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Toon- Amended 'Stop and Frisk' Proceedures (Original Post) n2doc Jun 2012 OP
Our nation is beginning to resemble the old Soviet Union... spin Jun 2012 #1
Move over cbrer Jun 2012 #2
Good questions ... spin Jun 2012 #4
You may be right for containing your hatred cbrer Jun 2012 #5
kick n/t n2doc Jun 2012 #3

spin

(17,493 posts)
1. Our nation is beginning to resemble the old Soviet Union...
Sun Jun 17, 2012, 04:35 AM
Jun 2012
The TSA's mission creep is making the US a police state

The out-of-control Transportation Security Administration is past patdowns at airports – now it's checkpoints and roadblocks

Jennifer Abel
guardian.co.uk, Wednesday 18 April 2012 10.42 EDT



A TSA 'viper' (VIPR) team patrolling mass transit

Ever since 2010, when the Transportation Security Administration started requiring that travelers in American airports submit to sexually intrusive gropings based on the apparent anti-terrorism principle that "If we can't feel your nipples, they must be a bomb", the agency's craven apologists have shouted down all constitutional or human rights objections with the mantra "If you don't like it, don't fly!"

***snip***

But now TSA is invading travel by other means, too. No surprise, really: as soon as she established groping in airports, Napolitano expressed her desire to expand TSA jurisdiction over all forms of mass transit. In the past year, TSA's snakelike VIPR (Visual Intermodal Prevention and Response) teams have been slithering into more and more bus and train stations – and even running checkpoints on highways – never in response to actual threats, but apparently more in an attempt to live up to the inspirational motto displayed at the TSA's air marshal training center since the agency's inception: "Dominate. Intimidate. Control."

Anyone who rode the bus in Houston, Texas during the 2-10pm shift last Friday faced random bag checks and sweeps by both drug-sniffing dogs and bomb-sniffing dogs (the latter being only canines necessary if "preventing terrorism" were the actual intent of these raids), all courtesy of a joint effort between TSA VIPR nests and three different local and county-level police departments. The new Napolitano doctrine, then: "Show us your papers, show us everything you've got, justify yourself or you're not allowed to go about your everyday business."

***snip***

Airports, bus terminals, train stations, highways – what's left? If you don't like it, walk. And remember to be respectfully submissive to any TSA agents or police you encounter in your travels, especially now that the US supreme court has ruled mass strip-searches are acceptable for anyone arrested for even the most minor offence in America. If you're rude to any TSA agent or cops, you risk being arrested on some vague catch-all charge like "disorderly conduct". Even if the charges are later dropped, you'll still undergo the ritual humiliation of having to strip, squat, spread 'em and show your various orifices to be empty.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2012/apr/18/tsa-mission-creep-us-police-state


Of course, as usual, there are two sides to this issue as with all issues.

Obviously we live in a very dangerous world and our freedoms could be a weakness that allows another terrorist attack that might result in thousands, hundreds of thousands or even millions of deaths. In order to effectively stop such a disaster, it can be argued that we have to give up some of the rights that we enjoy. The fact that our nation has not suffered a major terrorist attack since September 11, 2001 proves that it is better to be proactive about terrorism than to allow it to happen. Unfortunately terrorists are intelligent, resourceful and inventive. In order to effectively stop all the possible attacks we be even more resourceful and inventive in our ability to detect nefarious plots than the terrorist are in developing new methods to attack us. That means that we have to develop the ability to quickly track all activities by any suspicious person and all those he comes in contact with.

The inconvenience caused by TSA checks is offset by the benefits. Ubiquitous surveillance cameras, email monitoring, records of internet activity, drones flying over our heads and body scanners at public buildings and malls are inevitable in our future. Many will view such devices and activities as an invasion of our privacy but if we are doing nothing wrong, we have nothing to worry about.

***

On the other hand, allowing our government to have power similar to the dictatorship portrayed in George Orwell's novel Nineteen Eighty-Four is not a future to look forward to.

Nineteen Eighty-Four

Nineteen Eighty-Four is a novel by George Orwell published in 1949. It is a dystopian novel about Oceania, a society ruled by the oligarchical dictatorship of the Party. Life in the Oceanian province of Airstrip One is a world of perpetual war, pervasive government surveillance, and incessant public mind control, accomplished with a political system euphemistically named English Socialism (Ingsoc), which is administered by a privileged Inner Party elite.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nineteen_Eighty-Four


Many nations and governments in this world hate the United States as our nation allows citizens to enjoy rights which they forbid. Our freedom threatens the existence of the ruling elite in such nations as their own subjects wish they could have the same privileges. (Of course many nations rightfully dislike the United States because of our government's inclination to intervene in foreign affairs in order to insure profits for our corporations and to prevent any alternative to our democratic-capitalist model.)

Terrorism will eventually result in our nation compromising many of the freedoms that American currently enjoy and our lifestyle will be less attractive to those who under the thumb of a dictator. The mere threat of a terrorist attack might accomplish this goal.

But the threat of terrorism might not be the only reason to watch everybody.

American citizens are beginning to suspect that our elected officials are bought and owned by the 1% and indeed there is probably a good deal of truth in this view. If so, the extremely rich and powerful have some reason to feel concern about citizen movements such as Occupy Wall Street. While still in their infancy, such mobilizations could spread and eventually force change. The 1% might back efforts to gather information on anyone who would wish to implement real change and create more equality and opportunity for the 99%. Our world history shows that often a rich few rule and oppress the poor and justify it by asserting that "the cream rises to the top." Since the rich are proven by their success to be far more intelligent and deserving of power than the unwashed mass they can provide beneficial leadership and wisdom. The threat of terrorism offers an excellent opportunity to implement the ability to detect and squash anyone who might ferment discontent.

Control of the media and government has been successful up to now in protecting the 1%, but the internet allows uncontrolled discussion which might undermine their power. Recent reports in the media indicate that government control and monitoring of the internet is in our future. It would definitely be an effective tool in shutting down the viewing of child pornography which is a noble and worthwhile goal but it could also halt the uncontrolled flow of news and information that might foster discontent with the system.

***

But then what I just posted sounds a lot like conspiracy theories popular with those who believe in the Illuminati, the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), the Trilateral Commission, and the Bilderberg Group. While I enjoy reading such conspiracy theories I find them somewhat humorous. I do believe that the rich and powerful do attend meetings and try to solve world problems in order to preserve their wealth and also try to insure that our civilization doesn't destroy itself with the power we have. That makes logical sense. While the 1% does have considerable influence, it is debatable that they are anywhere as omnipotent as some believe. Controlling people is a lot like herding cats.

Realistically I fear that while the ability to bypass the Fourth Amendment to our Constitution might avert a terrorist attack and save many lives, that same power could be abused by a President like Richard Nixon.

I'm being somewhat facetious when I say that because I posted this I will have to put on my tin foil hat, watch for inconspicuous white cars following me and listen for odd clicks and buzzes when I talk on the phone. However if we continue heading in the same direction as we are today in a few years I might be wise to avoid expressing such views on the internet.

As Ben Franklin said,


Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.

Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759
http://www.quotationspage.com/quotes/Benjamin_Franklin/31


 

cbrer

(1,831 posts)
2. Move over
Sun Jun 17, 2012, 05:37 AM
Jun 2012

And let me put on my tin hat right next to you.

Without wanting to sound like the "spin" admiration society, I think you've made astute, and valid observations. Questions then sprout from those thoughts...

Will we take our nation back before the cloud of control descends on the internet as well?

Will OWS expand into a valid political force?

Will vote counting continue to move to an electronic means?

Will enough citizens be outraged to perform their duty as outlined in the Declaration of Independence?

spin

(17,493 posts)
4. Good questions ...
Sun Jun 17, 2012, 04:11 PM
Jun 2012

My answer is mere speculation as I lack a crystal ball.

I will also point out that all your questions are largely interconnected in that if the ruling elite gains control of the internet, freedom movements such as the Arab Spring and OWS will be largely irrelevant as will voting as the results of future electronic elections will be predetermined. Indeed electronic voting may spread across the world because of this fact.

Such control will be one of the most important factors in deciding if the 1% continues to rule the 99%. If the elite win, freedom will suffer. If the people win, freedom will spread and grow. The internet has helped to cause dictatorships to fall in the Middle East and also offers a freedom of information that can allow citizens in more democratic societies to force positive change.

Control of the internet can stifle the voices of those who disagree with the direction their nation is headed and will enable their government to target them for prosecution before support for their views grow to a dangerous level. For example the Patriot Act in our nation will enable our government to label political dissenters as terrorists. Therefore outrage about the loss of the liberties we have been granted by the Bill of Rights could be held to a minimum.

Many people in our nation have noticed that it makes little difference which candidate you vote for as the overall direction the nation is heading never changes. Minor changes over wedge issues do occur but they are largely unimportant to the ruling 1%.

While I disagree with their goals, the Tea Party has successfully moved the Republican party toward an extremely conservative position. Perhaps we need to form such a movement using the Tea Party example to garner support from Democrats and Independents and force our party to better represent our goals. If there is a problem with the OWS type movements it is that they can be portrayed as anarchists by the media. The Tea Party gathered and successfully placed many very conservative candidates into office. They were largely peaceful and law abiding and reportedly left the areas they occupied for a short period of time neat and clean when they left. Some carried firearms and some displayed racist signs, but overall the media was unable to portray them in a negative light and to a large extent they accomplished their goals. Unfortunately the people they managed to get elected to national office have led to a stalemate on any compromises between the Republican and Democratic fractions of Congress and we have seen no progress since the midterm elections in solving the problems our nation faces.

I personally feel that a large segment of the 99%, including conservatives, liberals and independents, could compromise and agree on some basic principles and work together to reform our system of elections in order to combat control of our elected bodies by the rich and the large corporations. We may differ on many issues but it does appear that many we elect are bought and owned and their masters can pull financial strings to insure that on anything truly important to the ruling 1% gets approved by their puppets in our Congress.

If such a movement were formed it could gather support from the majority of people in our nation as polls show we are fed up with and largely distrust our elected officials who hold national office (with good reason).


http://www.gallup.com/poll/149009/congressional-job-approval-ties-historic-low.aspx

Admittedly forming such a movement might be impossible but if the effort was successful it would scare the shit out of the 1% and the career politicians they own. At the worst we might see some laws passed that would actually help the 99% and at the best we can elect people to office who would better represent the middle class as well as the poor and actually compromise to find solutions to our problems.

It serves the 1% to foster public division over wedge issues such as abortion rights, gun control, gay rights and marriage and immigration reform. Such concerns are largely irrelevant to the elite as long as they control their own agenda which is mainly to maintain their power.

It was not the intention of the founding fathers of our nation to guarantee that the few would rule the many but human history shows this is common. Our nation achieved its current status as the world leader because we believed in the wisdom and intelligence of the many rather than a royal elite. Because we have a relatively unique form of a representative democracy we created a strong middle class. In order to achieve this we have had to fight the control of the 1% many times in our history. However the rich and powerful are quite resourceful and fully capable of adapting to our modern world and using our new technology to stay in power. We, the many, are also intelligent and often even more inventive than the 1% and can use the same technology to fight back. We can win the good fight and share power with the few and both they and us will be better off.

I personally have no hatred of the 1% but I don't want to live with their boots on my neck.

I found a fairly interesting article on control of the internet for you to read and consider.


World War 3.0


TWO FUTURES? Privacy, piracy, security, sovereignty—the divisions on these issues reflect an even deeper split between those who want tight control and those who want unfettered freedom.

When the Internet was created, decades ago, one thing was inevitable: the war today over how (or whether) to control it, and who should have that power. Battle lines have been drawn between repressive regimes and Western democracies, corporations and customers, hackers and law enforcement. Looking toward a year-end negotiation in Dubai, where 193 nations will gather to revise a U.N. treaty concerning the Internet, Michael Joseph Gross lays out the stakes in a conflict that could split the virtual world as we know it.
http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2012/05/internet-regulation-war-sopa-pipa-defcon-hacking




 

cbrer

(1,831 posts)
5. You may be right for containing your hatred
Mon Jun 18, 2012, 05:52 AM
Jun 2012

For some reason (evolutionary adaptability?) it seems easier for humans to hate than love.

But more on point, I HATE the greed and short sightedness that have inflicted so much hurt, sorrow, and injustice on humanity. The people who have perpetrated these acts are beneath contempt. They believe themselves above retribution, or accountability.

It's easier for everyone to succeed. Having a healthy economy, a clean environment, and a philosophy of learning, are actually attainable, and beneficial to all. Especially the future generations.

PS I'll check the link

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