History of Feminism
Related: About this forumPorning Politics: How Pornification is Making the (Political) World a Worse Place
In his recent Huffington Post piece, Mike Edison made his case for How Sex Magazines Made the World a Better Place. His conclusion? In addition to supposedly holding pictures of naked ladies in a more sacred light than does todays internet porn, Edison asserted that magazines like Screw and Hustler were ground zero for relentless freedom of speech in the form of tasteless comedy, brutal political satire, and, of course, naked ladies. As an amateur First Amendment scholar, Im sure that Edison is aware that another group that has benefitted from key freedom of speech court decisions is the Ku Klux Klan, but I doubt that Edison would argue that they, therefore, made the world a better place. Indeed, its possible to be an unabashed supporter of free speech and still question the cultural value of magazines that mainstream the sexual objectification and victimization of women. Of course, people have been debating whether or not pornography has deleterious effects on society for decades, and women who identify as feminist and pro-woman often come down on opposite sides of the issue. What this debate has thus far ignored, however, is the pornification of U.S. political culture, where womens images are often hijacked for prurient purposes, further degrading political dialogue.
This trend emerged forcefully during the 2008 primary and general election campaign cycles, at a time when women were making historic political gains. (Want all the gory details? The full version of the study is available here.) Hillary Clinton was the first woman to be a major-party frontrunner for the presidential nomination, but she was also repeatedly called a term that rhymes with blunt:
Sarah Palin was the first woman to be a Republican vice-presidential nominee, but shortly after being attached to the McCain ticket, Palin became the MILF next door:
Perhaps the worst offender of 2008 (and the one that employed imagistic strategies closest to those employed in porn magazines) is the Declare Yourself get-out-the-vote campaign. Its public service ads, aimed at the 18-25 year old voter, use a torture porn aesthetic to convince ostensibly disengaged citizens that when they fail to vote, they limit their own political agency:
You dont have to look far, however, to find persistent pornification of political women in 2011. Elizabeth Warren was heckled as a socialist whore at one of her campaign events. When Sarah Palin failed to confirm or deny her intention to run for president in 2012, Meghan McCain derided her as a tease. Janice Hahn, a candidate for Californias 36th congressional district, was lampooned in an attack ad that the conservative Daily Caller describes both as the most racist, fear-mongering, sexist sing-a-long the political world may ever see, and as horribly hilarious. In the video, titled Give Us Your Cash, Bch, Hahn is cast as a pole-dancing ho who funnels funds to menacing gang bangers.
http://www.thenewagenda.net/2011/12/14/porning-politics-how-pornification-is-making-the-political-world/
Drale
(7,932 posts)I've hear people bitching and moaning about how strippers are being used and such, but the one time I went to a strip club with my friends I ended up having a deep conversation about the environment with one of the girls. She was very intelligent and was stripping because she loved to dance, didn't care about people seeing her naked and made a huge amount of money. Yet one of the the stupidest people in history, Sarah "You Betcha" Palin, could have been Vice President and no one blinks an eye. Sorry about the mini rant.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)there were more than a few blink of the eyes thinking palin would be vp. i think that is the largest factor in mccain losing. my father has never voted dem in his life. he voted obama. because of palin.
edit to add... lol, thanks for your rant. there was mine.
whathehell
(29,113 posts)It's not true.
"She was very intelligent and she was stripping because she loved to dance.."
Riiiight, because slithering around near-naked with men sticking bucks in your
bra expresses a simple love of The Dance.
"Yet one of the the stupidest people in history, Sarah "You Betcha" Palin, could have been Vice President and
no one blinks an eye".
No one "blinks an eye"?....HUH?...Where have you been hanging out?
If you want to support the exploitation of women with "intelligence" but questionable self-esteem,
go ahead, but please don't try and act as if it's something else.
On the Road
(20,783 posts)"She was very intelligent and she was stripping because she loved to dance.."
I have talked with a number of women who have been strippers, and they're all over the map. I dated one for a while. Of course it does not represent all strippers, but it should serve to break the stereotype as I think it was supposed to do.
MadrasT
(7,237 posts)It is a tired derailing tactic and that shit doesn't play in this group.
whathehell
(29,113 posts)whathehell
(29,113 posts)as did Seabeyond.
Go back and read our posts.
MadrasT
(7,237 posts)Always.
Every. Single. Time.
And I'm not sorry about my mini rant.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)owner takes most of it for me out her taking crap from you all....
now, how about a tip.
i mean really.
it is the desperate need of men to feel that really... this is what the woman is all about and really, there is no exploitation. cause if they have to see the reality, well, what would that make them.
yardwork
(61,813 posts)What would people expect the stripper to say. And if being a stripper is such a terrific career choice, why aren't women lining up to audition.
yardwork
(61,813 posts)You seem surprised that she was intelligent and that she said that she enjoyed being a stripper. Did you expect her to say that she hated being a stripper? Even if this were true, would you expect her to tell a customer that? Think about it.
When you go to a bar, do you expect the cocktail waitress in the short skirt and high heels to tell you that her feet are killing her, or do you expect her to smile and tell you that she's having a wonderful evening at the job she loves?
These kinds of jobs carry an expectation of certain kinds of behavior with them. The job description includes flirting with the customers and reassuring the customers that they are in the right place. Does any strip joint advertise itself as a sleazy place where women are exploited? Don't they all claim to be high class places that serve excellent food and employ beautiful talented women who love to entertain men?
Think about the expectations and you will begin to see why there is no way out for these women. They can't simply tell their customers that they hate their jobs, that they're being exploited, that the manager demands blow jobs from them between shows, that they would love to have a better job but they need to support their kids and minimum wage isn't going to do it.
redqueen
(115,108 posts)most of the 'dancers' there would lower their chances of making the most in tips if they shared their woes with the 'clients' (that they might be working there due to a dependency on drugs or alcohol, or because their abusive boyfriends like not working and living off their girlfriend's income, or whatever else the 'clients' would rather not know).
Also, please, at least in this group, please use the word "women" when referring to women.
MadrasT
(7,237 posts)dana_b
(11,546 posts)I'm not a 18-25 y.o. so I don't remember them but that looks like Jessica Alba. She's a fairly good actress too - it's too bad that she didn't see the harm in them.
ManyShadesOf
(639 posts)I apologize to any who didn't appreciate the discussion.
By the time the thread got huge, latecomers didn't understand what the question was - not just crossposting, but intention, frequency, targeting certain Groups, harassment, abuse, muddying the waters.
One of the last posts was interesting:
"It's not as though a second thread in a separate group interferes with the first."
Sometimes it does. Sometimes it's intended to. Sometimes the interference is the point. Interfering with the thread, the topic, the Group, the members, the purpose of the Group. Particularly after being Blocked.
It's cultural.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)that is clear. to expect anyone to be balanced when discussing this forum, isn't going to happen. and ONLY a newbie would not know this. so you were expecting people to fairly look at what you provided in the OP and it wasn't going to happen. that was your error. that is why we try to stay out of that forum.
and that is also the affirmation that you step in without knowing what the fuck is really going on as you were repeatedly accused as being a sock. those accusing were not really thinking it thru.
ManyShadesOf
(639 posts)it makes the hostility worse, intentionally?
The take on your OP article could not have been more reactionary. It was presented to inflame.
This piece looks like a good one to help people (literally) see what the effects are. If they have eyes to see.
Apparently the knee jerk lines are already drawn over "porn" anything.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)and you are right. you will see that. total dismissal of the actual topic to redirect and not have to deal with any issue.
scorn, mock, ridicule, shame.
ManyShadesOf
(639 posts)what abusers do?
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)isnt that what the right wing men do? yes. isnt that what misogynist men do? yes. lol. larry flynt, stick a dick in the womans mouth to shut her up, and they will throw flynt on their shoulders and cheer.
and there you go.
it was really a hoot to watch the outrage with rush calling out fluke as we watch SOME of our progressive feminist men run around the board doing exactly that. yes.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)with strong, kick ass hosts.
ManyShadesOf
(639 posts)it takes a lot of huts to make a village ...
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)i LOVE this. excellent. exactly. some huts are on the outskirts of town for good reasons, lol. very good.
Response to seabeyond (Reply #27)
ManyShadesOf This message was self-deleted by its author.
Response to seabeyond (Reply #17)
Violet_Crumble This message was self-deleted by its author.
ManyShadesOf
(639 posts)in Seabeyond's thread. I'm sorry you're offended. It's over.
Response to ManyShadesOf (Reply #32)
Violet_Crumble This message was self-deleted by its author.
ManyShadesOf
(639 posts)take my post at face value
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12554696#post32
MadrasT
(7,237 posts)It is obvious that one poster in particular trolls this group for things to pluck out to take to another group for the sole purpose of sarcastically mocking.
It is also easy to guess why.
Just doesn't bother me that much. It's an interesting thing to observe and it makes me curious but not upset.
Dragging us into Meta is not cool. We have like minded people hanging in their own groups and have had enough damn drama already.
If that group wants to be the DU version of frat boys at Hooters at Happy Hour, meh, I don't care.
Just don't take away their porn. Or video games.
ManyShadesOf
(639 posts)SNAFU
Response to ManyShadesOf (Reply #16)
Violet_Crumble This message was self-deleted by its author.
ManyShadesOf
(639 posts)Ouch. The apology in this thread applies to all. And it's not "my" fucking pointless meta drama. Thank you.