General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWe need an anti-war movement
In the Democratic party.
Democrats in the senate have supported and 80 billion dollar increase to the war machine of death and destruction. 700 billion dollars total to kill countless lives around the globe.
Its time the Democrats said enough! We will no longer feed your murder machines. Its time we as the Democratic base demand anti-war candidates! Every senator that supported this murder bill should be primaried witha candidate that values human life and want to invest in books and not bombs!
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Their huge local support. Trillions in tax money going to boondoggle war machines is why we can't have good things like health care!
leftstreet
(36,125 posts)According to the media that is
DURec
inwiththenew
(973 posts)There was for 3-4 years after the Iraq War started and then nothing. People lost interest I guess.
gilbert sullivan
(192 posts)Doing the same thing over and over, expecting different results hasn't worked.
ck4829
(35,126 posts)gilbert sullivan
(192 posts)to my question. Sorry.
HughBeaumont
(24,461 posts)With potential for more once radiation poisoning takes hold.
Trump is taking something that was never a problem and is now making it a problem.
gilbert sullivan
(192 posts)is not a "problem". Would it become one if one were to destroy Sapporo....or Guam?
gilbert sullivan
(192 posts)It almost seems as if some people would rather have 300 million Americans die than 10 million NKs. Wow.
You seem to be confused about just who is rattling the saber here.
HughBeaumont
(24,461 posts)What, you think Kim Jong Who Cares didn't exist during Obama?
President Obama paid him as much mind as he deserved to be paid. ZERO. DPRK is a crumbling iso state that can't even feed it's people. Lil' Kim wasn't even a blip on America's scope before Schtroumpf elevated him to Issue Number ONE . . . likely to distract from Mueller's upcoming investigation on the Putin Colludin'.
gilbert sullivan
(192 posts)"Li'l Kim" managed to get hundreds of missiles and nuclear bombs over the last 10 years. I despise Trump but he wasn't POTUS when that was going on.
WinstonSmith00
(228 posts)For the war profiteers, murderers, and the MIC.
Anybody that values human life above all else knows war is the least productive thing on the planet.
Proper response would be to not publically antagonize and threaten and rattle the war sabres.
gilbert sullivan
(192 posts)will be plowing for those who do not.
Not Ruth
(3,613 posts)And put Chinese troops on the DMZ alongside US troops
gilbert sullivan
(192 posts)Where would the DMZ be then?....and why would it even be needed?
Weekend Warrior
(1,301 posts)comradebillyboy
(10,224 posts)white college students to go fight in Afghanistan or Iraq then maybe an anti war movement might start. The opposition to the Viet Nam war needed the end of student deferments to really pick up steam. Not many people are needed for the current wars and everyone in the military now is a volunteer.
Initech
(100,312 posts)Forget that - we need to start going after the party's core values. We need to start painting them as the racists and white supremacists that they really are. We need to start going after their records. Otherwise it's going to be same shit, different year.
HughBeaumont
(24,461 posts)Democrats need to stop being receptive to destructive Conservative ideas. Stop going along to get along.
We're an opposition party . . . START OPPOSING.
WinstonSmith00
(228 posts)And primary Democrats that vote like repuklicans.
$80,000,000,000 increase to an already over inflated and wasteful budget. Feeding an out of control war that has killed over four thousand civilians by US bombs just since Trump has taken office.
If the Democrats truly oppose trump and the Republicans it is time to end their war games.
snooper2
(30,151 posts)are you getting emails from Bogdan? All of mine have been coming straight from Artyom.
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)and is a position the voters will reject.
There is a responsible middle ground in the Obama-Clinton mold that's the best option for peace.
WinstonSmith00
(228 posts)And saving the lives of our men and women who serve this country. They are being killed for greed nothing else.
We dont have to isolate our selves just simply stop dropping bombs and withdraw our military and bring our men and women home to fix this country.
Its time the people start determing their own destiny. There is a genocide going on in Burma right now we are not there. Death and brutality in Thailand. There are evil rulers totalitarian animals ruling so many countries and many are supposedly our allies.
Ending our war against the Muslim world (which under Trump thats truly what it is) and withdrawing our troops from conflicts that are none of our business is the right thing to do. Withdrawing our support from evil dictators and oppressive regimes also the right thing to do.
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)around the world.
Turning our back on the world is not a pro-peace position. It is a variant of America Firstism.
Bill
WinstonSmith00
(228 posts)We only spread more death chaos and misery with our bombs. More destablization and more conflict and endless war.
The US withdrawing militarily from the world would force the regions with conflict to either figure it out or anniliate eachother either way we should stay out of it.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Meanwhile they take the pork in Vt same reason they do in Iowa. The voters support their local military- whether or not they support your local military they want the business in state. Is that corrupt?
jalan48
(13,978 posts)Expecting Rain
(811 posts)got behind isolationist America Firstism in opposition to the internationalist anti-fascist policies of FDR.
And look how isolation turned out then.
Today we are seeing a resurgence of analogous populist nativist movements that challenge the FDR traditions of the Democratic Party.
Turning our backs on the world by embracing the isolationist positions of FDR's opponents would be a willful decision to ignore the lessons of history. Isolationism is a pro-war and pro-death position and isn't in the tradition of our party.
jalan48
(13,978 posts)And since then how many wars and interventions has the US (Military/Industrial/Complex) taken part in? Vietnam., as just one example, where thousands of US men were killed and over a million Vietnamese were killed and the environment destroyed with toxic chemicals-for what? Nike makes it shoes there now and it's a "Communist" country. No thanks, I don't need anymore Neo-Liberal perpetual war state.
WinstonSmith00
(228 posts)Stopping aggression and protecting the soveriegnty of our allies is not comparable to our current state of aggressive strike first world police we are today.
Iraq didnt ask us to invade them. Afghanistan didnt ask us to invade them. Neither country was threatening our allies or aggressively conquering other nations.
The megawealth are fueling both sides of this endless war for greed and nothing more. The fascist totalitarian nations are our allies and who we support the most with our bombs and jets.
Militarily funding the Saudis is the same as funding Hilter or the Daesh.
Over 4000 families destroyed with american bombs in 9 months since trump took office. Ending the murder machine MIC is not isolationism. It is a moral necessity if we ever want to live in a world of peace.
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)or how do we help stop aggression and protect the sovereignty of our allies if we lack the military capacity to do so?
That's the point.
There is a middle ground that Democratic presidents like Barack Obama have traveled with success. The Democratic tradition isn't one of supporting isolationism, as isolationism is a pro-war and pro-death position that speaks to the sorts of America Firsters and nativist populists who've long been in conflict with the party of FDR.
WinstonSmith00
(228 posts)And their primary mission should be peace keeping.
What we dont need to do is increase funding by 80 billion or have a military budget larger than the next 10 countries combined!
Having a rational defensive antiwar military budget would be expected.
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)to stop aggression and protect the sovereignty of our allies. Right?
gratuitous
(82,849 posts)There are other alternatives. Lots and lots of them. But we don't avail ourselves of them, because they don't line the pockets of defense contractors and they don't make pretty bang-bang explosions for the major media to oooh and aaah over. Those alternatives also don't feed our addiction to redemptive violence, which is so baked into our society we don't even notice it anymore.
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)which is why the "I'm already against the next war" neo-Isolationism that's on the rise in some quarters is so antithetical to the traditions of the party of FDR.
DemocraticWing
(1,290 posts)It should have been obvious by now. Why do you think young people supported Obama so much in 2008? What do you think explains the rise of neo-libertarianism, what do you think made Bernie really gain steam with young people?
No. More. War. We're tired of it and won't vote for people who refuse to end it.
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)WinstonSmith00
(228 posts)And promised he would withdraw even though he didnt.
Trump won because he was anti afghanistan and promised he would withdraw even though he isnt.
Part of Hillary not having the support from the left that Obama had is because she is too hawkish.
The anti-war rhetoric is winning even though its just rhetorical and makes for good speeches its what the people want.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)WinstonSmith00
(228 posts)But He did claim to be against Afghanistan and said he would withdraw and his base supported this position.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)jalan48
(13,978 posts)WinstonSmith00
(228 posts)Pumped into our infrastructure, social services, schools, and health care.
KG
(28,755 posts)WinstonSmith00
(228 posts)Vote anti-war!
SHRED
(28,136 posts)Corporate military contractors have big money...OUR MONEY. Which they use against us to their advantage.
disillusioned73
(2,872 posts)WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)phones.
And I'm not joking. College students were essential to the 1960s/70s anti-war movement.
Act_of_Reparation
(9,116 posts)...the college students of the 1960's and 1970's are the ones starting the wars.
So there's that.
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)As stated above there isn't a binary choice between neo-Isolationism and Amercian military adventurism.
Our party has done its best to maintain a middle path, with Vietnam serving as a blot on our record.
The answer isn't to swing to neo-Isolationist extremism that would only fuel war and death worldwide.
It isn't a position worthy of the Democratic Party.
WinstonSmith00
(228 posts)And the totalitarian regimes we support with weapons is the only path to peace. Everyday our weapons fuel more death worldwide.
SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)are anti-war?
Until hardworking citizens categorically reject the jobs provided by the Military Industrial complex (or they all move to solidly Red States), we're always going to have Senators that fund those jobs. And frankly, what do you expect in a Democracy? No one is going to vote for their own unemployment. They're going to replace their current senator with one who represents their interest, which is being able to put food on their table.
If you want to take a shot at the heart of the Military Industrial complex, you need to start/promote a movement to find alternative employment for those individuals because Senators can be replaced at the drop of the hat. They have more than enough money to ride out the 2-6 years necessary to replace a Senator in a swing state.
PragmaticLiberal
(904 posts)Expecting Rain
(811 posts)When nativist-isolationism is the surest path to global conflict, war, and needless deaths.
SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)"Don't approve the Defense Budget".
gilbert sullivan
(192 posts)Neville Chamberlain, clone a new one from the DNA and nominate him for President next time around,. THAT will show
those rocket flinging nutcases!!!
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)walkingman
(7,834 posts)it will never work. Americans love war in all of it's variations. Just look through history and you will see that anyone publicly discouraging war is labeled unpatriotic. If they are of any status then it gets even worse. They are publicly destroyed and without remorse.
We do not learn from our mistakes. The Vietnam and Iraqi wars are perfect examples. It doesn't matter. Most Americans like playing tough guy no matter how many people are killed or maimed. That include Americans.
The draft and civil rights movement were the only reason that the Vietnam protests were semi-effective but we were greatly outnumbered. I would think the religious communities would be willing to denounce war but just the opposite. We will be fighting and killing each other until the end of time.
gilbert sullivan
(192 posts)then attempting to interfere with inevitability is a fool's errand, nu?
alarimer
(16,245 posts)The Democrats (most of them) are atrocious in this aspect. Even as presidents, they have to be as warmongery as possible so that they won't be called wimps.
gilbert sullivan
(192 posts)begin with "Dear Leader Kim".