Or be apologists for it.

Last edited Fri Apr 26, 2024, 04:27 PM - Edit history (2)

And they are apologists for people too stupid too heed the obvious warnings.

Would these idiots have listened to Hillary had they heard her warn them in person? Would they have even attended her rallies to begin with?

Let's not forget that Hillary canceled one of her biggest rallies in Wisconsin -- her first of the cycle with Obama, I believe -- due to the one of the worst mass shootings in our nation's history taking place shortly prior to it (the Pulse nightclub shooting).

Also let's not forget that winning Wisconsin wouldn't have won her the presidency, and she and other Democrats invested heavily in other similar Midwest states (i.e. Pennsylvania, where the Democratic National Convention was held, one of her biggest rallies of the entire cycle was held, her pre-election eve rally was held, etc.) and she still barely lost them, just because enough idiots believed the lies about her and not the truths she was telling.

Don't be apologists for the idiots.

people have and will continue to die because Hillary lost. Our very Republic is at risk now...so anyone who doesn't vote for Biden now can fuck themselves and those who didn't vote for Hillary too.

Not to litigate 2016 failures but mistakes were made campaigning as well. The truth isn’t enough to win. You have to go on offense. And in 2016 not flirt around with the middle. Now the middle seems the o ly way to save the nation. With common ground and moderate compromises. But people were sick of nepotism and moderation then.

to point to one thing and say, see this is why HRC didn't win, when it is perfectly obvious that her loss was because of 3rd party "conscience" voters who didn't give AF about the Supreme Court, seems disingenuous to me.

Too many swing voters didn’t like her. I’d be more open to excuse for losing be Trump cheating. WI, MI and Ohio seemed very off to me.

in any of those states. You are making excuses for the actions of so-called progressives who did't give AF about the Supreme Court or even the country.

And I vote Democrat. But we need candidates that can win.

Evidently she was so confident she had the state in the bag for her. And for voters on the Left, that gave them permission to vote for 3rd party candidates rather than the nominee of the Democratic Party because Jill Stein of the Green Party received more votes than Trump's margin of victory in Wisconsin. And I'm certain they are stupid enough to do the same thing again.
Too many on the Left don't grasp the simple concept that our presidential elections are binary and in this one the next president will either be Biden or Trump. That's it. And if you don't vote for Biden, that only helps Trump. So please, get over yourself and do the right thing and vote for Biden.

It is Hillary's fault...well, I say no fucking way. I don't know how with Roe, the Covid epidemic, the January 6th insurrection, children kidnapped at the border etc. how the voters supposedly Democratic voters or Liberals can sleep at night. I really don't. When the other candidate is a Republican, one must always vote Democrate...no excuses. Oh, and Green really stands for 'get Republicans elected every November. Fuck them all. I will never forgive them.

to vote third party? President Obama, VP Biden, Bernie Sanders went to Wisconsin -- Obama in particular was very confident, guess it was their fault too. I don't understand this excuse at all.

They didn't in '20 either. And nobody is overconfident about the state either.
People here want to see that the actual candidate cares enough to come and campaign in the state itself since Wisconsin is not exactly in the US boonies. So try understanding harder.

Could you please explain? Why would people who hate Democrats go to a Democratic rally? Are people hypnotized by rallies? They don't have TVs or anything and have no idea who they're voting for unless they see them in person?

didn't vote for Hillary...these votes all but destroyed our Republic. And I will never forgive such voters as I said in my above post. Don't tell me about Hillary...these people saw Obama's nominee stolen and still didn't vote to protect the courts because wah wah Hillary was not the perfect candidate for them. They had a real sad and took their ball and went home...leaving the rest of us to suffer under Trump. They have no shame even today.

To see it happening again (but nothing like the vicious hate and elaborate conspiracies) with Biden is .

I saw a poll yesterday...that contained numbers that clearly show Biden was ahead...but after massaging the data...it was breathlessly announced that Trump was ahead. The title was even misleading.

My husband hears the American news I watch and gets worked up, says: What the hell is wrong with America, it's not a normal country, what the hell.

Sigh. It's a long story.

supporters from the left said "they were tired of voting for the lesser of the two evils"

According to Norm Ornstein, up to 25%, refused to vote for Hillary in the general election in 2016.

Link to tweet

So, Sanders did a better job than she did when she lost the primary.

Bernie and Jill Stein voters.

It would have been great if every Bernie and Stein voter converted to Hillary, but it is wrong to assume that would happen.

I know some Republicans who would have voted for Bernie for president. Generally, they were impressed by his honesty. Also, Bernie has a way of explaining basic liberal tenets that make it all seem like common sense.

Bernie was one of the do nothing Senate dems in 2000 who all hid in their cushy ivory Washington towers while W stole the 2000 election in Florida. It's the height of hypocrisy for Bernie or anyone else in that group of do nothings to complain about the nightmare our country is now facing. Their failure to act helped make it possible.

Maybe, given your user name, you have lost perspective in the present.

I seem to remember Gore giving up when he should have fought.

Bernie Sanders attracted people outside the Democratic party.

Again, who are you to demand their vote?

Many things contributed to Hillary's loss in 2016. Mostly, that people chose not to vote for her.

Your OP reads like a big nonsequitur. Feeling frustrated? Looking for someone to blame? You'll just have to deal with it like the rest of us.

etc, who encouraged people not only not to vote for Hillary in the general election, but encouraged others to do likewise. In every critical swing state Hillary lost by less than 1%, while Jill Stein won by 1% in those critical swing states.

It didn’t take much, but those arrogant folks who refused to vote for Hillary, by either not voting or voting third party did make a difference, and the same groups are pushing the same bullshit again.

and those “wonderful”, self-identified progressives have no regrets for not voting for Hillary in the general election in 2016.

If Trump wins the WH, screw it. First thing I will do is stop all my charitable contributions, because if this country puts Trump into the WH again, this country doesn’t deserve my charitable contributions.

and make no mistake about it, anyone who doesn’t vote for Biden, is a vote for Trump. Same as it was in 2000.

>> Ask Cornell West, David Sirota, Nina Turner, Briahna Joy Gray, Susan Sarandon

I will not ask them a thing. Why would I blame them more than Republicans for Hillary's loss? These people you cite were very clear where they stood from the start.

There are people further left than the Democratic party, and they will never vote for our candidates. So give up the anger and the blame, and GOTV as best you can with those who will work with you.

>> who encouraged people not only not to vote for Hillary in the general election, but encouraged others to do likewise.

What???

>> I will do is stop all my charitable contributions,

You are well past the point of rational conversation. I'm not going to respond to you again.

Come back to rational space, John.

We need you. We need all of us.

Stop blaming them and embrace your lefty cousins. Give them good info. Ask for their vote.

And don't be angry if they say no. Because then, you can ask again. Forgive them, for they are just people. (Lefties are people wanting better lives for everyone. Righties are people wanting better lives for themselves.)

I tried with Stein voters. I failed. But, I understood where they are coming from, and chose to keep my friends.

What choice do you have? We're all on this Earth together.

The world will either survive and continue to hobble along on the brink of WWIII if Biden wins, or it will end altogether if Trump or other Republicans win. Enough of them want the endtimes that they will bring it on.

I'm pretty sure we will win this one, and either one or both houses of Congress.

But, the fight continues after we win. There is no rest for the weary. There will always be people trying to steal our democracy.

For example, RFK, jr. This is a new improved Jill Stein that will suck up votes. Twenty years ago, RFK jr was one of us. But, we didn't give him enough attention. So, he went to crazy town where people lauded him. Now, he'd sacrifice our democracy just to get attention.

And he himself was in no dire hurry to refute them, either.

Of the several factors that contributed to Trump's getting installed in the presidency, to say that Sanders and his team were not among them is one of the more insulting of claims, in my opinion, but that is just my opinion.

was supposedly threatening them as persons and very upsetting.

They're not right wing think tanks, they're terrorist organizations and they're out for absolute power.

that ‘one vote’ majority!

But Hillary was a "warmonger," you know. And she gave speeches, or something.

Obviously she was plotting with Goldman Sachs to take over the world and force everybody to say "it takes a village" or something equally horrible. And she didn't like terrorists, which made her "Queen of the Warmongers."

because The Revolution was supposed to happen with rallies.

The People would drop everything and hold huge rallies demanding Republicans do their jobs and they'd totally listen and be nice. I wondered for a long time what the revolution was and then the leader explained in an interview with Rachel Maddow.

Yet Mr. Rallies, Trump, lost (and barely won in 2016) and Biden didn't even really campaign. A miracle. And they always freak out that the candidate with the most money HAS to win which obviously isn't true (Hi, Mitt Romney, Hi, Nina Turner, etc.)

Hillary's loss is all the fault of people who would never vote for her, who were very clear they would never vote for her.

Go on blame them. It's more productive than trying to understand a simple fact -- many of them were never Democrats. They were willing to vote for Bernie and that's the extent of it. They didn't listen to him when he supported Hillary. He could only lead them to where they wanted to be led.

When voting for Bernie wasn't an option, they stayed home or voted for Stein like they said they would. They knew full well voting for Stein was throwing the vote away. They chose to do anyway because they felt the Democratic party wasn't listening to them, and that it was listening to Goldman/Sachs.

They certainly didn't listen to me, but I heard what they had to say. Some were friends of mine.

My own mother voted for Trump. I had no control over that either. As she gets older, she gets angrier. There's no limit.

The majority of people did vote for Hillary. She lost in the electoral college. But, let's put the blame somewhere else, eh?

I heard it a thousand times back when we were pleading with the anti-Hills to listen to reason.

Predictably,

The "Choir of Self Righteousness" went silent and caught amnesia soon after the Gorsuch installation.

Remember PUMA? I would wager the people who ran so hard with that slogan were not exactly friends of Hillary, given that they wanted to throw away their vote on 3rd party candidates. I finally just started posting “SCOTUS, SCOTUS, SCOTUS” in reply.

Fck’em. They either never learn or they know exactly what they are doing.

I doubt they will learn and will go it...again. I cannot express the contempt I have for those people.

I spent the better part of 7 years hanging out in the BOG while President Obama was in office, while he was accused of throwing this or that group under the bus, while he was accused of caving to this or that enemy.

We didn’t exactly cover ourselves with glory.

I have a dreadful feeling that even if Hillary had won in 2016, it would have been similar here.

Folks will just ignore their bullshit and carry on.

Common sense. Why evangelicals played the long game so well.

Federalist society. However, this couldn't have happened if the so-called left had our back and cared about the courts, women, and our Republic. There is no excuse for those who did not back Hillary and yes Obama fully...none. The courts matter. And I see the same bullshit with these protests going on...It appears to be a Jewish-hating fest to me-not much different than Charlottesville. What is the point of attacking Jewish Americans for something happening thousands of miles away in a different country?

And you have written it over and over.

People's votes are based on the information they have. Most people are not politically interested like we are on DU. They are subjected to propaganda: errors of commission from right-wing networks (lies) and errors of omission from left-wing sources (incomplete information).

I find your statements of anger to be unproductive. You are now conflating multiple news items in a single paragraph.

forgive them...never.

"Too bad"? Really? I find that shameful.

Have you ever seen this?

removing and replacing any judges appointed for life by someone found to have cheated their way into the White House and thus never belonged in a position to make those appointments.

Link to tweet

ideology is wrong. Democrats don't ignore the working/middle classes because of imaginary corruption but Trump listened to them and was very nice and helpful. It's nuts.

I mean, come on, no way those things are real.

worried then McConnell pushed through Barrett. The idea was the SCOTUS would follow the law because Justice Roberts knew that to do otherwise would call the legitimacy of the court in question. That settled law was safe because it was.......settled

Well, that theory has no legitimacy. These people have no ethics, no problem pushing their political ideology.

SCOTUS is pure politics these days - unquestionable. And they know they can do anything they want.