Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

BumRushDaShow

(129,995 posts)
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 12:47 PM Feb 2019

Virginia Attorney General Herring says he wore blackface in college

Source: Washington Post

RICHMOND — Virginia Attorney General Mark Herring (D) said Wednesday he dressed in blackface during college, elevating the Capitol’s scandals to a new level that engulfed the entire executive branch of government.

“In 1980, when I was a 19-year-old undergraduate in college, some friends suggested we attend a party dressed like rappers we listened to at the time, like Kurtis Blow, and perform a song,” Herring said in a statement. “It sounds ridiculous even now writing it. But because of our ignorance and glib attitudes – and because we did not have an appreciation for the experiences and perspectives of others – we dressed up and put on wigs and brown makeup.”

Herring acknowledgment comes as Gov. Ralph Northam (D) faces calls for his resignation after a photo emerged on his 1984 medical school yearbook page featuring someone in blackface standing next to someone in Ku Klux Klan robes.And early Monday, Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax (D) denied the allegations of a woman who said he sexually assaulted her at the Democratic National Convention in 2004.

The scandals suggest a possible constitutional crisis. If Northam should step down, Fairfax would succeed him because of his position as lieutenant governor. Herring, as attorney general, would be next in line.

Read more: https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/va-atty-gen-herring-appears-in-blackface-in-photo-from-college-days/2019/02/06/9aa4aff8-2a26-11e9-984d-9b8fba003e81_story.html



90 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Virginia Attorney General Herring says he wore blackface in college (Original Post) BumRushDaShow Feb 2019 OP
How far down the chain will they have to go? treestar Feb 2019 #1
Someone on Morning Joe suggested that the Ilsa Feb 2019 #3
LOL. I'm going to end up governor and I have never even lived there! treestar Feb 2019 #47
After AG next in line is a Republican Loki Liesmith Feb 2019 #27
That's the goal. When you can't win at the ballot box, you do whatever it takes. LastLiberal in PalmSprings Feb 2019 #44
Figures. Whose will take the office treestar Feb 2019 #48
Until we find the Sacred Hermit with no history who has done nothing ever delisen Feb 2019 #54
Turning VA red.... Historic NY Feb 2019 #2
Expect to see more of these "scandals" coming out about every Democratic candidate Dopers_Greed Feb 2019 #4
It's not like some conservative outlet leaked this. bearsfootball516 Feb 2019 #8
Why can't some of our smart Democratic interns find a Republican doing the same? LiberalLovinLug Feb 2019 #67
I guess credit for getting out in front of it... doompatrol39 Feb 2019 #5
I had quite a few white college friends in Georgia in the early 80s who listened to rap groundloop Feb 2019 #10
Early 80's sure... doompatrol39 Feb 2019 #24
"Rapper's Delight" was getting tons of airplay in Charlottesville in late 1979. mahatmakanejeeves Feb 2019 #17
Yup it was BumRushDaShow Feb 2019 #36
Exactly. doompatrol39 Feb 2019 #40
As one of only 400 or so BumRushDaShow Feb 2019 #46
By "tons of airplay," what I mean is that mahatmakanejeeves Feb 2019 #52
"There are three versions of the original version" BumRushDaShow Feb 2019 #60
Kurtis Blow did "The Breaks" and "Basketball"... SKKY Feb 2019 #65
This was big in DC in the spring of 1980: mahatmakanejeeves Feb 2019 #66
Yup, you are wrong again obamanut2012 Feb 2019 #18
"Controversial" is the wrong word... doompatrol39 Feb 2019 #29
Do you have any evidence for your claims? I mean, if we're asking about evidence here... Stand and Fight Feb 2019 #33
Which claim? I stated an opinion and positioned it as such. doompatrol39 Feb 2019 #37
And yet, when people did the same as you, you asked for evidence... Strange that. Stand and Fight Feb 2019 #38
So.... doompatrol39 Feb 2019 #43
I'd hardly say the terms "lots" and "love" is a basis of fact. Stand and Fight Feb 2019 #45
Oh yeah... For good measure, I must too state... Stand and Fight Feb 2019 #39
As a note about what you wrote BumRushDaShow Feb 2019 #59
Good grief! fleur-de-lisa Feb 2019 #6
Damn atreides1 Feb 2019 #7
I think there may be a little bit of difference... regnaD kciN Feb 2019 #78
So, are there any white Virginia politicians who haven't done blackface? bearsfootball516 Feb 2019 #9
There are plenty who still laugh and brag about it. They're called "Republicans". nt JustABozoOnThisBus Feb 2019 #90
Any white people in Virginia who have not worn black face please raise your hand njhoneybadger Feb 2019 #11
Next someone will want them to all register. Uh Oh....... delisen Feb 2019 #57
Next! Now serving #4. jalan48 Feb 2019 #12
Blackface is awful. It's horrible and racist DrToast Feb 2019 #13
He was a 19-year-old kid in 1980 obamanut2012 Feb 2019 #15
Yeah, I said that in my post. DrToast Feb 2019 #21
i was agreeing obamanut2012 Feb 2019 #32
Yup, It matters who they are now not a compilation of their youthful indiscretions njhoneybadger Feb 2019 #35
Not that I'm condoning this (and I don't personally know anyone who ever did this, AFAIK) LisaM Feb 2019 #56
He was a 19-year-old kid in 1980 obamanut2012 Feb 2019 #14
Gotta purge folks Loki Liesmith Feb 2019 #30
Is the demand for purity a secret desire for the status quo? delisen Feb 2019 #49
No. Igel Feb 2019 #58
Good writing. delisen Feb 2019 #85
That's forgivable Polybius Feb 2019 #42
I didn't mention Northam. obamanut2012 Feb 2019 #61
Then we likely agree Polybius Feb 2019 #69
I hear ya.... Adrahil Feb 2019 #55
After the AG there be Republicans. Marcuse Feb 2019 #16
Well where will it all end? bluestarone Feb 2019 #19
OFFS. Is there anybody in Virginia who has had the decency not to do blackface Autumn Feb 2019 #20
Whew how! Right here underpants Feb 2019 #26
At some point we are videohead5 Feb 2019 #22
I'm done... The Commonwealth is turning into shit Blue_Tires Feb 2019 #23
As Virginia Republicans start getting nervous about their own possible lapses in judgement Freethinker65 Feb 2019 #25
Republican voters don't care hueymahl Feb 2019 #28
Why? They won't be asked to resign obamanut2012 Feb 2019 #34
Gotta love a good circular firing squad hueymahl Feb 2019 #31
As bad as this is, 19 in 1980 is a lot better than 25 in 1984 Polybius Feb 2019 #41
Everyone needs to have matched your personal history? delisen Feb 2019 #51
Not mine Polybius Feb 2019 #68
agreed obamanut2012 Feb 2019 #62
Bravo, well done... Blue_Tires Feb 2019 #50
Lordy.... LovingA2andMI Feb 2019 #53
I fess up!! James48 Feb 2019 #63
I dressed as Amy Carter for Halloween 1982 jayschool2013 Feb 2019 #64
What the hell is in the water there in Virginia? n/t SFnomad Feb 2019 #70
Tide. VA has tidewater. JustABozoOnThisBus Feb 2019 #71
You forgot this... ms liberty Feb 2019 #87
Hope Mr. Sharpton stays out of the mix whistler162 Feb 2019 #72
What does that have to do with the OP? BumRushDaShow Feb 2019 #73
He without sin cast the first stone! whistler162 Feb 2019 #88
I still don't see the relevance BumRushDaShow Feb 2019 #89
But was it done as a racist thing videohead5 Feb 2019 #74
Here's the thing BumRushDaShow Feb 2019 #77
There is that movie where the Wayans brothers put on white makeup cannabis_flower Feb 2019 #80
I remember when that came out BumRushDaShow Feb 2019 #81
I watched part of it a few years ago... cannabis_flower Feb 2019 #82
I was never a fan of over-the-top "physical humor" films BumRushDaShow Feb 2019 #83
My husband is a fan cannabis_flower Feb 2019 #86
Jimmy Kimmel........ Historic NY Feb 2019 #75
Billy Crystal BumRushDaShow Feb 2019 #84
What an idiot nycbos Feb 2019 #76
If a republican, i.e. filthy fucking racist who is a filthy fucking no good racist in 2019 Eliot Rosewater Feb 2019 #79
44. That's the goal. When you can't win at the ballot box, you do whatever it takes.
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:40 PM
Feb 2019

It's purely a power play to gain the governorship and two other offices. Whomever the Repugs put in place could have video of himself (it would never be a woman) burning a cross in a black family's yard and the GOP would say it was "youthful indiscretion." That term worked for Dubya, after all, to excuse everything he did before the age of 40.

delisen

(6,047 posts)
54. Until we find the Sacred Hermit with no history who has done nothing ever
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 02:22 PM
Feb 2019

but alas even this person will be subject to "fake news". We are doomed as is our party. Surrender is our only option.

We will just have to rely upon the generosity of spirit of our Curren "president" and his party. (Lots of luck with that.)

Dopers_Greed

(2,640 posts)
4. Expect to see more of these "scandals" coming out about every Democratic candidate
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 12:50 PM
Feb 2019

Until every political office in the entire country is red

bearsfootball516

(6,377 posts)
8. It's not like some conservative outlet leaked this.
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 12:55 PM
Feb 2019

He delivered a press release saying he did it.
I’m guessing he’s trying to get out in front of it before somebody found out.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,180 posts)
67. Why can't some of our smart Democratic interns find a Republican doing the same?
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 04:02 PM
Feb 2019

I'm sure its out there. At least take down one or two of their's in response. Or at least have a stale mate that way.

 

doompatrol39

(428 posts)
5. I guess credit for getting out in front of it...
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 12:52 PM
Feb 2019

...However, I'm not buying that a white 19 year old in Virginia in 1980 was THAT into Kurtis Blow. It's easy to forget how not-mainstream hip hop was at that point. Hell, it was controversial that at the time that MTV played Michael Jackson.

groundloop

(11,534 posts)
10. I had quite a few white college friends in Georgia in the early 80s who listened to rap
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 12:56 PM
Feb 2019

I wasn't into rap, but I knew quite a few people who were. I think your generalization is off base.

 

doompatrol39

(428 posts)
24. Early 80's sure...
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:13 PM
Feb 2019

...1980 was when Blow's first album came out. Not saying it's not possible, just that it doesn't seem likely.

mahatmakanejeeves

(57,740 posts)
17. "Rapper's Delight" was getting tons of airplay in Charlottesville in late 1979.
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 12:59 PM
Feb 2019
Rapper's Delight

"Rapper's Delight" is a 1979 hip hop track by the Sugarhill Gang and produced by Sylvia Robinson. While it was not the first single to include rapping, "Rapper's Delight" is credited for introducing hip hop music to a wide audience. It was a prototype for various types of rap music, incorporating themes such as boasting, dance, honesty and sex, with the charisma and enthusiasm of James Brown. The track interpolates Chic's "Good Times", resulting in band members Nile Rodgers and Bernard Edwards suing Sugar Hill Records for copyright infringement; a settlement was reached that gave the two songwriter credits.

"Rapper's Delight" is number 251 on the Rolling Stone magazine's list of The 500 Greatest Songs of All Time and number 2 on VH1's 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Songs. It is also included in NPR's list of the 100 most important American musical works of the 20th century. It was preserved into the National Recording Registry by the Library of Congress in 2011. Songs on the National Recording Registry are "culturally, historically, or aesthetically significant."

The song was recorded in a single take. There are three versions of the original version of the song: 14:35 (12" long version), 6:30 (12" short version), and 3:55 (7" shortened single version).

{Edited} Mitaswell add this. It's in the original 4:3 format. The audience looks about 50-50 white-black.



Sugarhill Records
Published on Aug 24, 2015

Download Rapper's Delight on iTunes - http://hyperurl.co/qb0e54
Stream Rapper's Delight on Spotify - http://hyperurl.co/1lhrq2
Buy Rapper's Delight on Amazon - http://hyperurl.co/xdfmxn

Follow The Sugarhill Gang
Website: http://hyperurl.co/cdks3h
Facebook: http://hyperurl.co/uk2aan
Twitter: http://hyperurl.co/gynbqc
Instagram: http://hyperurl.co/hdnybg

Sheesh, that's dreadful audio. Let's try again:

BumRushDaShow

(129,995 posts)
36. Yup it was
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:27 PM
Feb 2019

I was a freshman in college that year (although I don't remember anyone at my school - UMASS/Amherst of all places) doing any black face because of that song! Most of the kids there were way more into -

1.) The Boss™ (Springsteen)
2.) Aerosmith and the J.Geils Band (Because. Massachusetts.)
2.) Pink Floyd
3.) Led Zeppelin



 

doompatrol39

(428 posts)
40. Exactly.
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:31 PM
Feb 2019

That's my point. Was Rappers Delight getting some radio play? Sure. Were most white college kids where I was in the northeast close to NYC, let alone "a lot" of white college kids as is being claimed here that into rap? No.

But yeah, I'm sure a bunch of southern white kids were super into it and that was a really common thing.

BumRushDaShow

(129,995 posts)
46. As one of only 400 or so
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 02:04 PM
Feb 2019

blacks at UMASS at the time (half of those being grad students), most of what I saw were guys jumping up on tables doing air guitar to Springsteen! And then during the dead of night in the various dorm areas (UMASS was in the middle of farm land), the silence would suddenly be broken with competing 600W speakers blaring Van Halen's "Running With the Devil" vs Africa Bambata and the Soul Sonic Force's "Planet Rock", punctuated with people yelling "SHUT THAT FUCKING SHIT OFF" and other various and sundry expletives.






mahatmakanejeeves

(57,740 posts)
52. By "tons of airplay," what I mean is that
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 02:20 PM
Feb 2019

WTJU, UVa's FM station, played it. As for the mainstream rock station in C'ville at that time, "Three W V" (WWWV), not so much, or maybe not at all. That's the best I can recollect.

BumRushDaShow

(129,995 posts)
60. "There are three versions of the original version"
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 02:31 PM
Feb 2019

I still have my 12" "single" of it in a crate in my basement.

SKKY

(11,836 posts)
65. Kurtis Blow did "The Breaks" and "Basketball"...
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 03:30 PM
Feb 2019

...which I'm sure also get a lot of air play back then. They sure did in Louisville, KY.

obamanut2012

(26,183 posts)
18. Yup, you are wrong again
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:00 PM
Feb 2019

Lots of white college kids at that time loved Rap. An no, it was not controversial that MTV played Jackson.

 

doompatrol39

(428 posts)
29. "Controversial" is the wrong word...
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:17 PM
Feb 2019

...but it was considered groundbreaking at the time.

And I said "I find it hard to believe" not that it's not possible. Do you have any actual evidence to the contrary? Blow's first album came out in 1980 and was not certified gold until a few years later IIRC.

I went to college in the northeast in the mid 80's, before Run DMC hit big and I would hardly say "lots of white college kids" at that time, in that location liked rap. So the south? in 1980? Yeah, possible but it still sounds like a stretch to me. Not stating it as fact, just an opinion.

 

doompatrol39

(428 posts)
37. Which claim? I stated an opinion and positioned it as such.
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:28 PM
Feb 2019

Hence "I find it hard to believe".

I don't recall stating anything was fact other than the year Blow's first album was released, the timing of it going gold, and the fact that I was a white college kid in the early to mid 80's in the northeast and rap was barely a blip on most white college kids radar at the time. So that is why I personally "Find it hard to believe" (which is an opinion).

The other poster said, without caveat that rap was very popular with white college kids in the south in the 80's.

One was stated as opinion based on a combination of specific factual information and personal anecdotal evidence.

The other was stated as a fact without anything even anecdotal to back it up.

People will argue about anything on this place. Good lord.

 

doompatrol39

(428 posts)
43. So....
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:36 PM
Feb 2019

"Lots of white college kids at that time loved Rap." Stated as fact. Facts can be backed up by evidence.

"I'm not buying that a white 19 year old in Virginia in 1980 was THAT into Kurtis Blow" Stated as opinion, with the reasoning for that opinion also provided. However, I might add also with actual facts about when the record in question was released, some data as to the sales numbers, and the fact that I was the demographic in question at the time we are discussing.

So......was that person in college at that time? Down south? Do they have any kind of sales data? I was just asking what they were basing their factual statement on, since I provided the information on which I was basing my personal opinion.

Stand and Fight

(7,480 posts)
45. I'd hardly say the terms "lots" and "love" is a basis of fact.
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:43 PM
Feb 2019

In FACT, the very ambiguity and subjectivity of the term makes it clear that's an opinion to me. Nice straw man though.

BumRushDaShow

(129,995 posts)
59. As a note about what you wrote
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 02:28 PM
Feb 2019

Here in Philly, they didn't even play "Rap" on the "black" radio stations - at least during the day. I could only hear it at night with the (somewhat "famous" ) "Lady B" who would play both Philly and NYC rap music on a show that came on at like 11:00 pm on Fridays - and this was on AM radio!



The "mainstream" (R&B) music at the time was still Disco (which was transitioning out) with Donna Summer and Barry White and Gloria Gaynor, etc. It was even difficult to hear Funk, which was running contemporaneous with these other genres since the early '70s. That's why we had the "basement parties" and later the cassette tapes with songs that were "cut" and "scratched" and otherwise mixed into a single flowing thing (nowadays the kids call their stuff "mixtapes" as one word - even though the youngins' today don't even use "tape" ).

atreides1

(16,110 posts)
7. Damn
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 12:54 PM
Feb 2019

The Republicans must be smiling....

People are clamoring for Northam to resign because he wore blackface in medical school, Fairfax is being accused of sexual assault, and now Herring admits to wearing blackface while he was a 19 year old college student!!!

Here's a good headline:

VIRGINIA GOES BACK TO RED BECAUSE OF BLACKFACE AND SEX!!!!

regnaD kciN

(26,045 posts)
78. I think there may be a little bit of difference...
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 07:59 PM
Feb 2019

...between a 19-year-old doing it in 1980 and a guy in his mid-twenties doing it in 1984. There’s a whole different level of maturity (or lack thereof) in play.

Personally, should Northam and Fairfax both have to step down, I suspect Democrats will be inclined to “forgive” Herring rather than turn the state over to Republican control — and I wouldn’t disagree with that decision.

delisen

(6,047 posts)
57. Next someone will want them to all register. Uh Oh.......
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 02:25 PM
Feb 2019

are we heading toward totalitarianism. Are we becoming what we claim to hate?

DrToast

(6,414 posts)
13. Blackface is awful. It's horrible and racist
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 12:57 PM
Feb 2019

But at some point don’t you have to look at who the person is today? He was wrong, but he was also 19 years old. Who is he now?

LisaM

(27,850 posts)
56. Not that I'm condoning this (and I don't personally know anyone who ever did this, AFAIK)
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 02:25 PM
Feb 2019

but isn't there some line of demarcation between darkening your face for a costume versus the type of blackface used in minstrel shows?

I'm not saying I approve of it - but the yearbook picture was way worse to my way of thinking (whoever it was in that picture) than going as someone in costume, particularly a living person. I'm happy to be enlightened on this point.

This reminds me of a number of years ago when Prince Harry was photographed in Nazi garb at a party - apparently you were supposed to come as something terrible - and it took him quite a while to overcome the bad publicity associated with the image (I think he was 20 or under at that point). The brain of a 19-year old male probably functions differently than it does later, especially as far as decision making.

That said, Virginia in the 1980s sure sounds a lot different from Michigan, at least the parts I lived in. I don't recollect anyone doing this.

obamanut2012

(26,183 posts)
14. He was a 19-year-old kid in 1980
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 12:58 PM
Feb 2019

I voted for Jesse Fucking Evil Satan Helms when I was 19 years old. Because I was a 19 year old kid. I am embarrassed I did, but I was 19 and stupid. My vote helped this evil person get reelected.

This is starting to get ridiculous.

Igel

(35,390 posts)
58. No.
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 02:25 PM
Feb 2019

It's an implicit claim that the accuser must certainly be superior.

It's like Mabel in the church I was in in 1980. Nobody rose to her august standard, and her goodness was not properly admired or appreciated.

At the same time, it was also making sure that nobody could be considered better than her. So it felt like inferiority and bitterness or pettiness mixed in with a hefty dose of self-righteousness. Or perhaps she just thought that what she wanted should be imposed on everybody, so it was really a way of saying she properly deserved the power to run the lives of lesser creatures. Like many mental illnesses, the symptoms often overlap or shift over time.

Polybius

(15,525 posts)
42. That's forgivable
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:35 PM
Feb 2019

I voted for Poppy Bush at 19 because his opponent admitted to smoking pot as a teen (what was I thinking?). However, the Governor wore blackface at 25. Not the same

bluestarone

(17,122 posts)
19. Well where will it all end?
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:03 PM
Feb 2019

We have comedians and dancers that all had routines that they wore black faces! I guess that was the way it was. Right or wrong that is the way it was back then, CAN"T change it. I wish we had a magic wand to just change shit BUT we don't!!

videohead5

(2,189 posts)
22. At some point we are
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:06 PM
Feb 2019

Going to have to forgive these people if they done something stupid when they was 19. If Northam can prove that's not him in the photo he should not resign.

Freethinker65

(10,107 posts)
25. As Virginia Republicans start getting nervous about their own possible lapses in judgement
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:14 PM
Feb 2019

Or would Republican voters even care?

hueymahl

(2,511 posts)
31. Gotta love a good circular firing squad
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:19 PM
Feb 2019

When are we going to wake up an learn? If you think our elected officials screwed up to the point of needing to be removed from office over this issue, lets show a little long-term rational thought and primary them at the next election. It does us no strategic good to remove them now.

Polybius

(15,525 posts)
41. As bad as this is, 19 in 1980 is a lot better than 25 in 1984
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 01:32 PM
Feb 2019

I did stupid things at 19, but stopped long before 25.

Polybius

(15,525 posts)
68. Not mine
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 04:15 PM
Feb 2019

But I do look at individual things and I decide on a case by case basis on what is and isn't forgivable (as in will I still vote for the person or not). I base this on the act, how much time has passed, and how old was the person at the time of the offending act.

I forgive the Virginia AG, as a 19 year old in 1980. The Governor, however, is different to me me. You can disagree, that's fine. It's just how I base my vote on.

Blue_Tires

(55,445 posts)
50. Bravo, well done...
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 02:13 PM
Feb 2019

We're now officially a laughingstock... Even Florida, Georgia and North Carolina folks on Twitter are clowning us...

I'm done and I can't take a second more of this

James48

(4,444 posts)
63. I fess up!!
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 03:13 PM
Feb 2019

ok- I went to college in the MIDWEST from 1978-1983,

And in 1979, in December, I attended A PEARL HARBOR DAY DANCE PARTY, in which I DRESSED UP IN A WHITE JUMP SUITE WITH A HEADBAND WITH JAPANESE CHARACTERS, and dressed as a KAMAKAZI Pilot!

This also involved large quantities of alcohol. I got the Japanese exchange student who lived on the same floor in the dorm, who spoke very little english, to paint the Japanese letters saying "Good Luck" on the headband.

The writing looked like this: がんばろう
which is different than the standard "Divine Wind" letters now found on the internet version today.
like this one: http://www.kimonorobestore.com/japanese-headbands-kamikaze.html

I had no intention of offending anyone- However, the following week, several "letters to the Editor" appeared in our campus newspaper saying that hosting a "Pearl Harbor Day Party" was in extremely poor taste, and was disrespectful to the dead.

My bad.

And that was as close as I ever got to the offensiveness similar to the Blackface incidents now coming to light.

I apologize to anyone offended- I did not mean to be insensitive or stupid. It just happened that way. I'm sorry.

(I also screwed up in that there were no Kamikaze's at Pearl Harbor, that happened much later in the war, not in the beginning, I blew it in several ways, offended families of service people who grew up with Pearl Harbor family stories, Japanese exchange students who were not happy with me, etc. I really screwed up. I am sorry!!)

 

whistler162

(11,155 posts)
88. He without sin cast the first stone!
Thu Feb 7, 2019, 07:44 AM
Feb 2019

no one's history is perfect and if you are going to call someone on a mistake they made 35 years ago then you better not have a worse mistake in your history.

BumRushDaShow

(129,995 posts)
89. I still don't see the relevance
Thu Feb 7, 2019, 09:10 AM
Feb 2019

of associating an activist who was bringing light to a now-discredited "victim" with someone who chose to smear whatever brown stuff he used, on his white face to "mimic" a popular black singer.



Your analogy isn't really applicable here because there are deeper issues at play with this "blackface" thing.

There seems to be a history of non-entertainer-associated white people smearing shoe polish or mud or whatever "brown stuff" on their faces to appear "black" but there is little if any history of the reverse happening. I.e., in general, if a young black girl wants to dress up as Snow White for Halloween, her mother doesn't smear white pancake makeup all over her daughter's face to have her go out as a "white" Snow White. She puts her in the standard Disney "Snow White" gown and she goes about her trick-or-treating. The outfit itself is so unique and was so prolifically shown over the past 80 years, that it easily identifies the wearer as "Snow White".

Similarly, there have been young white boys who love/loved Michael Jackson and his performances and have dressed up as the '80s version of him with the "white sparkly glove" and black outfit with hat, without the need to "brown up" (although I expect some did anyway). The outfit itself was identifiable enough. Of course the irony here is that MJ apparently had vitiligo (a skin pigmentation disease - I knew girls in school who had that along with some kids who were borderline albino) and with makeup and treatment, eventually ended up with "white" skin.



One of the underlying issues too is "ownership of culture", something that African-Americans have battled since being dragged kicking and screaming here to the U.S. hundreds of years ago. And what has made it difficult is the fact that it (my culture) is made up of a forced amalgam (due to slave-owner "breeding" ) of various African ethnic groups and their sub-cultures that had to survive and adapt within a European-based country. And then you have the irony where you find that the "oppressor" so desires to be like us that they cover themselves in "black"... I suppose as self-flagellation or something. It's literally love/hate.

As a final note - last year's "Black Panther" movie set the stage for a whole new set of quandaries for young white boys who love that character. The full Black Panther costume covers everything including the face but without the costume, how they handle the T'Challa character is a whole other issue that I expect many parents are trying to grapple with.



BumRushDaShow

(129,995 posts)
77. Here's the thing
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 07:57 PM
Feb 2019

and I am saying that as an AA... I really don't recall black folk "emulating" white anything - whether they are portraying "super heroes" or "princesses" or "historical figures", or whoever, by putting on white makeup. They just put on the costumes and go with it. The only time I would normally see that white face paint come out (not associated with an actor in a movie or tv skit like Eddie Murphy or Godfrey Cambridge) would be if the person was playing a clown or maybe even a mime, where the makeup was associated with that entity.









(Godfrey Cambridge)

So then the question should be - why do white folk do this?

We have a big issue that has been going on for 100 years here in Philly with our Mummers and those who keep trying to sneak in "black face" - to the point that this year, they did so by having a Mummer (doing what came across as the appearance of "black face" but actually being a real black Mummer) as part of one of what they call the "Comic" clubs, where he was playing the rapper JZ and had a club mate white Mummer playing the current city Mayor Kenney as a "lap dog" down on all fours with a leash being held by the "JZ" character.





The Comic Clubs & Brigades tend to be raunchy and they still have their "wenches" that they attempt to trot out, but there is a deeper level of issue.

And you have to ask why? What is this obsession to "be" what "you" (editorial "white" ) continue to oppress?

BumRushDaShow

(129,995 posts)
81. I remember when that came out
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 08:41 PM
Feb 2019

but never saw it (not much of a comedy movie goer)! I know there were several "role reversal" things which included makeup (going either way) that came out over the years, but I think all stirred all kinds of controversy too.

cannabis_flower

(3,769 posts)
82. I watched part of it a few years ago...
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 08:43 PM
Feb 2019

and I'll say it was a singularly terrible movie. I didn't find it offensive, just bad.

BumRushDaShow

(129,995 posts)
83. I was never a fan of over-the-top "physical humor" films
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 08:49 PM
Feb 2019

And a lot of those "gag" comedy movies are just horrible, with little or no plot except to highlight the performers' antics.

True story but me and my sisters were banned from watching any "Three Stooges" on TV in our household, and to this day, over 50+ years later, I still can't watch them.

cannabis_flower

(3,769 posts)
86. My husband is a fan
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 09:41 PM
Feb 2019

of slapstick comedy. His favorite movies are "Dumb and Dumber" and since he speaks Spanish "El Chavo del Ocho". This is a comedy about a bunch of kids, played by adults dress as children.



I said it looked like a show for kids and he said well, don't you like "Los Tres Chiflados". I had to think about it. That's The Three Stooges in Spanish. I have to admit, I find them funny but only in very small doses.

BumRushDaShow

(129,995 posts)
84. Billy Crystal
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 08:57 PM
Feb 2019


But the question is, would it be acceptable to say, portray Jews with "hooked noses" (something that continues to happen in entertainment media and during Halloween, etc) or portray the Irish with red noses and falling-down drunk... and just say - well, "no harm was meant"?

Eliot Rosewater

(31,137 posts)
79. If a republican, i.e. filthy fucking racist who is a filthy fucking no good racist in 2019
Wed Feb 6, 2019, 08:00 PM
Feb 2019

ends up as Governor, we have lost our way.

Worst democrat is 100,000 times better than the BEST republican. If I have to explain why this matters now more than EVER I must be in the wrong place.

Latest Discussions»Latest Breaking News»Virginia Attorney General...