Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin

(108,456 posts)
Sun Apr 28, 2024, 02:57 PM Apr 28

College protesters want 'amnesty.' At stake: Tuition, legal charges, grades and graduation

Maryam Alwan figured the worst was over after New York City police in riot gear arrested her and other protesters on the Columbia University campus, loaded them onto buses and held them in custody for hours.

But the next evening, the college junior received an email from the university. Alwan and other students were being suspended after their arrests at the “ Gaza Solidarity Encampment,” a tactic colleges across the country have deployed to calm growing campus protests against the Israel-Hamas war.

The students’ plight has become a central part of protests, with students and a growing number of faculty demanding their amnesty. At issue is whether universities and law enforcement will clear the charges and withhold other consequences, or whether the suspensions and legal records will follow students into their adult lives.

Terms of the suspensions vary from campus to campus. At Columbia and its affiliated Barnard College for women, Alwan and dozens more were arrested April 18 and promptly barred from campus and classes, unable to attend in-person or virtually, and banned from dining halls.

https://apnews.com/article/student-protest-gaza-war-arrest-amnesty-ae235703d6a9b99114078fca13a530a0

I'd say it depends on what the suspended person did. Threats of physical violence, especially when things are heated, should never be tolerated. Kind of like the idiot below.

Columbia University Enforces Campus Ban on Student After Antisemitic Outburst

Columbia University has enforced a ban on Khymani James, a prominent student protest leader, after a video of James making inflammatory and antisemitic statements resurfaced online. Amid heightened tensions and protests on university campuses nationwide concerning the Israel-Hamas conflict, the move by Columbia has become a focal point of discussions on freedom of speech and student safety.

James, associated with the student group Columbia University Apartheid Divest (CUAD), was captured in a video stating, “Zionists don’t deserve to live,” and comparing Zionists to Nazis and racists. The video, verified by NBC News, has prompted considerable backlash from the university community and beyond.

A statement from a Columbia University spokesperson clarified that chants, signs, taunts, and social media posts threatening Jewish people are unacceptable, emphasizing that students will be held accountable for such incidents. The university’s decision to ban James from campus underscores the stance that while peaceful protest is a protected right, calls for violence and discriminatory harassment cannot be tolerated.

The ban comes as student protests, calling for universities to divest from companies doing business with Israel, escalate. The university’s condemnation of the remarks was echoed by the White House. Andrew Bates, White House deputy press secretary, conveyed President Biden’s stance that “violent rhetoric, hate speech, and Antisemitic remarks have no place in America whatsoever.” Bates branded the statements by James as “dangerous” and “appalling,” emphasizing the need for such rhetoric to serve as a “wakeup call.”

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/columbia-university-enforces-campus-ban-on-student-after-antisemitic-outburst/ar-AA1nOEzb

28 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
College protesters want 'amnesty.' At stake: Tuition, legal charges, grades and graduation (Original Post) Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Apr 28 OP
Thank you.. they went too far and found out. Cha Apr 28 #1
They did. You can't get student loans if convicted of a crime. Demsrule86 Apr 28 #2
Cal Poly Humboldt campus *closes* through the end of the semester Cha Apr 28 #7
This college doesn't give money to Israel and is very careful where they put their money. Demsrule86 Apr 29 #8
Kids sometimes do dumb stuff. Happy Hoosier Apr 30 #21
Nope, there comes a time when you must and shall be held accountable for your actions. republianmushroom Apr 28 #3
If they were involved with violence, or hate speech? Nope. If not, then yes, with an asterisk. Happy Hoosier Apr 28 #4
What if civil disobedience involves violations of college rules they pledged to uphold when they applied to the college? Beastly Boy Apr 28 #6
I think Columbia offering an amnesty was the right move. Happy Hoosier Apr 30 #20
Civil disobedience is breaking the law or rules and accepting arrest or punishment ripcord Apr 30 #18
Another example of the entitled ignorance of the protesters Beastly Boy Apr 28 #5
I would be happy if every single one of these loons remains forever unemployed. The Mouth Apr 30 #9
We really don't want that. LiberalFighter Apr 30 #10
I've got an option for them. The Mouth Apr 30 #17
You are conflating all the protestors with Hamas supporters -- why? obamanut2012 Apr 30 #14
That bent probably has something to do with the fact most here want to see Biden re elected BannonsLiver Apr 30 #19
They don't have the upper hand. LiberalFighter Apr 30 #11
There is a price to be paid for stupidity LetMyPeopleVote Apr 30 #12
FAFO Swede Apr 30 #13
So the generation that never had consequences EllieBC Apr 30 #15
Freedom of Speech is not Freedom from Accountability. Lancero Apr 30 #16
Every college worth its salt Blue Idaho Apr 30 #22
The protesters want their meals catered LetMyPeopleVote Apr 30 #23
Wow. Jedi Guy Apr 30 #25
They have bathroom faucets in the building, I'm sure. tblue37 Apr 30 #27
That's insane. If you want to eat. Leave the building. jimfields33 Apr 30 #26
How about "no". Does "no" work for them? brooklynite Apr 30 #24
This makes me smile LetMyPeopleVote May 1 #28

Cha

(298,037 posts)
1. Thank you.. they went too far and found out.
Sun Apr 28, 2024, 03:02 PM
Apr 28
Andrew Bates, White House deputy press secretary, conveyed President Biden’s stance that “violent rhetoric, hate speech, and Antisemitic remarks have no place in America whatsoever.” Bates branded the statements by James as “dangerous” and “appalling,” emphasizing the need for such rhetoric to serve as a “wakeup call.”

Demsrule86

(68,800 posts)
2. They did. You can't get student loans if convicted of a crime.
Sun Apr 28, 2024, 03:12 PM
Apr 28

Many are likely to be expelled from current schools as well. And for what? We don't control Israel...one school that is currently closed because of this is already is picky with investments and they don't support Israel. During the 70s and before some got arrested. Hell, I did twice. Once Dad came and got me. And the other time Mom came and got me. I was not charged. But times are different now and I didn't assault anyone or engage in hate speech. Also, they didn't keep records like they do now. This will follow some of the protestors their entire lives-damn shame. By the way, I did burn my sister's bra in New York in the 80's. I was always big-chested so I had to wear one and couldn't sacrifice mine.

Cha

(298,037 posts)
7. Cal Poly Humboldt campus *closes* through the end of the semester
Sun Apr 28, 2024, 05:02 PM
Apr 28


They Don't Know How to Protest.. Always Attacking the Wrong People and Businesses.


I read somewhere that Cal Poly Humbolt had Nothing to do with Israel.. have you seen that?

Thank You!

Demsrule86

(68,800 posts)
8. This college doesn't give money to Israel and is very careful where they put their money.
Mon Apr 29, 2024, 01:23 PM
Apr 29

These students don't deserve amnesty.

Happy Hoosier

(7,479 posts)
21. Kids sometimes do dumb stuff.
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 03:31 PM
Apr 30

I think offering a chance to rethink the situation is called for. Those that didn't accept it have forfeited any further consideration. And tossed away an Ivy League degree.

Happy Hoosier

(7,479 posts)
4. If they were involved with violence, or hate speech? Nope. If not, then yes, with an asterisk.
Sun Apr 28, 2024, 03:36 PM
Apr 28

Any protestor that engages in or supports violence should be shown the door. It's a FAFO moment.

Same with hate speech that is at the level of calling for or otherwise justifying violence like saying "Zionists don't deserve to live." People can do say things they later regret, but some bells can't be unrung.

I'll go further and say anyone here on a temporary visa should have that visa revoked. Citizens and Permanent Residents get a bit more leeway, but even permanent residents have some restrictions on what they can advocate.

But if a student is simply engaging in civil disobedience, then I think some forbearance is called for, so long as that forbearance is not repeatedly abused. So camping and not clearing out when ordered to is not a "explision" event to me... Harrassing fellow students IS. And that goes both ways.

Beastly Boy

(9,574 posts)
6. What if civil disobedience involves violations of college rules they pledged to uphold when they applied to the college?
Sun Apr 28, 2024, 03:46 PM
Apr 28

It is a contractually agreed upon condition for them to remain Columbia students in good standing.

Happy Hoosier

(7,479 posts)
20. I think Columbia offering an amnesty was the right move.
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 03:26 PM
Apr 30

Those that declined to accept it should now be subject to disciplinary action, including suspensions and expulsion.

Beastly Boy

(9,574 posts)
5. Another example of the entitled ignorance of the protesters
Sun Apr 28, 2024, 03:41 PM
Apr 28

Amnesty does not preclude facing consequences of an offense, it is usually conditional on facing the consequences. For example, amnesty for the students may include a change in their record noting a previously recorded reprimand has been removed, usually conditional on students paying the price for their objectionable conduct. It does not, in itself, automatically restore their standing on campus to what it was prior to them committing an offense. Likewise, amnesty will not protect them from scrutiny in seeking future employment.

I hope they will take some time to understand what they want and what they can get away with. Probably a more difficult challenge than getting a passing grade in Conceptual Foundations of International Politics.

The Mouth

(3,171 posts)
9. I would be happy if every single one of these loons remains forever unemployed.
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 01:31 PM
Apr 30

All of these Hamas supporters believe this, it's just that this dolt said the quiet part out loud.

LiberalFighter

(51,345 posts)
10. We really don't want that.
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 01:43 PM
Apr 30

But they lose their chance of a degree.

A job not requiring a degree would be their option.

obamanut2012

(26,183 posts)
14. You are conflating all the protestors with Hamas supporters -- why?
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 02:09 PM
Apr 30

It is 100% not true. Not in the least.

They are also not "loons."

The anti protestor bent of DU recently is something else.

BannonsLiver

(16,545 posts)
19. That bent probably has something to do with the fact most here want to see Biden re elected
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 03:01 PM
Apr 30

And our democracy preserved while these performative cosplay demonstrators care more about Gaza, and are actively working to see that he is not re elected over a single issue that for the majority of the demonstrators has zero impact on their lives.

LiberalFighter

(51,345 posts)
11. They don't have the upper hand.
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 01:54 PM
Apr 30

The colleges could probably nullify the classes they took for that semester. And if allowed back as a student it would take a semester longer to graduate.

Require them to pay for some of the damages they created.

Put them on probation.

EllieBC

(3,052 posts)
15. So the generation that never had consequences
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 02:15 PM
Apr 30

as children is still demanding a no consequence life as adults. Shocking.

Lancero

(3,018 posts)
16. Freedom of Speech is not Freedom from Accountability.
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 02:17 PM
Apr 30

That's a lesson that a lot of people could do with learning, given how many protestors have been trying to justify their actions with "But my freedoms!" in recent years.

Their are plenty of alternatives for protest, besides walking the line - and in recent days, jumping over it entirely - on violence. Given the amount of people who support their stated goals, a general strike is not beyond reason.

Blue Idaho

(5,068 posts)
22. Every college worth its salt
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 03:32 PM
Apr 30

Has a Student Code of Conduct. Violation of this code can and usually does lead to permanant expulsion. Now guess how hard it is to gain enter to another college? Virtually impossible.

Jedi Guy

(3,288 posts)
25. Wow.
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 06:09 PM
Apr 30
I guess it's ultimately a question of what kind of community and obligation Columbia feels it has to its students. Do you want students to die of dehydration and starvation, or get severely ill even if they disagree with you? ... This is basic humanitarian aid we're asking for.

The cluelessness, the arrogance, the entitlement is just breathtaking. They took over a university building, damaging it in the process, and held university employees hostage, however briefly, and are in effect holding the campus itself hostage... and they think the university is in some way obligated to just allow them to bring in supplies to extend the duration of their stupidity indefinitely.

Hard pass. Interdict food going into the building, allow them water. Hunger strikes are a time-honored tradition of protests, after all. When they've had enough, they can come out, get arrested, and have a sandwich when they get to jail. It's not going to keep me up at night if they have rumbly tummies.

jimfields33

(16,120 posts)
26. That's insane. If you want to eat. Leave the building.
Tue Apr 30, 2024, 06:16 PM
Apr 30

If the university delivers food to them, this country is in big trouble.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»College protesters want '...