General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region Forums"People for Bernie" says that Ds and Rs are basically the same. Promises to attack both.
http://www.salon.com/2017/09/08/some-bernie-sanders-supporters-complain-that-the-democratic-party-isnt-letting-them-run-things/Politico reported Friday that Bernie Sanders supporters are trying to infiltrate and purify the Democratic Party by lobbing attacks at anyone who seems to move to the center.
Prominent Democrats are increasingly riled by attacks from Bernie Sanders supporters, whose demands for ideological purity are hurting the party ahead of the 2018 midterms and 2020 presidential election, they say.
https://medium.com/@People4Bernie/in-response-to-the-democratic-party-establishments-recent-attempts-to-divide-the-party-b6228c7316ec
The Democratic Party establishment has no leverage over us or over Bernie. Time and time again, we've proven that we are willing to work with them. Unfortunately, it seems theyre more willing to work with Trump than work with us.
Theyre the ones creating division. We encourage them to show up to the next canvass and talk to actual activists instead of talking to their donor list.
...
We dont need unity around party, we need unity around issues. On issue after issue, the American people have already decided theyre on our side.
...
As a group and as a movement we spend far more time attacking Republicans than Democrats. If certain Democrats can only see the attacks on them, they need to act less like Republicans and more like Democratic Socialists.
--------------------
There you have it. By their own words.
You are either with the "People for Bernie" or you're against them.
If you're not a Democratic Socialist, then you're not a Democrat: Then you're a Republican.
I have seen quite a few posts that the Democrats should be nice to the Bernie-people, because the Ds need their votes...
Now we know how the Democrats can do that!
All they have to do is giving the "People for Bernie" full control over the party! It's that simple!!!!!!
Not Ruth
(3,613 posts)Eliot Rosewater
(31,150 posts)civil rights of all non white christians, ahead of any and all economic issues.
Far left I am not sure of, or what that means exactly.
Not Ruth
(3,613 posts)mcar
(42,474 posts)EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)johnsonsnap
(56 posts)Well?
Response to Eliot Rosewater (Reply #3)
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Bernardo de La Paz
(49,075 posts)Please do not do that, even if it is your first post.
He did not call anybody "racists and deplorables".
Rosewater wasn't throwing anybody under the bus.
Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #140)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Bernardo de La Paz
(49,075 posts)In any case, in the post you just linked, the DU member you are attacking makes an excellent point: As much as tRump is a problem the fact that his supporters are blind to his faults is a big problem too.
As far as I can see (5 or 6 of your 7) your posts have all consisted of attacks on Democrats and DU members.
Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #142)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Bernardo de La Paz
(49,075 posts)Stop. Please. While you can.
George II
(67,782 posts)Response to George II (Reply #145)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Bernardo de La Paz
(49,075 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)Bernardo de La Paz
(49,075 posts)Hortensis
(58,785 posts)Last edited Sun Sep 10, 2017, 10:57 AM - Edit history (1)
Sorry, but lifelong liberal here, and that makes about as much sense as a doctor prescribing aspirin but holding the antibiotic until after the fever and cough resolve. They must be addressed together.
Economic issues are not just hugely important to everyone personally and because the stability and wellbeing of our nation are implacably tied to them, but economic issues are hugely integral to all other rights, very much including social justice issues. Money is empowering.
Caliman73
(11,760 posts)No offense to Elliot Rosewater, but I think defining liberals as putting social issues ahead of economic issues is not accurate. Economic issues and social issues are intertwined.
The problem with Bernie Sanders and many of his supporters (of which I was one in the primary) is that he focused almost exclusively on economic issues without addressing the specific social issues which lock many women and minorities out from economic justice. Bernie did not resonate with many people of color because he failed to address the additional obstacles that they face. We have to remember that even during the hay day of the Union movement in the 40's through the 60's, there was segregation and discrimination by Unions against Black Americans, Latinos, and women. Economic justice is never really guaranteed for ALL Americans, but social justice for Black people, Latinos, Asians, LGBT people, and Women does not mean LESS justice for other groups not mentioned. Liberal either do, or they certainly SHOULD be for both social and economic justice.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,150 posts)lunasun
(21,646 posts)samnsara
(17,665 posts)brush
(53,978 posts)PLEASE!
It's like that movie: They just don't know how to quit us.
PragmaticLiberal
(904 posts)If they're truly that unhappy then perhaps it's time to strike out on their own.
democratisphere
(17,235 posts)brush
(53,978 posts)trueblue2007
(17,250 posts)He isn't even a member of our party !! Why are OUR Democrats giving in to him.
If Bernie wants to BE A DEMOCRAT that is fine, but until then, I think he should stop threatening us.
MizMort
(4 posts)I joined DU because I am kind of horrified by the influx of all this Bernie content. I am a proud Democrat and I would have never voted for Bernie or Stein. Ever.
It was time to finally sign up and add my loyal Democrat voice to this community- I must say, I do love the block and trash feature very much!
shanny
(6,709 posts)dictating to Democrats?
fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Oy vey!
Autumn
(45,120 posts)As a Bernie supporter just like him, I support Dems. I clicked on your link to see who these "people for Bernie" are and it took me to a writing site. There is othing there about these "people for Bernie".
lunasun
(21,646 posts)Autumn
(45,120 posts)lapucelle
(18,410 posts)Here's the updated link to their story.
https://medium.com/@People4Bernie/in-response-to-the-democratic-party-establishments-recent-attempts-to-divide-the-party-b6228c7316ec
Here's the tweet that People for Bernie published yesterday.
Link to tweet
Fiendish Thingy
(15,711 posts)msongs
(67,502 posts)Kablooie
(18,648 posts)NastyRiffraff
(12,448 posts)LonePirate
(13,446 posts)It would seem that some people have not learned a damn thing since January 20 of this year.
Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)any comment that might reflect poorly on Bernie or a group of his supporters, someone complains that it is fighting the Primary again. Current events are not fighting the Primaries all over again. He (or they) do not get a blank check for anything that comes after the Primary.
spooky3
(34,528 posts)Dem. Party.
LonePirate
(13,446 posts)And if someone does dare to call out people who think there is/was no difference between Hillary and 45, they are immediately ganged up on by his supporters. It's like clockwork.
JHan
(10,173 posts)If that's the case , those who don't like it being called out probably sympathize with the disrupters.
mcar
(42,474 posts)They are actively working to hurt the Dem party. Tell me again, why should we reach out to them?
MANative
(4,113 posts)As much as some people say they want Hillary to go away, multiply that by 10,000,000 and you get how I feel about Bernie bros.
BainsBane
(53,137 posts)There aren't enough zeros to communicate my agreement with that statement.
Skidmore
(37,364 posts)follow.the.money.
BainsBane
(53,137 posts)ProfessorPlum
(11,284 posts)namely, figments of a right wingers wet dream.
lunasun
(21,646 posts)ProfessorPlum
(11,284 posts)there are no fake people on Twitter, as we all know
clu
(494 posts)half could be Russian. sorry to be dismissive maybe they are an earnest group but I don't think they represent the intentions of all progressive voters. yes some dems should be primaried, but with good candidates. 2017 is not that far away whew
Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)good advice for any that think the parties are the same...
Orsino
(37,428 posts)pansypoo53219
(21,010 posts)ananda
(28,914 posts)If Dems would just be Dems and go back to their
liberal roots, nobody would have to worry about
Sanders supporters.
They would win races handily.
BainsBane
(53,137 posts)what time are you talking about. Please, be specific.
nini
(16,672 posts)How the hell does that make sense?
That's one of the lamest arguments make by you purists that we lose votes to the side that is completely off the edge of the right.
Learn about gerrymandering, election hacking etc.. then talk to me about how easy it is.
Democrats are still the best choice.
Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)you be happier if the banker world went to China? Millions of Americans including me have money in 401K's which would not be helped by destroying Wall Street, and this sort of rhetoric won't work in electing Democrats either. It is foolish...you have to have an economy...most Americans have no desire to live in a country without jobs...so for God sake, can we show some common sense and stop with the meaningless talking points like 'get Wall Street'. It won't happen, and it shouldn't happen. How about common sense regulation? Now that has meaning.
BainsBane
(53,137 posts)Just before the People's Summit. The speeches from that Summit, most notably Nina Turners, made no mention of the bill. Instead she claimed the Democrats were worse than the GOP on Wall Street, despite the fact Democrats opposed the bill. If the concern was Wall Street, why wouldn't have Turner and others encouraged supporters to organize against that bill?
The Clinton campaign and the party proposes greater regulation of and higher taxes for Wall Street.
https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/wall-street/
https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/a-fair-tax-system/
To claim they are the same is factually false. In fact, it requires a concerted effort to remain uninformed.
Hekate
(91,039 posts)BainsBane
(53,137 posts)Last edited Sat Sep 9, 2017, 02:07 AM - Edit history (1)
To say what they mean by any of these labels?
JI7
(89,289 posts)according to one poster the democratic party from 30s-60s was the glory days of the party.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,150 posts)move their heads up and down in agreement, not knowing exactly what they are agreeing to, actually.
What is "pander" and what would you have a political party do with our economy which is almost entirely based on Wall Street, unfortunately?
You see if you want to talk about the ills of our version of capitalism, we can talk, I will be to the left of you on it I bet.
But if you want to talk about our EXISTENCE now, and how to deal with it, that is different, VASTLY different.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)With things like attacks on LGBT, African American and women's rights not to mention attacks on the dreamers who did nothing wrong.
Meaningless slogans aimed at Democrats helps empower Republicans and helps put them in office.
Caliman73
(11,760 posts)What is "pandering to Wall Street"?
What does "Cutting off Wall Street" mean and how would that look?
I am all for addressing the influence that finance has on the political system but to me, "pandering" and "cutting off" sound like empty phrases that maybe express frustration, but do not provide any sort of information.
BainsBane
(53,137 posts)Unity around issues? What issues? They want unity around Bernie and their own demands for power.
If they gave even the slightest shit about issues, they wouldn't say the two parties are the same. That's a blatant lie.
That comment reveals complete disregard for the lives of DACA recipients, victims of hate crimes, the sick, elderly, and others who are losing rights and basic subsistence income under Trump. It shows they don't give the slightest shit about access to higher education or the environment.
Only people with a great deal of privilege and financial comfort could make that statement.
Kolesar
(31,182 posts)There was a list of harms they kept whining about. Gay rights, TPP, etc.
People who will never be happy, will always find something to be outraged about.
Me.
(35,454 posts)Fed up with these shams
Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)the majority of Democrats need to coddle and appease the far fewer 3rd Party left voters so they will vote for the Democratic nominee.
There's too much at stake to keep spending time on them.
nini
(16,672 posts)Someone needs to tell them 'working with' does NOT mean if they don't get their way every time they lash out like petulant children.
You can't get a damn thing done without compromise at times. Until they figure that out they'll be the insane tea party of the left.
I am so over them.
jalan48
(13,916 posts)Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)rhetoric. And that is a damn shame.
jalan48
(13,916 posts)Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)endorsing candidates like Mello are pushing us rightward...and the GOP will make us look socialist...the kiss of death for us in the coming elections. The far left cost us 16...the fucking Greens ...eternal spoilers and their riffraff buddies...and now we have moved to the right...thanks to them...now that is irony for you.
jalan48
(13,916 posts)We have moved to the right because our political parties have moved to the right over the last 40 years. The influence of money coming from corporations and wealthy individuals has harmed our system of government-not the Greens and other fringe groups. More social programs to help the citizens mean higher taxes for these folks, so guess what- these programs are referred to as "ponies" and are called unrealistic. Sadly even Democrats are falling for this charade.
Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)And your concern for wealth and wall street would be more convincing if the far left was not primarying Dianne Feinstein with a rich Wall Street guy who is pretending to be a socialist...hahah.
mythology
(9,527 posts)Both sides seem far more invested in being "right" than finding common ground. And yes that absolutely includes some of the more aggressive Clinton supporters.
GoCubsGo
(32,103 posts)(Or, returned from that other site.) The only posts they have made have been to push Sanders. Not a peep from them in the posts about the hurricanes, DACA, Trump, or any actual Democratic issues and policies....
nini
(16,672 posts)That's why there's been an escalation in the insanity here lately.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)But instead of a single payer plan, we have an Insurance company subsidy thinly disguised as a health care plan.
The US spends far more on its war machine than the next 12 countries combined, yet there is bipartisan support for even more war spending and military intervention.
Surveys show that actual workers and taxpayers support higher taxes on the rich and their corporations, but where is the call for higher taxes on the rich?
I see this as being on the side of the workers or being on the side of the rich.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)For liberal or conservative policies.
JI7
(89,289 posts)clu
(494 posts)guessed correctly that as a single state they could not afford such a program
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)It needs to be a national program.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Voting patterns support the idea that voters are progressive on the issues, but issue framing is the GOP strength.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)between those who call themselves pragmatists and those who see ground for a victory if only the Democratic Party can abandon a failed paradigm.
Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)It is going to vary by the state and trying to elect a liberal or a socialist in say Texas or West Virginia simple won't work...and as I have said before, people lie.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Sanders ran very well in rural areas and in states that the Democrats lost in the election. He is still the most popular politician in the US. To say that certain states must be written off to any progressive appeal in favor of centrism is to concede defeat prior to the election.
Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)But Sanders, and Wellstone before him, showed how motivated voters can overcome money.
Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)And that is two people...and how many lost because they didn't have the money?
LisaM
(27,863 posts)If he doesn't, well, then it's clear that he doesn't mind this.
R B Garr
(17,019 posts)nini
(16,672 posts)are Russian bots working on dividing the Democrats? I think there's both the bots and the obnoxious bros here at work.
YCHDT
(962 posts)Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)world wide wally
(21,762 posts)Plus, I hate to break it to you but Bernie will never be the President.
Now, what are you going to do about that? Vote for Jill Stein? Or maybe Trump himself?
Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)B. Sen. Sanders is not permitted to run as a Democrat as he is not a Democrat...or C. Sen. Sanders loses the primary. I think some actually think he will be president in 2020. It will never happen but the attempt will elect a Republican.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)trying to stir the shit from some Macedonian server farm...
Cary
(11,746 posts)Good grief.
Weekend Warrior
(1,301 posts)Mike Nelson
(9,990 posts)...obviously, Bernie Sanders doesn't agree with these liars. He repeatedly noted a clear difference between Democrats and Republicans - and he had no trouble seeing the difference between Hillary and Trump.
Willie Pep
(841 posts)Sanders can't control all of the people who claim his name. Some of these online Bernie supporters are really "out there" but as others have pointed out before on this forum most Sanders supporters voted for Clinton in the general election and there is not much difference between most Clinton and Sanders supporters except for a few issues like trade and perceptions of corruption in the political process. Those are important differences but not as large as some would think given the intensity of arguments on the Internet between some Clinton and Sanders supporters. Thankfully the Internet is not exactly like real life. This is why I try to avoid some of these online groups. They often represent the views of a small number of extreme people not the majority.
Mike Nelson
(9,990 posts)...they are a small minority, but very vocal. I have friends who can't forgive the Democrats for "stealing" the election from Bernie. He did well - there were some regrettable moments by all, but there always are... many of the Bernie supporters clearly stated, right here on DU, that they would never vote for Hillary Clinton. I believed them. Also, she moved as "left" as she could without losing support on the other side. Hillary, Bernie and many Democrats are more "liberal" than they let on... it's politics. Bernie has the gun folks in VT to think about, for example. I wish people could be more practical...
Willie Pep
(841 posts)I can't remember where I read that but I think it is true. Anyway, I agree with you. I don't understand why some people would want to possibly throw the election to Trump just because of the primary. Even if you don't agree with Clinton on everything at least with her Sanders supporters would get say 75% of what they want as opposed to almost nothing like they would with Trump.
haveahart
(905 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)stevenleser
(32,886 posts)"For all intents and purposes"
You use that kind of a qualifying phrase for someone or something that isn't really part of a group or class but you are making an exception to treat them as such.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)However, what admin seems to be saying here is, for the purposes of discussion and the rules of DU, he is subject to the same considerations.
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)Cuz damn!
grantcart
(53,061 posts)Real Democrats don't need asterisks
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)Bleacher Creature
(11,258 posts)Last edited Fri Sep 8, 2017, 09:55 PM - Edit history (1)
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)Thinking Gore was as bad as Bush should embarrass anyone in hindsight. 16 years later many of them made the same mistake again.
That should be doubly embarrassing, I mean anyone can make a bad mistake once right? To not learn from widely known and public mistakes from others (or yourself) and do the same thing again is really the stuff of rank stupidity. (i.e JPR types)
Cary
(11,746 posts)And ever so they shall remain.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)And use those stupid beliefs to make voting decisions that hurt large groups of vulnerable Americans is another matter.
DFW
(54,506 posts)Equating Gore and Bush or HRC and Trump is basically looking into the sun and saying it's midnight.
shanny
(6,709 posts)is continuing to blame Nader for the loss of Florida when far more Florida Democrats voted for Bush than Nader.
But scapegoating the left is preferable to some, isn't it.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)You can register as a Republican. If you then vote Green does that mean Republicans want Greens in office?
No. I lived in Florida for 15 years. I know that there are a lot of conservative people in the panhandle who register Democratic because they arent as far right as a lot of the other folks in the panhandle. But few of their views are what anyone here on DU would consider Democratic. Those are the "Democrats" who voted for Bush.
Do the research before you make assertions. And not just superficial research, try to understand what it is you are saying at a deep level, because what you wrote here isn't it and doesn't cut it.
shanny
(6,709 posts)so what constitutes a real "Democrat" is what people on this board and specifically you, think constitutes a real Democrat? that's one problem--but it's debatable so i'm not going to bother with arguing about it. but to back up your claim of deep knowledge and research you cite fucking anecdotal evidence? your personal experience--as told to you, 'cause you certainly didn't witness it in the literal sense
that is very, very deep. i am so impressed.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)Stinky The Clown
(67,846 posts)No. Really. Go Fuck Yourselves.
ucrdem
(15,512 posts)I remember when Lyndon LaRouche tried to take over the Peace and Freedom Party in California. Very ugly and P&F never really recovered.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)If it were an act they would deserve an academy award.
Sadly it's not.
dembotoz
(16,866 posts)EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)Yes. I said it.
onecaliberal
(33,008 posts)Just fucking stop already
LuvLoogie
(7,078 posts)Historic NY
(37,462 posts)People for Bernie present a convoluted argument. In their first paragraph, they renounce loyalty to the Democratic Party,
JI7
(89,289 posts)the left.
clu
(494 posts)seemed to accept the article on it's face and went on to condemn members of this group. maybe I misinterpreted - my mistake. thank you for this clarification it is important to make.
jalan48
(13,916 posts)"People for Bernie", "Berniebros", etc. are ruses to distract us from the reality of our current political system. Who is paying to elect our politicians?
emulatorloo
(44,274 posts)Sorry not seeing anyone saying that.
jalan48
(13,916 posts)her losing effort. My point is why all this focus on Greens and Bernie Bros-shouldn't our focus be on the big money buying our elections? The Greens have no power and little influence compared to billionaire hedge fund mangers.
emulatorloo
(44,274 posts)the two parties are "the same".
I don't know anything about this group, I doubt Bernie is aligned w it.
jalan48
(13,916 posts)of money to finance their candidates. Bernie made this a central point of his candidacy.
emulatorloo
(44,274 posts)Steve King/Paul Ryan.
As to campaign finance issues, I'll remind you Our Revolution is a 501c, which is not required to reveal its donors.
Campaign finance reform is a huge issue. We should have a full and honest discussion about that. Not spuriously claim that Dems and Republicans are the 'same'
jalan48
(13,916 posts)emulatorloo
(44,274 posts)It isn't relevant to the OP which is about ideology.
Until we get more Dems elected to congress I see little chance we'll see comprehensive finance reform. Republicans have zero interest in reform.
---
Interesting article about Barbara Boxers new hybrid PAC. Designed to create attack ads against Republicans and support Democratic candidates in CA.
Barbara Boxer may be retired, but she isnt giving up the fight against Trump
https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpost/barbara-boxer-may-be-retired-but-she-isnt-giving-up-the-fight-against-trump/2017/09/09/78a1d37a-94c9-11e7-aace-04b862b2b3f3_story.html?utm_term=.c326afa743f9
<snip>
This violates Boxers belief that unlimited donations should be outlawed, but shes willing to endure the charge of hypocrisy as long as conservative groups collect even larger checks from mega-donors.
Im going to play by the same rules as the Koch brothers, Boxer said in a reference to Charles and David Koch. The billionaire brothers donate to politicians and political causes.
<snip>
I believe this is what drives progressive organizations like Our Revolution and progressives like Boxer to create PACs. No one is interested in laying down and surrendering to billionaires Republicans. No finance reform is coming until we get more Dems in congress.
YCHDT
(962 posts)Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)who packed the courts and ushered in United...now some of you seem to think that Democrats should be all high and mighty and not take the money...that happened by the way during Obama's time in office; there was a rule implemented at the DNC...did you see any winning? We have to win before we can address the money and starving our candidates is not the way to go. The rule about money has been rescinded and thank God for that. In Ohio, they gave up on our gubernatorial candidate in a month or two...only those who were convincingly ahead got money because there wasn't any damn money...so some purist may enjoy losing and wring their hands sobbing, 'the Dems must take the high road', and watch the GOP literally kill people and steal our rights one by one, but I want to win and stop those bastards...so we do what we have to in order to win...or it really doesn't matter.
jalan48
(13,916 posts)Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)jalan48
(13,916 posts)Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)Job losses and pension losses followed...my neighbor hung himself in his garage...while many left left talk about the abstract and how the Dems should or should not...blah blah...real people live and die when they vote their so called conscience. My conscience doesn't allow me to vote for a candidate that can not win and elect a Republican who literally causes the death of the poor and now the DACA kids if they get their way.
Had these folks not abandoned Obama because he could not get the impossible dream...single payer...we might have made some progress during his term...but no...sob , sob ...why they would show him and take away every possibility of a implementing a progressive agenda (created the gerrymander too). We had six years where nothing got done...nothing new with these folks.They are very effective in their sabotage and have elected many Republicans.
jalan48
(13,916 posts)How about we look in the mirror and ask ourselves why millions of registered Democrats and other voters don't even bother to vote in elections. The blame game is hurting our Party, it makes us look out of touch. What are we afraid to see?
Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)jalan48
(13,916 posts)Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)jalan48
(13,916 posts)Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)Vote Democratic. it is the only way to advance a progressive agenda...look to majorities which never happen without a big tent Democratic Party.
jalan48
(13,916 posts)didn't even bother to vote. Do you think those mean Greens kept them away from the polls?
Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)what happens and there are some states that don't have party registration...people who tout the 'falling numbers' never take that into account. All those on the left left...these conscience voter who have no conscience or empathy for real human beings like the Dreamers, all they can do is act as spoilers and enable Trump and the GOP...I don't consider them progressive in the least and I despise them. Of course many of them during the 2016 general who were touting the idea the parties are the same or the Democrats were worse for God's sake...and the I hate Hillary meme...were Russian trolls who tricked the apparently gullible left left green riffraff...well when one considers the Democratic Party to be the same or even a greater threat than rethugs...that person can't be very bright.
jalan48
(13,916 posts)Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)majority of the Democratic Party...based on 16. So if you support groups like "our revolution" and right now even move on you support Republicans...as with primarying sitting Dems that is who they are helping.
jalan48
(13,916 posts)Blue_true
(31,261 posts)If they live up to their word, it is better for us. Because in the past they have fucking attacked nothing but Democrats.
eShirl
(18,509 posts)I mean, we need to stop Putin meddling in our domestic politics
larry budwell
(50 posts)Trump is President, not Bernie. A purity test will kill the Demo's chances in 2018 and 2020.
Being a Democratic Socialist is not a winning position. Let's win in 2018 and 2020. Remember that "politics" is the art of compromise.
clu
(494 posts)thank you mr. 49 post counter who registered in 2016 - we definitely need to move away from traditional democratic platforms
edit- work with president trump? this post stands with a three story foundation go back to russia
Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)the election.
trueblue2007
(17,250 posts)Who gives a crap about working with Trump??? If this is your idea, are you a Republican pushing this point? It sure isn't in the Democratic party platform to work WITH some asshole who is Against raising the minimum wage, wanting to privatize everything..... his rich buddies. PRO KICKING MILLIONS OF PEOPLE OUT OF THE USA, Against a woman's right to chose to have an abortion and all the other CRAP NOTIONS HE HAS !!!!!
YOU ARE WRONG !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Response to trueblue2007 (Reply #119)
Post removed
trueblue2007
(17,250 posts)and WORKING TOGETHER hardly ever works
HARDLY EVER GET IT???? GOP's propose things we hate. it is IMPOSSIBLE to work together when the GOP's want to get rid of OBAMA CARE, ABORTION, Want to put RELIGION IN SCHOOLS, want to DRILL IN THE TUNDRA, next to our rivers and in our oceans for just a few things. I think you are either trying to cause a fight with DEMS or you are incredibly naive.
DFW
(54,506 posts)How are Democrats supposed to "work with" someone whose views are shaped with the last person he talked with?
I'm trying to figure out just what issues are ripe for collaboration? Environment? Nope, Pruitt at EPA is proof that Trump couldn't care less. His "good luck" to drowning Houston confirmed it. Education? Nope. DeVos as Secretary of Education proves he couldn't care less about that. Foreign relations? Even Tillerson can't work with Trump, so how are Democrats supposed to manage that? The economy? Having Mnuchin at Treasury nixes any illusions of being able to do that, not to mention that Trump's actions with regard to his own and family businesses make it look like he is trying to surpass Warren Harding in the field of corruption in office.
The trouble with slogans like "work with Trump" is that Trump didn't have a political agenda to "work with" in the first place, other than satisfying his ego trip of beating Hillary. Well, he got his wish (well, OK, no, he didn't, but it was manipulated enough to have that effect). But what happened then? Like the Robert Redford character in "The Candidate," who ended up winning en election he wasn't supposed to win, Trump seems to have this lost "What do we do now?" approach to things.
Here's the next phase:
YCHDT
(962 posts)DFW
(54,506 posts)He's a threat to a good many of his most enthusiastic supporters, for that matter. They won't realize it until they are out of work with no welfare or sick with cancer from pollution and have no means of getting treatment, or having their local schools closed for lack of funding, but until that and similar ills come home to roost, they will continue to think he's really good for them. After all, Fox Noise said so, and it's their only form of information. The opposite being true will remain of no consequence to them until it's too late to rectify their mistake--and even then, more than half of them will blame their ill fate on "libbruls."
clu
(494 posts)LBM20
(1,580 posts)peggysue2
(10,853 posts)Unless Pelosi & Schumer can pull additional rabbits out of the hat.
Beyond that this Administration is illegitimate, despicable and totally unreliable. I'm all for compromise but not with a mentally and morally challenged nitwit. If Pelosi and/or Schumer can outfox Trump, appealing to his McConnell/Ryan distrust or stroking his bloated ego? Fine. But compromising with a unstable mood-monster never ends well. The best scenario is Trump resigns or is forced out.
I absolutely agree that the Democratic Party must rack up wins in 2018 which makes the Saint Bernard/People for Bernie/constant popularity polling all the more odious in its divisiveness. Which, I suspect, is the underlying point. Anything to divide Democrats and have us fighting among ourselves. Worked pretty neatly in 2000 & 2016. And we're paying the price, not simply as a party but as a country. Same goes for calling for the ouster of Democratic leaders or insisting on progressive candidates in conservative districts. Or claiming that Democrats and Republicans are all the same. One need only glance at the Republican agenda/wish list to know how truly insane that theory is.
Whatever micro-wins we can manage with Trump we should take and run. Otherwise, he's toxic. Or as Rick Wilson--Republican Never-Trumper--has said repeatedly: "Everything Trump touches dies."
Jakes Progress
(11,124 posts)Hillary and donnie are exactly the same, you are stupid.
Let's see. Bernie ran for the Democratic nomination. Does that make him just like donnie?
Actually the idiots who write this shit are most likely russian bots and paid trolls. They don't believe anything. They did this shit during the election and some soft-headed, non-thinkers ate it up. They are only gearing up for the next election with this kind of dangling bait for the weak-minded.
mountain grammy
(26,676 posts)Jakes Progress
(11,124 posts)get the red out
(13,468 posts)How much of this division of the left is pushed along by bots? Personally I think we waste our energy on this stuff. The election was hacked, Hillary really won, bots can go to hell, time to fight the hacking and the Republicans who love it.
potone
(1,701 posts)Let's focus on issues and finding good candidates for offices at all levels.
We are facing crises on all fronts; let's not dissipate our energies on marginal groups.
shanny
(6,709 posts)And FYI it is a bad idea to keep following the center when the center is being dragged to the right by the nutjobs. We will all end up where we don't want to be.
Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)a center right country by now, you can not run to the left, or you will have a Dukakis style loss. This time is not that different from the 90's where Bill Clinton devised a strategy to beat the Republicans, and it worked...saved the courts...now please spare me the whining about Clinton...no liberal was ever getting elected 92 and as a liberal, I am sad to say I don't think a true liberal or socialist can get elected in 2020. We are going to have to go after a big tent. It is the only way. Will we not get our liberal dreams fulfilled no...but we will get some things...like a public option which can lead to medicare for all or some other universal plan, maybe we can end two stupid wars, save the dreamers, reign in the police and their recent abuses, stop the practice of giving police department military weapons...the list is endless. You can be pure and lose, but a 100% of nothing is still nothing, or you can work with what we have: stop the GOP and have incremental victories. We need to face the reality of our situation...and make it work for us.
shanny
(6,709 posts)Demsrule86
(68,825 posts)It doesn't change what I wrote...the country can not be considered as a whole but state by state or even district by district.
shanny
(6,709 posts)trump won by moving the overton window...where?
ananda
(28,914 posts)Sheesh
TexasBushwhacker
(20,256 posts)People4Bernie is probably funded by the Russians or the Kochs or the Mercers. Because rat fuckers gotta fuck rats.
Response to DetlefK (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
liberal N proud
(60,352 posts)They are just as extreem, just as dangerous.
MBS
(9,688 posts)especially since they seem to be getting more strident, less co-operative, less willing to compromise with time. You'd think that with the current disastrous administration, they'd be more understanding of the need for a unified coalition. .. but no.
I'm getting really worried about this situation.
flyingfysh
(1,990 posts)Claiming that the parties are the same only plays into the hands of the ultra-rich Republicans. I had some disagreements with Hillary (if I look hard enough, I can find disagreements with practically anybody), but supported her enthusiastically.
L. Coyote
(51,129 posts)Or is it a quote from "Republicans for Democratic Divisiveness"?
Or, are those just two names for the same group?
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)WhiteTara
(29,736 posts)Akoto
(4,267 posts)His name is used lately in a number of divisive groups or movements.
I'm pretty sure Sanders wouldn't sincerely agree that Democrats are no better than Republicans. The Dems at least share some of his values, or come close to.