General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWhy the Democrats started chanting USA! USA! USA! and waving the flag?
It is not a natural, normal thing for Democrats to resort to such patriotic symbolism. But, that does not mean that Democrats do not love their country. They do.
Many Democrats felt threatened by the candidacy of Donald Trump. They felt that their country and their way of life was threatened. It was a natural reaction to defend our country and to display some outward patriotism. It was an act of protection.
It is not a bad thing. It was a statement. Yes, we love our country and we are not ready to surrender it to the likes of Donald Trump and his minions.
I do not see it as some dangerous drift into nationalism.
jmg257
(11,996 posts)Vattel
(9,289 posts)The reality is that most Americans and even most Democrats are excessively militaristic and nationalistic. The attitudes towards war and killing in war held by most mainstream politicians, pundits, and citizens turn my stomach.
ronnie624
(5,764 posts)the US political culture being driven further and further to the right.
KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)Vattel
(9,289 posts)seaglass
(8,173 posts)Received guidance on chants that will be coming from Sanders folks throughout the evening. Below lists Sanders chants and what our counter will be. Send to delegates ASAP.
No More War - USA
Love is Love - Join them
Walk the Walk - Hillary
Stop the TPP - Hillary
Ban Fracking now - Hillary
Black Lives Matter - Join them
https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/758858618779217921
some guy
(3,448 posts)Hillary has said she's opposed to TPP, so why wouldn't that be a join them chant, like Love is Love and Black Lives Matter are?
And why would they be opposed to Walk the Walk? Should also be a join them.
I don't know her position on fracking.
On the No More War v USA chant, I suppose having the military represent and be greeted with No More War might be bad optics. Of course, juxtaposd, it makes Dems seem like war mongers. "No, you can't say no more war. We love war."
I'd question whether that tweet was legit, except it seems to dovetail with what happened.
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)I was stunned to not be impressed even by Obama's. I think it's kind of tragic that the organizers would take breaks from the lip service they give to poverty and police brutality to be sure ma nationalistic chant is pounded into the brains of people seemingly with the goal of trying to convince people who are suffering that there is not something fundamentally wrong here.
adigal
(7,581 posts)What the heck is going on? Watched Dems sounds like Repubs chanting USA, USA, USA, gave me chills, and not in a good way. I live my country, but I recognize its flaws and have never been comfortable with jingoistic cheerleading.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)and then kicked our asses in Presidential races?
It's payback time.
The Republicans are running a dystopian ethno-nationalist. Distinguishing patriotism from nationalism is one of the necessary--and I do mean necessary--tasks ahead in this race.
adigal
(7,581 posts)I was in college during Reagan's first term. I don't want the Dems to sound like the Republicans. Ever.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)this is a continuation of Obama's themes from 2004 and onward.
what do Republicans sound like these days? Donald Trump.
patriotism and optimism are effective political themes, and there's nothing anti-progressive about them.
let them be the "America sucks, and so does life" party.
leftstreet
(36,119 posts)The poster is right - it's very retro 80s
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Heck I'd even take Poppy Bush's from 1988
leftstreet
(36,119 posts)issues like 'patriotism' were essentially status quo votes
Now, not so much
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)and healthcare?
leftstreet
(36,119 posts)You can't be serious
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)leftstreet
(36,119 posts)Sorry I didn't say 'more' but most people assume that's understood
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)adigal
(7,581 posts)But I always founds Dems to understand that patriotism means you use your brains and skills and question who you vote for and how they are doing. It didn't mean flag waving and chanting.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)a mere supplement, not the main course.
adigal
(7,581 posts)My husband got sick for this country as a fireman in NYC during 9/11 and the years after. We both love this country, even with its flaws. I just am clear- eyed about it all, as I think many Dems are.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)or who don't see him as a threat to our democracy.
So, things have to be dumbed down a bit to appeal to them, as they aren't the types who pay attention to the details.
leftstreet
(36,119 posts)The target audience should be nonvoters
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)smears against Clinton over the past 40 years.
leftstreet
(36,119 posts)So you're saying the Clinton campaign is targeting idiots by 'dumbing down' the message
My question remains the same - why would you WANT those voters when half the voting population doesn't vote and you COULD target them on economic issues?
Oh wait...
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)During his 1956 presidential campaign, a woman called out to Mr. Stevenson "Senator, you have the vote of every thinking person!" Stevenson called back "That's not enough, madam, we need a majority!"
There is targeting of unlikely/lapsed voters, but as a general rule they don't vote for reasons that transcend anything any candidate can do or say.
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)Nothing wrong at all. The difference between us need not be whether or not we love our country, but how we manifest it.
For Republicans, how to manifest love of country is very different than for Democrats, in most cases.
When people are saying that Obama sounded like Reagan, they are referring to his optimism and expressed love of country.
People really DO respond to an optimistic, hopeful message.
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)If anyone thinks we're going to change the minds of haters by validating their "America first" attitudes has not been paying attention to the US culture as it has evolved post 911.
JI7
(89,290 posts)loyalsister
(13,390 posts)With pledges to the flag, flag decals, America first rhetoric, never criticize the USA, and of course, rewriting history in order to sanitize it enough that people will be foolish enough to participate.
JI7
(89,290 posts)You think it was about wearing the flag and never criticising ?
bigwillq
(72,790 posts)Folks are free to do what they choose.
KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)means you might want to inform yourself.
And why the f*ck shouldn't a Democrat be patriotic and proud of OUR flag and country?
maxsolomon
(33,475 posts)and I took them on vacation and put them up outside our cabin.
Republicans want to own the flag. Fuck them.
ileus
(15,396 posts)rollin74
(1,996 posts)I had no problem with chants of USA or Hillary
or with expressions of patriotism at the Democratic National Convention
Democrats can be patriotic too
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)Work to form a more perfect union
BainsBane
(53,137 posts)Trump gave them an opening and they took it. It's very smart.
The chants were to drown out the protesters' heckling.
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)and now believes that Democrats actually think he's right but won't admit it because of special interests. Jingoism is the path into xenophobia, not out.
BainsBane
(53,137 posts)That was the point. America is great BECAUSE of its diversity. Celebrating America requires celebrating its people, all of us.
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)among xenophobes and racists by mimicking their America rules, "pledge allegiance pass the ammunition" mentality?
BainsBane
(53,137 posts)Or that it is somehow about them and not the rest of us?
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)As are most expressions of "my country is king" crap, USA! USA! USA! is a praise 'merica pass the ammunition promotion. I am disappointed and ashamed. I thought jingoism was one of the biggest flaws of republican twisted culture.
BainsBane
(53,137 posts)And refuse to consider the reframing that explicitly made the opposite point. Why do you think they featured the Khan family, the father with his copy of the constitution?
Being anti-war and anti-racist doesn't require disdain for country.
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)It doesn't have to be loud chanting LIKE republicans are apt to do. It can be tasteful and personal. Holding hands and chanting is joining the party of enforced jingoism. Get caught not chanting or saying the pledge and you will be accused of letting them define patriotism or worse.
JI7
(89,290 posts)Which was always about bigotry.
It wasn't love of country that was bad but the way they made it about white america.
This was the opposite . An immigrant muslim father of a soldier killed use the constitution against them.