000 civilians. Dont make excuses. One evil doesnt justify another.
Cha
(297,705 posts)Gang Rapists of Hamas is Not Working.
HandmaidsTaleUntold
(237 posts)Its overkill. Obviously. We didnt bomb Afghanistan back to the Stone Age. Are you saying 30,000 civilians are Hamas? Cursing doesnt prove your point.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,769 posts)1500 years of brutality against us is enough. And I mean Jews, not Israelis.
AZLD4Candidate
(5,769 posts)We all know Israel lies about everything and Hamas tells the true about everything.
Hamas reports 15,000 Palestinian children have been killed and the entire world (and American liberals) want to see Israel up on war crimes, since the UN reported their numbers. My evidence for it here. Look how I get attacked for questioning Hamas reported numbers, since Hamas is the elected government of Gaza.
Hostages show evidence of torture in Israeli investigations and the world will give a collective yawn.
History of my people shows our lives are cheap and our blood is worthless. No one will care about this and Israel and Jews (yes, Jews. . .look at the language of the Pro-Palestinian protestors) will still be demonized.
EndlessWire
(6,569 posts)start a discussion, and then say, when people respond with their opinion, that they are attempting distraction? I don't get that.
When did Gaza and the WB become their own countries. Because, last I looked, they are part of Israel. Israel is annihilating people living apart from the rest of the population.
I have never been against Israel. But, I no longer have a really high opinion of them, rooted in academics and smart moves. What they are doing now is not a smart move. When the war against Hamas was declared, I was with them, because they had to do something. But, deliberately starving kids and killing aid workers is beyond the reasoning they used to start bombing. At some point, the rage has to stop. They are not rational now.
I don't care what they say, the only solution is a two-state division with a wide no man's land. Goes for the WB, too. Yet they steadfastly cling to the notion that reducing Gaza and all the people living there to rubble is the only way to achieve peace. This is not true.
For the record, I read the report weeks ago. It is horrific, and Hamas should not have expected anything else but an armed response. But, at some point you have to stop. I think that's what most people are trying to point out.
I supported rooting out Hamas until it became rather clear that Israel has another agenda of taking the land and putting Israeli settlers in there. I don't believe them when they claim they don't plan to do that. That causes a real problem of refugees with no place to go.
They should have taken the tunnel system. They told the population in the North to get out pending operations there, so they obediently moved. Then they came down South to the areas where people are basically stuck and starving, and now they are bombing there.
If Hamas starts shooting rockets again, bomb away. But, just to kill civilians in hopes they're Hamas is not going to work. And, killing aid workers is a big no no, too.
At some point, it has to stop, and not after they have cleared Gaza of its residents. And, I do feel Israel's outrage at the UN for not putting Hamas on the terrorist rape list. That is beyond absurd. But, Israel is not looking for peace, and if they can trick the US into engaging Iran, they'll be happy with that, too.
Cha
(297,705 posts)report in the OP. No acknowledging it.. and asking what it has to do with what they want talk about.
They need to make their own OP Not try to Hijack this one..
Mossfern
(2,557 posts)It's when. History is witness to that. Palestinians do NOT want a two state solution. They seek eradication of Israel. They have said that themselves loud and clear, yet there are those who still don't believe that. It was Hamas that broke cease fires - not Israel.
BTW, just to be clear about my personal stance regarding settlers - I am completely opposed to the settler movement and believe it is they that may a major contributing cause the downfall of Israel.
questionseverything
(9,661 posts)This didnt start on the 7th
ExciteBike66
(2,374 posts)atreides1
(16,093 posts)But I do support an independent review of this report. Israeli authorities, just like Hamas have lied before...and I don't take the word of either group.
Mossfern
(2,557 posts)for the number of innocent women and children killed in Gaza, or do you take the reports of Gazan authorities on it.
keithbvadu2
(36,933 posts)How much does Hamas care about the lives of ordinary Gazans/Palestinians?
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100218683807
Hamas commander on why terror group attacks civilians
CBS-""You had to have known that there would have been Israel's response, that Palestinians would suffer as a result."
A- "We are not pleased with that, but this is the path of armed struggle."
-----------------------
Certainly not the families of Hamas elite.
Hamas leader and family escape through their tunnels.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100218686776
Hamas uses civilians as human shields, Gazan journalist states
And we know that Hamas revels in the deaths of people in Gaza as well.
Hamas are not "freedom fighters," they are not like Mandela, they are brutal terrorists who use their own people as human shields. The idiots on social media and college campuses, wearing their Amazon-bought keffiyehs and supporting these disgusting terrorists? Maybe they need to take a trip to Gaza or Iran and see how things really are.