General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsElections matter- no Clinton & Obama-no Breyer, Ginsburg, Kagan, and Sotomayor-no marriage equality
DCBob
(24,689 posts)Hillary no doubt will continue the same.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)LiberalElite
(14,691 posts)msanthrope
(37,549 posts)Justice sat.
DURHAM D
(32,619 posts)and thank you for your comment (on your OP thread) regarding further implications for housing, employment and public accommodations.
The fight goes on.
Dawgs
(14,755 posts)msanthrope
(37,549 posts)Dawgs
(14,755 posts)msanthrope
(37,549 posts)Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)msanthrope
(37,549 posts)AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)I thought she wasn't Bill (welfare reform, 50,000 new police, etc.)?
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)I didn't have a problem with that and apparently neither did the big dog.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)nt
truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Glass Steagall?
greatauntoftriplets
(175,776 posts)LiberalElite
(14,691 posts)Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)fuckitty fuck fuck fuck it all that.
Smarmie Doofus
(14,498 posts)We want our ponies ( if we're entitled to them; everyone ELSE has one.) and we want 'em now.
I shall now E V O L V E out of this thread.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)There should be a hall of fame for righteous Republicans.
LynneSin
(95,337 posts)Remember Kennedy voted in favor of George W. Bush in the Bush v. Gore. Thanks to that vote we had 2 wars along with John Roberts and Sam Alito.
It's good to know that he'll do the right thing from time to time but if I was a gambling person I wouldn't put money on him.
truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)JI7
(89,289 posts)msanthrope
(37,549 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)eom
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)Post hoc ergo prompter hoc.
riderinthestorm
(23,272 posts)SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
leftofcool
(19,460 posts)LynneSin
(95,337 posts)I do not want another Scalia, Thomas, or Alito on the Bench
Look at John Roberts - he was 50 years old when George W. Bush not only appointed him but also made him Chief Justice. That guy could be sitting on the bench for another 20-30 years.
These are LIFETIME appointment folks. And in the end it seems like whomever controls the SCOTUS controls a whole what the hell is going on in this country.
Citizen United decision is one of the WORST modern decisions after Gore v Bush.
We women are so dangerously close to forever losing all rights to our body.
Ginsberg and Breyer are not getting any younger.
We need a Democrat in the White House.
You folks fight it out and pick one in the Primary. I'll fight my ass off in the general election to help get them elected. I'm just a short train ride from Pennsylvania and I'll make sure that state stays blue!
brer cat
(24,670 posts)emulatorloo
(44,276 posts)nolabear
(42,009 posts)Fight it out however you must in the primaries. I respect that. But don't fuck us over in the general.
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(108,509 posts)+1000
azmom
(5,208 posts)NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Good on both of them and good on the country for electing them. Love the picture.
William769
(55,151 posts)dbackjon
(6,578 posts)Spazito
(50,645 posts)morningfog
(18,115 posts)jwirr
(39,215 posts)MineralMan
(146,354 posts)It's about Presidents who are either in office or were. Nothing about the future.
It's also about elections being super important. We really must elect a Democrat as President and regain a majority in the Senate in 2016.
This OP was not about the primary elections.
jwirr
(39,215 posts)person most likely to win in the general so we cans save the SCOTUS. Read reply #1 & 2.
MineralMan
(146,354 posts)enforced by forum hosts. They can only look at the OP, not the ensuing discussion. The thread's contents are not the responsibility of the OP. So, this thread is not a primary election thread, as originally posted.
jwirr
(39,215 posts)discuss real issues and not turn them into Hillary/Bernie threads. Oh, well.
MineralMan
(146,354 posts)The DUer who starts any thread is not responsible for what is written in replies. Replies can be hidden by a jury if they aren't in keeping with community standards.
In this case, the OP is about historical issues and Presidents. It makes the point that Democratic Presidents have appointed SCOTUS justices who were instrumental in this week's decisions. That others discussed the upcoming primary elections is in no way a reflection of the intent of the original post.
In my own reply in this thread, I made the point about how important it is to elect a Democrat as President in 2016, along with regaining a majority in the Senate. Which Democrat? Whichever one is the nominee.
DU can't start locking GD threads because they might turn into a primary discussion. That would be impossible. Only the OP is subject to that rule.
jwirr
(39,215 posts)sanity.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)MineralMan
(146,354 posts)jwirr
(39,215 posts)glad when they created GD-primary because then we could get back to discussions that didn't always turn into Hillary/Bernie threads and was referring to that. I am fully aware that your post was about a very good topic. Sorry if I offended you.
emulatorloo
(44,276 posts)jwirr
(39,215 posts)JI7
(89,289 posts)frylock
(34,825 posts)emulatorloo
(44,276 posts)My preference too. However I trust all of our potential nominees to do the same.
frylock
(34,825 posts)Zorra
(27,670 posts)appointed to the Supreme Court possible.
Sheepshank
(12,504 posts)it guarantees he can make the most liberal nomination for Supreme (or any) court judge. The confirmatoin will be a whole other story.
Beacool
(30,254 posts)Let this be a reminder that elections DO matter.
Let this also serve as a reminder next presidential election. There have been some who have stated that they won't vote for the Democratic nominee, if it's not their candidate of choice. I got one word for them: SCOTUS.
bucolic_frolic
(43,548 posts)and Scalia Alito Roberts Thomas for the corporations
I can never understand why people with such rigid minds make for
judicial appointments
Oh, right, the rigid minds that appointed them
Lancero
(3,020 posts)Huh. Never knew that.
Wait - Is it like that 'seperate but equal' thing that we had from the late 1800s to mid 1900s?
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)BTW, it's silly to judge someone by the standards of our times when they were governing in their times.
Oh and btw, DADT was the compromise after Sam Nunn (D) who was the Chairman Of the Armed Services committee pulled the rug out on Clinton who wanted to allow gays to serve openly and Colin Powell, Chairman Of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, went along.
Lancero
(3,020 posts)Clinton put DOMA into law, with which marriage inequality was made 'legitimate'.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)YEAs ---85
Abraham (R-MI)
Ashcroft (R-MO)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bennett (R-UT)
Biden (D-DE)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Bond (R-MO)
Bradley (D-NJ)
Breaux (D-LA)
Brown (R-CO)
Bryan (D-NV)
Bumpers (D-AR)
Burns (R-MT)
Byrd (D-WV)
Campbell (R-CO)
Chafee (R-RI)
Coats (R-IN)
Cochran (R-MS)
Cohen (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND)
Coverdell (R-GA)
Craig (R-ID)
D'Amato (R-NY)
Daschle (D-SD)
DeWine (R-OH)
Dodd (D-CT)
Domenici (R-NM)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Exon (D-NE)
Faircloth (R-NC)
Ford (D-KY)
Frahm (R-KS)
Frist (R-TN)
Glenn (D-OH)
Gorton (R-WA)
Graham (D-FL)
Gramm (R-TX)
Grams (R-MN)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Harkin (D-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hatfield (R-OR)
Heflin (D-AL)
Helms (R-NC)
Hollings (D-SC)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Jeffords (R-VT)
Johnston (D-LA)
Kassebaum (R-KS)
Kempthorne (R-ID)
Kohl (D-WI)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Lieberman (D-CT)
Lott (R-MS)
Lugar (R-IN)
Mack (R-FL)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Murray (D-WA)
Nickles (R-OK)
Nunn (D-GA)
Pressler (R-SD)
Reid (D-NV)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Roth (R-DE)
Santorum (R-PA)
Sarbanes (D-MD)
Shelby (R-AL)
Simpson (R-WY)
Smith (R-NH)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Thomas (R-WY)
Thompson (R-TN)
Thurmond (R-SC)
Warner (R-VA)
Wellstone (D-MN)
People change,
MADem
(135,425 posts)This had nothing to do with changing. He got shoved into a corner by the wingnuts. It was realpolitik, and he acknowledges what a fuckup it was (see very interesting article, below).
I worked under the hot-breathed supervision of the White House when we thought the prohibition against gays serving in the military was going out the window--ten hour days, seven days a week. No one was more disappointed than our WH overlords when that effort crumbled. They WANTED it to happen....sometimes, though, the political opposition is able to exert more pressure and get their way. That is what happened in that instance.
Contrast that with the "guidance" we were getting from the legislators on the HASC and SASC, which was, in essence "Don't waste your time, this isn't going anywhere." They were hostile to those of us making a good faith effort to get all the boxes checked in preparation for lifting the restrictions. They were telling us from the beginning to not bother, to forget about it. Of course, we weren't going to take anyone's word for anything--we acted under the assumption that the restriction was going to be lifted, and there was a shitload of stuff to fix/change/eliminate for that to happen. We had to go over every damn instruction/notice/directive and propose the needed changes. All that stuff got tossed in boxes when the (cough) "compromise" of DADT was agreed to.
Elections do matter.
With DOMA, Clinton wasn't happy at all--he didn't change, he just got bigfooted by the wingnuts, and the discriminatory "American people" -- many of whom didn't have his back.
Why Bill Clinton Signed the Defense of Marriage Act
http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/why-bill-clinton-signed-the-defense-of-marriage-act
The essay, a Clinton associate told me, was Clintons own idea; he wrote it out himself in longhand on a legal pad. As his former White House adviser on gay-rights, I was not surprised by the message. But Clintons willingness, just twenty days before two gay-rights cases go to the Supreme Court, to publicly call DOMA discriminatory is a big step, even if his comments stopped short of the full apology some have asked for.
But the op-ed leaves a political mystery intact. Clinton, though clearly unhappy with the law today, does not really explain why he signed it, other than to say it was a very different time. Perhaps that is explanation enough. Still, how was it that Bill Clinton, the first President to champion gay rights, put his name on one of the most discriminatory anti-gay statutes in American history?
The simple answer is that he got boxed in by his political opponents, and that his campaign positions on gay rights ran ahead of public opinion. But there was another important factor: a failure to imagine how quickly gay rights would evolve, and how difficult it would be to undo the damage that DOMA did. ....Was it realistic to think that a Presidential veto of DOMA would have put Clintons reëlection in jeopardy? At the time I thought not. But in 1996 less than thirty per cent of Americans supported gay marriage, and even eight years after that, in 2004, President George W. Bush used gay marriage extremely effectively as a wedge issue against John Kerry, who at the time only supported civil unions. In fact, many believe that it was the Bush campaigns very strategic placement of anti-gay-marriage state constitutional ballot initiatives throughout moderate and conservative leaning states (like Ohio) which brought out conservative Bush voters and carried the day for him in that election. Could similar tactics have been used with the same effectiveness in 1996? Obviously, we will never know.
Lancero
(3,020 posts)...You can't really label Clintion as a life-long supporter of LGBT rights.
I mean, look at the logic here - He pushes for DOMA, which deprives many people of their rights. He appoints Justices who later vote to return the rights that HE deprived them of.
It's hard to say that he lead the way for marriage equality when, what he did was appoint two Justices who later returned to the people rights that he decided to deprive them of.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)Precisely, everything you said is correct but if not for Breyer and Ginsburg we would not be celebrating today and we would still have DOMA.
Lancero
(3,020 posts)He is deserving of praise, because someone undid his mistakes?
Really, seems to me that the people who undid those mistakes are deserving of the praise, not the one who made them.
You want to praise someone? Give the praise to Breyer and Ginsburg, the ones who returned to the LGBT community their rights, instead of the one whose action deprived LGBT people of their rights for nearly a decade.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)No Clinton and Obama- no Ginsburg, Breyer, Kagan, and Sotomayor...
And even President Obama whom I admire wasn't always a marriage equality supporters...
Two thoughts-better late than never and if somebody flip flops I hope they flip my way.
Lancero
(3,020 posts)No Clinton, no DOMA.
Still though, I can agree that Obama is deserving of praise. While he was a bit reluctant to speak his mind on LGBT issues for a time, when he eventually decided to he came out swinging on the side of Equality. Such can't be said of Clintons time in office.
Honestly though, I wouldn't really trust someone who flip-flops around. They tend to support whatever is popular at the time, correct or not. And there is no telling what will become the next 'popular' thing.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)Clinton didn't do DOMA by fiat...
342 Representatives and 85 Senators voted for it including prominent Democrats.
Today is a day to celebrate and savor for everybody.
DURHAM D
(32,619 posts)Add Sen. David Boren (D) of Oklahoma as a powerful enemy.
I attended a seminar in 1993 presented by the Servicemembers Legal Defense Network and they were estatic about DADT passage. And then Colin and the DOD took over and did not enforce it the way it was intended. It is the main reason I have absolutely no respect for Powell.
I don't think I have seen anyone discuss the fact that Sanders (while serving in the House) voted against DADT in 1993.
Cha
(298,124 posts)Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)he's featured in many DU avatars and siglines, they have progressive training camps named after him and the works. It was bullshit, but if you criticize Wellstone for that vote people will attack like dogs. I have never, ever seen any straight person complain about DOMA unless is was about Cinton. Those who actually voted for it, they all get a big pass and a Gold Star for Progressive Excellence. Why is that, exactly?
Biden, Lahey, Murray, Harry Reid, Harkin, Levin, Durbin, Cardin, Cummings, Schumer, Clyburn, all of these and many more were DOMA yes voters.
Lancero
(3,020 posts)Thanking Biden for DOMA/DADT.
A lot of people here seem to thank Clinton for both of em though.
truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)and didn't.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)That is more than enough to override a presidential veto.
truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)If someone wants to codify discrimination, and I could not stop it, I would still do everything in my power to make them work for it. That's me; it was not Bill Clinton and fwiw it is not Obama, Pelsoi, or Reid either.
As demented as they are, I have to appreciate how hard the righties fight for their so-called principles.
JI7
(89,289 posts)truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)I admire fighters, and even more, I admire those who fight the good fight, even when it loses. Ted Cruz has never been, and will never be, on the right side of a fight.
ismnotwasm
(42,030 posts)Romeo.lima333
(1,127 posts)"but i need a reason to vote.
im not voting for someone just cause there's a D by his name.
democrat havent inspired me to vote.
voting for the lesser of 2 evils is working for me anymore.
i need something to vote for not against "
these are actual quotes from duers NOT ME regarding voting
Iliyah
(25,111 posts)Dont call me Shirley
(10,998 posts)randys1
(16,286 posts)edhopper
(33,667 posts)will be a stain on this country for years.
SunSeeker
(51,817 posts)Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)bvar22
(39,909 posts)I find that hard to believe.
A President from the Progressive Caucus might have given us even better SC judges....like a liberal replacement for Stevens instead of a "moderate".
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)No, I didn't
bvar22
(39,909 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)Gloria
(17,663 posts)Having been mocked for being concerned about the court if the next Prez. is not a Dem, I thank you profusely!
davidn3600
(6,342 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)Thank you for putting words in my mouth though.
leftofcool
(19,460 posts)Cha
(298,124 posts)Cha
(298,124 posts)Cha
(298,124 posts)[font color=blue]ELECTIONS MATTER~[/color]
Sara Lang ?@SaraLang
This.
5:19 AM - 26 Jun 2015
4,560 4,560 Retweets 6,860 6,860 favorites
http://theobamadiary.com/2015/06/26/tweets-of-the-day-30/
Smarmie Doofus
(14,498 posts)At least not recently. Everyone knows better SCOTUS appts. have been made by recent DEM PsOTUS than GOPers.
PeaceNikki
(27,985 posts)Gothmog
(146,012 posts)The next POTUS will select three to five justices and these justices will control the direction of the court for a generation