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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

LAS14

(13,783 posts)
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 01:54 PM Jan 2020

Warren's drop in the polls is the signal that we're not yet ripe for structural....

... change. Warren attracted a lot of people (like me) who would be delighted to get on board with a push toward structural change if it looked like that was happening. Hence Warren's early surge. But when it begins to look like the surge is not happening, Warren's supporters shift to "beat Trump." Sanders' supporters are fanatics and don't switch for any reason. I'm keeping my Warren identity on DU for now, but I'm glad I don't have to vote in Iowa.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
46 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Warren's drop in the polls is the signal that we're not yet ripe for structural.... (Original Post) LAS14 Jan 2020 OP
And Bernie's rise in the polls? FiveGoodMen Jan 2020 #1
To me it does Doremus Jan 2020 #11
Bernie not rising in the polls. Not. This not a forum for fake. Scurrilous Jan 2020 #21
In January 2019 Sanders was 8% behind Biden, and today he's.....8% behind Biden brooklynite Jan 2020 #23
Facts? Scurrilous Jan 2020 #24
I decided not to mention (again) that Sanders is at half his support of 2016... brooklynite Jan 2020 #26
I'm making people cry on Twitter. Scurrilous Jan 2020 #29
I think Warren squirecam Jan 2020 #2
This! eom BlueMTexpat Jan 2020 #18
She's doing well in Wyoming. Up a bunch. Scurrilous Jan 2020 #25
Or ... frazzled Jan 2020 #3
Hillary won the popular vote!!! We're ready. nt LAS14 Jan 2020 #5
But we still have the electoral college ... frazzled Jan 2020 #6
Don't get discouraged yet. Buzz cook Jan 2020 #4
Interesting point on not being ripe enough yet. defacto7 Jan 2020 #7
No, it's a signal that she shot herself in the foot at the last debate. Algernon Moncrieff Jan 2020 #8
Warren squirecam Jan 2020 #9
Why? Cuz it showed her up as an uppity female????? nt LAS14 Jan 2020 #10
No Algernon Moncrieff Jan 2020 #34
She was dropping before that. The drop started when R B Garr Jan 2020 #12
Exactly. nt Blue_true Jan 2020 #31
Yes, women should know their place. BannonsLiver Jan 2020 #39
The house is on fire. We need to remove Trump. That's all that matters. scheming daemons Jan 2020 #13
It does not follow. LanternWaste Jan 2020 #14
I posted this as an opinion, a hypothesis, looking for other DUers thoughts. nt LAS14 Jan 2020 #15
Do you think calling a large number of fellow DUers 'fanatics' Kentonio Jan 2020 #16
I enjoyed it immensely. BannonsLiver Jan 2020 #38
Probably one of the reasons I had you on ignore for a long time after 2016 Kentonio Jan 2020 #40
Awww BannonsLiver Jan 2020 #41
Horseshit. I support Sanders... SMC22307 Jan 2020 #17
Horseshit indeed. David__77 Jan 2020 #22
I really don't believe that we are BlueMTexpat Jan 2020 #19
I think your post squirecam Jan 2020 #20
But some will bring more and better BlueMTexpat Jan 2020 #36
Public confidence in the economy is the highest it's been in 20 years Recursion Jan 2020 #28
I would LOVE to see Warren win. But I agree. I don't think we are ready for a woman to win just yet. Vivienne235729 Jan 2020 #27
Why not???? Hillary Clinton beat Trump by 3,000,000 votes fer pete's sake!!!! marble falls Jan 2020 #42
Bc since 2016, trump seems to have unleashed a frenzy of knuckle draggers Vivienne235729 Jan 2020 #43
A thread here said that Warren crushed Sanders in a mock caucus at Drake University (in Iowa). Blue_true Jan 2020 #30
In Calif. lots of independent contractors have dropped support of Warren and Sanders over AB 5. Liberty Belle Jan 2020 #32
almost... myohmy2 Jan 2020 #33
I think she would be a fantastic VP, or cabinet member. She's got most of the right ideas Malmsy Jan 2020 #35
Awesome post BannonsLiver Jan 2020 #37
Please don't go! Let me tell you what I do now... CTyankee Jan 2020 #44
Thing is, polls don't vote, people do Baclava Jan 2020 #45
You just had to insult Sanders supporters didn't you. totodeinhere Jan 2020 #46
 

FiveGoodMen

(20,018 posts)
1. And Bernie's rise in the polls?
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 01:56 PM
Jan 2020

Doesn't that say the opposite?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Doremus

(7,261 posts)
11. To me it does
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 03:05 PM
Jan 2020

Or maybe some of Warren's voters are moving over to Sanders.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Scurrilous

(38,687 posts)
21. Bernie not rising in the polls. Not. This not a forum for fake.
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 09:25 PM
Jan 2020

I'll link to my post. I'm tired of posting the numbers every time someone says Bernie is rising. He is not. All 538. From a few hours ago.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287452592#post9

Sanders leads in 8 states only Eight. Biden has 10 in South alone. Smallest margin 7% in Texas.

By 1% by 1% by 1.3% by .5% by 1% by 3% in 6 states. Wee NH and Utah only good leads

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

brooklynite

(94,792 posts)
23. In January 2019 Sanders was 8% behind Biden, and today he's.....8% behind Biden
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 11:00 PM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Scurrilous

(38,687 posts)
24. Facts?
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 11:17 PM
Jan 2020

Nice to see you.

I'm done posting poll numbers. My hands hurt from typing. It's good to see a link and some reality. Thanks brooklynite.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

brooklynite

(94,792 posts)
26. I decided not to mention (again) that Sanders is at half his support of 2016...
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 11:27 PM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Scurrilous

(38,687 posts)
29. I'm making people cry on Twitter.
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 11:33 PM
Jan 2020

Seriously. I feel terrible. " I trust Bernie." Just got that. Amazing.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

squirecam

(2,706 posts)
2. I think Warren
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 01:58 PM
Jan 2020

Is far from done.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Scurrilous

(38,687 posts)
25. She's doing well in Wyoming. Up a bunch.
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 11:19 PM
Jan 2020

Minn. Mass. too. And Montana.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

frazzled

(18,402 posts)
3. Or ...
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 01:58 PM
Jan 2020

still not ready for a woman to be President.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LAS14

(13,783 posts)
5. Hillary won the popular vote!!! We're ready. nt
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 02:02 PM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

frazzled

(18,402 posts)
6. But we still have the electoral college ...
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 02:13 PM
Jan 2020

and a lot of sub rosa misogyny

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Buzz cook

(2,474 posts)
4. Don't get discouraged yet.
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 01:58 PM
Jan 2020

Iowa hasn't happened yet and we have many primaries after.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

defacto7

(13,485 posts)
7. Interesting point on not being ripe enough yet.
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 02:51 PM
Jan 2020

It doesn't seem like we're ready for exceptional minds in the presidency in general. The public is too drawn toward personality even demagoguery.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Algernon Moncrieff

(5,794 posts)
8. No, it's a signal that she shot herself in the foot at the last debate.
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 02:52 PM
Jan 2020

Confronting Bernie on stage, no matter how justified, wasn't good optics.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

LAS14

(13,783 posts)
10. Why? Cuz it showed her up as an uppity female????? nt
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 03:02 PM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Algernon Moncrieff

(5,794 posts)
34. No
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 02:05 AM
Jan 2020

1) She made an accusation that, while very possibly true, can't be proven (literally "he said/she said" )
2) Not shaking Sanders' hand looked (wait for it....) UnPresidential

I like Elizabeth Warren. My first two choices are likely out by June. She'd be my third.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

R B Garr

(16,995 posts)
12. She was dropping before that. The drop started when
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 03:07 PM
Jan 2020

she started providing cost details to her plans, especially M4All. Bernie doesn’t bother with such details.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BannonsLiver

(16,508 posts)
39. Yes, women should know their place.
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 02:44 PM
Jan 2020


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

scheming daemons

(25,487 posts)
13. The house is on fire. We need to remove Trump. That's all that matters.
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 03:14 PM
Jan 2020

Liz is prescribing policy positions that are the equivalent of plans for a kitchen remodel or adding an addition.


The house is literally burning down, we need to put out that fire, repair the damage.... and *THEN* we can worry about improvements.


Liz is out of touch with what is needed right now.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
14. It does not follow.
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 03:20 PM
Jan 2020

'After this therefor because of this' is a known logical fallacy. Support your given reason for particular poll movements with objective data illustrating it's not another reason and you'll have a valid premise.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LAS14

(13,783 posts)
15. I posted this as an opinion, a hypothesis, looking for other DUers thoughts. nt
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 03:44 PM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
16. Do you think calling a large number of fellow DUers 'fanatics'
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 06:37 PM
Jan 2020

Is a healthy way to promote unity heading towards the election? Or indeed to show good manners?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

BannonsLiver

(16,508 posts)
38. I enjoyed it immensely.
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 02:41 PM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
40. Probably one of the reasons I had you on ignore for a long time after 2016
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 03:48 PM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

SMC22307

(8,090 posts)
17. Horseshit. I support Sanders...
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 06:40 PM
Jan 2020

but will vote for whomever is the Democratic nominee. Stop believing everything you read on social media.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

David__77

(23,558 posts)
22. Horseshit indeed.
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 10:56 PM
Jan 2020

...

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

BlueMTexpat

(15,374 posts)
19. I really don't believe that we are
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 08:24 PM
Jan 2020

not ripe for structural change.

If we are not, we will be in serious trouble. Because simply returning to the Obama years will NOT be enough, even though too many fantasize that it will be.

Serious damage has been done ... and will continue to be done ... if we return to "same-old-same-old-go-along-to-get-along" crap, no matter who our candidate is.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

squirecam

(2,706 posts)
20. I think your post
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 08:38 PM
Jan 2020

Is just as misguided as the OP.

Any dem would bring needed change from the current administration.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BlueMTexpat

(15,374 posts)
36. But some will bring more and better
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 02:37 PM
Jan 2020

change.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
28. Public confidence in the economy is the highest it's been in 20 years
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 11:33 PM
Jan 2020

Being on the left often means we lament that our fellow citizens just aren't wanting the right things; this is a case of that. We don't win by promising to fundamentally change an economy most of the public is happy with.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Vivienne235729

(3,390 posts)
27. I would LOVE to see Warren win. But I agree. I don't think we are ready for a woman to win just yet.
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 11:31 PM
Jan 2020

We are so backwards. But my hope is that ONE day, hopefully in my lifetime, we will have a female president.....and universal health care too.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

marble falls

(57,355 posts)
42. Why not???? Hillary Clinton beat Trump by 3,000,000 votes fer pete's sake!!!!
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 05:23 PM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Vivienne235729

(3,390 posts)
43. Bc since 2016, trump seems to have unleashed a frenzy of knuckle draggers
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 09:12 PM
Jan 2020

It seems like there is far more mysogeny, sexism, bigotry and racism now. And sadly, I think it is being normalized to some degree.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
30. A thread here said that Warren crushed Sanders in a mock caucus at Drake University (in Iowa).
Tue Jan 28, 2020, 11:43 PM
Jan 2020

So maybe Senator Sanders does not have the youth support that all his supporters claim. We will get a first datapoint in a few days.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Liberty Belle

(9,538 posts)
32. In Calif. lots of independent contractors have dropped support of Warren and Sanders over AB 5.
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 01:01 AM
Jan 2020

Warren especially came onstage here to announce she was supporting AB 5 and tout endorsement of Lorena Gonzalez, its author.
The bill, now law, is decimating the livelihoods of all kinds of freelancers including musicians, artists, writers, photographers, journalists, translators, etc. It was touted as going after Uber and Lyft to help exploited workers but media seeking to find those "exploited workers" helped by the bill can't find any!

The bill is also horrible for small businesses and nonprofits, as well as media outlets, infringing on freedom of the press in many ways.

There was a rally in Sacramento today with all kinds of fed up contractors who are losing work since out of state companies wlll no longer hire freelance writers etc. in California. The bill is making criminals out of hard working creative people. Lorena has gone from being respected as champion of labor and women to being reviled by all being hurt by this bill. A single petition asking to exempt musicians from the law got 40,000 signatures in days. It ruins life for bands and band promoters, too. There are lawsuits filed by independent truckers, freelance writers and others with the means to sue, but for so many who can't afford a lawsuit there's no way out of its Draconian and impossible to afford to comply with provisions.

So who are all these fed up contractors and those who need to hire them turning to? Republicans introducing bills to repeal or reform AB 5. Dems in CA are shooting themselves in the foot following Lorena right off a cliff, like lemmings. They need to admit this bill was a tremendous overreach that is hurting way too many people and helping basically nobody -- even Uber and Lyft are funding a balot measure to exempt just themselves/their industry and meanwhile pushing the limits with a new business model that neither makes people employees (as the author intended) nor helps the workers in any way but instead, lets drivers set their own rates, in what drivers say will be a race to the bottom.

Dems need to admit this was a huge mistake, repeal it and the underlying bill that led to the earlier Dynamex Supreme Court decision that made AB 5 necessary to provide "exemptions" to Dynamex but that made things even worse for many people, slightly better for others but not enough to survive for most.

Think you're safe if not in CA? Nope. There are similar bills in some other state legislatures and guess what? Warren and Sanders have both said they want a national version of AB 5. So has Feinstein. If you don't want Dems to lose in November, better start talking to those legislators now. This is a Trojan horse that can take the whole party down, taking away people's livelihood is driving even life-long Democrats in CA to tell me they will be voting Republican at least in the legislative races this fall which leaves many of us including me feeling betrayed by both parties, with nobody I want to vote for. Yes I will hold my nose and vote for whatever Dem wins the primary for president since our democracy itself is at stake, but I can't say the same for our state legislature, nor will I lift a finger to actively help any candidate or official who supports AB 5 or a national bill like it.

My own Republican legislator has introduced a state constitutional amendment to repeal AB 5, which won't get through the legislature with so many Dems with heads in the sand, but it should. If they try to put it on the ballot as an initiative, every creativ person I know plans to sign it. We are all seething with fury over Dems doing such a despicable thing.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

myohmy2

(3,182 posts)
33. almost...
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 01:14 AM
Jan 2020

"...we're not yet ripe for structural... change."

...from Warren...

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Malmsy

(297 posts)
35. I think she would be a fantastic VP, or cabinet member. She's got most of the right ideas
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 12:14 PM
Jan 2020

and could really be a help to President Sanders.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

BannonsLiver

(16,508 posts)
37. Awesome post
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 02:40 PM
Jan 2020

Stick to your choice. She’s a gem. Loved what you said about BS supporters.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

CTyankee

(63,912 posts)
44. Please don't go! Let me tell you what I do now...
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 09:16 PM
Jan 2020

I am simply sticking with Elizabeth until she wins or says "OK, I'm stopping my campaign." I figure what do I have to lose anyway.

I love her. I want a woman president. I'm all in for her until she tells me she quits.

Don't give up just yet.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Baclava

(12,047 posts)
45. Thing is, polls don't vote, people do
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 09:20 PM
Jan 2020

I'll wait to see the results in all the states

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

totodeinhere

(13,059 posts)
46. You just had to insult Sanders supporters didn't you.
Wed Jan 29, 2020, 09:24 PM
Jan 2020

I support Bernie and I am no fanatic. I think the reason why Warren's support is declining is because voters who are to the left of Biden are choosing Bernie over her. Myself, I support Bernie but I would have no problem supporting Elizabeth either.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
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