General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWould it be fair to compare a Bernie
candidacy to the prior Kucinich candidacy for president?
Zorra
(27,670 posts)the right time.
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)still_one
(92,454 posts)Vermont, you do not identify with a party. There are Conservative Democrats, Liberal Democrats, Moderate Democrats, and Bernie is a Socialist Democrat
Bernie is also running as a Democrat, and just like Pattrick Leahy he will be recognized as a Democrat because he identifies himself as such
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)Sen. Patrick Leahy....DEMOCRAT from Vermont!
Sanders runs for office as an independentbut caucuses with the Democratic Party and is counted as a Democrat for purposes of committee assignments. He was the only independent member of the House during most of his service and is the longest-serving independent in U.S. Congressional history. Since January 2015, Sanders has been the Ranking Democratic Member on the Senate Budget Committee.[5]
still_one
(92,454 posts)Democrat, and he will be on the ballot as a Democrat. Kinda bothers you doesn't it?
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)But you are right....they DO renounce and become a MEMBER of another party all the time. Unless Bernie says he is no longer an Independent (you understand what that means right) then he is not a Democrat.
Do you think he will run for his Senate seat if he loses this Primary as a Democrat?
still_one
(92,454 posts)changes his affiliation later that is hypothetical
As I said, people have changed back and forth their party all the time
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)otherwise he is STILL an Independent. PERIOD!
You don't have to BE a Democrat to run in the Democratic Primary...therefore just running in it...doesn't automatically make you one!
and he runs as an Independent in Vermont...(unlike Sen. Pat Leahy...Democrat from Vermont)
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)At what point does this become embarrassing to you?
MADem
(135,425 posts)That's what's on record with the FEC. For now, anyway.
He might change that when he files to run for President, but he hasn't done it yet.
People here at DU don't seem to understand that it doesn't matter what "Vermont" says about VOTERS, when people run for NATIONAL office, they have to file with the Federal Election Commission, and they have to declare a party affiliation on FEC Form 2. That's why Pat Leahy is a Democrat, Howard Dean ran for President as a DEMOCRAT, and Jim Jeffords was a Republican, until he switched parties.
It's not simply a "Because I say so" thing, there's a formal process associated with it.
LWolf
(46,179 posts)working for the people the Democratic Party is supposed to serve than some other prominent Democrats. And, of course, he's running in the real Democratic Primaries.
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)but it doesn't make him a Democrat....
and you see...you CAN run in the Democratic Primary and not be a Democrat....so UNLESS Bernie renounces his Independent Party cred.....and proclaims he IS an ACTUAL Democrat....he still isn't one.
Do you really think if he loses the Primary he will run for his Senate seat next election as a Democrat?
LWolf
(46,179 posts)that position on issues should trump cheer leading for a political party for voters with any integrity. I think Bernie is as good a Democrat the party's got, whether he registers that way or not. I think that if the Democratic Party allows him to run in the Democratic Primary, you've got nothing. I think you know that, but your perpetual need to engage in simple-minded arguments in a futile effort to "win" when it's simply not in your wheelhouse is going to continue to provide entertainment for many.
still_one
(92,454 posts)would wish otherwise
In Vermont you do not declare party affiliation when registering.
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)He isn't....just running in the Primary doesn't make you one if you have been running in elections for years as an Independent. Pretty simple concept...
And by the way...Senator Patrick Leahy...Democrat from Vermont....Check MATE!
Sanders runs for office as an independent but caucuses with the Democratic Party and is counted as a Democrat for purposes of committee assignments. He was the only independent member of the House during most of his service and is the longest-serving independent in U.S. Congressional history. Since January 2015, Sanders has been the Ranking Democratic Member on the Senate Budget Committee.[5]
Do you honestly believe that if he loses this Primary he will go home and suddenly start running as a Democrat?
morningfog
(18,115 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)failure to recognize....
you claimed you cannot register as a Democrat and therefore Bernie COULD NOT be a Democrat...unfortunately for your little theory...Senator Pat Leahy IS a member of the Democratic Party from Vermont.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Why? What is your point?
840high
(17,196 posts)morningfog
(18,115 posts)smokey nj
(43,853 posts)It'll go from "IS NOT" to "WAS NOT." I have to go and get more Tylenol.
immoderate
(20,885 posts)--imm
LWolf
(46,179 posts)They are both better than the status quo neoliberals they ran, and are running, against.
Sanders has better ability to get broad support.
Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)still_one
(92,454 posts)and though I probably would not use the word dork for Dennis, he sure does not explain things as clearly as Bernie
Zorra
(27,670 posts)Was it the fact that he voted against Bush's Iraq War, or maybe that he was the leader of the House Democrats against the Iraq War, that you find to be dorky?
by Dennis Kucinich
Unilateral military action by the United States against Iraq is unjustified, unwarranted, and illegal. The Administration has failed to make the case that Iraq poses an imminent threat to the United States.
There is no credible evidence linking Iraq to 9/11. There is no credible evidence linking Iraq to Al Qaeda. Nor is there any credible evidence that Iraq possesses deliverable weapons of mass destruction, or that it intends to deliver them against the United States.
snip---
America cannot and should not be the world's policeman. America cannot and should not try to pick the leaders of other nations. Nor should America and the American people be pressed into the service of international oil interests and arms dealers.
We must work to bring Iraq back into the community of nations, not through destruction, but through constructive action worldwide. We can help negotiate a resolution with Iraq that encompasses unfettered inspections, the end of sanctions, and the cessation of the regime-change policy.
We have the power to do this. We must have the will to do this. It must be the will of the American people expressed through the direct action of peaceful insistence.
http://www.progressive.org/node/1424
tritsofme
(17,412 posts)He is a more grown up marginally more credible version of Kucinich. I don't think anyone can say with straight face or a clear mind that his chances are any better.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)But your comparison is not without warrant. They are very similar on the issues and the concerns they raise.
But just on style, presentation, and national recognition I think Bernie will be a stronger candidate.
In some ways Kucinich was actually further to the left, or more of an impossible candidate.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)We pretty much think we know this won't turn out the way we want it to. But, what the hell - like we can do anything else?
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)maybe not politics but what they bring/bought to the primary and candidacy.
Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)I think Bernie has deeper ties to more constituent groups. I don't have any info on how he stacks up in terms of success in getting bills passed. I seem to remember that was one of the criticisms of DK--he had good ideas, but not many of them made it into law? Memory fades.
arcane1
(38,613 posts)Though I did donate to him and slap stickers all over the place for him
Then again, there were a few differing factors: "social media" as such didn't really exist back then (and Sanders is really getting around on social media!), and the war in Iraq was a very specific thing to be opposed to, and with a repub president. Today, we have "income inequality" as a thing to be opposed to, but it's more multifaceted and less specific than the war was.
In terms of how far left they are, it's pretty close!
Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)wait till they get through with him....
actually I think he is running interference for Hillary!
NightWatcher
(39,343 posts)merrily
(45,251 posts)dsc
(52,169 posts)Kucinich had, in a very high profile way, changed his views on abortion and gay rights which made anyone who cared about those issues rather suspicious that it was a rather convenient conversion. Sanders also has been in the Congress for coming up on 30 years and in the Senate for over a decade. That said, I think he has an uphill fight ahead of him.
Zorra
(27,670 posts)betsuni
(25,687 posts)but some sort of avuncular confidence and integrity that one can trust. He's always in control, never lets anyone lead him off message. He also seems to be gaff-proof. I think a good ticket would be Hillary running for president, appealing to older voters and maybe even a few conservatives, and Bernie as VP, popular with younger voters who might not ordinarily vote.
Marr
(20,317 posts)seabeyond
(110,159 posts)the reception of public perception?
tell me marr. how are the anti clinton people doing in their criticism of clinton? logo? really?
i am beyond flabbergasted after a good year of watching a good group of duers trash clinton now making comments like you are making.
sander supporter here? i am pretty sure he can handle this. if this is how his campaign is going to look, i am not seeing what i had hope in possibilities for him and us.
are dems, regardless who they challenge, suppose to only praise sanders?
Marr
(20,317 posts)No candidate is going to be free from heat and criticism around here-- Hillary least of all. But she's perceived (and promoted) as being in the lead. So making these sorts of mocking, back-handed, derogatory posts looks worse. Criticize his policies and votes if you can-- absolutely. But this is just mockery.
If a sports team is presumed to be going to the playoffs, then mocking the underdogs is only going to make people hope that leading team loses.
Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)All's 'fair' in love and war. So feel free to compare Sanders to Kucinich. I'll compare Hillary 'Bosnian sniper fire' Clinton to Brian 'Chopper RPG' Williams.
JI7
(89,279 posts)seabeyond
(110,159 posts)cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)Only a fool or an idiot would do that.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Can you imagine this phrase being reality: " Fox News contributor Bernie Sanders?"
lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)steve2470
(37,457 posts)instead of batting it away with contempt or with grace... I knew he was toast. Ok, we can all debate UFO's but MOST Americans see that as crazymoonbat stuff. He was toast. Sorry Mr. Kucinich.
Jamaal510
(10,893 posts)that they think Bernie is "adorable for an old guy" for whatever weird reason...
I was sitting there thinking
I have my classes at Humboldt with some of the most colorful characters.
lamp_shade
(14,846 posts)Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)agenda driven.... looking back can be so amusing.