2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumBernie's biography.
Go to youtube and look at some of Bernie's videos. There is one in particular that has gotten the Republican's attention. He is speaking to a college class. He describes how excited he became when Castro overthrew the Cuban government and said it was this revolution that triggered his involvement in politics.
A few years after the revolution, the Cuban Missile Crisis occurred. Castro had become best buds with Khrushchev, the premier of the Soviet Union, during the height of the Cold War. Recall that Khrushchev in a speech said to the United States, "We will bury you."
With Castro's full support, Khrushchev built nuclear missile sites in Cuba with the capability of killing one third of the US population. When the US discovered the sites, the US experienced one week of moves and countermoves between JFK and Khrushchev.
It was the closest the world has ever come to nuclear war.
Think for a moment what the Republicans will do with that if Bernie were to be the Democratic nominee.
Research Bernie's support of the Sandinistas. Or his service as a presidential elector in a socialist organization that calls for the public ownership of all industrial means of production. Think what the Republicans will do with that.
I lectured on the Cuban Missile Crisis in MBA classes at a private university for many years. I have also researched Bernie's biography. His biography is one reason why I will not support him. Because he would be unelectable in the general election and he would take the Democratic party down with him.
If you think this is all hogwash, ask yourself: Why does Bernie not talk about his employment and relationships with organizations before he was elected Burlington mayor? Hillary talks about her early adult life - her work for minority and women's rights and establishing the Children's Health Fund, for example. Bernie? Not a peep. Why? He knows there are parts of his past that are political kryptonite.
He also knows that he's been very lucky in that there's not been a peep from other parties who have this information.
Hillary has all this information but she hasn't used it. Why? She doesn't want to anger his supporters.
The media have it but they're not using it. Why? They want a horserace that = higher ratings, more clicks and more $$$.
The Republicans have it. But they've not said a peep about Bernie. While they spend millions on anti-Hillary ads. They want Bernie in the GE and they're keeping their powder dry.
But Bernie's luck would end in the GE once the Republicans launch their assault.
I have much respect for Bernie and his movement. But he's been given a free pass, and I'm not willing to sacrifice the party for him.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)We didn't become fervently anti-Castro until a bit after the revolution. At first, Washington felt they might be able to work with the guy.
BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)Most people supported Castro early on.
kstewart33
(6,551 posts)It's there if you look for it.
Silver_Witch
(1,820 posts)kstewart33
(6,551 posts)Bernie continued to praise Castro after the Cuban Missile Crisis.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)I don't know who felt that way, except the Mob.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)..and a sense of humor.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)If the republicans wasted their money on that stuff from the 1960's, Bernie would be a shoe for election.
Who is that crap going to turn against Bernie? No one but right wing fanatics. That red baiting stuff doesn't fly anymore except on the far right and they aren't voting Democratic come hell or high water.
Hillary is the one who can't win the election. She's toast. The emails and the FBI are going to blow her out of the water.
kstewart33
(6,551 posts)The most reliable group of voters are those over 60.
I guarantee you this: They remember the Cuban Missile Crisis. And Daniel Ortega and the Sandinistas. And the Cold War that lasted through the 1980s.
There are hundreds of thousands of Cubans in Florida whose grandparents fled the Castro regime in boats that fled to Key West.
There are many who did not make it. Some tried to swim to Key West. All swimmers died.
Those grandparents have told their children and grandchildren about the Castro dictatorship and why they fled and those friends and relatives who died trying to escape Castro's brutality.
All the Republicans have to do is run TV ads in southern Florida showing Bernie praising Fidel Castro. He will lose a significant percentage of the southern Florida vote.
Red baiting? Tell that to those Cuban families.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Castro is a hero in Latin America
Read 'Open veins of Latin America'
tazkcmo
(7,306 posts)Something that happened 50 years ago gives you pause but a very critical and eye opening IG report and an active FBI investigation today means nothing. Got it.
kstewart33
(6,551 posts)And the role that Castro, Bernie's hero, played in it?
And the thousands who died under Castro's brutality?
Are you serious?
tazkcmo
(7,306 posts)lol Is he influential or a nobody from Vermont?
pangaia
(24,324 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)why did Cuba wind up in the Soviet sphere? Simple really -sugar- which was Cuba's main export -the US offered to buy for a price-the Russians offered more-simple as that really
kstewart33
(6,551 posts)Castro partnered with Khrushchev because he needed $$$ to stabilize and rule Cuba. K needed C because he wanted land 90 miles from the shore of America. His motives were obvious.
What does sugar have to do with it?
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)Castro sold sugar to the USSR rather than the US because they were willing to pay more-
pangaia
(24,324 posts)riderinthestorm
(23,272 posts)kstewart33
(6,551 posts)Tell that to the Cubans who died fleeing in boats for Key West to escape Castro's brutality. And those who swam in desperation, and died.
Denial in the face of facts does no one any good.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,719 posts)Read about the Doctor's Plot.
My maternal grandparents left Russia in 1908, one step ahead of the latest pogrom. My maternal grand uncle did well in America becoming rich making children's clothing, returned to Russia after the 1918 Revolution on a visit, gave sewing machines to some of his family members left behind, and the government confiscated them.
As an aside we are discussing America's relationship with Cuba during the Cold War, not communism in general or religion...
Jitter65
(3,089 posts)answer.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)No, really.
Time for change
(13,718 posts)JFK, AFTER the Cuban Missile crisis.
From James Douglass' great book, "JFK and the Unspeakable", 4 days before JFK's death:
Thus the stage was being set, four days before Dallas, for the beginning of a Kennedy-Castro dialogue on U.S.-Cuban relations As carefully as porcupines making love, they were preparing to engage in a dialogue on the strange proposition that the United States and Cuba might actually be able to live together in peace.
JFK's interview with the French journalist, Jean Daniel, October 24, 1963:
I believe that there is no country in the world including any and all the countries under colonial domination, where economic colonization, humiliation and exploitation were worse than in Cuba, in part owing to my countrys policies during the Batista regime I approved the proclamation which Fidel Castro made in the Sierra Maestra, when he justifiably called for justice and especially yearned to rid Cuba of corruption. I will even go further: to some extent it is as though Batista was the incarnation of a number of sins on the part of the United States. Now we shall have to pay for those sins. In the matter of the Batista regime, I am in agreement with the first Cuban revolutionaries. That is perfectly clear.
And Daniels' interview with Castro on Nov. 19, 1963, trying to mediate a dialogue between the two -- Castro talking about JFK:
But I feel that he inherited a difficult situation; I dont think a President of the United States is ever really free, and I believe Kennedy is at present feeling the impact of this lack of freedom. I also believe he now understands the extent to which he has been misled, especially, for example, on Cuban reaction at the time of the attempted Bay of Pigs invasion
Suddenly a President arrives on the scene who tries to support the interests of another class (which has no access to any of the levers of power) to give the various Latin American countries the impression that the United States no longer stands behind the dictators What happens then? The trusts see that their interests are being a little compromised; the Pentagon thinks their strategic bases are in danger; the powerful oligarchies in all the Latin American countries alert their American friends; they sabotage the new policy; and in short, Kennedy has everyone against him
I cannot help hoping that a leader will come to the fore in North America, who will be willing to brave unpopularity, fight the trusts, tell the truth and, most important, let the various nations act as they see fit. Kennedy could still be this man. He still has the possibility of becoming, in the eyes of history, the greatest President of the United States, the leader who may at last understand that there can be coexistence between capitalists and socialists, even in the Americas. He would then be an even greater President than Lincoln.
BreakfastClub
(765 posts)when they hear Bernie talking up Fidel Castro? That alone is enough to sink his candidacy in a GE. And he has said and written much, much worse. It's time for Bernie to be vetted.
Samantha
(9,314 posts)He is the best candidate for President we have had for decades. Don't underestimate him.
Sam
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)I dont think "zomg he made nice with Castro" means a whole hell of a lot to the generation that thinks the Red Hot Chili Peppers are "your dad's music"
bvf
(6,604 posts)but that's exactly right. My daughter fits that demographic, and I can even vouch for the Red Hot Chili Peppers thing.
P.S.
She has a degree in political science, and just now shrugged and rolled her eyes at the OP.
Time for change
(13,718 posts)It would come up during a debate, Bernie would explain it, and that would be the end of it.
Silver_Witch
(1,820 posts)So why all this demand for vetting? I am so confused by Hillary supporters who do this dance of thinking that Bernie's action in the 60s means something but Hillary being a republican back then means nothing!
RBInMaine
(13,570 posts)Zen Democrat
(5,901 posts)They only care about the future -- climate change, social issues, jobs, education.
99Forever
(14,524 posts)...is that you?
Ri-fucking-diculous.
stone space
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A history of the Plowshares movement from 1980 to 2012, compiled from the records of many friends by Ardeth Platte OP and Susan Crane.