Documents show ‘American Sniper’ Chris Kyle embellished record
Source: http://q13fox.com/
HOUSTON (AP) Documents show that slain Navy Seal and American Sniper author Chris Kyle misrepresented the number of medals he received.
Navy documents obtained by an online magazine through an open records request show that Kyle earned one Silver Star and three Bronze Stars with valor. In his best-selling book, Kyle wrote that he had received two Silver Stars and five Bronze Stars.
A Navy spokeswoman confirmed the validity of the documents and says the armed services branch is investigating the discrepancy.
Read more: http://q13fox.com/2016/05/25/documents-show-american-sniper-chris-kyle-embellished-record/
"Kyle was warned at least once before American Sniper was published that its description of his medal count was wrong, according to one current Navy officer, who asked not to be identified because he was not authorized to speak about the case. As Kyles American Sniper manuscript was distributed among SEALs, one of his former commanders, who was still on active duty, advised Kyle that his claim of having two Silver Stars was false, and he should correct it before his book was published.
Current and former Navy SEALs interviewed for this article, who agreed to speak on background because they feared being shunned by their close-knit community, did not dispute Kyles heroism in combat, but saw the inflation of his medal count as significant because they consider battlefield embellishments to be dishonorable."
https://theintercept.com/2016/05/25/american-sniper-chris-kyle-distorted-his-military-record-documents-show/
Archae
(46,379 posts)I've also read that he was a vicious racist.
greiner3
(5,214 posts)Paper Roses
(7,475 posts)The news of the embellishment is not new. I read the book about a year ago and found out shortly after that not only were some of the events fabricated but there was a lot of money missing from some donations to the charities Kyle was supposed to have supported. I believe it was over $1,000,000.00. It sure destroyed an allusion and I'm sure it made a lot of good people upset.
I don't have a reference to the articles I read but when I discussed this with some friends, they were aware of the situation.
Sad for all involved.
Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)I find it very hard to view snipers as "heroes".
7962
(11,841 posts)War isnt fencing.
Ask the Brits who were pinned down by heavy machine gun fire for hours until one of their snipers was able to take out the shooters with a record breaking long shot.
Plenty of stories like that.
None of which excuses inflating your record
Now Kyle being gone, he wont see punishment for puffing up his medal count. But it sure will hurt his legacy as well as his families income from it
braddy
(3,585 posts)covering your back as all of your attention and tunnel vision is focused on the doors and windows and what might be inside of the dwelling you have to enter?
In soldiering you use layers upon layers, and shooters covering you is one of those layers, also, sending in a sniper team to take out an enemy individual by stealth and using distance, is a lot less costly than a mass frontal attack in the hopes of taking out that individual, who might escape in the confusion of a large battle costing dozens or hundreds of lives.
How about distance shooting? Do you want to leave your sniper behind while you engage long distance machine guns with your little short distance M-16 that doesn't even come close to reaching them?
How about enemy snipers shooting you from a mile away, do you not want your own counter sniper?
arcane1
(38,613 posts)"Enemy snipers shooting you from a mile away" are people defending their homes from an invading army.
braddy
(3,585 posts)Just not right now?
Is your complaint about the American fighting man, or snipers?
arcane1
(38,613 posts)You may think so. That's your problem, not mine. They started their wars, just like we started ours.
No Iraqi ever attacked the US.
braddy
(3,585 posts)arcane1
(38,613 posts)braddy
(3,585 posts)I have no idea why you posted to me then, why didn't you just post to the OP?
MillennialDem
(2,367 posts)innocent country - I'm not sure.
Just for argument's sake a side note if you'd be indulge ME...
Would it have been ok to make movies about and honor men like Otto Carius and Erich Hartmann?
braddy
(3,585 posts)MillennialDem
(2,367 posts)Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)I will amend my comment to say "hostage situation" and "counter-sniper".
braddy
(3,585 posts)demanding about it in contrast to that of a military sniper who has to get to and be where the enemy is, and sometimes behind enemy lines, and the sheer difficulty of perhaps days of hard and clandestine living and movement trying to get into position, and then having a doubtful chance of return.
Which combat situations would you like to forbid our side's snipers from?
Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)Some soldiers behave heroically, but by and large, it is just people who didn't ask to be there, who were manipulated into the job, killing people on someone else's behalf.
Are there instances where war is justified? Certainly, but they are VERY rare. The vast majority is about simple butchery, and people are told lies to make it all seem noble. Training someone to the point where they are able to murder a complete stranger in cold blood, and then be proud of it, doesn't strike me as "heroic". Yes, again, there are some circumstances where it is morally justifiable, but again, very, very rare.
braddy
(3,585 posts)humans are willing to do, go up against other trained soldiers in a fight to the death, to serve our nation, even some of the training involves risk.
To me heroism has to involve concrete risk to the hero, while a police sniper taking out a bad guy during his shift is very helpful to saving lives, it isn't what I think of as heroic.
Which combat situations do you want to forbid our soldiers from having snipers in?
Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)designed to keep the military filled with young, easily manipulated, young men and women, who are told they are "protecting America", who are then sent to wage war on people for lies and profit. Mostly for profit. The last morally defensible war we fought was in 1941, and even then only if you ignore all the money we made looking the other way while Hitler came to power.
All wars since then have been wars we didn't have to fight, against people who really can't defend themselves where we spend a lot of time simply slaughtering people.
There is nothing noble or heroic about what we have been done or are doing.
braddy
(3,585 posts)TipTok
(2,474 posts)... In alternating volleys with roughly equal weapons.
Just to be fair...
Some people... I swear...
Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)EL34x4
(2,003 posts)The awards he received would be reflected in Block 44 of his evaluation, signed by his Commanding Officer. If the awards in his evals matches the awards in his NDAWS and BUPERS files, it would be a surprise. Typically, it is a never-ending battle for sailors to ensure their many records are accurate and match each other.
If he claimed awards that weren't reflected in his evals, he has (or would've had) some explaining to do. Every sailor knows if it's not in your eval, it didn't happen.
itsrobert
(14,157 posts)EL34x4
(2,003 posts)Has nothing in Block 44. This is very unusual. In fact, I have never seen an eval where this section is blank (I'm currently active duty with 12+ years) Even if his command could find absolutely nothing to put in this block (and that's a very big "if" they would've entered "none" or something along those lines if only to keep someone else from entering all kinds of cool shit that never happened after the eval had been signed by the CO.
Something is very fishy about this eval. This being said, he signed it. Or he signed something.
At any rate, I'm not going to lose much sleep over this. Kyle's valor is well documented. Whether he received 3 Bronze Stars or 5 means little to me.
Everyone keeps a few silver stars tucked away behind the silverware drawer, right?
What do you mean he only has one?!
This is a Greenwald hit piece for pub. The pogue LTC who wrote the article did not read the DD-214 right.
This a hit piece by Glen Greenwald for pub. Kyle's DD-214 clearly states 2 Silver Stars and 5 Bronze Stars with V.
The pogue LTC who wrote the article did not read it right.
alarimer
(16,245 posts)It was known before this article. He lied about Jesse Ventura. He also lied about another encounter in which he played the hero.
He's fucking scum. Any right-wing hero is automatically scum, but this one is proven to be a liar.
I don't believe in hero worship of the military. They are people just like us, not automatically heroes and a number turn out to be liars and criminals.
4Q2u2
(1,406 posts)I was pointing out the fact that just because we do not like someone that all of a sudden Glen Greenwald is a credible source, even when the Navy's record of his service clearly points out that he did earn those Awards.
Riddle me this?
Is Glen Greenwald a KNOWN liar?
Which liar do we hold to a different standard?
EL34x4
(2,003 posts)Not even sure why it merits investigation.
underpants
(183,071 posts)We saw with John Kerry's records from Vietnam that the Navy keeps very accurate records.
We also saw from W's AWOL information that those records were very well kept and easily retrieveable.
Iggo
(47,603 posts)...he either lied about murdering two dozen people in the aftermath of Katrina, or he told the truth about murdering two dozen people in the aftermath of Katrina.
He was either lying scum or he was murdering scum.
But he was fucking scum.
Stuckinthebush
(10,847 posts)Any way you slice it....scum
Laurian
(2,593 posts)often embellishing their stories. I'll take a humble hero over this type of guy anyday.
7962
(11,841 posts)It amazes me
mentalsolstice
(4,463 posts)My husband served in Vietnam, he rarely talks about it. I also dated USMC helicopter pilot for 3 years, also a Vietnam vet, again not a word. When he would don his dress blues for the birthday ball, that's when I knew he must have seen some action. There was a lot of metal on his chest, and the deference shown to him by others.
My dad was well respected state policeman in KY before I was born. I only know about heroic things he did from others, as he never spoke of it.
OTOH, my husband's nephew did two tours in Afghanistan, and won't shut up about it, even 5 years later. However, if you really question him about it, he spent the time sitting in front of a computer, even though he was infantry.
Skittles
(153,321 posts)BlueStater
(7,596 posts)I really don't care if it's good on a technical level. I have no desire to ever see Eastwood's propaganda bullshit.
TexasBushwhacker
(20,257 posts)The reason I ask is that on a recent road trip from Houston to Ft. Worth I noticed part of the highway about 30 miles south of Ft. Worth was "Chris Kyle Memorial Highway". I just thought it was odd to choose him. He didn't die in action or saving someone else's life. Despite his embellishments, I figure that he was good at his job as a sniper, but better than all other soldiers?
Kingofalldems
(38,520 posts)I remember when the movie came out a few were all aflutter about it.
ReRe
(10,597 posts)Did not see the movie or go near the book. There is no glory in killing people. I feel sorry for his wife and however many kids he had. Hope they have been able to get on with their lives.
TexasBushwhacker
(20,257 posts)His royalties for the book were estimated to be around $3 Million and film rights would be added onto that. But he was sued for defamation by Jesse Ventura. Chris said in the book that he punched Ventura in a bar after Ventura said some disparaging comments about the SEALs. Jesse said the whole thing never happened and was awarded $1.8 Million. He's gotten a lot of flack for taking away money from a widow and she's appealing.
ReRe
(10,597 posts)... That is so sad. What's wrong with Jesse V? She should not be held responsible for what her husband chose for his life. If Jesse was awarded that $1.8 Million, he should just give it back to her. He doesn't need the GD money.
TexasBushwhacker
(20,257 posts)Person 2713
(3,263 posts)Widow is a grifter just like her husband
Check out all the money they raised for vets but never gave to vets
She is still a grifter and will do fine
ReRe
(10,597 posts)... I will stop feeling sorry for her. But still, I can't feel that way about those kids. Kids don't ask for this shite. When you was a kid growing up, did you ever think that you might have been born into the wrong family? I did and still do. but kids are resilient. I hope they grow up and go to college for a long long time.
malokvale77
(4,879 posts)She is banking on his name though.
TipTok
(2,474 posts)Response to TexasBushwhacker (Reply #10)
Skittles This message was self-deleted by its author.
Igel
(35,393 posts)It's not what you do, it's how you can be used as a symbol to annoy others.
Some are honored for merely existing in a given place and time and being oppressed. Sort of memorializing the reason for hatred and a sense of grievance. As opposed to memorializing somebody who did something considered meritorious.
TexasBushwhacker
(20,257 posts)where he settled with his family when he left the service. He's probably their only claim to fame.
LiberalFighter
(51,403 posts)Response to Garion_55 (Original post)
tenderfoot This message was self-deleted by its author.
riversedge
(70,483 posts)Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)I was calling BS on some of his book excepts years ago...
And I always thought his kill count was abnormally high, even for a great sniper...
KG
(28,753 posts)Stainless
(718 posts)As a Veteran, I'll withhold judgment on a military hero who was murdered and is no longer here to defend himself.
I don't like this kind of bullshit from anonymous gutless bastards. IMHO, DU allows way too much of this activity to occur. It's why I don't have a yellow star.
BlueStater
(7,596 posts)You're misusing that term. A "chickenhawk" is a person who supports war but refuses to serve in it themselves. No one here supported the Iraq war.
Being a "military hero" doesn't make a liar not a liar. He lied about punching Jesse Ventura in a bar and he lied about shooting people in New Orleans during Katrina (and on the unlikely chance he didn't lie about that, that just makes him a psychotic murderer). So you can why, based on his past behavior, people here think him lying about his medals is not out of the realm of possibility of something he would do.
Spider Jerusalem
(21,786 posts)He claimed to've found WMD in Iraq. He claimed to've shot looters in New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina. He claimed to've killed a pair of carjackers. He claimed to've punched out Jesse Ventura. He lied in all of those instances, provably and verifiably. And did it publicly (and in most instances in his book). He may or may not have served honorably in Iraq and been a very effective sniper, but his character is demonstrably poor, he was a serial liar, braggart, and blowhard (Alvin York he wasn't).
ReRe
(10,597 posts)... legend in his own mind. He lived by the rifle and died by the rifle. And he would have wanted his demise no other way.
Feeling the Bern
(3,839 posts)the rainbow.
libodem
(19,288 posts)Just in a sanctioned condition.
canuckledragger
(1,671 posts)I don't like anonymous gutless bastards that try to shame others for pointing out the truth about lying racist blowhards that try to grandstand at shooting ranges while showing off to folks suffering from PTSD.
Kyle is dead because he's a moron.
Iggo
(47,603 posts)...a chicken hawk is someone who supports war but gets deferment after deferment after deferment....like Dick Cheney or Mitt Romney.
Chris Kyle claimed to have murdered dozens of Americans on American soil in the aftermath of Katrina. That makes him a liar or a murderer. One or the other. No in-between. There's your hero.
LisaM
(27,864 posts)But, RIP anyway.
Press Virginia
(2,329 posts)back around 1996?
kacekwl
(7,028 posts)This guy is HERO number one with soooo many military and gun lovers that nothing will tarnish him . Kinda like Trump.
Paladin
(28,290 posts)libodem
(19,288 posts)How we now take pride in snipers and mercinaries I'll never fathom.
Spit. Pffft.
rockfordfile
(8,712 posts)4Q2u2
(1,406 posts)This is a Glen Greenwald hit piece for pub. The writer is a pogue and a wanna be.
The facts of his DD-214 show 2 Silver Stars and 5 Bronze Stars with V. Just because we do not like someone does not abdicate doing proper research and due diligence. When did Greenwald become unimpeachable?
alarimer
(16,245 posts)When the right-wing anoints someone a hero, I immediately try to figure out the con.