contrary to the facts that they've still got the power, physical, financial, political, every way.

if anyone would have fear it would the countless numbers raped, molested, beaten, intimidated and controlled.... women. and yet... we keep on keeping on. i do not get this argument that men are fearful. there was a man trying to explain it but we didnt have a chance to really get into it.

I think it has more to do with love of power. Harassment (and worse) makes the attacker feel powerful. People who need to feel powerful look for those who will be easy victims. Women, being generally smaller than men, and socialized to be empathetic, non-confrontational, etc., make easier victims.

The overlap between sexuality, excitement and bad behavior increases the appeal for men of victimizing women.


As our society and world become more chaotic and threatening, people will act out their rage, fear and despair even more.

literally, point blank and from more than a few, and for a long time. but your point absolutely is right on.

the way it was being said was a personal fear of women. i do not get that. thanks.

The part about power and control I think misses the point.

I don't agree with the whole article, but this part is well-said:

it is the fear of power and control. i get that one, though never experienced, nor would i allow for a new york minute. but, i do understand the fear of loss of power.

your piece is stating it is a fear of loss of control. so that basically would be reinforcing what the others say on this thread.

i do not get a general fear of women though. if that is the case, that is what i want to understand. fear of what?

It is about having or losing control of a single aspect of a woman's persona, the part that is associated with procreation.

cause he is jealous? cause she can do and he cant?

what are you talking about?

my mind is very good at seeing these things. this is one i am not seeing at all, so you gotta help

The whole concept is terrifying to some folks.

as i said, i was in the middle of this with another man and was called away. never got back to him.

it wasnt about preg. cause he was talking how men were fearful, and hard to meet up. so not even close to being preg situation. but then again. someone said.... men are fearful of women by being laughed at, women are fearful about violence.

so, ... the meeting up fearful would be rejection or laughed at.

but then, why wouldnt women hold the same kind of fear in that situation.

i dunno

thanks.

There are a lot of ways to get hurt, including getting laughed at or rejected. So the payoff has to be good or no one would play at all. So we're wired a certain way in order that the species won't die out. I believe that for some men the control thing makes it all much safer.

I think my point is that trying to separate this huge payoff from the methods that are employed to achieve it is not seeing the whole picture. But I'm not really sure any more what my point is.

There seems to be a lot of conflation going on about what seem to me to be completely separate issues. In this case, in response to the subject of this particular OP, I think the whole point is about sex and making it somehow safer/easier-to-deal-with for scared old white men.

but when I think of the famous quote, "Men fear women will laugh at them; women fear men will kill them", it doesn't support the fear of women excuse.

Claiming "fear of women" gives the guilty parties a rationalization. Claiming we make them afraid allows them to live with themselves and takes the focus off of what they do. It makes it easier to blame the person you victimized, dehumanized, or simply humiliated.

What they DO, is ENJOY the power rush. Objectifying women fits that whole psychological scenario. It is easy to enjoy the tingle in your groin when you ogle anonymous T&A.

not having these types of men in my life... well, lol. you can read that post, lol. to sheshe.

thanks

i couldnt see anything to fear, like women have.

It's fear of losing power & authority.

Laughing and rejection. you see some here them here whining about how the hot girls get to pick and choose men (implying - not them), if they find their behavior creepy it's not fair, or that they need to be concerned about their height, or lack of hair. It's as if they are tortured by not having their choice of female partners, and it is bizarre how they resent ALL women for it. It is definitely an MRA thing that has crept into this place. Fucking sad.

thankfully, they really are a minority….the ones that are obviously showing some kind of personality disorder.

there's one who is gay, but still shows up to get in his digs at women. Impresses me as Narcissistic Personality Disorder, but of course, I can't diagnose. Just shows a lot of typical traits.

horrible women their Moms were -trading notes on their neglect. It was sad, but it's even sadder that they deal with it by lashing out here. I bet they don't even see the connection.

my mother could probably beat theirs any day. I've got loads of issues (that I've worked hard to improve, and always will), but being mean to people isn't one of them.

"ah hah!" but I genuinely felt sorry for those two. now I just consider them scared little children. I can't help them, but I can't take them seriously either.

Well said.

It boils down to power. And the desire to keep it. It leads to a no holds barred mentality in those who feel threatened by women, LGBTs, minorities, etc.

The fear is of losing power.

And they don't understand that.

Maybe it is that they are just weak and feel stronger and more manly in their abuse. Glad I had the sense to walk away from mine after a few short years of marriage.

was being said to me, is i have never been around a man that had this issue. and also no man that feared women, anymore than i fear man. so i had blinders. but, ya... talking about the man that is fearful of no longer having control, and losing her... the harder he controls and holds on. it is a different kind of man than i know.

is that what you are talking about?

to have never been around a man that had this issue.

Yes indeed, in a nutshell, that is what I was saying.

I've interacted with a few, but always had the strength to walk away. The men in my life are honest, decent human beings (as I believe most men are)who respect women as equals.. but the men who are influencing our lives negatively every day are in the state legislatures, the Congress, the justice department, the Supreme Court and in control of most corporate boards.

It's time for another militant feminist movement in America. We've become too complacent.

at the Denver Planned Parenthood and has seen the ugly face of suppression of women up close and personal. We're hitting the road this summer.

that man that supports you.

now that America is becoming too diverse for their tastes.

wanna run with me???

to repel attacks against ground we considered long ago secured

Sometimes they might really hope to re-conquer the territory; and sometimes they might just be throwing red meat to rightwing wacko ideologues in order to keep them in the Republican camp

But there's another possibility that might explain some of the proposals: if they can keep us fighting on the rear, our efforts are split, and fewer people notice the rightwing successes elsewhere

The Reagan administration was very good at something like this: Reagan would stand up and say this incredibly ignorant stuff, and we'd all mobilize against what he said -- but it was often a distraction, that had us paying close attention to the Empty Suit At The Podium while all this other ugly stuff happening in the background went unnoticed

Here in my state in the 1990s, the Republicans introduced bills (say) to sell off state parks to developers and to eliminate zoning laws. There's no doubt some developers would have liked to have the state park land or that some libertarians would have been delighted to see zoning laws perish. There was also no doubt that we could win these fights if we organized -- so we organized and won. But it still sucked up a lot of time and effort that could have been spent making real progress, instead of holding onto prior gains -- and I started to wonder if that weren't their real point

The anti-feminist ideologues, of course, are still out there and still eager to rollback past advances in women's rights. And IMO these are fights we can win -- so we must fight back when the attacks are serious. But it's also worth pausing a moment to ask what exactly motivates this particular attack? because there's always the possibility that it's a strategic distraction

Let me add that I have very little use for Naomi Wolf, who seems to me more an opportunist than a feminist: she rather disgusted me, for example, with her claim that the sexual assault charges, against Assange, were politically motivated. I don't know whether the charges would stand up in Swedish court -- but neither does Wolf. My ultimate impression was she made her claim simply to get attention

---rings true.

Keep us all divided and disallow progress on any front.

All progressive groups have to fight together.

Attack in areas thought secure, in an effort to stall the advance of women's equality.
It's an effort to swiss cheese the equality support network with constant backfilling.

We are seeing issues that we thought had been fought out, now being "zombie-fied."

We're not going to forget history because we don't want to repeat it.

most of what they gained was taken from them after the revolution was over.

....wait,...let me rephrase that...

or so I heard on BBC this morning. Women and younger sons got a share of the family inheritances, especially in Normandy, which was very "first son" oriented...and that didn't go away with Napoleon.

Not for Naomi "Nail Polish" Wolf.

Please run rampant and revolutionize this place! Please give me matriarchy! As a father of 3 strong, progressive daughters--and recently grandfather to another beautiful girl--I'm so totally fed up with the male-dominated status quo. Seriously--you go, girl(S)!! Founding "Fathers" be damned, women will save this country--I have no doubt. Girls rule--and they will rule.

Your daughters are the next generation. We fight this together!

One of the best for our women in life's journey is the respect and worth fathers give daughters.

AND

We do not need to rule the world and are quite capable of greed and corruption... But I am all for women taking a shot at it every chance we get.

Go woman... Is right

Oh and welcome

If only.

I know, right?

Oh well back to real life...

Just ask my mom!

There's always fear involved with change.

What women are, in many cases is pissed off. There's not a day go that goes by where I don't find a article where a women in-- usually--some non-traditional role has spoken up about something-- this is the Information Age, followed by subsequent rape and death threats. From philosophy to gaming to physics.

The hope is the up and coming generations will be more comfortable with the rate of change, the redefining of gender and gender roles, because it's not going to slow down.

The hope is also that the 50% of us in this country, women, that are pissed off will vote.

The right has made their stand and I firmly believe that they have created a wave that they never expected to see. I see women pissed and rising. The up and coming generations will be vigilant, yet I believe that we have a chance to strike a mortal blow now.

We need to vote as if our lives depended upon it, and indeed they do.

when you realize that a lot of women are uncomfortable with the rapid change, too, especially women who were born too soon to take advantage of much of it. They long for the good old days when you didn't have to think about what to do or which choice to make because you were automatically chuted into your life because you were a woman.

I took advantage of all the changes, but I do understand a lot of the women who couldn't, who were already tied down with homes and children and the heavy labor that came with them.

We have to find a way to talk with these women and bring them along with us. It's easier if they have daughters. It's not impossible if they have sons.

And as frustrated as I get with politics-- they shape lives and I'm never giving up

(and I work with tons of women-- RN here---I'm very vocal, and bring up voting were it needs to be brought up)

Really.

Men have failed the nation. In positions of power, men everywhere, from the very top to the bottom, have failed. Time to give women the job of running the nation.

But not Hillary. Hillary cannot address the problems of corporate control of the election and legislative process. She has been a part of it.

The world would benefit if Women had more control, more say in the priorities in government, more representation in decision making etc.

Yes, the "good 'ol boys" fear women!! They only finance/promote women that are nuts enough to do as they are told such as Palin, Bachmann & the like.

Last edited Mon Feb 17, 2014, 03:19 PM - Edit history (1)

That would be a refreshing change.

I'm trying to raise my daughter to question authority (including mine), question beauty images, and to understand that she is capable of doing anything that she wants to do in life despite what the assholes of the world tell her.

I have 16 1/2 y/o twins.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Birds are territorial creatures.
The lyrics to the songbird's melodious trill go something like this:
"Stay out of my territory or I'll PECK YOUR GODDAMNED EYES OUT!"[/center][/font][hr]

Why do you ask?

It's like they sit around and obsess about all of this stuff all day everyday. I don't know how. It seems like an unhealthy obsession. You'd think that they might have other more important things to deal with like, oh, I don't know, putting people to work, making sure people have access to affordable health care and other things that, you know, could help people?

Women are just too damn smart!

in the new War on Women. The numbers of "reality"television shows featuring narcissistic harpies, gold diggers, criminal psychopaths and character disordered women have proliferated in the last 5 years or so. The Kardashians, Jersey Shore, the multiplying Housewives series, Bad Girls, Mob Wives, NBA Wives, Bridezilla, the ID channel and others are popularizing a stereotype of women that is extreme and grotesque and all over cable television. I can think of no corollary shows that feature similarly insulting characterizations of men. Maybe it makes it easier to see women as needing to be controlled when you see so many of them out of control on television.

The media have a unbelievable influence on our society & now that they are corporately controlled, it is profit above all else, including decency. It is alarming. I have not seen the shows you mention, but I am amazed at the number of them. But people watch them, not even aware of how they are being conditioned.

From another thread where the OP suggested that objectification of men is equal to the objectification of women.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4510273

This is standard fare in our media & it is revolting. We have no standards anymore. There is an attitude that because we are free to do something we should & then push it to it's extreme. That's what's happened in porn. I cannot believe what passes for porn today compared to back in the 70s. It's disgusting.

I'm just happy to be a human being and I would like all human beings to be equal. Period.

she's stupid and simplistic.

I think it's basically a matter of a political party -- the Greedy, Obstructionist Polecat party --following their usual playbook of ginning up social issues to attract the fundy morons and other self righteous paleos to gain a political edge.

They're probably amping it up because they've acquired enough power to give their payoff to their deluded social conservative base.

But the good news (I hope) is that enough average Americans are moving away from the basis of their "social consrvative message" that it may well backfire on the GOP.

I hope so anyway.

...actually addressing what is to be done about all these nasty bills.