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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 06:46 PM
Original message
Steep decline in oil production brings risk of war and unrest, says new study
Source: The Guardian

World oil production has already peaked and will fall by half as soon as 2030, according to a report which also warns that extreme shortages of fossil fuels will lead to wars and social breakdown.

The German-based Energy Watch Group will release its study in London today saying that global oil production peaked in 2006 - much earlier than most experts had expected. The report, which predicts that production will now fall by 7% a year, comes after oil prices set new records almost every day last week, on Friday hitting more than $90 (£44) a barrel.
...
The results are in contrast to projections from the International Energy Agency, which says there is little reason to worry about oil supplies at the moment.

However, the EWG study relies more on actual oil production data which, it says, are more reliable than estimates of reserves still in the ground. The group says official industry estimates put global reserves at about 1.255 gigabarrels - equivalent to 42 years' supply at current consumption rates. But it thinks the figure is only about two thirds of that.

Read more: http://www.guardian.co.uk/oil/story/0,,2196435,00.html
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Major Hogwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 07:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. But, but, but Bush said invading Iraq in 2003 would lower gas prices!!
But at $90 a barrel for oil, it looks like the oil sheiks of OPEC have given Bush the collective finger.
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BootinUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 07:35 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. There is another reason
for the recent price spike, it has to do with foreign speculation and the weak dollar.

oil supplies actually rose according to a recent news story on this.

So production will drop by 7% over the next year? I guess I'll believe it when I see it.
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lostnotforgotten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. www.theoildrum.com - All The Detailed Analysis You Will Ever Need
eom
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Major Hogwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 08:48 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Your oil fact kung fu is strong, weedhopper.
Not only do I not trust the news for relevant stories on oil, I don't count on the man who wears the star.

LoL
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CGowen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. good old inflation......n/t
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #10
19. I think it's more than that...
since the start of the war, many nations have been dumping the dollar in favor of either the euro or other currencies to trade oil.

Yeah inflation helps but inflation caused by the decreased use of the dollar as a petro currency is also a cause.

once upon a time the US was on the gold standard but then it was taken off of that and instead based it on oil.

And as a result, anytime there is either a fluctuation in the price of oil the worth of the dollar changes. Now that several nations are purging their dollars in favor of something else, the dollar loses value. so it's the reverse now, the dollar tanks and the fluctuation takes place in the price of oil.

if you recall, iraq changed over to the euro prior to the first gulf war. Iran has been trading up to 70% of their oil in something else other than the dollar for a few years now. See a pattern?

the dollar is a bad bet for several reasons, but mostly because our economy is tanking. but in this situation, one begets the other.

nations are buying less and less of our debt, not quite dumping our t-bonds, but that comes next.

unless moron* is kept from invading iran or bombing them back to the george jetson glowing stone age, we are in deep do do.
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Delphinus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 06:39 AM
Response to Reply #19
32. I think the reason for the first Gulf War
is different than this:
if you recall, iraq changed over to the euro prior to the first gulf war.

From what I've read, the Euro didn't start getting circulated until 2002, after being "born" in 1999.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #32
36. correction, you are right...
it wasn't the euro, it was there own currency. the started setting up their own oil bourse.

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FogerRox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 09:47 PM
Response to Reply #4
11. Hedge fund speculating
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yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 08:45 AM
Response to Reply #1
17. Oil & Gas Journal, oil execs said war to keep price HIGH and Bush promised Putin in DSM price would
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BornagainDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #1
24. OK, but it would have $200.00/barrel...
If Bush hadn't tried to smoke the terrists out! :sarcasm:
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JohnyCanuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 07:15 PM
Response to Original message
2. The Admiral's Warning

The Admiral's Warning

by Dadid M. Shribman

Fifty years ago, he saw today's energy crisis coming, but we didn't listen. Are we listening now?

This year marks the 50th anniversary of a number of important cultural markers -- the launch of Sputnik; the publication of "The Cat in the Hat," Dr. Seuss' landmark children's book; the introduction of the Edsel, a symbol of failure, soon after the Bel Air, which became an American icon; the school crisis in Little Rock, one of the biggest battles involving racial integration; and the release of the movie "Bridge on the River Kwai," which went on to win seven Academy Awards.

All that plus one other, hardly noted at the time, all but forgotten now: A half-century ago Rear Adm. Hyman G. Rickover, the father of the nuclear Navy, accepted an invitation to speak at the banquet of the Annual Scientific Assembly of the Minnesota State Medical Association in St. Paul. In that speech, before a gathering of physicians, Adm. Rickover raised the specter that easily accessible and economically reasonable supplies of fossil fuels would be in jeopardy ... just about now.

In those 1957 days of big-fin roadsters, drive-in restaurants and a lifestyle that increasingly revolved around the automobile, this was a remarkable, radical thought. By that time, for a quarter-century (with, of course, a wartime interruption) the motor car had been the standard by which world economies were measured. It was a means of conveyance, to be sure, but it was also the tool that made the suburbs inevitable, that made fumbling, back-seat premarital sex possible, that made transportation a style statement and an emblem of conspicuous consumption.

Hardly anyone remembers what Rickover said and, in truth, hardly anyone remarked on it. Not a soul took his advice, and hardly anyone took him seriously. But his speech makes for provocative reading today, with oil prices soaring and with experts and scholars seriously and legitimately wondering whether we might have reached an economic milestone, when world oil production has peaked, or soon might, and whether the same might soon be said about natural gas and coal.

SNIP

Rickover understood what was happening, and what is continuing to happen now, and he warned that we ought to take action before it was too late. Smart, responsible people now are talking about the implications of a new energy crisis that will make the last one seem tame. Energy scarcity, for example, could become a vital health issue; consider how much energy is required to operate hospitals, manufacture drugs and common medical devices, and run the sophisticated tools of health technology.

http://www.energybulletin.net/35992.html
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Strelnikov_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Broke the mold with Rickover
and Hubbert, among others.
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Baby Snooks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 07:19 PM
Response to Original message
3. The spinmeisters
Edited on Sun Oct-21-07 07:21 PM by Baby Snooks
There are any number of studies that give varying time ranges with regard to "peak" and "decline" and "depletion" but the only thing that gives a realistic projection of where we are headed and how quickly we are headed there is the announcement by PEMEX not long ago that the reserves in Mexico are being depleted with production from its major field now at 40% from a year ago. Some might say, who needs Mexico? We do. We import somewhere between 15 and 25% of our oil from Mexico.

If the planning and response policies of the Bush Administration with regard to what is happening in Georgia and California and the predicted water shortages within 90 days is any indication, you won't see any announcement that "we" are worried about possible oil depletion until gas stations start closing because there is no gas to sell.

We are running out of oil. Time for people to wake up. We are also running out of water. That is far more frightening than running out of oil. Running out of both is not exactly indicative of a bright future in a country that has refused to address either problem.

And Congress is playing the same game with this that it played with global warming. It has stuck its head in the sand as well. It's not just Bush. It's all of them.


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Delphinus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 06:44 AM
Response to Reply #3
33. Baby Snooks,
I agree with you on both points: water and oil. I'm sure it was yesterday, in LBN, there was a story from Mexico about their decline in oil production.

But it's not just Washington who've got their heads buried in the sands. How many people (not counting those here on this board) do you know who have a clue as to the situation we are facing? The M$M doesn't help, by not putting a major focus on these two things.
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Strelnikov_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 07:51 PM
Response to Original message
6. Energy Watch Group produced a report recently that concluded all that coal
the little kids on TV tell us we have is not really there.

Seems we used all the good stuff (high EROEI) first, and what we have left is lower quality (low EROEI). Not a problem, unless one is using coal as an energy source.

Go figure.

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Strelnikov_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 07:54 PM
Response to Original message
7. Linky for coal and oil reports cited in article
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FogerRox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 09:53 PM
Response to Original message
12. try may 2005
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DLnyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-21-07 10:41 PM
Response to Original message
13. Some countries may be hit harder than others
from the OP:

"The German policy, which guarantees above-market payments to producers of renewable power, is being adopted in many countries - but not Britain, where renewables generate about 4% of the country's electricity and 2% of its overall energy needs."

How about the US policies? Oh yeah, like we were prepared for Katrina, for the occupation of Iraq, for the dollar falling, for huge numbers of foreclosures, . . .

A 'policy' that consists of just controling the media and supressing dissent is great--for making believers feel good. Problem is later when reality creeps up behind you and shouts "BOO!"

There is a silver lining, though. A few well-connected companies won't have to worry about slightly lower profits . . . yet. The logic is just overwhelming.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 09:37 AM
Response to Reply #13
20. Pfft! just watch Africa if you want to see previews of things to come.
Kenya for example.
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DLnyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 08:31 PM
Response to Reply #20
31. Not quite sure what you mean
That kenya will be more affected? Less affected? More able to adopt alternative energy sources? Less?
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 11:40 AM
Response to Reply #31
35. If you look at Kenya you will see a nation on the edge of collapse.
due to the fact that the price of oil is sky rocketing.

It's a very good example of what the US will face in about 15 to 20 years.
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Pachamama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 12:38 AM
Response to Original message
14. These liars ru(i)nning our country knew back in 2000 that Peak Oil was here & nothing has been an
accident or coincidence as far as this administration is concerned when it comes to Oil and any policies that correspond. This includes ofcourse the illegal invasion and occupation of Iraq and now the plans they are making for Iran. They have reaped huge benefits and profits from the rising oil prices and they know what else is coming, so they are milking it for all its worth and by the time production is really down, then they will get even richer.... It's all been part of the plan... :eyes:
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Warren Stupidity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 06:58 AM
Response to Original message
15. How much did that study cost?
I would have been happy to provide this same information for a mere EU 500,000.
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Toots Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 07:37 AM
Response to Original message
16. Watch the price of oil soar
While I believe these type stories are put there solely to boost oil price per barrel I do believe the USA better get off it's collective ass and find a better way..The best way to do that is to dump the GOP (Grand Oil Party) and elect people that actually have some brains.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 09:38 AM
Response to Reply #16
21. Check out my post #19. nt
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yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
18. another benefit of Reagan Revolution: thumbs up our asses for 30 years on preparing for this
if we had actually started to shift away from oil, there would be less to possibly no shock as we ran out of oil, but then those last barrels of wouldn't be worth their weight in gold as they will be if we wait until the very last minute or later to restructure our energy supply.

It oil company profits are more important than the economic welfare and even the lives of the rest of the whole world.
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TalkingDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 11:37 AM
Response to Original message
22. What should I go with here: Sarcasm? Resignation? Anxiety? Vindicated Rage?
Shit, Forget it.

Think I'll just go eat some chocolate. While I can still get it....


My Favorite Master Artist: Karen Parker GhostWoman Studios
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Delphinus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
23. I just posted this in the Peak Oil forum ...
didn't think it would be here on LBN.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. Soon as I can afford to donate, I'll be back there.
Looks like all the things we've been predicting are coming to pass. And it doesn't make me happy! $90 a barrel oil, and this is before any action against Iran, which would guarantee triple digits now.

:hi:
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 03:52 PM
Response to Original message
26. NEWSFLASH: The Guardian 1st MSM publication to say Peak Oil HAPPENED.
The only question now is: where does civilization go from here?

One quibble with their math: if production falls 7% a year, wouldn't production fall by half as soon as 2015, not 2030? I'd like to read that report.
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fedsron2us Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 05:49 PM
Response to Original message
27. Not sure about all aspects of the EWG methodology.
I read their study on coal reserves but found some of their analysis a bit suspect. For example, they cited the UK as example of a country where recoverable reserves had been downgraded by 90% in the 1990s. However, their figures were based on the amount of coal left in working pits. In the period in question the UK coal industry had contracted sharply because the UK electrical generation industry had moved over to burning natural gas and also substituted UK coal with cheaper imports from China and elsewhere. Many of the mines that had been shut had in fact had viable reserves left in the ground but these were not counted in the study. If you just use production data as a measure there is a danger that fluctuations in output will be misinterpreted. For example, using their argument the slump in oil production that accompanied the early 1980s recession could also be seen as an indication that the peak in world oil production had passed. EWG is funded in part by the Ludwig-Bölkow-Foundation which has interests in the renewable energy field so they have a horse in this particular race (Ludwig Bulkow himself worked in the German defence industry).

BTW I am not dismissing the idea of Peak oil itself as I have read Deffeyes books on the subject and I found his arguments entirely convincing.
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rocktivity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 07:21 PM
Response to Original message
28. Candidate for this month's "You Call This NEWS?" Award
The "To Figure That Out, You Had To Do A Freaking STUDY???" division.

:headbang:
rocknation
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JohnyCanuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 07:36 PM
Response to Original message
29. Kunstler disses Houston and brings grim news from ASPO conference
From his latest blog entry:


Peak Universe

October 22, 2007

The big Peak Oil conference of the year took place in Houston last week – but before we get to the substance of that, a few words about where we were. It is hard to imagine a more horrifying urban construct than this anti-city in the malarial swamps just off the Gulf of Mexico. And it is hard to conceive of a more desolate and depressing urban district, even of such an anti-city, than the utter wasteland around Houston’s convention center.

SNIP

So, while the price of oil ratcheted up hour by hour, the ASPO conference members heard from an impressive range of experts who have been leading the public conversation on the Peak Oil story – with no help from the mainstream media or the political sector. Among them were Robert Hirsch, co-author of the now-famous 2005 Hirsch Report, commissioned by the US Department of Energy, which, much to the consternation of its sponsor, first told the nation in no uncertain terms that it was heading for a catastrophic set of disruptions in “normal” American life if we heedlessly continued energy business-as-usual. Hirsch went a little further now, two years on, than he had in his famous report, predicting a future of “oil export withholding,” panicked markets, and allocation disturbances that would make the 1973 OPEC embargo look like a golden age.

Matt Simmons, the leading investment banker to the oil industry, who has worked tirelessly to lift public awareness of Peak Oil, also raised the specter of shortages, telling the audience that market allocation problems in the near future would almost certainly induce “hoarding behavior” among the public that would cripple the economy, lead to enforced rationing, and shock the nation. Simmons compared the current public mood over energy issues to a “fog of war.” He also repeated his oft-stated opinion that the drilling rigs and other equipment used around the world to pump oil out of the ground are so uniformly old and decrepit that they pose a problem every bit as dire as peak oil itself. In the meantime, he said, to offset climbing prices, the developed nations have lately dipped so deeply into their accumulated stocks of crude and “refined product” that some countries may breach what is called their “minimum operating levels.” Offstage, he told me, “We’re too preoccupied trying to figure out the exact date of the peak. Meanwhile, we’ll drain the gasoline pool and it will be gone forever.”

The other most significant contribution came from Texas geologist Jeffrey Brown who presented a full-blown version of his theory that world export rates from the countries with oil to sell are liable to decline so much more sharply than their actual production decline rates that the world would be thrust into an oil export crisis within the next five years – and that this export crisis would turn out to be the defining condition of the Peak Oil story.

http://jameshowardkunstler.typepad.com/clusterfuck_nation/2007/10/peak-universe.html
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Strelnikov_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-22-07 07:55 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Reading this weeks blog post I got the distinct impression that Kunstler
was not very impressed with Houston.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #29
37. Here's another grim entry from Houston
Report from ASPO: Dark clouds, no silver linings

It is difficult to walk out of the peak oil meeting here in Houston and not feel miserable.

Yes, there are some attendees who might be considered a bit offbeat, ex-hippie types who see their long-held dreams of "the end of oil" nearing reality.

But the majority of the 500+ attendees at the US meeting of the Association for the Study of Peak Oil are not in that category. They are geologists, economists, professors, consultants, economists. And no matter who steps up to the podium to make a presentation, the forecast is grim.

The details differ, but the broad message is consistent. Saudi oil production has peaked, according to some; others see a peak in the future, but a peak nonetheless. Jeffrey Brown, an independent geologist, was particularly bleak on Thursday, showing how exports from the world's biggest exporters, including Saudi Arabia and Russia, are going to run up against a combination of increasing domestic demand at home and declining or flat production, and shipments to other countries are going to fall, if they haven't already.

more...

http://www.platts.com/weblog/oilblog/2007/10/report_from_aspo_dark_clouds_n.html
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Delphinus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 06:19 AM
Response to Reply #37
42. Thanks to you and Johnny Canuk
for posting this. When I learned it was going on in Houston, I asked on the PO forum if anyone was going. I wanted to be there, but it was not in the plans.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-25-07 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #42
50. Sure! Energy Bulletin's keeping great tabs on this.
I wonder if GliderGuider went. If so, I hope he posts on his experience.

The peak oil crisis: A message from Houston

by Tom Whipple

We gathered at a hotel near the Convention Center, some 525 of us from 18 countries and 36 states attending the Association for the Study of Peak Oil-USA’s 3rd annual conference. The PowerPoints flashed by at mind-blowing speed as speaker after distinguished speaker shared the latest thoughts and insights into the peaking of world oil production.

For those of us acquainted with the field, there was nothing startling. World oil production has either peaked already or is certain to do so within the next few years if the world’s petroleum industry manages to eek out a little more production. But the good times are clearly over.

Peak production of conventional oil came 30 months ago and although new production projects will come on stream in the next few years, they will have a hard time balancing the depletion from existing fields which various speakers placed at 4-5 percent a year and probably increasing. As a greater share of world production shifts to undersea production, which is expensive and is usually water flooded to get the oil out as quickly as possible, some believe the annual world depletion rate could increase to six percent or more.

The most ominous development for countries such as the U.S., which must import most of its oil, is the emerging concept of “peak exports” which was discussed by several speakers. Peak exports simply means that oil-producing countries are using more and more oil at home – leaving less to sell abroad. Moreover, sentiment is starting to develop in many nations that they must save some oil for future generations, not just sell it to the foreign devils as quickly as possible.

more...

http://www.energybulletin.net/36194.html
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4dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #37
43. I wonder why a 50% drop in exports
doesn't get more attention from du'er or American's in general??

I wonder make believe world most people are living in today..
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #43
45. I've tried to bring GliderGuider's research to a wider audience in GD.
I did have some success, this thread got 63 votes to the greatest page:

We need to wake up to what's going on in Mexico NOW.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1334856


I think a greater percentage of DUers are aware of Peak Oil than Americans in general. But still the general attitude seems to be that this is something that will happen in "the future". People need to understand that where Peak Oil is concerned, the future is NOW.
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Strelnikov_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #45
46. Also, as Kunstler notes, the 'Jiminy Cricket Syndrome' is at play
We suffer from a kind of Jiminy Cricket syndrome in this country. We believe that if you wish for something, it will come true. Right now a lot of people - including people who ought to know better - are wishing for some miracle technology to save our collective ass.
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. As Carlin said on KO last night, we're blinded by our love of toys.
Just paraphrasing, but the public isn't raising their voice loud enough because they're still waiting to buy a cell phone that makes pancakes.
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Doctor Cynic Donating Member (965 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 09:39 AM
Response to Original message
34. Hey, at least
this could be what saves us all from global warming. :P
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Strelnikov_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #34
38. Welcome. And, unfortunately, it will not.
Without an enlightened leadership and populace, industrial society will turn to alternatives such as GTL (gas to liquids), CTL (coal to liquids), tar sands/heavy oil, and (will try) oil shale in order to keep the easy motoring life going.

All of these alternatives (with the exception of GTL) will increase the emission of global warming gases 2X or more over conventional oil for each gallon of liquid fuel end product consumed (along with the bonus myriad of other environmental impacts).

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NickB79 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
39. Has anyone here thought of planning for a future Great Depression?
As I see a long, grinding downward spiral of recession setting in, especially in the US, if oil production truly does decline at a substantial rate.

What are some things that people here are doing to plan ahead to cushion themselves from this potential disaster?
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-23-07 06:05 PM
Response to Original message
40. Could someone please listen to this?
I'm at work and don't have speakers. Could someone summarize what he's saying? Chris Skrebowski is one of the voices I respect most when it comes to the study of Peak Oil.

Chris Skrebowski on alarming new peak oil report
http://globalpublicmedia.com/chris_skrebowski_on_alarming_new_peak_oil_report

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4dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:26 AM
Response to Reply #40
41. Most du'er still in denial about peak oil!!
I'm am totally convinced that most people here are still in denial about peak oil and will continue to bury their collect heads in the sands until the crisis is upon us..

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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #41
44. I believe this is the biggest crisis facing civilization.
Most people, for whatever reason, are not connecting the dots to see the big picture. Look at all the other political stories out there today; Will the US bomb Iran, Will the US bomb the Kurds, etc. Peak Oil is the motive fueling everything.

I wasn't too sure about the EWG. But there's a thread at peakoil.com discussing this:

http://www.peakoil.com/fortopic33066-45.html

Here's a couple things that made me realize how important this report is:

Carlhole wrote:

But I wonder why it is that ASPO has done all their research, put on all their conferences and developed an internet presence, etc. And all EWG has to do is plagiarize them a little and they get all this attention??


Actually they are the same persons:

ASPO Deutschland e.V. Board

1st chairman:
Prof. Dr. Wolfgang Blendinger,
geologist, 38678 Clausthal-Zellerfeld
2st chairman:
Dr. Werner Zittel,
physicist, 85540 Haar

3rd chairman:
Dr. Martin Held,
economist, 82327 Tutzing
treasurer:
Joerg Schindler,
economist, 85579 Neubiberg


Authors of the Energy Watch Group:

Dr. Werner Zittel
Ludwig Boekow Systemtechnik GmbH, Ottobrunn near Munich
Joerg Schindler
Managing Director Ludwig-Boelkow-Systemtechnik GmbH

Stefan Peter
Institute for Sustainable Solution and Innovations



In answer to my question about Skrebowski, (I post there under the name lexicon) I got this response:

lexicon wrote:
Does he agree with the EWG's findings? My understanding is that Skrebowski believes Peak will come in 2010, but Energy Watch Group says we peaked in 2006.


Skrebowski gave the EWG report his complete blessing.



If all of the candidates running for President in 2008 refuse to address this issue, I believe you can officially write the political obituary for this country.
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Altean Wanderer Donating Member (202 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 06:17 PM
Response to Reply #44
52. Well said! n/t
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-29-07 01:25 PM
Response to Reply #52
53. Thanks! n/t
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Ilsa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:36 PM
Response to Original message
48. Well, I'll probably be gone by then, so what do I care? (sarcasm)
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-24-07 05:41 PM
Response to Original message
49. CNN reported this too.
Report: 'World at peak oil output'

LONDON, England (CNN) -- The world has reached the point of maximum oil output and production levels will halve by 2030 -- a situation that will eventually lead to war and disaster, a report claims.

The German-based Energy Watch Group released a report Tuesday saying the world's oil production peaked in 2006 and from now on will drop by around 3 percent a year. It says that by as early as 2030, the global availability of oil will be half of what it was at its peak.

"It's a very serious result," said Hans-Josef Fell, a German lawmaker from the environmentalist Green Party who commissioned the report. "I fear the world will come into a big economic crisis in the coming years."

The report warns that coal, uranium, and other key fossil fuels are also in declining supply. It predicts the fall in fossil fuel production will bring with it the threat of war, humanitarian disaster, and general social unrest.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/BUSINESS/10/24/oil.decline/index.html

Not as in depth as the Guardian link, and even has this ridiculous, cornucopian, head-explodingly myopic comment from someone who thinks the report is scaremongering:

"Oil could be left in the ground and we could move on to another fuel in the future, not because we're running out of oil but because, economically speaking, it is not worth extracting the oil," Drollas said.

:wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf:
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-29-07 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #49
54. That's double talk for whistling past the grave yard. nt
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-27-07 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
51. Weekend kick
:kick:
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