... so can Bernie Sanders.

Wow, Scuba, that is a contender for post of the week.

That's a touch harsh.

Please remember that Mrs. Clinton may not be perfect, but she is far from a present-day Republican.

(And please dont attack me for trying to temper the mood now and then: if you mean to convince others, a tempered tone and reasoned arguments will go a lot further toward achieving your goal. By contrast, you may well do Mr. Sanders a disfavour by too much "fervor" in attacks on his primary opponents.)

Respectfully,

Betty.

n/t

The corporate mafia and the Wall St puppets are suppose to choose the candidates for each Party.
Its the big show for them
They have chosen Hillary as the Democratic candidate and whom ever the Koch Brothers decide for the Republicans since they are the probably the deciding vote.

So for these corporatists, Bernie Sanders is throwing a wrench into their well oiled machine and they don't know what to do about it.

"So for these corporatists, Bernie Sanders is throwing a wrench into their well oiled machine and they don't know what to do about it"

I love it!

there's nobody better than him!

and explain to it why they are doing it all wrong.

but personally I prefer that they don't.

They accepted him in the DNC knowing exactly why he was never a Dem, knowing exactly how he caucuses with them and helped them, knowing he was not, or can not change his status to Democrat. I don't think he held them at gun point, do you?
So they accepted him as a part of the organization with all that entails. I doubt he made a deal that he would meekly be grateful. Come on. These people have known him for years.

They turned him down as was their right. I would sure rather see more debates but that is not going to happen now. Oddly I have not heard disgust or anger or anything really from them about this. My guess is it was a request that was denied and that was that.

coulda sworn I read Bernie registered with the party just before tossing his hat in the race. ???

He could move to another state and register, but then people would call him a carpetbagger.

... and basically help the Republicans win! It would seem from what is being said here, many here would rather a corporatist Republican be president than a populist Bernie!

Fortunately, it would seem that Bernie hates the idea of him running help a Republican win, which is why he's running in the Democratic Primary given the way the system is rigged towards only one of the two major parties winning, and those controlling them controlling our government that some here don't seem to have a nproblem with that so many other Americans do (and not necessarily just liberals and Democrats), that Bernie represents!

Pardon him for not just STFU when he perceives this process being corrupt to favor corporate candidates, the same way that the League of Women Voters objected to the two parties manipulating their administration of the debates back in 1988 too.

building and networking within the Democratic Party on a national level?

He has relationship building within the Congress on a level slightly above that of a Republican working with Democrats to get legislation past.

He has not built any sort of relationships within the party itself on a national level. He has no inroads into state party structures whatsoever. He hasn't spent decades raising funds for Democratic candidates at all levels all across the country.

Simply because he caucuses with Democrats in Congress really has no effect whatsoever on interparty politics on a national level. Never has and never will. It is far more complicated than that and Bernie has precisely ZERO EXPERIENCE with the Democratic Party on a national level.

It is not a bold statement to say he is inept at the sort of interparty relationships required to run a presidential campaign. He's never had to deal with that sort of networking or relationship building.

Empty, patently false bullshit at that, dear.

You have asked me to prove a negative.

Bernie has never done that sort of relationship building. Never. Not once.

He has built some relationships within the Congress, but as an outsider. Much like Jim Jeffords.

He has NEVER done the campaign trail for fundraising.

He has no interparty chops, no fundraising chops, not relationships at the state level.

Cry all you want, you cannot alter reality. Bernie Sanders is not now nor has he ever been a Democrat, thus he doesn't have what it takes to win the presidency as a Democratic Candidate.

the Progressive Caucus, which is in fact the largest Democratic caucus within the Congress with 68 or 69 members currently. This caucus was established in Bernie's first term in the House along with a few good Democrats, two of which are still in the House, Peter DeFazio and Maxine Waters. They have been in the caucus they founded since 1992.

Yeah, he doesn't know anything about inter-party politics.

You left out thos two important words.

He doesn't have four decades to get it right.

She's never even RUN for president before.

I remember when she ran for the Democratic Party NOMINATION, but didn't win. I don't recall her running for president. Was it as an independent?

He asked for something very reasonable and it's amazing to watch the reaction to a simple request. Rather than say 'you know that's a great idea, we'll show up all those Republicans in these debates, you would think he had to start a war or something.

This is about the Democratic nominee for president.

It is ALL ABOUT THE PARTY!

The race for the Democratic Nomination is a party event. To fuck with interlopers and outsiders, this is the Democratic Party and we will proceed with whatsoever is best for the party.

all the name calling in the world won't alter the realities of what is best for this country.

There is a whole year ahead before the nomination and you would do well not to insult the intelligence of others of us within the party.

The truth shown by your comments here doesn't hurt. It has me feeling absolutely more strongly about Bernie running and fixing the BROKEN party that calls itself the Democratic Party these days that is a hollow shell of what it used to be before the cancerous tumor of DLC control is long overdue for some heavy chemo therapy that might just kill it now in the course of getting treatment.

Bernie is what many of us have been waiting a long time for to provide this treatment and help us fix the country too.

A party isn't there just like a football team demanding loyal fans that are only concerned if the home team wins. It is so much more about REPRESENTING the PEOPLE and not working at the behest of others that screws the PEOPLE if they aren't important to them.

It's about time that we have a civil revolution now with Bernie in charge to take back this country for its people instead of waiting for us to get to the point of insurrection and the penalties all of us will feel if circumstances parallel the French Revolution instead later when people get more desperate.

To survive America needs some deep fundamental changes that basically need to happen just about every 80 or so years of its existence. Someone like Bernie I think is the only one that understands the need for that that is running for president now.

Bernie is not even worthy of his sniff.

Pretty much every time I come across your name (interestingly enough, I don't even use the search feature), it's to see you have tried to demean or insult a long time DU'er.

Now, I wonder why that would be?

I wonder what an actual "search" would come up with? Nah can't be bothered, my observation is enough.

Weird, eh?

....is what's best for the Democratic Party.

(That sounds better in the original German.)

It ALWAYS ends badly.

I love the Party of FDR,
and have been a reliable member since 1967.


The fact that I love the Party of FDR, LBJ, JFK
is what distresses me so much today.
Since the Clinton administration, the Party has abandoned Organized LABOR, the Working Class, and The Poor
The Party has turned Hard Right,
and I won't follow it any deeper into Republican/Corporate buggery.

Because I have donated for 50 years,
because I have canvassed for every election
because I've manned the phone banks,
because I have collected donations,
because I have distributed Lawn Signs and bumper stickers for 50 years,
[font size =3]I have EARNED a voice in my Party,
and this Democrat is not afraid to use it.[/font]

Clinton was the second best president of m lifetime.

Obama is the best president of my lifetime.

I look forward to Hillary Clinton surpassing both.

You must be very young.

I remember when the Democratic Party would have bailed out Main Street
instead of Wall Street.

The country turned hard right in 1980.

half a century and am a 4th generation Democrat.

That alone disqualifies him from getting my vote in the primary.

Or would you prove yourself not to be a "loyal Democrat" in that instance?

He has precisely no chance of winning whatsoever, so your point is moot.

By for Hypothetical bullshit sake, I would vote for the nominee regardless of the fact that even in some weird universe where Bernie Sanders actually won the Democratic nomination, he would still have precisely zero chance of winning the general election.

That's rich.

Bernie Sanders will NEVER be president.

of the Democratic Party than many of the corporate money mongers, ineffectives and GOP lights that have been steering the ship. I'm one of more than 125 close relatives and friends that include 6 siblings, 19 first cousins and many family members from 8 months to 82 years. We are lifetime Democratic Party voters in NY, PA, MD, DC, VA, NC, FL, OH, MN, AZ, CA, HI with highly diverse occupational, ethnic and cultural backgrounds. For a hundred years most of us have been invested in and supported the Democratic Party. Because this country is on a fast decline and faces many major difficulties, if party Democrats do not return to core values of working for the people and a better, more equitable economy and society for all in 2016 we're done. And that's a first, an historic one.

But they PAID to put in place the current corporate leadership that was established when they helped build the DLC both with money and people.

I'd much rather have someone like Bernie Sanders leading the agenda than the disciples of the Koch Brothers, whether it is the newer generation of Koch Brothers, or their father Fred Koch who also worked with 1%er Joseph Stalin who basically worked hard to kill off and oppress democratic socialists like Trotsky in his day.

how I wish the two converged.

Supposed to be all about the people?



Why so huffy? you have at least 6 months of adulation before the Harrow is retired.

"The Harrow"

Democrat born and Democrat til' the day I die.

Your pov is Corporation First. (Democratic Party) and our pov is People first.

This site is about Democrats and the Democratic Party.

Based upon what you said, you should start the party and the site.

..left leaning, progressives of all stripes.
The only taboo is actively campaigning for someone running against a Democrat,
and even THAT has had exceptions here.

Therefore, Bernie is worthy of Democratic discussion.

He is a Democratic Socialist, and aligns with the Democratic Party.

It sort of hits a certain funny bone if you get my drift..

we now find ourselves in regarding income inequality, inequitable taxation, banksters and other international financial institutions wielding more power than governments yet demanding to be bailed out by them when their bets blow up, climate change, police brutality, the assault on women's reproductive rights, and a zillion other issues.

If all that counts is which team wins, regardless of whether the "winner" will address the issues, you wind up circling the drain.

“If you don't stand for something you will fall for anything.”


― Gordon A. Eadie

Of course it is ALL ABOUT THE PARTY! for you folks. Always has been.

Sanders is the ranking member of the budget committee. That's among one of the best committee assignments in the Senate. Only the "Rules" committee is better. There is a huge competition to get that seat. And Sanders got it.

In other words, he has been "building and networking" within the Democratic Party for decades.

Btw, what the hell is "building and networking"? You're missing a noun. You have to be building something. You can build a network. You can build support. You can't build.

can you show where he went on the road to raise money for Democratic candidates?

Sanders has campaigned for several Northeastern Democrats over the years. The centrists running the party don't want to use him much outside the area, since he doesn't fit with their Republican-lite campaign theme.

Clinton is "building and networking" so much, she must've appeared in lots of 2014 campaigns, right? Not just Grimes, who having lost has zero influence. Oooo! Ooo! I know, her campaigning for Hagan clearly pushed her over the top! Oh wait, Hagan lost too. Well, CO is a tight race. Surely Clinton can put him over the...oh he lost too.

Well, a tight race like Landrau surely would have benefited from Clinton....oh, Clinton didn't campaign with her. Oops. Well, Merkley won by not running as a centrist, but surely Clinton...oh wait she didn't go there either.

Hillary has been a Democrat for decades and has a long history of campaigning and fund raising for other Democrats - it is the traditional way that politicians raise their national profile within the party if they aspire to the presidency. Obama did the same thing. Did Bernie? If not, why are you surprised that he is viewed as an outsider by many Dems?

You'd prefer we not make it fair to Clinton?

then I will retract my statement.

I look forward to you educating me on what the chair of the House progressive caucus does.

Called "The American Progressive Caucus Policy Foundation". You can find their filings on sites like this.

Did you think that political parties were like high school cliques? "You don't have a D after your name, so you can't sit at the cool kids table!!!"

are established over time with a lot of work on the part of the candidates. The Progressive Caucus is not part of the Democratic Party establishment nor part of its informal power structure so it is not accurate to say Bernie is owned anything by the party.

Bernie can all of a sudden declare himself a Democrat but that does not mean that he automatically gains the support and respect of decision makers, formal and informal, in the Democratic party. It may not be a clique but it is certainly not neutral or fair minded - it is full of partisan politicians engaged in bareknuckle partisan politics.

... and I enjoyed every moment of meeting both of them then.



Hoping that this button might have some newer value if VP Warren steps in after Bernie serves one term as president and has a great new running mate here.

I would think that Merkley would have welcomed Sanders as well. He doesn't have tons of contribution money that others have that has strings attached. So, I can't really blame him for having to measure the time and resources he alots for this sort of thing. Most important is the legislation he works on with like minded Democrats that help us all as citizens. Those actions and those who he works with speaks for themselves to voters.

Other than that, he has every right to request whatever he wants of the DNC. And they have every right to decide what is best for the party and not just what is best for Bernie.

Which is what happened.

Kuch was not a serious candidate.


If you really can't see the difference between Sanders and Kucinich then you might want to hold back posting on this subject for a while. It might be less painful when HRC implodes, again.

I heard people saying Kucinich could win both, too.

no actual polling ever backed that up

Keep in mind that these contests are still a long way off, things can change in either direction. Even so, Kuch never had a real chance and Bernie does.



http://crooksandliars.com/2015/06/early-polls-bernie-sanders-surges-new

^snip^

Early Polls: Bernie Sanders Surges In New Hampshire


Among Democratic voters who say they will participate in the state’s primary next year, 44 percent back Clinton. Next up: independent Sen. Bernie Sanders, the self-described socialist from neighboring Vermont, who grabs 32 percent. Vice President Joe Biden, who has shown little inclination to run, claims 8 percent of likely Democratic voters.



http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026841036

^snip^

Let me be the first commentator to state explicitly what many Democratic insiders fear and many of the most progressive activists in the party yearn for: There is a very real prospect that Senator Bernie Sanders wins an outright victory in the Iowa caucus and pulls off one of the most stunning upsets in modern political history.

At this moment I would put the odds that Mr. Sanders upsets Hillary Clinton in the Iowa caucus at nearly 40 percent. As someone who can fairly be called a Democratic insider myself, I can report that some of the smartest Democratic strategists in national politics privately believe this but will not publicly state it. I just did.

Iowa and/or New Hampshire?

They are still over 6 months away.

Kuch had a rally about 2 miles from me and it drew less than 20 people. I didn't even bother going and it was nearly walking distance.

Bernie drew the same kind of crowd in Denver that Hillary drew in NYC with her big announcement.

Clearly, Bernie is not Kucinich.

Cross posting.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026876589


Bernie Sanders RALLY In Denver Draws One of BIGGEST CROWDS In Election Cycle





Massive turnout is latest sign the Vermont senator is gaining on Hillary Clinton


Share with Friends.....




At least 5,500 Coloradans crammed into a Denver gymnasium, an adjacent atrium, and lacrosse field Saturday night to hear presidential candidate and Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders speak, in what is being reported as one of the biggest political rallies so far in the 2016 election cycle. Addressing the crowd at the University of Denver, Sanders said: "What we are doing tonight is we are sending a message to the billionaire class and that is: You can't have it all!"

This campaign is not about me," he continued. "It is not about Hillary Clinton or any other candidate. This campaign is about you, your kids and your parents. It is about creating a political movement of millions of people who stand up and loudly proclaim that this nation belongs to all of us and not just a handful of billionaires." Saturday's crowd is the latest sign that Sanders is proving a real challenge to former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, whose rally at New York City's Roosevelt Island last week drew an estimated 5,500 people.

"Sanders's audience—in a state not among those with traditional early nominating contests—rivaled the largest drawn by Clinton and the Vermont senator in recent weeks," wrote Washington Post reporter John Wagner. "The extraordinary turnout was the latest evidence that Sanders, 73, has tapped into the economic anxiety of the Democratic electorate."


Sanders has been drawing large crowds, from Vermont to Minneapolis, and numerous polls show that Sanders is gaining on Clinton, including recent surveys of the battleground state of New Hampshire.


http://www.commondreams.org/news/2015/06/21/bernie-sanders-rally-denver-draws-one-biggest-crowds-election-cycle
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