Sounds like a sociopath to me, and can't say I handled it well; had me depressed for years.

Try 'coping with divorce or separation,' and/or mental health support groups?

I have a million different emotions right now....the worst isnt necessarily even that he has been having affairs, its that he has this whole secret life and looks me in the eyes and lies to me regulary. I havent gone to any group....Im talking to a therapist from years ago trying to get some advice....saw a divorce attorney too....got the low down on things that are my rights, but sadly too the reality of how my life is going to be turned upside down. Im going to need after not working for a decade to go find work in my mid-40's in a shit economy. Im scared. And yet i dont know what is scarier.....being on my own and struggling....being in a marriage that might give me economic security and allows me to be a stay-at-home mom, but it means being with a liar and cheat and incredible lonliness.

I am going to be looking for a job....I wont live like this....I cant live like this....but I am scared.

This is what I learned..

First, you need to find a professional to talk to about YOU,
to sort out feelings and to decide how, in the long run, you want to deal with it.
Make hubby pay that bill.
Second, talking about HIS cheating with HIM will get you nowhere.
No matter what he says, would you believe him after all the lies he has told?
He shows no remorse, and is clearly not able to share feelings. You already know that about him.
What he is thinking, feeling, is not your problem.

You can't take care of yourself and another person at the same time.

I am not a big advocate of looking an abuser in the eye and asking him to explain why he is abusing me.
He is doing it because that is who he is..period.
Your job is to stop being a target for his emotional abuse. Yes, infidelity is emotional abuse.
That can be done in many ways,
by mentally, or emotionally or physically not being available to the abuser.
Instead of focusing on HIM and on WHY he abuses you, ( no, it is never your fault)
focus on what YOU want, what YOU feel, and find a safe person to talk it out with
( hint: the abuser is NEVER a safe person).

Your decisions, given this horrible economy, is how you and the kids can most realistically survive.
Sometimes NOT leaving is a good option. ( Unless there is physcial abuse, of couse, in which case immediate action has to be taken)
Sometimes not acting on urges right away is a good method of buying time and planning for decsions.
Tis best if you can act from logic than from anger, hurt, fear etc. That takes time.

btw...anger and fear are great motivators, even tho it does not feel good at the time.

But, I don't. Just so you know I am a pack first and ask questions later kinda gal. There is no good reason for married people to hang out on singles sites. Fine if they say they are married and have kids and just want to hang out still iffy though and still good not really it's opening a door that shouldn't be open. But, in this case he is lying. And there are other lies, not good. If it was me someone's bags would be packed and I would be seeing a lawyer. Scratch that see a lawyer first to make sure that you wouldn't get penalized for abandoning the marriage or kicking him out or whatever. Just CYA and take care of yourself and get a good attorney.

I feel for your suffering but I do not think you will help by outing your spouse on DU. You should delete your post and get professional help for your marriage.

I'm sure others will be along to advise differently.

He doesnt come to DU, doesnt even know my name....

I came here to go to a safe place....

However, I do not consider it safe and it is not a place I would come for relationship advice. I value what little privacy I have. YMMV.

Certainly not facebook....the reality is my hsband doesnt come here. No one here knows my personal info except Skinner and the government that probably monitors DU and its members posts. So the government knows I have a shitty marrriage and a cheating husband.....they probably have known that forever!!! Even before I found out!

And you would get more trustworthy advice than from a bunch of angry internet divorcees with grudges against former thier former spouses.

LOL

Whether or not you think it is safe or where you would come to for advice is not the point of this conversation. Do you have some some more condescension to offer? She's been here for quite some time it appears, maybe you should let her trust her judgment before screeching into yours. HMMM?

Unless you were willing to be more supportive.

There is something different about normal marital problems, and one night stand cheating versus living a completely secret life. The latter is a severe betrayal and enabling the behavior by keeping it silent just isn't the answer.

I don't think you feel her suffering. I don't think you could've possibly been through something like that either or you wouldn't have posted what you did. Unless she has posted her real name in relation to her account, there is relative privacy here versus talking to IRL friends. IMO, it's the better option in this cesspool of shitty options.

Pachamama - I've been through something similar. You can PM me if you'd like to talk. There's no way to describe the feelings if you haven't been through it.

I think people who do things like that are cowards. When there are problems in a relationship and someone is tempted to stray, s/he needs to speak up. Get it out in the open and try to work on some kind of resolve before acting on the temptaion. It may not be the resolve that one party wants, but lying and cheating is too painful and it usually (as you well know) gets discovered anyway. I am so sorry that this has happened to you and your family.

And somebody who is creeping on dating sites on the side does not possess the required degree of commitment.

I've never dealt with this personally, but I would give anybody who did this to me an ultimatum. Not necessarily because I would be so offended that they did it, but because it would show me that they lacked the degree of commitment I want in a life partner.

That's not to say you should can them on site, but I'd have a long talk in which I outline what I expect. And if it's important enough to put themselves out there on the dating scene, they need to do it as a single person.

Whenever I've felt the need to that myself, I've always ended the relationship first. I think it's disrespectful to creep around on a partner. There's nothing wrong with doing what you have to do, but you have to show enough respect for your partner to not drag them and their emotions along for the ride.

He may have actually been looking for someone to have an affair with.

He may do that habitually and actually meet people that way.

He may do that habitually and never meet anyone that way but just indulge fantasies that way.

So many possibilities.

You could simply ask him whether he is trying to have a joke or is cheating?

But then you could ask him what he would do if he discovered that you were signing into a singles website and claiming to be not only single but childless.

Or tell him that you found out about a guy who was signing in, etc., and then ask him why he thinks someone would do that?

It's very possible that he was not looking for any kind of relationship because if he seriously had been, he would have had to admit to the person he met that he had children even if he hid the fact that he was married. That person would soon realize he was lying.

He may just be indulging in a fantasy life. People do that on the internet, you know.

So, talk to him about it.

But if you can control yourself, don't just accuse. There may be something more complicated than you would first assume. But there may not be.

It is possible that he is very unhappy in your relationship, but don't assume that. Don't assume anything.

I've been married to my husband for 49 years. Takes a lot of patience and good communication. Things are not always what the appear to be, but usually they are.

And congratulations on making it to 49 years.

Love heals a lot, but it has to be there. Sometimes life gets so busy that there is not time to communicate, to express your love. That is when marriages run into trouble.

I am just hoping that you find your way. I can't really give advice because we are all different.

But, I assure you, this is NOT the end of the world even if it feels like that.

I'm giving you a big DU hug across the internet. Take care, but don't take anything too seriously.

the loneliness he might have felt as she was dealing with cancer. Spouses of cancer victims need support as well. If he wasn't part of a group or something, then maybe he inappropriately sought attention.

I just read down below that he tried to meet and have a date. Yuck.

I think denying that he has kids was his attempt to limit himself; he hasn't decided he wants a divorce. Or, He's not looking to have a long term relationship if he's lying to someone online about his kids.

in the past, he almost certainly will in the future. I found out a BF (yeah, that RW one of 6 wasted years) had been posting on an adult dating site while we were supposedly exclusive with each other.

I have zero tolerance for cheaters. YMMV. Some folks have open relationships where this is ok but both parties are in agreement when that's the case.

Thankfully, she & her husband didn't have any children. The situation was heartbreaking, nonetheless, because she loved him. They divorced, she got the house, he tried to go back with her but she no longer trusted him, & she is doing well & very happy now.

Personally, I'd be tempted to join the singles dating site to try to get some answers from him -- along with some evidence that I may need later.

I'm so sorry this has happened to you.

... but since I don't know you, don't take this personally.

It takes 2 people to make a relationship work. When one person "strays", it can be a personality flaw of that said person. A sexual addiction is commonly "just" acted out on the internet... and rarely do these "online cheaters" actually meet people in person.

But with that said, could it be the "cheater" is just not getting what they desire from you in the relationship? If that is the case, then it is over... unless you can agree to work on fixing the problem.

But the first step is to admit there is a problem. And getting your spouse to admit it, means you HAVE to confront him.

The best way to handle it is to talk to your spouse, and not just ignore it. And the "way" you confront your spouse will affect any outcome. If you want to keep your relationship, you need to discuss this with the idea that it can be "fixed". If you just attack and turn it into a screaming session, the outcome will not be good.

If your spouse is viewing porn online without your knowledge, is that "cheating"? This doesn't sound like your situation, but are you sure?

If your spouse is actually meeting people from online, then that is a totally different situation.

If you want to save your marriage, you NEED to confront it now. You need to be honest with how you feel and indicate what is acceptable.

When a spouse cheats, whose fault is it? Think about it... because every relationship is different.

Please don't quit your day job. This is not a marriage struggling through the slog of marriage. You know just the normal shit of trying to get along. This is a marriage where a spouse has been caught in dubious, lying behavour. Big difference.

Like when my mother said, "Maybe if you weren't so fat he wouldn't have cheated." My answer is if he was unhappy with me being fat, he should've divorced me (he always maintained it was never my weight and that I had done nothing wrong). Also, if fatnesss was the problem, then why did my ex's uncle cheat on his gorgeous, skinny, sweet as pie, generous wife with a 300 lb mean and spiteful woman?

IMO, it's more 'blame the victim' crap. Sure it takes 2 to maintain a relationship, but did you know it only takes one asshole to rip apart a 15 year marriage and a family with 4 kids? And if you're not the one asshole, there is not a goddamn thing you can do to keep that relationship together (believe me I tried).

Really? The excuses are so fucking trite. My lying cheating shit-bag was playing meet the new partner before I even washed my hair. Really. It only takes one to rip the whole thing to threads. Love you sister. With all my heart.

How the hell do you KNOW that? Did you talk to both parties? .. yeah, right.. didn't think so.

Sometime relationships just move apart, and it is NO ONE'S FAULT... so get over your "WE HAVE TO BLAME SOMEONE" attitude.

Maybe one spouse has already moved on, and not told the other one yet.

... that's kind of the problem. If you decide to move on that is fine, but you don't get to do it on the down low.

If you are unhappy SACK UP and be honest. Running around behind someone's back is not healthy, honorable or correct in any circumstance.

You only have ONE SIDE of the story here, but there are those who think they have the answer for this problem...

it is the typical knee jerk reaction you get in online forums. Marriage Counselor advice from the head of the Scourned Wives Club.

Castration is always the answer, because we all know it's the man's fault. How many more replies are we going to read here with the subject similar to "and it happened to me too".

Almost 50% of all marriages end up in divorce. How many of those marriages have one spouse cheating BEFORE the other finds out? Oh Humanity! Some spouses move on with their lives, and others get paralyzed and are frozen in time with blame. Make your choice.

.... with the possible exception of
1) the spouse said it was ok
2) the spouse is already cheating

All of the other "well there are two sides, you don't know what the marriage was like", etc, etc, etc are just bullshit rationalizations.

It's not all right when a man doesn't think he's getting laid enough. It's not all right when a woman doesn't feel her emotional needs are met.

It's just not all right, period.

You have ZERO background details on why this marriage is in trouble.

I'll say it again. Roughly 50% of marriages end in divorce. I bet if you did a comprehensive study, you would find that most divorces are a result of both spouses letting it fall apart.

Yeah, sure there will be cases where one spouse just loses interest, and moves on. But the point is it doesn't MATTER the reasons, if a relationship is over, then move on - both parties. Life is too short to sulk.

Which comes first.. the decision to "move on" or the "cheating"?

And the question for the OP is whether she wants to save her marriage or does she want to "move on". Being stuck in a blame game goes nowhere... and after reading numerous replies to this thread with comments like "it happened to me" or "sounds like a sociopath to me" is ignoring the reality of what a relationship is all about. Time to grow up folks. Ever have someone dump you? Did you ever get over it? Yeah, it's painful.. but you get over it.

Is EVERY person who ever dumped someone a scumbag or a sociopath? Go look at the numbers again on how many people get divorced every year.

To the OP.. go get someone better, you deserve it. and you will be happier as well.

... but every person who cheats first is.

You keep conflating ending a marriage with cheating.

Bullshit.

Marriages end all the time often for good reason. What you do is END THE MARRIAGE and then you find someone else to fuck.

There is no other way to do it honorably.

"honorably"

Is that the way most divorces end in the United States? Or is it more common that one spouse cheats on the other before telling?

I am calling you out on "bullshit"... you seem to be projecting your denial on me for pointing out the facts about divorce and why it happens. By the way, women cheat just as much as men... this isn't a gender thing.

You don't get to PICK the way your spouse dumps you.

"What you do..." -- yeah, start telling the 50% of the population getting divorces what they should do... get back to me when you solve the cheating problem.

I can't even imagine how much it would hurt. Nobody deserves that kind of pain, I don't care how dissatisfied he is or isn't with the marriage. I have no advice, but I hope everything works out for you and that you remember the hopes and dreams you had before you met him and what you expected out of life. Surely, it wasn't a future of being lied to and humiliated. You're worth much more than that.

......."Surely, it wasn't a future of being lied to and humiliated. You're worth much more than that...."


Exactly....I need to remember that and think of what Pachamama's next chapter looks like....

Its been a tough time.....I have big decisions to make....

You have many, many good friends here.

If not, it could have been just for fun/curiosity and may have nothing to do with your relationship. I don't think many people really consider what they write on such sites to be lies. It's all imaginary to them and has nothing to do with real life.

Edit: I'm sorry, I see above you mentioned that he did.

...from him. She couldnt believe it....he used his real name, his profile describes himself to a tee with his likes and dislikes (except the wee itty bitty detail that HE IS MARRIED and has TWO KIDS!!!

She went to meet him and when she saw it was him sitting there went running out of bar shaking. She called and canceled. She sat on info for a long time but finally couldnt not say something to me. Sure enough, i saw his profile, its him. His email too etc...

PS: even if he hadnt gone on this date, what would be the reason for joining such a site? To see whether people were out there? Didnt it ever occur to him there might be a chance of it being someone who knows me?

some very prominent politicians have proved to be incredibly stupid when it comes to sex. Incomprehensible to me, but that is the way it is.

I'm so sorry you have to deal with this.

Fun/Curiosity is what single people do. Not married ones.You don't think lying even out of fun/curiosity is wrong? Lies are not imaginary, they are real. Hope you get some one day.

Some husbands and wives play those games with their partners' knowledge. They don't actually go out on dates. It's just for fun. You can get all hot and bothered about it, but not everyone was raised in a convent.

My ex cheated on me, apparently for years, I had no clue. I was one of those sanctimonious people, when I'd hear about other people being cheated on, that used to think, "Well, there MUST have been SOME REASON we don't know about! That would never happen with MY marriage!"

hahahaha. Boy was I an idiot.

I didn't do anything wrong (*L* even HE said this). I did everything a wife is supposed to do to support my husband. I was open and honest about everything. I asked him to be open and honest. We always seemed to have good communication. We never had huge fights. We had the same interests, or so I thought. I trusted him with my life.

When I found out the truth, YEARS after it started (I found out it started at least when my youngest was a newborn, and maybe even before that) I was sick. And he still freakin denied it. To this day, he won't admit it, even though he moved her into our marital home! wtf.

After doing some research I'm convinced he has anti-social personality disorder - he has every single trait (not just the number needed for diagnosis). I found out, only after I moved away, about years and years of lies, going back to before we even started dating (as teenagers!). He has always lived a double life, I just didn't know it. AsPD means he was just done with me and I was thrown away like yesterday's trash because I didn't serve his purpose anymore for what he wanted. I hear he treats his girlfriend the same way, like trash. I'm sure he had other girlfriends I just didn't know about. Looking back, there were signs, but they were extremely subtle that it was only after researching narcissistic personality disorder, anti-social personality disorder and compulsive lying, was I able to see a pattern. Then again, I had an abusive childhood, so I was clueless as to how 'normal' people behaved towards their loved ones. That set me up for the failed marriage I had.

Pachamama, as I said in another post upthread, feel free to PM me if you need to talk. When I first found out I thought I was going to die from grief and could've used some support online (there wasn't much, but I did find an IRL meetup group). I'm so very sorry you are dealing with his. It's going to be rough at first while you decide what you want to do. If you do decide to leave, I just want you to know that it does get better. It's not easy, and it's been 2.5 years since I found out but I'm starting to enjoy the single life. Huge cyber hugs to you.

--first rule is NO LYING!! Not ever. Not to anyone. "To live outside the law you must be honest."

know several couples that live together for economic reasons only, and to share raising their children. Their personal lives are separate, vacations and time apart. When the time is right and you are more secure about your future, work prospects and finances, you can divorce or live separately.

Very close friends of mine lived this way until the children were older. Even though they are both with other partners now, they still get together for special occasions. Although the love they once shared was gone, they still have a very amicable, respectful relationship and the children know they were loved by both parents.

It is always the lies and deceit that are the most hurtful. If you could sit down now with him, get everything on the table, let him know how the lying and cheating have hurt you and that you are worried about the children's future. Decide together where it is best to go from here. As difficult as this might seem, it is better than living in emotional pain and uncertainly.

I have talked to many women whose husbands/boyfriends have started affairs or left them when they were diagnosed with breast cancer. They just couldn't handle it, women without breasts or just the disease itself. It seems very cruel, but it happens. Don't blame yourself.

that your relationship is going to be hard to save. If he's going on the internet using his real name with a lot personal information, it says to me that this guy must not want to be married anymore. It looks like he's trying to get caught. The best thing for you to do, I think, is to simply confront him with what you know and ask him if he truly wants to be with you. I would try to get a yes or no answer from him. You deserve to get an honest answer to that question, I just hope he's man enough to tell you the truth. Best of luck to you.

which tends to raise huge warning signs to me immediately.

some people have open marriages. some people have kids they don't actually raise. but only a selfish liar feels the need to cross the boundaries and withhold information thus preventing informed consent.

you either want a relationship or you want the pretense of one. adults should strive for the former and outgrow the latter.

edit: however, reading this topic more, i reflect with another idea. moments of crisis lead us to do dumb things. that's part of being human, too. not knowing how to cope with something so heavy like a spouse suffering cancer... not sure i can judge so harshly immediately. wrong was done, but to what degree of forethought and malice? there are degrees of judgment; but first must begin discovery and that requires listening to everything relevant on all sides.

But I think he is begging for trouble.

I have been at the receiving end of a married man who posted on a singles site where I was posting, and I did not appreciate having my time wasted or being suckered into his personal drama.

I am so sorry I do believe you must do something with that knowledge. You have learned something about Pachapapa that changes who he is in your eyes forever. Just the fact that it makes you sick to your stomach says you must deal with it.

Exactly how you deal with it, only you can decide, but you cannot stuff it. You must deal with it.

I wanted to give you a and say how sorry I am that you are going through this.

Not knowing any other details, I would call him scum. It would be difficult to impossible for me to get beyond this. And you say he also has done other things. IF you and he are willing you could suggest intense and long term marriage counseling. Wishing you the best in such a difficult time.

I went thru this myself and nothing has ever hurt so much. We tried to put things together but it was never the same. I still have trust issues. I really understand your pain and I know exactly what you're going thru. You'll make it thru this but don't know if you can make it together.

Only one thing to do. And, you already know what that is. In your gut, you know you have to leave this relationship. It will hurt, but you deserve better.

You can love someone very deeply and not be getting what you need physically from them because they are unwilling or unable. In such cases I don't have a problem with him/her getting it elsewhere. Ideally, you would get permission to do so but in most cases it's unrealistic to expect that kind of consideration so you do what you have to do. That is really the only scenerio where I find cheating acceptable.

Otherwise you're just being a sleaze bag. It sounds like you're dealing with a sleaze bag. If you no longer love your partner or are no longer attracted to them you should give them the courtesy of telling them and moving on before cheating.

If I found my wife doing this I would divorce her immediately because there is no reason to go looking anywhere else, I make that abundantly clear every day. She would do the same to me because she does the same for me. Sex is extremely important in a healthy relationship. As important as any other aspect.

But sometimes cheating is not about sex at all, sometimes it's just about someone to talk to.

My advice is to confront the person and let them know what you know (have proof) and give him a chance to tell his side of it before kicking his ass to the curb. There is a possibility there is a reasonable explanation for this behavior. Unlikely but not impossible.

Sorry for your pain.