General Discussion

Tom of Temecula

(1,327 posts) Mon Apr 29, 2024, 09:36 PM Apr 29

David Frum: The Plot to Wreck the Democratic Convention

Opponents of the Iraq War gathered to disrupt the Republican National Convention in 2004. Tens of thousands of protesters gathered in New York City; some put the total as high as 200,000. A minority of the protesters disregarded police lines. More than 1,800 people were arrested. Yet the convention itself proceeded exactly as planned. President George W. Bush was renominated, and subsequently won reelection. In so doing, he became the only Republican presidential candidate to win a popular-vote majority in the 35 years since the end of the Cold War. In 2014, New York City paid $18 million to settle the legal claims of people who contended that they had been wrongly swept up in the 2004 convention arrests.

Some radical opponents of President Joe Biden hope they will have better success disrupting the Democratic National Convention in Chicago this year. They imagine they can do to a political convention what they have done at America’s prestige universities. They are almost certainly deluding themselves. Biden’s opponents have based their plans on a folk memory of events in 1968. For The Free Press, Olivia Reingold and Eli Lake reported from an activist planning meeting: “‘Have you heard that the Democratic National Convention is coming to Chicago?’ [a leader] asks the crowd. ‘Are we going to let ’em come here without a protest? This is Chicago, goddamn it—we’ve got to give them a 1968 kind of welcome.’”

In 1968, a poorly disciplined Chicago police force brutalized protesters and journalists in front of television cameras. The horrifying images symbolized a year of political upheaval that smashed forever the New Deal coalition of pro-segregation, conservative white southerners; unionized workers; northern ethnic-minority voters; and urban liberals. A Republican won the presidency in 1968—and then again in four of the next five elections.

Exactly why the utterly self-defeating tumult of Chicago ’68 excites modern-day radicals is a topic I’ll leave to the psychoanalysts. For now, never mind the why; let’s focus on the how. Is a repeat of the 1968 disruption possible in the context of 2024? Or is the stability of 2004 the more relevant precedent and probable outcome?

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/ar-AA1nR90t

5 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

David Frum: The Plot to Wreck the Democratic Convention (Original Post) Tom of Temecula Apr 29 OP

FWIW, it wasn't just at the RNC in 2004, there were also anti-war protests at the DNC in 2004 EarlG Apr 29 #1

I don't recall any significant campus uprisings in any of those years you've cited. Tom of Temecula Apr 30 #5

2004 was too close to the Saudi terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center, Pentagon and an empty field in PA. Barry Markson Apr 29 #2

This makes me feel better. Conventions are now federal "National Special Security Events". They weren't in 68. LeftInTX Apr 29 #3

there will not b another 68. take it to the bank. mopinko Apr 30 #4

EarlG

(22,031 posts)

1. FWIW, it wasn't just at the RNC in 2004, there were also anti-war protests at the DNC in 2004

Reply to Tom of Temecula (Original post)

Mon Apr 29, 2024, 09:43 PM

Apr 29

Not massive ones, but it happened.

BOSTON, Massachusetts (CNN) -- Protesters outside the Democratic National Convention skirmished briefly with police Thursday. Police reported four arrests, but not all were related to that clash.

The flare-up came on the final day of the Democratic gathering, and order was quickly restored.

Earlier, protesters burned an American flag along with a two-faced effigy of President Bush and Sen. John Kerry, who is set to claim his party's presidential nomination tonight.

Crowd size was difficult to estimate, as many journalists mingled with the protesters, but the group seemed to number about 200. Only a handful clashed with police.

https://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/07/29/dems.protest/index.html

And if anyone is worried that this must be a problem because we lost in 2004, there were even bigger anti-war protests at the DNC in 2008...

Thousands of anti-war demonstrators converged near security gates outside the Democratic National Convention hall on Wednesday, chanting slogans and asking to talk to party officials about getting U.S. troops out of Iraq.

Police in riot gear ordered the group to disperse, and after about 15 minutes many protesters drifted off. But about 400 gathered several blocks away, still within sight of the Pepsi Center, where the Democrats were nominating Barack Obama for president.

The protesters wanted to give Obama a letter asking that he agree to an immediate withdrawal of troops from Iraq, provide full health care benefits for returning troops and veterans and provide reparations to the Iraqi people for damage caused by the war.

The protest began with an anti-war concert by Rage Against the Machine and other groups, which drew about 9,000 people to the Denver Coliseum. Afterward, throngs began the four-mile march toward the Pepsi Center.

https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna26429975

Oh and also, there were anti-war protests at the DNC in 2012:

CHARLOTTE, N.C. — Hundreds of protesters marched Sunday in the first of several demonstrations planned for this week’s Democratic National Convention.

The protest was boisterous but peaceful, with police officers lining the route in this city’s Uptown area. Officers watched but did not arrest about two dozen participants who locked arms and sat in front of the Bank of America headquarters. More than 500 demonstrators railed against war, immigration policy and Wall Street, among other topics, hoisting signs with messages like “Bail Out the People Not the Banks.”

A handful held signs or wore shirts advocating for the release of Mumia Abu-Jamal, who was convicted of killing a Philadelphia police officer in 1981.

The protest fell short of the thousands expected by organizers, but the Charlotte Observer reported that as many as 90 groups are expected to demonstrate during the DNC -- many more than showed up for the Republican National Convention in Tampa, Fla. The edges of Hurricane Isaac put a damper on protest activities at the RNC.

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2012-sep-02-la-pn-dnc-protests-charlotte-20120902-story.html

It's really not that uncommon.

Tom of Temecula

(1,327 posts)

5. I don't recall any significant campus uprisings in any of those years you've cited.

Reply to EarlG (Reply #1)

Tue Apr 30, 2024, 03:06 AM

Apr 30

However, there was quite a bit of student activism in 1968. The year America first elected Richard Nixon.
What happened in Chicago only confirmed impressions a lot of people already had.

There is a precedent here. But it doesn't really involve much of what happened in 2004, 2008 or 2012.

I think we need to start asking who is going to benefit from all of this. It isn't Joe Biden. And then we need
to try and figure out why it is happening, and what is actually behind it.

Barry Markson

(280 posts)

2. 2004 was too close to the Saudi terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center, Pentagon and an empty field in PA.

Reply to Tom of Temecula (Original post)

Mon Apr 29, 2024, 10:08 PM

Apr 29

There still was a wave of misplaced anger at the Muslim world and the domestic Muslim community wasn't as large, vocal, and represented as it is today. Ilhan Omar would not have been tolerated then.

I don't recall large and growing anti-war demonstrations leading up to the conventions as has been happening since last Oct 7.

LeftInTX

(25,909 posts)

3. This makes me feel better. Conventions are now federal "National Special Security Events". They weren't in 68.

Reply to Tom of Temecula (Original post)

Mon Apr 29, 2024, 10:13 PM

Apr 29

In 1968, a poorly disciplined Chicago police force brutalized protesters and journalists in front of television cameras. The horrifying images symbolized a year of political upheaval that smashed forever the New Deal coalition of pro-segregation, conservative white southerners; unionized workers; northern ethnic-minority voters; and urban liberals. A Republican won the presidency in 1968—and then again in four of the next five elections.

Exactly why the utterly self-defeating tumult of Chicago ’68 excites modern-day radicals is a topic I’ll leave to the psychoanalysts. For now, never mind the why; let’s focus on the how. Is a repeat of the 1968 disruption possible in the context of 2024? Or is the stability of 2004 the more relevant precedent and probable outcome?

From 1968 to today, responsibility for protecting political conventions has shifted from cities and states to the federal government. This new federal responsibility was formalized in a directive signed by President Bill Clinton in 1998. The order created a category of “National Special Security Events,” for which planning would be led by the Secret Service.

National Security Special Events draw on all the resources of the federal government, including, if need be, those of the Defense Department. In 2016, the federal government spent $50 million on security for each of the two major-party conventions.

mopinko

(70,428 posts)

4. there will not b another 68. take it to the bank.

Reply to Tom of Temecula (Original post)

Tue Apr 30, 2024, 12:08 AM

Apr 30

every elected in chgo is gonna throw themselves into the line of fire if shit breaks out.
protesters r gonna b very disappointed.
i wish i cd find a pic from the 03 protests. it was a solid blue wall.
and btw, the city paid out $6m to protesters that yr. we’re tired of that shit.

Reply to this discussion

Kick in to the DU tip jar?

This week we're running a special pop-up mini fund drive. From Monday through Friday we're going ad-free for all registered members, and we're asking you to kick in to the DU tip jar to support the site and keep us financially healthy.

As a bonus, making a contribution will allow you to leave kudos for another DU member, and at the end of the week we'll recognize the DUers who you think make this community great.