Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

US MISSILE DEFENSE SYSTEM "OPERATIONAL" (OH BOY!)

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Latest Breaking News Donate to DU
 
goodboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:15 AM
Original message
US MISSILE DEFENSE SYSTEM "OPERATIONAL" (OH BOY!)
Edited on Tue Jun-20-06 10:17 AM by goodboy
http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=domesticNews&storyID=2006-06-20T140019Z_01_N20421649_RTRUKOC_0_US-ARMS-USA-MISSILE.xml&archived=False

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Amid concerns over an expected North Korean missile launch, the United States has moved its ground-based interceptor missile defense system from test mode to operational, a U.S. defense official said on Tuesday.

The official, speaking on condition of anonymity, confirmed a Washington Times report that the Pentagon has activated the system, which has been in the developmental stage for years.

"It's good to be ready," the official said.

U.S. officials say evidence such as satellite pictures suggests Pyongyang may have finished fueling a Taepodong-2 missile, which some experts said could reach as far as Alaska.



"There's real caution in how to characterize it so as to not be provocative in our own approach," the defense official said of the move to activate the system.



© Reuters 2006


I FEEL SAFER ALREADY
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:18 AM
Response to Original message
1. My ass.
From the article:

"It's good to be ready," the official said.


:rofl:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
goodboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:21 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. google: "Missile Defense System Failure" over 5.4 million hits.




Web Results 1 - 10 of about 5,490,000 for missile defense system failure. (0.22 seconds
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #4
12. Maybe they're not talking about the Star Wars
missile defense?

I have not read one thing that said that ever worked or ever could. Maybe they mean some old fashioned missile defense system in this article?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bananas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #12
33. A few years ago, they said they were going to deploy it even though
it didn't work, and that they would upgrade it over time.
There was also a big news story because Canada didn't want any part of it,
the pentagon wanted to put radar and missiles in Canada.
I forgot how that turned out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
robinlynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #33
48. Didn't they just buy Canada?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 06:50 PM
Response to Reply #33
53. They've revived it with a new name,
but the Canadians are still being sensible about it. :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mr_Jefferson_24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #12
72. I'll bet you're right...
Edited on Wed Jun-21-06 10:32 AM by Mr_Jefferson_24

Duck and Cover missile defense system fully operational
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 11:14 AM
Response to Reply #72
75. We had windowless cloakrooms.
I never did the under the desk missile defense. Always hid in the cloakroom, guaranteed to protect you from radiation.

It must have worked. I survived. :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mr_Jefferson_24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #75
77. I don't know if you've...
Edited on Wed Jun-21-06 11:39 AM by Mr_Jefferson_24
...ever seen The In-Laws ('79) with Peter Falk and Alan Arkin. Do rent it if you haven't, it's a classic--many good laughs. The reason I mention this is that my own personal missile defense strategy is taken from a scene in this film: "Serpentine, Shel! Serpentine!"

If this makes no sense to you, do yourself a favor when you could use some good laughs and rent it. Didn't really mean to turn this into a movie review, but Falk and Arkin together in this one are absolutely great--the original made in '79, not the remake.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0079336/usercomments
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #77
78. Serpentine! :)
I loved that movie. It was hilarious. Not only do I remember "serpentine" but I remember that he backed up over the terrain where he had already run a straight line.

I didn't know there was a remake. I can't imagine why anyone would remake such a hilarious movie. I loved it the way it was.

No longer having a cloakroom, I will adopt your serpentine missile defense for current times. If it's copyrighted, I'll send you a royalty check. :hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mr_Jefferson_24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #78
79. I hold no patent or copyright and...
...even if I did, you'd have full lifetime serpentine privileges, on the house. No need to thank me, I'm here to save lives.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #79
80. Thank you for brightening my day.
Truly. :hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mr_Jefferson_24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #80
82. My pleasure. nt.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
longship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #77
83. Much better than the remake.
Peter Falk is great in the original.
I think I'll put that in my Netflix queue.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ixion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #1
9. even if 'ready' is an illusion
I guess. :eyes:

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #1
57. self-delete (error)
Edited on Tue Jun-20-06 07:50 PM by chill_wind
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Norquist Nemesis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:18 AM
Response to Original message
2. Alaska should start evacuating
just in case. Given this administration's stellar record for success, I'd be high-tailing it out of there if that's what their plan is.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cosmik debris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:21 AM
Response to Original message
3. It may be locked and loaded, but
It can't hit the broad side of a barn! It is another boondoggle, with no military value.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tanyev Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #3
59. ATTN San Francisco DUers:
This might be a good time to take a vacation elsewhere in the country. I've never been able to forget Jebbie's little "joke" about your city.

''It looks like the people of San Francisco are an endangered species, which may not be a bad thing. That's probably good news for the country.''

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #59
81. I'm glad you brought that up.
Sometimes people say things that are on their minds.

Example:
Life would be easier in a dictatorship, as long as I was the dictator. (paraphrased) Note the extraordiary number of signing statements by this imperial presidency.

We should all keep the San Francisco remark in mind.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tridim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:24 AM
Response to Original message
5. I think BushCo must have watched "Spies Like Us" a few weeks ago
They're following the plot to the letter.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
alvarezadams Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #5
85. "Spies Like us"?
Nah. "Canadian Bacon".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
alvarezadams Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #85
86. Trailer
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
swag Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:25 AM
Response to Original message
6. I'm sure the North Korean missiles are equipped with US provided homing
beacons, but even then the chances of a successful intercept seem slim, given the abysmal record of the NMD program and contractors thus far.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
PinkUnicorn Donating Member (546 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:26 AM
Response to Original message
7. So they convinced
So they managed to convince the North Koreans to strap a homing beacon on the missile, promise to only launch it in good weather, and to have a 'do over' if (*shock*) the interceptor misses?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:27 AM
Response to Original message
8. this is deadly game for the US to be playing!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
winter999 Donating Member (530 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #8
15. US?! What about NK?!
How's North Korea contributing to a peaceful world going down its path? Besides the missile defense is mainly for South Korea and Japan. If person A were raring back to punch the shit out of you (or a friend), is it ok to put up an arm to defend yourself or one of your friends?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. Do you think it's helpful...
...to tout a defense system that doesn't work as 'operational' merely for PR effect?

Who does it help?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
davepc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #18
51. Because now the North Koreans have to weigh that idea that it *might* work
And if it does work, then their test which is supposed to stick a needle in the eye of the US/Japan/South Korea is going to blow up in their face and be a huge embarrassment.

They have to decide to call the bluff or not. And if their wrong, Kim Jong-il isin't going to blame himself for his military commanders failure.

This is a game of ballistic missile chicken.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 07:08 PM
Response to Reply #51
56. NK is doing a test --that means they don't know if it will work
That's why it's called 'a test'.

The US is stating that it's defense system is 'operational'. That means it's ALREADY supposed to work.

Who is risking more loss of face here if their technology fails?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dansolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:25 PM
Response to Reply #51
67. The embarassment may end up being ours
What is going to happen if we make a big deal about knocking out their missle, and we miss? Who will then be the laughing stock?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rooboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 07:08 AM
Response to Reply #51
69. Let me save you and the North Koreans a lot of mental energy.
It DOESN'T work, and is not even close to working.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tiberius Donating Member (798 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 09:26 AM
Response to Reply #69
70. I'll take it one step further
... I doubt if it will EVER work. The apt analogy is "hitting a bullet with a bullet", but even that understates just how big of a feat it would be to get missile defense to work.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
unda cova brutha Donating Member (208 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #15
23. NK is only responding to threats from the US
They are showing us that they will not allow the US to bully them around like we do everywhere else. Is that so bad for them to do?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OnyxCollie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #15
43. Bushco set the precedent.
No sovereign state is safe from a hegemonic war. Unless you can turn a large portion of the attackers citizens into charcoal, of course. Why do you think Iran wants a bomb?

My cousin is a retired Navy commander who now works on missile defense systems. "Doesn't work," he said. "Too hard to take two objects traveling at mach 2 and have them collide."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Pierre.Suave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 09:52 AM
Response to Reply #15
71. You are assuming
that NK is actually planning on launching that misssile at the US, which I highly doubt.

As fas as I know, this is only a test. We do it all the time, why cant they?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #71
73. these big toys for these little men,
makes me want to :puke:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #73
87. I'm with you
those missiles sure look like phallic symbols to me.;) Remember in the good old days when South and North Korea marched side by side during the Olympics? Besides * publicly declaring N. Korea as an enemy, he apparently had a little "chat" with the South Korean President (as I remember). That man spreads "love" where ever he goes. When he made his little speech after 9/11, he basically called the shots against N. Korea and Iran. It's like someone waving a red kerchief at a bull. N. Korea and Iran, apparently, saw what happened when a country is defenseless--do you think they're looking for the same treatment? Kim Jong may be "loony tunes", but we got our own "loony tunes." Off the topic, doesn't Moon own property in North Korea?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Eugene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:30 AM
Response to Original message
10. Okay, now we need the North Koreans to put a homing beacon on the missile.
:silly: Give me a break! This all feels so Strangelovian.

That system has never worked in any kind of realistic test,
and one major component or another has failed in nearly
all of the tests. Oh well, what's a few billion dollars more
for Lockheed Martin? It's not like Rummy would notice. :eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HereSince1628 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #10
35. My thought, exactly.
And they will use this to PROVE that the missle defense system is not only "operational" but also "effective." I don't know if I should laugh or cry.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:44 AM
Response to Original message
11. Every day we are punished with another transparent atrocity.
We don't deserve this except that we weren't paying attention to the creatures swarming and descending on us - stealing us blind and going on a killing and lying nation destroying binge.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jus_the_facts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
13. "Hasta la vista, baby!"
....wonder how long until SkyNet becomes self aware?! :evilfrown:



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sidpleasant Donating Member (376 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #13
21. Dr. Forbin says Colossus will protect us from Kim Il Jong
nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ElboRuum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #13
41. My guess...
Skynet will become self-aware long before Shrub.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
earthside Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 11:02 AM
Response to Original message
14. Totally STUPID!
So, now if the North Koreans launch their missile ...

... and the Reagan/Bush missile shield tries to intercept and misses ...

... or if they don't even try ...

... then the GOPentagon and Bush/Cheney/Rove will have made the U.S. look like even bigger fools than they have already made us look like.

Jeez ... these people really are stupid and moronic.

If we don't boot them out of the White House pretty soon ... we're all doomed!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 11:04 AM
Response to Original message
16. I feel safer already. Thanks George.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tempest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 11:06 AM
Response to Original message
17. Will it work as well as the Patriot missile system?
Remember when they told us how successful it was during the first Gulf war?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
grytpype Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 11:18 AM
Response to Original message
19. Hey, relax everyone, George Bush is in charge!
What could go wrong?



"Duh, I pushed the wrong button agin..."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AnOhioan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
20. Update
Edited on Tue Jun-20-06 11:30 AM by AnOhioan
The United States has activated its missile defense system to deal with a possible North Korean missile test, Kyodo News agency reported Tuesday, citing a report.

The U.S. is considering intercepting the missile if North Korea goes ahead with the test , Kyodo said, quoting The Washington Times.


Full story at http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/06/20/world/main1731500.shtml?source=RSS&attr=World_1731500

Bolding added by myself


Great...NK launches test (one missle flying around)

US launches intercept (Two missles flying around)

The NK missile test may well fail. Our interceptor may well fail. In other words....

Look out below. If I was in Japan...I would be nervous right about now.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Carni Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #20
44. OK exactly where are they shooting the thing to *test it*
Maybe I am stupid...but if it's a test don't they have to fire it at something?

Why would bushit inc announce (casually of course) that they have activated our pretend star wars system?

Maybe I'm dense but doesn't this seem kind of important compared to oh say gay marriage and the shit the bushites are still yakking about currently?

I guess I expected a little more importance to be placed on this issue in the media as it would seem to be kind of important, but what the hell do I know?!?!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Posteritatis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #44
47. Most ballistic missile tests
are into a target area offshore, usually considerably offshore. The launch is basically to see if the missile works, if it has the range and performance that's expected, if it shows up (or doesn't) on radar like it should (or shouldn't), etc. If that works out well, then there's some more finessed, specific target practice later - though for a nuclear-capable weapon all you need to know is if it landed within a couple miles of its target. Conventional stuff is usually short-ranged enough that it's simply tested within the firing country.

In practice, most ballistic missile test "areas" are a large box of open ocean a few hundred by a few thousand miles; they're aimed as close to the middle of nowhere as possible. Pakistan and India's missile tests are off into the southern Arabian Sea or Indian Ocean; the US tends to fire them into the northern Pacific; etc. Russia tends to fire them from one side of the country to the other, but that's mainly because they have an insane amount of surface area and can keep the test completely in their territory.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Carni Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #47
63. Thanks for the info
I guess I will cross an Alaskan cruise off of my list of vacation spots lol
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DemonFighterLives Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #44
64. It's the dense pack
this whole gang of thieves.
:nuke:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 11:49 AM
Response to Original message
22. Boy do *I* feel safe now! Woo hoo!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
formercia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
24. This may be what Moon wanted
Edited on Tue Jun-20-06 12:38 PM by formercia
His stated goal was to provoke a nuclear exchange between the US and North Korea. His ascendancy depends on it.


All hail Moon, King of the World.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bluestateguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 12:38 PM
Response to Original message
25. Good. Now which country should be destroyed first?
Edited on Tue Jun-20-06 12:40 PM by bluestateguy
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #25
45. we can now achieve our goal of WORLD domination...
Edited on Tue Jun-20-06 05:29 PM by QuestionAll
thru liberal...non-conservative use of our nuclear arsenal- without ANY fear of reprisal in kind from our enemies...:woohoo:

(um...do i really need to use the sarcasm "smilie" for anyone...?)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The_Casual_Observer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
26. Al the tests have failed, but it's "ready".
That spokesman should be put in jail for this.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mikelgb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 12:44 PM
Response to Original message
27. Emperor/Chimperor quotes!
"Now witness the firepower of this fully operational battle station."

http://www.mcsweeneys.net/links/lists/Bush-Palpatine.html

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
laconicsax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #27
32. Except
Except that the battle station could hit what it aimed at.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pokercat999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #27
65. My thought exactly except that the line is spoken by
Mel Brooks in a Nazis uniform with a huge gun. When he pulls the trigger a small ball rolls out the barrel and drops to the floor. This my friends is the Bushco war machine at work.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Celefin Donating Member (256 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
28. Just as ready as FEMA when Katrina hit, I presume.
Except this time the readiness could even amount to something
as an act of war, (or at least something that could be interpreted as such)
should the unlikely event of actually downing the NK missile occur.

Way to go!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Trajan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 01:08 PM
Response to Original message
29. I dont believe them ....
They are lying ....

The news around town is now, and always has been : Missile Defense is no better than hit or miss .... MOST the 'real' tests have went poorly, and other than knocking down SCUD type ground-to-ground missiles, there has been little success hitting midpoint targets, and virtually NO success knocking out re-entry vehicles/warheads .... This isnt classified information: this is what has been available in the media .... so unless they have established a new paradigm in this field (which has not been mentioned), then this can be no more than a foolish game being played by the neocon WH .....

I believe this is pure bluff ..... in a deadly poker game .....

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dave420 Donating Member (141 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #29
74. In Gulf War I
The Patriot system didn't work at all. All the reports of successful interceptions were bullshit propaganda.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
neverforget Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
30. The Maginot Line was operational too. The Germans just went around
Edited on Tue Jun-20-06 01:22 PM by neverforget
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
coffeenap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 01:34 PM
Response to Original message
31. Is it conceivable that the US could fake an NK launch, fake an
intercept, and thus begin the next "conflict", or "heroically" save the US from the new "enemy"? Is this the next way they hope to get the Repub. ratings up?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HuffleClaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #31
34. i doubt it
they could fake an 'intercept' but not a north korean launch.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Thor_MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 03:53 PM
Response to Original message
36. IF a Nodong missile on top of a SCUD can even get within range of
our unreliable missile defense system, the odds are that we couldn't hit it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Posteritatis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #36
46. If a Scud could hit CONUS from Korea, it'd deserve to (n/t)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RangerSmith Donating Member (488 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 03:57 PM
Response to Original message
37. Be careful, George
You'll shoot your eye out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Supersedeas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #37
42. his, ours, and so many more
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jim__ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
38. I hope that system's not on some type of automatic.
We'll wind up shooting down some unfortunate airliner.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 04:24 PM
Response to Original message
39. How conveneeeeninet. A multi-billion dollar "machine that goes
ping" just in the nick of time.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #39
88. oh great, now you reminded me
of the scene in Monty Python's "The meaning of Life." Remember the hospital scene where she's delivering the baby and the machines that go ping? Very, very expensive machines that go "ping" but we don't know what they do.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #88
93. That was the sourde of my quote.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ElboRuum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
40. Well, they certainly like ratcheting up the difficulty level, don't they?
As it was explained to me once, an anti-ballistic missile system can be analogized down to the following:

1) Throw a pencil off a 100 ft. building laterally.
2) You, on the ground, throw another pencil and hit the pencil in mid-flight before it hits the ground.

If you can do this, you just saved Alaska.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
killbotfactory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 06:23 PM
Response to Original message
49. Sure it is
Reuters reporting a washington times scoop.

Huh...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tocqueville Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 06:26 PM
Response to Original message
50. Shields Up, Mr Rummy ! activate phaser banks
the North Klingonians are coming !
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Up2Late Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 06:41 PM
Response to Original message
52. OMG! This is such a HUGE LIE!!! This is SO far off the mark, it's hard...
...to even describe.

Here's a link to the MDA (Missile Defense Agency), and News of their recent "Successfully Completed" tests:

<http://www.mda.mil/mdalink/html/mdalink.html>

The reported successes are so minor, it's not even funny.

I don't usually like to refer to anything UPI writes or posts, but this article does provide a good summery of the current situation. I've cross checked the fact presented, and though understated, they do check out.

Please see the GAO report Abstract below this report!!!

(Annotated links below this report)


<http://www.upi.com/SecurityTerrorism/view.php?StoryID=20060606-032551-3961r>

'Operational' missile defense undefined



WASHINGTON, June 6 (UPI) -- The Pentagon has still not determined the criteria the national missile defense system must meet before it can be declared "operational," a new (GAO) report states.(*L1) That declaration has been pending since 2004, when the first ground-based interceptor missiles were deployed in Alaska, following U.S. President George W. Bush's 2002 decision to deploy a system with limited operational ability.

But in January 2005 -- shortly after an interceptor missile had failed to lift off when cued to its target in a test -- Pentagon spokesman Larry Di Rita said the system may never be declared operational. It would just continue to be developed and added on to. (*L2)

"I don't think that the goal was ever that we would declare it was operational. I think the goal was that there would be an operational capability by the end of 2004," DiRita said.(*L3) The ground-based interceptors are meant to launch soon after a long-range enemy ballistic missile is fired at the United States, racing out to space to smash into and destroy the warhead while it is still outside the atmosphere.

Traditionally weapons programs proceed along a linear path, from the identification of a requirement...

...The ground-based missile defense system, however, is following a different track known as spiral development - the system is built in stages, tested as it goes, and then added on to, with no specific end-state defined.

(more at link above)



(More links below this GAO Abstract)

Defense Management: Actions Needed to Improve Operational Planning and Visibility of Costs for Ballistic Missile


Defense, GAO-06-473, May 31, 2006
Highlights-PDFPDFAccessible Text

The Department of Defense (DOD) has spent about $91 billion since the mid-1980s to develop a capability to destroy incoming ballistic missiles. In 2002, recognizing the new security environment after the September 11 attacks, President Bush directed that an initial set of defensive ballistic missile capabilities be put in place in 2004. Although DOD is developing the Ballistic Missile Defense System (BMDS) to meet an urgent need, preparing to operate and support a system under continuous development poses significant challenges. GAO was asked to assess the extent to which (1) DOD has made progress in planning to operate the BMDS, and (2) the Future Years Defense Program (FYDP) provides complete and transparent data on BMDS operational costs.

DOD has made progress in planning to operate BMDS; however, it has not established criteria that would have to be met before declaring BMDS operational, nor has DOD resolved security issues or completed training and personnel plans. DOD officials agree that operational criteria are typically established and met prior to declaring a system operational, and that planning for new systems includes identifying personnel requirements, developing training programs, and identifying logistics and maintenance requirements.

DOD has developed BMDS procedures and guidance, created an organization to integrate planning and operational support, and conducted some training and exercises. However, DOD has not established formal criteria for declaring that limited defensive operations or subsequent blocks of capability are operational or completed planning for security, training, and personnel. DOD has not done this because it is developing BMDS in a unique way and BMDS is exempted from traditional requirements guidance.

Without specific operational criteria, the Secretary of Defense will not be in a sound position to objectively assess combatant commands' and services' preparations to conduct BMDS operations nor have a transparent basis for declaring BMDS operational, which will become more important as capabilities are added in subsequent blocks and Congress considers requests to fund operations. Without adequate planning, clear criteria, and identification of responsibility for ensuring necessary actions have been completed, it may be difficult for DOD to identify and prioritize actions, assure itself or Congress that the necessary pieces are in place before declaring the system operational, and determine whether the return on its significant development investment in BMDS can be realized.

(more at link) <http://www.gao.gov/docsearch/abstract.php?rptno=GAO-06-473>


Full GAO report in pdf, make sure you check out the chart on page 24!
<http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d06473.pdf>

(L1)<http://www.gao.gov/docsearch/abstract.php?rptno=GAO-06-473>

(L2)<http://www.nti.org/d_newswire/issues/2005/1/14/6e8bc9d8-7dbb-4f78-9011-dd913c7c13cb.html>

(L3)<http://www.defenselink.mil/transcripts/2005/tr20050113-1982.html>

Good info here too: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Missile_Defense>
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
onecent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 07:00 PM
Response to Original message
54. How in the hell did we go from "weapons of Mass Destruction" to
possible confrontation with fuckin' North Korea.

I'm scared. I have some bad feelings about this week, and I hope I'm VERY VERY WRONG. I don't have good feelings about these 2 boys that were killed...I sense something is going to really explode here....
and messing with North Korea is insane. Every hour that I turn to check what the media is saying (yes, I'm hooked), I hear something else that has escalated to make us go..
"Oh, my God".....missing?
"Oh, my God.......Dead?
"Oh, my God,.....Abused?

I'm a senior....and I have NEVER in my life seen such turmoil...I guess I have even been hoping it was just my age (61 yrs young)...and that I was pessimistic because the generation gaps are kind of getting to me.!! to say the least.

I have so much hatred for * that I can barely get through a day without assaulting someone verbally about this shitty administration....

Ranting here.......sorry.....

Penny


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #54
90. remember when * said they create the reality
the reason why you haven't seen the likes of what's happening before, is they are doing the creating. We're just here for the ride as they get their delusional creation going. Because it's their reality, not ours.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
truthisfreedom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 07:07 PM
Response to Original message
55. hmh. so they solved that "tumbling random missile" thing? the problem
where they couldn't hit a crappy missle that was tumbling because it wasn't a predictable target? the kind of crappy missile we expect from North Korea, operating many decades in the past as far as technology goes?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 07:47 PM
Response to Original message
58. June 19: 4,000 gov workers will head to bunkers
Edited on Tue Jun-20-06 07:52 PM by chill_wind
June 19: 4,000 gov workers will say bye to families for bunker

katty (yesterday)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=103&topic_id=217014

BACK TO THE BUNKER

By William M. Arkin
Sunday, June 4, 2006; B01


On Monday, June 19, about 4,000 government workers representing more than 50 federal agencies from the State Department to the Commodity Futures Trading Commission will say goodbye to their families and set off for dozens of classified emergency facilities stretching from the Maryland and Virginia suburbs to the foothills of the Alleghenies. They will take to the bunkers in an "evacuation" that my sources describe as the largest "continuity of government" exercise ever conducted, a drill intended to prepare the U.S. government for an event even more catastrophic than the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.

The exercise is the latest manifestation of an obsession with government survival that has been a hallmark of the Bush administration since 9/11, a focus of enormous and often absurd time, money and effort that has come to echo the worst follies of the Cold War. The vast secret operation has updated the duck-and-cover scenarios of the 1950s with state-of-the-art technology -- alerts and updates delivered by pager and PDA, wireless priority service, video teleconferencing, remote backups -- to ensure that "essential" government functions continue undisrupted should a terrorist's nuclear bomb go off in downtown Washington.

more
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/06/02/AR2006060201410_pf.html


So, how's our "continuity of government" thing at the moment?
Did they reschedule this exercise? Give the President a pet goat book and and a guitar and leave him with Condi for the rest of the week and say seeya?

Just wondering....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Posteritatis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #58
66. I could go for some discontinuity of government right about now.. (n/t)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
formercia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 06:24 AM
Response to Reply #58
68. Able Archer '83
http://www.abc.net.au/rn/history/hindsight/features/torn/episode5.htm

What they don't tell you in this article is that Reagan ordered live tactical warheads moved to military units and they also planned a COG exercise similar to the one planned for the 19th of this Month. Obviously, nothing occurred, but this type of behavior can easily send a dangerous message.

The orders on the Soviet side were to launch a preemptive strike if the President went into the bunker. At the last minute, it was canceled when reports began coming back that Soviet bombers, loaded with nuclear weapons were preparing to take off for an attack on the West.

We came within minutes of a full scale nuclear exchange.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Joe Bacon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 08:07 PM
Response to Original message
60. So, how many of OUR missiles are gonna miss the target?
All I ever read about this system was that EVERY test FAILED!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 08:10 PM
Response to Original message
61. Are they talking about the one that doesn't work???
Is this one of those thingees Rummie didn't get around to reading?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
VegasWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-20-06 08:24 PM
Response to Original message
62. It's going to be really embarrassing when Bush's missle misses the
Korean missle by 500 miles.

:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kablooie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 11:15 AM
Response to Original message
76. The missle defense system probably WILL work.
It's not designed to destroy the other missle.
Just the country that the missle came from.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
alvarezadams Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
84. Considering its objectives...
...it is certainly operational.

These are, of course - government welfare for the military-industrial complex and a blank check for those who wish to impose some sort of political hegemony on the world.

Otherwise, anyone with any knowledge on the issue knows that the very concept of ABM is flawed, while anyone with any sense should know that the very idea of a "shield" is as viable as the Maginot Line.

Spend on the military! With our way of dealing with the rest of the world it is a necessity. If you make enemies you'd be best off if you invest in defense. Otherwise, those who push for military spending above and even beyond the Cold War levels (as we're doing today) tend to be those that are against social spending. PEOPLE don't deserve welfare, CORPORATIONS do.

What a fvcked up perspective the US right (including a good portion of the DNC) has.

------------

BTW, from a neutral perspective, what would you call country "A" (with nukes, ICBM's and the world's strongest and most expensive military) when it demands that country "B" or "C" (threatened by "A", called the "Axis of Evil", etc.) have neither ICBM's nor nukes?

You have three guesses and the first two don't count. Hint - it starts with an "H".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 12:45 PM
Response to Original message
89. Penis fencing...
We often think of animals hunting and fighting for food, but many flatworms appear to hunt and fight for mates. Each worm is hermaphroditic, containing both ovaries with eggs and testes with sperm. Some even have two penises and one or more genital pores for receiving a unique, two-tailed sperm delivered during copulation.

Using new camera technology, Marine Biologist Leslie Newman of Australia's Southern Cross University participated in filming the marine flatworm Pseudobiceros hancockanus engaging in some odd reproductive behavior -- referred to as penis fencing.

During penis fencing, each flatworm tries to pierce the skin of the other using one of its penises. The first to succeed becomes the de facto male, delivering its sperm into the other, the de facto female. For the flatworms, this contest is serious business. Mating is a fight because the worm that assumes the female role then must expend considerable energy caring for the developing eggs.


http://www.pbs.org/kcet/shapeoflife/episodes/hunt_explo2.html
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seasat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 01:47 PM
Response to Original message
91. Russia already has a way to defeat a "working" ABM system.
This didn't get a lot of play in the MSM but Putin announced months ago that they were devloping missiles that would change course mid-flight. Even if Star Wars II actually worked, it would be easy to defeat since it requires an early lock on the missle's course to be able to intercept it. Heck, all it would need to do is change course once and the current system (if it worked) would probably not be able to adjust. It chaps my ass that we have thrown so much money down the toilet that could have been better spent improving the lives of US citzens on a blatant gimmie to defense contractors for a system that could be so easily defeated. (LINK)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sakabatou Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 02:44 PM
Response to Original message
92. Sure it's operational
But so was the Death Star and look what happened to it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tight_rope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
94. GOD DAMN...Not this N. Korea shit again...I thought we were trying
to bomb IRAN...I can't fucking keep up with this mis-administration:spank:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ThoughtCriminal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-21-06 10:42 PM
Response to Original message
95. So maybe they figure that there is a good chance the NK
missile will fail in flight and they can claim it was an intercept.

I don't think there's really much chance of getting away with that, but if they could, it would make some GOP friendly defense contractors very happy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue May 14th 2024, 10:03 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Latest Breaking News Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC