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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsNYTimes Nate Cohn: "No, Hillary Clinton would not benefit from a primary fight."
It's an argument that we often see around here -- that Hillary Clinton's candidacy would be strengthened by a vigorous primary fight.
Nate Cohn doesn't buy it.
And he makes sense. Having to fight off attacks from the left during primary season isn't going to help strengthen HRC for the attacks she'll face from the right, once she's campaigning in the general.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/14/upshot/hillary-clinton-doesnt-need-a-primary-fight.html?mabReward=CTM&action=click&pgtype=Homepage®ion=CColumn&module=Recommendation&src=rechp&WT.nav=RecEngine&abt=0002&abg=0
Mr. MacGillis argues that it would be better for Democrats to reckon with their true feelings about Mrs. Clinton in the primary rather than in the general election. That may be true on matters of style on the hyper-cautious answers or disingenuous efforts to align herself with the moods of the moment that Mr. MacGillis cites. But on the more substantive matters, a credible and vigorous primary challenger would be the single likeliest thing to increase Democratic dissatisfaction with her candidacy. It would involve a full year of a liberal Democrat and allies reminding liberal Democrats of all of the reasons they thought Mrs. Clinton was a problematic candidate in the first place.
Mrs. Clinton has a good chance of fending off these charges with a unified Democratic Party. Republicans wont attack her for being overly hawkish on national security, and Democrats wont countenance a Republican like Jeb Bush or Scott Walker attacking Mrs. Clinton on her ties to Wall Street. Controversies about the Clintons like over the Clinton Foundation or her email account are far less likely to take hold if Democrats defend her.
But without a unified party, she could face recurring and resonant attacks on all of those issues. Though it probably wouldnt be as bad as what Mr. Romney faced, it could also be worse. After a year of being characterized as a Wall Street hack, or a warmonger with low-grade corruption issues, Mrs. Clinton could face a Ralph Nader-like third-party challenge, which generally becomes likelier after a party has held the White House for consecutive terms.
SNIP
Her total political experience entering the 2016 contest is probably more akin to that of an incumbent president than anything else. Did Presidents Obama or Bush or Clinton struggle in the general elections in 2012, 2004 and 1996 because they werent tested in the primaries? It may have hurt them a little bit in the first debate. But incumbent presidents tend to fare pretty well in presidential elections, and I dont remember too much talk about the trouble they faced getting back into playing shape.
SNIP
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)Guess what? It's still BULLSHIT.
We want democracy, not a %$@%# coronation.
This reminds me of the 2000 judicial coup d'etat. The Supremes awarded the election to Junior based on their finding that further vote counting would be detrimental to him. That notion was bullshit then and is bullshit now.
pnwmom
(109,020 posts)if our candidate is weakened by a pummeling in primary season.
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)I hate it when that happens.
Cosmic Kitten
(3,498 posts)Didn't you get the message?
She's gonna be our "champion".
Democrats don't have to
"earn" voters support.
What are we gonna do?
Vote republican
<sarcasm>
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)IT WILL BE HER! THIS TIME. I MEAN IT. REALLY.
Cosmic Kitten
(3,498 posts)We must all vote harder for her this time!
Vote like we really mean it, and it matters!
No half-hearted, lesser of two-evils votes!
We need to vote as hard as we can to win!
SHE is counting on US!
840high
(17,196 posts)Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)They put something in your drink, you nod off, and when you finally wake up, Bam! You're shocked to learn the primary is already over.
It's happened to me on a couple of occasions
arcane1
(38,613 posts)Like last time
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)Run
Elizabeth
Run
pnwmom
(109,020 posts)And she's written a letter urging HRC to run.
But go ahead, keep thinking she's a liar.
mimi85
(1,805 posts)We get it, you're for Mrs. Clinton.
pnwmom
(109,020 posts)who are so sure she doesn't mean what she so clearly says.
Do you see HRC's avatar on my post? I haven't committed to anyone yet -- except for the Democratic nominee, whoever that is.
But so far I haven't seen anyone formally commit to the process except for HRC.
mimi85
(1,805 posts)AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)with that sleight of hand re: the letter. EW straightened that fib out; you will note the Clinton campaign dropped that claim.
And Elizabeth is not running ... until she does. Plenty of pols have changed (or made up) their minds. It's a distinct possibility.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,123 posts)AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)mimi85
(1,805 posts)And what polls? Not happy or unhappy about it, just curious - which gets me in trouble frequently. Sounds like EW is your choice. One can wish.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)Suggesting she have no opposition and just sashay to the nomination is undemocratic in the most repugnant way. Here's what Father Pfleger had to say in 2008 about that sense of entitlement.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)SNL had a great joke with a lot of truth last week.
Something to the effect HRC led all possible primary candidates with 60+% of vote.. The next best was at 3%, and was named MARGIN OF ERROR.
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)Remember the splitscreen Obama-Hillary spot from 2008?
video @ http://www.ebaumsworld.com/video/watch/759670/
---------------------------------------
And Amy Poehler as Hillary Clinton:
video @ http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/message-from-hillary-clinton/n12241
deutsey
(20,166 posts)Is that the state of our alleged "democratic process"?
We don't dare raise issues or put forth candidates that might hurt a presumptive candidate?
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,716 posts)pnwmom
(109,020 posts)Autumn
(45,120 posts)The American people may be the ones to benefit if a Democrat ran who is interested in economic equality.
pnwmom
(109,020 posts)in the general won't do us any good.
Autumn
(45,120 posts)So this author of the piece is an idiot
peacebird
(14,195 posts)She is doing small events with precleared syncophants. She has not put out her positions, and frankly her attempts to sound populist ring as false as her call to have a constitutional amendment to stop the money machine in elections - knowing a constitutional amendment will take close to a decade and she won't have any more elections by the time it passes, and she knows it has a snowballs chance in hell OF passing. But she can claim she is doing something.
winter is coming
(11,785 posts)Cosmic Kitten
(3,498 posts)The worst part is...
she would be "damaged"
by a debate!?!
Is she really that out of step
with Democratic values?
Apparently she has nothing
to inspire or ignite the Party?
So it's all about damage control.
pathetic really
Logical
(22,457 posts)1. Don't complain about Hillary
2. The DU needs to 100% support Hillary
3. Stop wishing for another Democrat to run
I cannot imagine a right wing GOP supporter being any more controlling that you are.
Wow, talk about getting sick of Hillary! You are making it easy.
mimi85
(1,805 posts)Hell Hath No Fury
(16,327 posts)to have competition in her quest, but it WOULD benefit the Democratic Party.
pnwmom
(109,020 posts)if she faces opposition during the primary.
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)It lengthens the campaign exposure in ways that can be very productive. The assumption that it will be so contentious it damages the nominee for the general is not necessarily true. Answering uncomfortable questions during primary season leaves room to focus on what matters during the general.
Hell Hath No Fury
(16,327 posts)No, I didn't. I said it would make the PARTY stronger. There is a difference.
pnwmom
(109,020 posts)HRC for the general.
treestar
(82,383 posts)whatchamacallit
(15,558 posts)In all the pompom waving some of us have forgotten it's NOT about Hillary, it's about US electing the best president we can. True, a primary won't make her run easier, but that's fucking democracy. Between the taint of money and the singleminded drive to win, it's getting pretty totalitarian up in here.
tularetom
(23,664 posts)by forcing a platform that is truly representative of the concerns and aspirations of the 99%.
Hillary Clinton is auditioning to be our employee, it isn't up to us to make it easy for her. It's up to her to prove to us that she is worthy of our trust.
If she's too much of a wimp to tell us how she proposes to do the things we expect her to do, she's too much of a wimp to actually do them.
Johonny
(20,918 posts)Hell Bradley ran against Gore. It wasn't much of a fight and probably the lack of interest resulted in the worst Democratic VP nomination of our lifetime. So why does Hillary get a free pass and, Hell, why wouldn't the democrats use the free publicity to get name recognition to younger candidates for VP and future elections? The primary used to be a place to show case talent.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)in the primary. It's probably good to at least have some nominal opposition, if only for PR reasons.
arcane1
(38,613 posts)I still do.
polichick
(37,152 posts)Hell Hath No Fury
(16,327 posts)Yup, unless there is a challenge there will be only one voice heard on a national level. NEVER a good idea, especially if there is any intention of moving a Party/country in a different direction.
treestar
(82,383 posts)arcane1
(38,613 posts)CanadaexPat
(496 posts)So a contested primary would help her on that score.
davidn3600
(6,342 posts)pnwmom
(109,020 posts)They're the ones deciding to "give" her the nomination, if that's what happens. And I won't have a problem with that.
lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)I want to win the GE with the most populist/progressive candidate we can find.
hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)mylye2222
(2,992 posts)In 2014, 2004, and 1996 since they were already sitting presudents seeking a second term...
Well completly disagree with this columnist. A primary challenge, and I mean a real one, will benefit BOTH HRC and her challengers. Everyone will present his/her vision and there will be an healthy exchange .
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)As it is, she is totally undefined.
Her video articulated nothing, just that she wants to be our champion.
And I think she won't offer many specific actions or solid positions unless she's challenged to in honest debates.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)Somebody running against Hillary, will make Hillary's run harder ???
Wouldn't THAT be the point ???
It called...an opponent.
pnwmom
(109,020 posts)Ruby the Liberal
(26,219 posts)Savannahmann
(3,891 posts)Citizens you will elect me! I will be your leader!
Logical
(22,457 posts)840high
(17,196 posts)NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)Don't resist.
Resistance is FUTILE!
pnwmom
(109,020 posts)Just don't be one of those who pretend Hillary would be better off with a challenger.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Don't worry, you can and will to continue to complain. And be victimized by all those supporters pushing back.
Proud Liberal Dem
(24,450 posts)Who will be running against her in the primary? He or she has not declared so what will happen if nobody else declares?v And I don't believe in having a primary for primary sake. I want candidates whom are in it to win it, not somebody trying to "make a point".
Cha
(297,877 posts)freshwest
(53,661 posts)It has nothing to do with attacks from the right, except there is a lot of this going on right now:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/110215862
For Democrats to resist it, they will have to truly know the platform. That is what is going to beat the right. A debate hashing it out in a respectful manner will be a plus.
What we see online is childish garbage being strewn about and any serious Democratic candidate will not indulge in demagoguery or slander. It's what goes on in online forums since they are anonymous.
Our candidates have a reputation and careers to be maintain and won't do it.
So I want a primary. It will put people's minds at rest and allow an informed decision.
cali
(114,904 posts)marmar
(77,102 posts)And is the election about "benefiting Hillary" or benefiting the public? The public always benefits when there's a healthy exchange of ideas, not a lockstep march toward coronation.
pnwmom
(109,020 posts)And being challenged from the left won't help HRC fight off attacks from the right.
treestar
(82,383 posts)the more ammunition the other party gets. Voodoo economics for instance. That was said during the primary.
Many of the attacks on Obama by McCain's supporters were things Hillary had brought up first.