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In reply to the discussion: 16 Penn swimmers say transgender teammate Lia Thomas shouldn't be allowed to compete [View all]IngridsLittleAngel
(1,962 posts)"An unfair advantage"... I'm sorry. That's life, people. The NCAA rules give eligible athletes the right and the opportunity to compete.. They do not guarantee a victory. Again, I'm sorry. That's life. That's reality. That's sports.
The entire history of sports, at every level, has had athletes who were just so much better than everyone else that it "seemed unfair". 100 years ago, it was Babe Ruth out-homering entire teams and seemingly being impossible to get out. In the 50's and 60's, Wilt Chamberlain was so dominant they changed the rules to try to slow him down. Wayne Gretzky scored 378 goals in one year in a youth hockey league (and we all know what he did in the NHL).
We can reply all we want about "broad shoulders" and "puberty". So tell me... Would everyone be screaming if Lia Thomas dominated the competition like this and was a cisgender woman? Where were these complaints when Martina Navratilova was dominating tennis? When Annika Sorenstam was dominating golf? Or is domination okay so long as you're cis?
For everyone who wants to pretend that being a transwoman is the cruise control to athletic dominance, I present to you Renee Richards. Renee was a mediocre tennis player prior to transitioning in the 70's. When she fought for and was able to compete as a woman post-transitioning... she was still a mediocre tennis player. No titles, no majors, and the only real success she had was a double partner (mixed-doubles with John Lucas, or women's doubles with Martina). "Broad shoulders", or being 6 feet tall, or "puberty as a male" didn't change a thing with her tennis career. It didn't lead to Renee having an unfair advantage, or overpowering the competition.
As to those of you who brought up the MMA fight a few years ago... I have the solution right here. BAN MMA. BAN BOXING. Ban all of these barbaric bloodsports! Whether it's the female MMA fighter who wound up with skull fractures, or watching Muhammad Ali waste away the way he did, or Kim Duk-koo dying thanks to injuries sustained in the ring, all of these sports are dangerous, and this is the risk anytime you put two people in the ring, the octagon, the whatever... Even if evenly matched and of equal size, every fight runs the risk of extreme injuries, long-term damage and death. These barbaric "sports" have no place in a civilized society. I don't give a damn if the fight is man vs. man, man vs. woman, cisgender vs. trans...
Don't get me wrong. I am saddened at someone being injured so badly in a fight... The same way I'm saddened anytime someone is badly injured in any boxing or MMA match. This is why I no longer watch boxing, and have never watched MMA. I don't get my jollies off watching two people try to beat each other to death.
The question there, honestly, should *not* be "Why did a cis woman end up in a match with a trans woman?" It should be "Why the hell were two people put into the ring to beat each other senseless?!"
I sincerely ask how much of this arguing and petitioning and calling for removal is in the name of "fair competition" and how much of it is just bigotry. I think some people wouldn't be thrilled with my guess.
There is no perfect answer. Perfect answers exist in perfect words. The older I get, the less perfection I see anywhere... Except maybe in a perfectly made pair of boots or a song like "25 or 6 to 4".
I don't think any trans person would object to hormone testing, and a determination that the hormones levels and ratio are acceptable for a trans athlete to participate on a team of their chosen gender. No one wants the absurdity of someone "gaming the system" while being insincere. No one wants someone trying to pull an Eric Cartman and pretending to be disabled to "dominate" the Special Olympics (though, if you saw the episode, you saw how well that turned out for him.) But if this is going to turn into an argument about physical build, shoulders, etc., then be fair. By that, ban anyone - cis or trans - who is built in such a way that their body gives them an unfair advantage.
But there is a huge difference between a scenario like that, and a transitioning trans woman wanting the opportunity to compete. You don't think I've seen cisgender women built like Lia Thomas before?
But if the "answer" is a blanket ban on trans athletes, what kind of answer is that? How is that any different than telling Josh Gibson or Cool Papa Bell "No. You can't play" just because of the color of their skin? Discrimination is discrimination.
Again, NCAA guidelines give athletes who are eligible an opportunity to compete... Not a guarantee of victory. The harsh reality in life is that sometimes you're just not the best. But, if there is one thing I've learned about bigots, it's that when in doubt, blame and/or punch down on "the others."
For everyone calling for Lia Thomas to "swim on an open team"... What kind of "open team"? Does it come with the same type of scholarship? The same kind of rights? Or is it less of a scholarship? No scholarship? Are we right back to the same ol' "You can't get married, your gay. Go get a domestic partnership instead" - even though a domestic partnership is not marriage? Separate but equal is not equal. We've seen it time and time and time again, whether it's race or gender or sexual orientation.
So what does she do? Not swim at all? Go swim on a "separate but equal" team? Go back to the "men's" team - which not only means being misgendered and misidentified, but the possibility of being the target of violence in the locker room? Taking away her rights is no better than denying Black baseball players the right to play in the Majors - regardless of "intention".
The other thing to really think about is if she indeed has an "unfair advantage". By that, I mean, quit discussing body shape, body development, "biology" or any of that... And instead think long and hard about what it's like living with this kind of internal conflict, this kind of pressure, this kind of scrutiny, this kind of controversy... Everyone sure celebrates the on-field achievements of Jackie Robinson and Bill Russell... yet take a look at what they endured off the field/court.
Some of you speak about what's fair, failing to take into account the entire picture, failing to go beyond "Golly gee, she went from 462nd to 1st". Instead, there is zero - absolutely zero - attempt to think about what would come of just kicking her off the team.
So would you like to hear life from the perspective of a trans woman?
You try losing nearly your entire family for coming out, complete with having two relatives try to murder you - one with a knife, one with a baseball bat.
You try having your "best friend", at three times your size, try to "beat the f*ggot" out of you, resulting in not only the emotional scars, but long-term physical health problems as a result of that "tough love."
You try having a county sheriff's deputy show up at your door and aim his gun at you to deliver the message to "shut the fuck up and get lost" after you push back against his bigotry on a BBS.
You try taking part in a large fundraising event, only to be denied opportunities and being told "no" on things because some jerkass bigot with too much power "pegged" you, and being subjected to abuse and bigotry, despite trying to bust your ass volunteering. Then after a decade of hell, you complain, only to be banned, and having to resort to the legal system to get out of your undeserved "prison without bars." The bigots, of course, still have their thrones. The only person punished was the victim of the abuse and bigotry.
You try 30 years of being treated as a third-class citizen - second-class would be a frigging step up at this point.
You trying having people outside your door, yelling "Crossdressers aren't real people!" because they watched Chappelle's "The Closer".
You try having a confrontation with the cops because some drunk idiot of a neighbor calls 911, accusing you of trying to prey upon a kid you've never even come near or spoken to before, all because "F*ggots like you prey on children."
You try 30 years of being denied proper healthcare, all because "God is in play" and "It might offend people" and "It's elective" and all that other shit. A situation that finally is about to be addressed, after far too long. All the while, you watch as certain people yell and scream about "giving hormones to trans teens." Yeah, fuck that. Let's wait until half their life is gone. Or more.
You try waking up with self-hatred every day, hating who the hell is in the mirror...
You try living in fear of becoming a statistic.
You try being one of the 41%, and having the scars to prove it.
Does every single thing I just listed apply to Lia Thomas, or any other trans athlete? Probably not - especially the fundraiser part. But I'm sure many of them do. But that is a taste of what life is like for a trans person. It's a hell I wouldn't wish upon anyone.
While people are going on about broad shoulders and puberty and "#462 to #1", everyone is failing to overlook the emotional baggage and inner turmoil and pain of being a trans person in the so-called "free-est country on Earth". While people are complaining about the results of an athletic competition, it seems no one is taking into account what real discrimination is - and it's not "not winning", it's being told "get lost. You're not welcome here."
Who is more vulnerable here - cisgender swimmers who aren't winning in a meet, or a member of a very vulnerable and highly targeted group of people who is being dragged into the middle of a controversy for the crime of trying to be true to themselves?
On one hand, there is not being good enough. On the other, there is being told "Get out of here, no one wants you" just because of how you are born. I'm sorry, but the former would be like calling me - an internet DJ of 14 years - a victim for not being as good as Rick Dees or Casey Kasem.
Assuming Lia Thomas is transitioning, and within the NCAA's guidelines, banning her is not only unfair, it's discrimination. Period. As long as she is following the rules, she has every right to be out there as anyone else does. The stance of these 16 swimmers, and Hog Head-Makar, and anyone calling for Thomas' ban, is downright upsetting to anyone who has been on the receiving end of that kind of bigotry and discrimination.
Fair solution? Go for it. But any "solution" that isn't fair to everyone - and that includes Lia Thomas - is nothing but discrimination. Something I think I have every right to say, being all too familiar with such discrimination.
If the "solution" sounds like something Fucker Carlson would say on Fux Noise... I'm sorry, it's no solution at all.