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brooklynite

(95,002 posts)
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 07:25 AM Jun 2015

Pope's climate change encyclical tells rich nations: 'pay your debt to the poor'

Source: The Guardian

Pope Francis has called on the world’s rich nations to begin paying their “grave social debt” to the poor and take concrete steps on climate change, saying failure to do so presents an undeniable risk to humanity.

...snip...

“The foreign debt of poor countries has become a way of controlling them, yet this is not the case where ecological debt is concerned,” Francis wrote. “In different ways, developing countries, where the most important reserves of the biosphere are found, continue to fuel the development of richer countries at the cost of their own present and future.

“The developed countries ought to help pay this debt by significantly limiting their consumption of non-renewable energy and by assisting poorer countries to support policies and programmes of sustainable development.”

In a press conference on Thursday in Vatican City to mark the release of Francis’s encyclical, Cardinal Peter Turkson, who wrote a draft and is the pope’s point-man on social justice issues, said it was imperative for “practical proposals not to be developed in an ideological, superficial or reductionist way”.

Read more: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jun/18/popes-climate-change-encyclical-calls-on-rich-nations-to-pay-social-debt



Encyclical Letter LAUDATO SI’ On Care For Our Common Home
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Pope's climate change encyclical tells rich nations: 'pay your debt to the poor' (Original Post) brooklynite Jun 2015 OP
Atone for centuries of past sins and on-going inhumanity while they're at it. Surya Gayatri Jun 2015 #1
the obscenely filthy rich catholic church has 2000 yrs worth of atonement to do nt msongs Jun 2015 #17
Yes, I fear Francis and his gang have a lot to atone for. Surya Gayatri Jun 2015 #19
ohhhh Rickey Santorum and the rest of his crazy Opus Dei pals aren't going to like this at all... Volaris Jun 2015 #2
Best thing about Opus is Penguin Opus rpannier Jun 2015 #6
Scalia and Thamas are Opus Dei, too. n/t leftyladyfrommo Jun 2015 #10
Here's the likely RW/MSM distraction on this underpants Jun 2015 #3
So when is the Vatican going to start SwankyXomb Jun 2015 #4
Good question! Jubilee! Cal Carpenter Jun 2015 #23
Go Pope libodem Jun 2015 #5
I'm sure they'll get right on that The2ndWheel Jun 2015 #7
How about just calling on western nations to do no harm jamzrockz Jun 2015 #8
One more thing jamzrockz Jun 2015 #11
Yes -- more solar sources for African countries! GreatGazoo Jun 2015 #14
This Pope almost makes me want to become a Catholic - RiverNoord Jun 2015 #9
I love this pope. I just wish he was better on women's issues. leftyladyfrommo Jun 2015 #12
The RCC is a misogynistic, homophobic institution. Arugula Latte Jun 2015 #18
not talking about the church leftyladyfrommo Jun 2015 #26
K&R raouldukelives Jun 2015 #13
Here is the Actual Paper: happyslug Jun 2015 #15
Yeah, his disgusting anti-birth control church contributed to the poverty Arugula Latte Jun 2015 #16
And yet US Catholics use birth control at higher rates than non-Catholics. pnwmom Jun 2015 #20
And that just shows the entire pretense of 'the faith' is bogus. They don't even follow the basic Bluenorthwest Jun 2015 #21
You know you're just a broken record on this subject. But carry on. n/t pnwmom Jun 2015 #24
This is about poor countries in debt to rich, Arugula Latte Jun 2015 #22
I disagree with the Church's position on birth control, which went against the original pnwmom Jun 2015 #25
 

Surya Gayatri

(15,445 posts)
1. Atone for centuries of past sins and on-going inhumanity while they're at it.
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 07:43 AM
Jun 2015

The world's weathy nations 'continue to fuel the development of richer countries at the cost of their own present and future.'

 

Surya Gayatri

(15,445 posts)
19. Yes, I fear Francis and his gang have a lot to atone for.
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 04:15 PM
Jun 2015

Top of the Catholic column of shame would have to be genocide in all of its heinous forms.

Volaris

(10,281 posts)
2. ohhhh Rickey Santorum and the rest of his crazy Opus Dei pals aren't going to like this at all...
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 08:02 AM
Jun 2015

nope not one little bit. What's next, the Pope feeding hungry people? Calling out the sin of avrice? Telling atheists they can go to heaven?

Oh yeah he did all that already.

There are days when the sound of crickets are rather calming actually lol=)

rpannier

(24,350 posts)
6. Best thing about Opus is Penguin Opus
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 10:03 AM
Jun 2015

I was shocked when I discovered that former baseball commissioner Bowie Kuhn was a member of Opus Dei when he was alive

underpants

(183,043 posts)
3. Here's the likely RW/MSM distraction on this
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 08:34 AM
Jun 2015

They will soak up air time with "but there is no proof it is man made" or at least "there are doubts about the cause".

The Pope smartly addressed the economical/financial aspect if this. THAT is the key.

 

jamzrockz

(1,333 posts)
8. How about just calling on western nations to do no harm
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 10:18 AM
Jun 2015

Start by calling for an end to the imperialistic fervor on western nations. Stop with the regime changes, humanitarian wars that lead to bigger humanitarian crisis, trade deals that favor corporations while hurting powerless people. He should ask for that first but he wouldn't.

I have yet to see him call on countries that support the terrorists attacking Syria to stop. I have yet to see him say anything meaningful about the conflicts in Libya or Iraq or Afghanistan. But he comes out with this trying to get western nations who are also in debt up to their eyes balls to pay third world countries money.

I think he is really trying very hard to destroy the church. He said you don't need the church to get into heaven and I really stopped going, I swear, the more the man talks, the more people will leave the church

 

jamzrockz

(1,333 posts)
11. One more thing
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 10:39 AM
Jun 2015

Last edited Thu Jun 18, 2015, 12:59 PM - Edit history (1)

I am originally from Nigeria and I visit every 2-3 yrs and by far the biggest problem we have is electricity. I am sure infrastructure of some kind will be the needs of most poor places. The best thing western nations can do is help poor countries build up their infrastructure to produce affordable services. I am talking about technical assistance, help with affordable loans, finances etc. It takes about $250 in diesel, regular electricity fees and maintenance of generator to keep the lights on in our place in Nigeria and that amount is unaffordable to most people back home

Do that and you will be doing a huge service to millions of people. But giving money to officials will not help. Most of those corrupt leaders will just take it and run. Poor countries needs help but this proposal will not happen and I doubt it will help any even if it is implemented.

GreatGazoo

(3,937 posts)
14. Yes -- more solar sources for African countries!
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 12:32 PM
Jun 2015

Solar panels large and small can increase independence, improve quality of life and avoid fires (from kerosene) that kill. One firm, SolarAid, donates $10 from every purchase to make more solar sources available throughout Africa.

http://www.solar-aid-eco-shop.co.uk/collections/all

http://www.sunedison.com/social-innovations

 

RiverNoord

(1,150 posts)
9. This Pope almost makes me want to become a Catholic -
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 10:31 AM
Jun 2015

even though I'm an atheist. Pretty tough divide to overcome there . Still, amazing that a man like him could become Pope in modern times after so many centuries of political scheming and extreme corruption at the highest levels of the Vatican. Hope he lives a long and fruitful life.

And, of course, it's kind of fun listening to American faux-Catholic nut jobs like Santorum making incredible asses of themselves lashing out at the most genuinely Christian pope in... well... maybe ever?

leftyladyfrommo

(18,874 posts)
12. I love this pope. I just wish he was better on women's issues.
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 10:42 AM
Jun 2015

The original Jewish Christians, John the Baptist, Peter, James and the rest were all Ebionites (the poor) and they were very strict vegetarians and believed in life long celibacy. Paul believed in celibacy but not the vegetarian stuff. They were all heavily influenced by the Essenes and the other desert groups that were so popular at the time. No sex but lots of cold baths. They were called the Daily Bathers. One historian wrote that all of Joseph's sons were chaste. And another one wrote that these guys took vegetarianism so seriously that they would be tortured and killed before they would eat meat.

This pope is really a whole lot closer to the original Christian concepts than anyone we have had for a very long time.

 

Arugula Latte

(50,566 posts)
18. The RCC is a misogynistic, homophobic institution.
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 04:06 PM
Jun 2015

Why would you want to support an organization like that?

raouldukelives

(5,178 posts)
13. K&R
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 11:33 AM
Jun 2015

“The foreign debt of poor countries has become a way of controlling them, yet this is not the case where ecological debt is concerned,” Francis wrote. “In different ways, developing countries, where the most important reserves of the biosphere are found, continue to fuel the development of richer countries at the cost of their own present and future.
“The developed countries ought to help pay this debt by significantly limiting their consumption of non-renewable energy and by assisting poorer countries to support policies and programmes of sustainable development.”

Anyone connected to Wall St, who doesn't recognize this as part and parcel of their legacy, is fooling themselves. People talk about making a better world, so few work towards it. Heck, most fund those attacking it.

I don't want it to be this way. I freaking hate it!

I want an economic system that makes peoples lives better. That is what Adam Smith wanted. Not world dominating monopolies and industries that plunder and pillage the poorest for obscene wealth at the expense of our ability to continue to live and evolve on this pale, blue dot.

We are on fire. Polar bears are eating dolphins. We don't need no water they say, I say, Bern motherfucker.
Bern.

 

happyslug

(14,779 posts)
15. Here is the Actual Paper:
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 01:23 PM
Jun 2015

Last edited Thu Jun 18, 2015, 04:33 PM - Edit history (2)

http://w2.vatican.va/content/francesco/en/encyclicals/documents/papa-francesco_20150524_enciclica-laudato-si.html

I like paragraph 189 and 195:

189. Politics must not be subject to the economy, nor should the economy be subject to the dictates of an efficiency-driven paradigm of technocracy. Today, in view of the common good, there is urgent need for politics and economics to enter into a frank dialogue in the service of life, especially human life. Saving banks at any cost, making the public pay the price, foregoing a firm commitment to reviewing and reforming the entire system, only reaffirms the absolute power of a financial system, a power which has no future and will only give rise to new crises after a slow, costly and only apparent recovery. The financial crisis of 2007-08 provided an opportunity to develop a new economy, more attentive to ethical principles, and new ways of regulating speculative financial practices and virtual wealth. But the response to the crisis did not include rethinking the outdated criteria which continue to rule the world. Production is not always rational, and is usually tied to economic variables which assign to products a value that does not necessarily correspond to their real worth. This frequently leads to an overproduction of some commodities, with unnecessary impact on the environment and with negative results on regional economies.[133] The financial bubble also tends to be a productive bubble. The problem of the real economy is not confronted with vigour, yet it is the real economy which makes diversification and improvement in production possible, helps companies to function well, and enables small and medium businesses to develop and create employment.


195. The principle of the maximization of profits, frequently isolated from other considerations, reflects a misunderstanding of the very concept of the economy. As long as production is increased, little concern is given to whether it is at the cost of future resources or the health of the environment; as long as the clearing of a forest increases production, no one calculates the losses entailed in the desertification of the land, the harm done to biodiversity or the increased pollution. In a word, businesses profit by calculating and paying only a fraction of the costs involved. Yet only when “the economic and social costs of using up shared environmental resources are recognized with transparency and fully borne by those who incur them, not by other peoples or future generations”,[138] can those actions be considered ethical. An instrumental way of reasoning, which provides a purely static analysis of realities in the service of present needs, is at work whether resources are allocated by the market or by state central planning.


Some other good Paragraphs:

171. The strategy of buying and selling “carbon credits” can lead to a new form of speculation which would not help reduce the emission of polluting gases worldwide. This system seems to provide a quick and easy solution under the guise of a certain commitment to the environment, but in no way does it allow for the radical change which present circumstances require. Rather, it may simply become a ploy which permits maintaining the excessive consumption of some countries and sectors.

153. The quality of life in cities has much to do with systems of transport, which are often a source of much suffering for those who use them. Many cars, used by one or more people, circulate in cities, causing traffic congestion, raising the level of pollution, and consuming enormous quantities of non-renewable energy. This makes it necessary to build more roads and parking areas which spoil the urban landscape. Many specialists agree on the need to give priority to public transportation. Yet some measures needed will not prove easily acceptable to society unless substantial improvements are made in the systems themselves, which in many cities force people to put up with undignified conditions due to crowding, inconvenience, infrequent service and lack of safety.

154. Respect for our dignity as human beings often jars with the chaotic realities that people have to endure in city life. Yet this should not make us overlook the abandonment and neglect also experienced by some rural populations which lack access to essential services and where some workers are reduced to conditions of servitude, without rights or even the hope of a more dignified life.

The Pope also address GMO crops, but refuses to say they are good or bad in and by themselves (That is still debated even among scieintists) but the affect such GMO crops have had on farmers in poor countries:

133. It is difficult to make a general judgement about genetic modification (GM), whether vegetable or animal, medical or agricultural, since these vary greatly among themselves and call for specific considerations. The risks involved are not always due to the techniques used, but rather to their improper or excessive application. Genetic mutations, in fact, have often been, and continue to be, caused by nature itself. Nor are mutations caused by human intervention a modern phenomenon. The domestication of animals, the crossbreeding of species and other older and universally accepted practices can be mentioned as examples. We need but recall that scientific developments in GM cereals began with the observation of natural bacteria which spontaneously modified plant genomes. In nature, however, this process is slow and cannot be compared to the fast pace induced by contemporary technological advances, even when the latter build upon several centuries of scientific progress.

134. Although no conclusive proof exists that GM cereals may be harmful to human beings, and in some regions their use has brought about economic growth which has helped to resolve problems, there remain a number of significant difficulties which should not be underestimated. In many places, following the introduction of these crops, productive land is concentrated in the hands of a few owners due to “the progressive disappearance of small producers, who, as a consequence of the loss of the exploited lands, are obliged to withdraw from direct production”.[113] The most vulnerable of these become temporary labourers, and many rural workers end up moving to poverty-stricken urban areas. The expansion of these crops has the effect of destroying the complex network of ecosystems, diminishing the diversity of production and affecting regional economies, now and in the future. In various countries, we see an expansion of oligopolies for the production of cereals and other products needed for their cultivation. This dependency would be aggravated were the production of infertile seeds to be considered; the effect would be to force farmers to purchase them from larger producers.


In paragraph 124 The pope uses the Catholic view of what is called "Man Domination" of the planet as stated in Genesis:

124. Any approach to an integral ecology, which by definition does not exclude human beings, needs to take account of the value of labour, as Saint John Paul II wisely noted in his Encyclical Laborem Exercens. According to the biblical account of creation, God placed man and woman in the garden he had created (cf. Gen 2:15) not only to preserve it (“keep”) but also to make it fruitful (“till”). Labourers and craftsmen thus “maintain the fabric of the world” (Sir 38:34). Developing the created world in a prudent way is the best way of caring for it, as this means that we ourselves become the instrument used by God to bring out the potential which he himself inscribed in things: “The Lord created medicines out of the earth, and a sensible man will not despise them” (Sir 38:4).


He did it again in Paragraph 67:

67. We are not God. The earth was here before us and it has been given to us. This allows us to respond to the charge that Judaeo-Christian thinking, on the basis of the Genesis account which grants man “dominion” over the earth (cf. Gen 1:28), has encouraged the unbridled exploitation of nature by painting him as domineering and destructive by nature. This is not a correct interpretation of the Bible as understood by the Church. Although it is true that we Christians have at times incorrectly interpreted the Scriptures, nowadays we must forcefully reject the notion that our being created in God’s image and given dominion over the earth justifies absolute domination over other creatures. The biblical texts are to be read in their context, with an appropriate hermeneutic, recognizing that they tell us to “till and keep” the garden of the world (cf. Gen 2:15). “Tilling” refers to cultivating, ploughing or working, while “keeping” means caring, protecting, overseeing and preserving. This implies a relationship of mutual responsibility between human beings and nature. Each community can take from the bounty of the earth whatever it needs for subsistence, but it also has the duty to protect the earth and to ensure its fruitfulness for coming generations. “The earth is the Lord’s” (Ps 24:1); to him belongs “the earth with all that is within it” (Dt 10:14). Thus God rejects every claim to absolute ownership: “The land shall not be sold in perpetuity, for the land is mine; for you are strangers and sojourners with me” (Lev 25:23).




This being a VERY IMPORTANT Catholic Document, abortion is mentioned in passing:

120. Since everything is interrelated, concern for the protection of nature is also incompatible with the justification of abortion. How can we genuinely teach the importance of concern for other vulnerable beings, however troublesome or inconvenient they may be, if we fail to protect a human embryo, even when its presence is uncomfortable and creates difficulties? “If personal and social sensitivity towards the acceptance of the new life is lost, then other forms of acceptance that are valuable for society also wither away”.[97]


93. Whether believers or not, we are agreed today that the earth is essentially a shared inheritance, whose fruits are meant to benefit everyone. For believers, this becomes a question of fidelity to the Creator, since God created the world for everyone. Hence every ecological approach needs to incorporate a social perspective which takes into account the fundamental rights of the poor and the underprivileged. The principle of the subordination of private property to the universal destination of goods, and thus the right of everyone to their use, is a golden rule of social conduct and “the first principle of the whole ethical and social order”.[71] The Christian tradition has never recognized the right to private property as absolute or inviolable, and has stressed the social purpose of all forms of private property. Saint John Paul II forcefully reaffirmed this teaching, stating that “God gave the earth to the whole human race for the sustenance of all its members, without excluding or favouring anyone”.[72]These are strong words. He noted that “a type of development which did not respect and promote human rights – personal and social, economic and political, including the rights of nations and of peoples – would not be really worthy of man”.[73] He clearly explained that “the Church does indeed defend the legitimate right to private property, but she also teaches no less clearly that there is always a social mortgage on all private property, in order that goods may serve the general purpose that God gave them”.[74] Consequently, he maintained, “it is not in accord with God’s plan that this gift be used in such a way that its benefits favour only a few”.[75] This calls into serious question the unjust habits of a part of humanity.[76]

52. The foreign debt of poor countries has become a way of controlling them, yet this is not the case where ecological debt is concerned. In different ways, developing countries, where the most important reserves of the biosphere are found, continue to fuel the development of richer countries at the cost of their own present and future. The land of the southern poor is rich and mostly unpolluted, yet access to ownership of goods and resources for meeting vital needs is inhibited by a system of commercial relations and ownership which is structurally perverse. The developed countries ought to help pay this debt by significantly limiting their consumption of non-renewable energy and by assisting poorer countries to support policies and programmes of sustainable development. The poorest areas and countries are less capable of adopting new models for reducing environmental impact because they lack the wherewithal to develop the necessary processes and to cover their costs. We must continue to be aware that, regarding climate change, there are differentiated responsibilities. As the United States bishops have said, greater attention must be given to “the needs of the poor, the weak and the vulnerable, in a debate often dominated by more powerful interests”.[31] We need to strengthen the conviction that we are one single human family. There are no frontiers or barriers, political or social, behind which we can hide, still less is there room for the globalization of indifference.
 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
21. And that just shows the entire pretense of 'the faith' is bogus. They don't even follow the basic
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 05:16 PM
Jun 2015

rules for themselves but they still want to affect that the faith and the Pope are holy authorities when they speak about other things, such as how gay rights are from Satan. The fact that Catholics don't practice their Catholicism does not make it better, it makes it worse. 'We don't believe it, but you have to hear it call you names'. So deeply selfish. Ritualized hypocrisy.

 

Arugula Latte

(50,566 posts)
22. This is about poor countries in debt to rich,
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 05:26 PM
Jun 2015

where people are much less likely to have access to birth control, thanks in part to the Catholic Church's centuries of repression and control in many of these countries.

pnwmom

(109,025 posts)
25. I disagree with the Church's position on birth control, which went against the original
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 05:48 PM
Jun 2015

recommendation from the theologians who studied it, and I hope it changes.

However, that doesn't keep me from welcoming the new encyclical on the environment. Just as I agree with many of Bernie Sanders positions on the issues, but not all -- especially on gun control.

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