Reply #60: This is a strange, strange post. [View All]

You do realize that most of us do believe this with every cell in our bodies, right? And we didn't get there by reading tea leaves, we looked at all the circumstantial evidence, and God knows there's a plethora of it, and as was the case with the 2000 election and Iraq/911/WMD and Bush's corporate welfare agenda, our belief that we were being had was justified.

I love it when people say 'we' around here. I always ask if they have a mouse in their pocket or something. ;)

"We looked at all the circumstantial evidence" is precisely the reason why I grind my teeth when people demand that Kerry act and act now. Circumstantial evidence doesn't cut it in a courtroom. Circumstantial evidence is the reason why Thursday's objection was political theater instead of actual action.

If circumstantial evidence is all we have, as you seem to state, then we had better game up for a,long haul, because we are going to need actual firm evidence before we move the pile. That is why I have been reporting on Conyers, Bonifaz, Cobb, Badnarik and Kerry as they progress in their investigations and legal challenges.

And I think that many of us are justified now in believing what we see; we've been had. Again. And, we've been let down by those who represent us. That goes for most of the Senate, the House and above all the Media, who are supposed to expose the powerful for the world to see, not portray the powerful as they would like to be portrayed.

You're not telling me anything I don't know.

Some of us are profoundly affected by the last four years; financially, emotionally, physically and spiritually. A lot of us don't feel we can afford another four years as opposed to those with jobs who actually benefit from insane presidents in the US of A. Like journalsits, or politicians with job security.

Two things, fellow.

1) I have been profoundly affected by the last four years. I have killed myself - financially, spiritually, mentally, physically - to get the truth out there. I wrote a book on Iraq (for which I did not make a dime because the publisher went bankrupt after printing too many books which we then gave away) in which I hung my balls way out in the wind on, and then traveled 150,000 miles give or take to just about every Red State in the country to try and give people the truth. In the process I lost a lot of money, an eight-year relationship, and a lot of friends who slipped away while I was working in this coal mine. I answer letters, emails and phone calls every day from the mothers of dead soldiers.

2) How fucking DARE you condescend to say that I have a profit motive in Bush being in that office? How fucking DARE you? You think I have job security? I work for a bloody website. I don't know how long you've been on the planet, friend, but if you were alive and breathing in the mid-to-late 1990s, you'd know that web work is here today and gone tomorrow. I make enough to live on, and that's about it.

Don't take that the wrong way, I'd give my left arm to be a journalist in these times.

Yeah right. I took it exactly trhe way you meant it, so spare me the backpedaling. If you're going to say things like that, have the courage to stand by your words.

And no offense, Will, but your perspective is limited to your occupation and your privileged access to inside information.

That's the confusing part. My occupation which is based on collecting and disbursing data, and my ability to talk to people who are involved in these things on the inside, *limits* my perspective?

Some of us have mouths to feed and are truly frightened at what the future holds for our children. Some of us can't afford another four years of being pre-occupied with politics at the expense of time spent with our kids, or actually enjoying a hobby or two.

Why do you think I do this. Oh, right, I forgot. You think I do this to get rich, and that I enjoy having George around. Or something.

You of all people should know how time consuming it is to keep informed. For those of us with jobs that don't involve politics, it's an extra 1-2 hours a day just to keep up with all the changes going on.

Which, again, is why we do what we do, when we're not masturbating with thousand-dollar bills and tearing down old-growth forests with our Humvees thanks to all the money we're making because we love having George around.

There is more than one good fight in this showdown. There are many, but all of them lead to one thing: getting the most illigitimate and corrupt president this country has ever known out of the the WH.

Good. Step #1 in that mission is to not shit on your allies.

Most of us call it as we see it, and each of us has our own legitimate perspective which, IMO, is simply not open for disparagement or criticism. Not even by you.

At what point did I disparage you or anyone? If anything, I only disparaged the people who come here to fight just for the sake of fighting. If anyone has done any disparaging in this thread, it has been you.

To answer youer opening question, which had nothing to do with the rest of your confusing screed: Yes, I believe there was fraud. I believe that fraud involved a) Computer firms rigging machines in Ohio to cover their asses, so they didn't get their contracts contested for placing faulty machines in use; b) Nefarious an illegal behavior on the part of GOP operatives and friends within the e-machine private sector; c) Both.