Demonizing Fat in the War on Weight

Almost every day, it seems, there is another alarming study about the dangers of being fat or a new theory about its causes and cures. Just this week, VH1 announced a new reality show called "Flab to Fab," in which overweight women get a personal staff to whip them into shape.

But a growing group of historians and cultural critics who study fat say this obsession is based less on science than on morality. Insidious attitudes about politics, sex, race or class are at the heart of the frenzy over obesity, these scholars say, a frenzy they see as comparable to the Salem witch trials, McCarthyism and even the eugenics movement.

"We are in a moral panic about obesity," said Sander L. Gilman, distinguished professor of liberal arts, sciences and medicine at the University of Illinois in Chicago and the author of "Fat Boys: A Slim Book," published last month by the University of Nebraska Press. "People are saying, `Fat is the doom of Western civilization.' "

Now, says Peter Stearns, a leading historian in the field, the rising concern with obesity "is triggering a new burst of scholarship." These researchers don't condone morbid obesity, but they do focus on the ways the definition of obesity and its meaning have shifted, often arbitrarily, throughout history.

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/05/01/arts/01FAT.html

anyone who tells you differently is living in denial...

Ask any Conservative. They'll proceed to talk at great length about anal sex.

Many obese people are in excellent health. These people are currently the subject of many medical studies. It also turns out that most of them exercise and eat good (and not excessive) diets.

If you have to protest about how bad obesity is -- as in, "I'm sorry, but ..." -- then chances are good you're not concerned about the health risks of obesity, but the immorality of the obese.

--bkl

Then why do we have startingly high incidences of heart disease, strokes, diabetes and other diseases in this country? You show me two people, one overweight and one not, and ninety-nine times out of 100 it's going to be the overweight person wheezing after climbing a flight of stairs. I don't think it's fair to demonize the overweight, but to say that many obese people are in "excellent" health is an attempt to whitewash the truth. Being obese is a strain on cardiovascular health.

It's more like 60 out of 100.

The incidence of heart disease, stroke, diabetes et al is associated with obesity -- obesity does not cause them. The incidence of cardiovascular disease can not be accounted for by weight alone.

The factor behind obesity and ill health is well-known. The individual's ability to metabolize sugar and carbohydrate first becomes abnormal (actually, many scientists suspect that some form of long-term stress starts the cycle). THEN obesity may develop. And if an obese person begins an exercise program, their health will improve, often dramatically.

There is no reason why fat alone poses a health risk; it is the factors that underlie obesity that cause the other problems. The association between obesity and illness is just that, an association. Becoming fat goes along with becoming dyspneic (the wheezing after climbing a flight of stairs) or developing heart disease. In the same way, heart disease does not cause wheezing.

Sure, losing weight will improve the health of people who are obese -- but it's not a guarantee. And for many people, obese or not, the stress of weight loss itself causes more damage. Even decreasing cholesterol can be counterproductive. A cholesterol level of 140 ng/dL is far more dangerous than a cholesterol level of 240 ng/dL. But the idea that the body is a dynamic system is not simple enough for the popular press to report on.

Obese people may also be less inclined to exercise, because it is usually more stressful than exercise for the non-obese, but the mortality (from heart disease) of the obese who exercise is about the same as it is for the non-obese. Take all the factors into account, and fat is the least deadly. Once again, chronic, unescapable stress is the central, causal reason for most of the diseases of civilization. And the "cause" of obesity is increasing being shown to be food metabolism disorders, all of which can also be induced in lab models (like mice) by uncontrollable stress.

As for your idea that this is a "whitewash", you are ignoring close to 70 years of scientific study. And the idea that fat is a moral issue -- to be "cured" with greater moral rigor -- isn't even scientific.

--bkl

...I don't buy that the problem with obesity is people not being able to metabolize fats. People in Europe, who provide most of the genetic stock from whence we came, don't have nearly the same problems with obesity that we do. They move around more, don't eat as much and don't eat as many high-calorie foods. I don't think it's an accident that said nations have a lower per capita incidence of cardiovascular-related diseases.

I also can't seriously believe you're telling me that 40% of obese people would be in better shape than someone not overweight. I know you're trying to be sympathetic to the obese, but I'm not going to stop calling a spade a spade to spare someone's feelings. If I see someone in public straining with a simple physical task, such as climbing stairs, running to catch a bus or even tying their shoes, that person is far more likely to be overweight than be average.

You're right in saying fat alone isn't a health risk..at least, a reasonable amount of it. The problem lies in having too much of it. When one packs on fat weight, one adds to the amount of tissue through which the heart has to force blood. Increased pressure is put on joints. Overall mobility and ease of movement is deceased. Being fat is a health risk and people who say otherwise are doing the obese a disservice.

It IS also pretty damn well a guarantee that losing weight will improve the health of the obese. There is simply no substitute for being a proper body weight when one has significant amounts of fat. I'm not sure what "scientific research" you're mentioning, but all the research I've seen suggests that being obese has long-term effects on your mortality.

do not eat meat with all the hormones that we do and they do not have the processed foods with corn syrup and corn starch as fillers. They are eating as they have for centuries instead of listening to every fad that comes down the pike. As for long term health, one study watched people who were nearly one hundred years old and they had a high fat diet, exactly what we have been told to avoid.

..and being overweight are two different things. The French, for example, have a fatty cuisine, but they don't have nearly the same problem with being overweight as Americans. Americans simply eat too damn much.

It's more like 60 out of 100.

The incidence of heart disease, stroke, diabetes et al is associated with obesity -- obesity does not cause them. The incidence of cardiovascular disease can not be accounted for by weight alone.

The factor behind obesity and ill health is well-known. The individual's ability to metabolize sugar and carbohydrate first becomes abnormal (actually, many scientists suspect that some form of long-term stress starts the cycle). THEN obesity may develop. And if an obese person begins an exercise program, their health will improve, often dramatically.

There is no reason why fat alone poses a health risk; it is the factors that underlie obesity that cause the other problems. The association between obesity and illness is just that, an association. Becoming fat goes along with becoming dyspneic (the wheezing after climbing a flight of stairs) or developing heart disease. In the same way, heart disease does not cause wheezing.

Sure, losing weight will improve the health of people who are obese -- but it's not a guarantee. And for many people, obese or not, the stress of weight loss itself causes more damage. Even decreasing cholesterol can be counterproductive. A cholesterol level of 140 ng/dL is far more dangerous than a cholesterol level of 240 ng/dL. But the idea that the body is a dynamic system is not simple enough for the popular press to report on.

Obese people may also be less inclined to exercise, because it is usually more stressful than exercise for the non-obese, but the mortality (from heart disease) of the obese who exercise is about the same as it is for the non-obese. Take all the factors into account, and fat is the least deadly. Once again, chronic, unescapable stress is the central, causal reason for most of the diseases of civilization. And the "cause" of obesity is increasing being shown to be food metabolism disorders, all of which can also be induced in lab models (like mice) by uncontrollable stress.

As for your idea that this is a "whitewash", you are ignoring close to 70 years of scientific study. And the idea that fat is a moral issue -- to be "cured" with greater moral rigor -- isn't even scientific.

--bkl

test (my bro died of a heart attack at 47 and *I* requested stress test). When I was doing the treadmill portion the technician had to stop the test because I was not getting winded, even at three miles per hour.

I passed as I do all of the other markers. I walk faster than most thin people I know (except for a couple of very tall and fast guys I know). I am not a runner but I can sprint for a short distance as well.

My great grandma was from Eastern Europe and was round
My grandma was round
My mom is round

I am round

To them fat people are just television stereotypes. 'Donut eaters' and 'walking heart attacks'.

The elitist thin hold a moralistic belief that all human beings are born thin, and that they later corrupt themselves through the sins of gluttony and sloth.

The argument is cloaked in a lot of self cushioning so they don’t have to feel they are being prejudicial, but its no different from the fundie argument that all persons are born straight and later become gay through sexual deviance and moral weakness.

Its a wonderful prejudice for them because it not only objectifies and belittles someone else, it at the same times re-enforces their own beliefs that they are more pure and more without corruption of spirit than the objectified.

Obesity is the biggest medical fraud ever perpetrated on any group of people. Its also the most profitable ever imagined, which is primarily what keeps it going.

Billions upon billions of dollars are spent every year on 'weight loss' products that do nothing. Not one has ever permanently turned a fat person into a thin person. Not one has ever worked.

The truth about obesity is ugly. If you take a fat person and perform bariatric mutilation on them, that is, removing most (or all as used to be done) or their digestive systems, they lose weight, then gain it back, then starve to death. Fat.

Bariatric mutilation, in all the forms it has ever been practiced in, stomach removal, stapling, banding, re-arrangement, is not effective. Permanent lifelong starvation is not effective. Weight begins to return after a number of years. Co-morbid conditions caused by constant starvation and malnutrition actually begin to increase over previous levels.

It is the ultimate undeniable proof that fat people are not fat from eating, yet it is still ignored. It is still ignored that in almost 100 years of performing these mutilations, they have never worked, except in the most temporary sense. They in fact lead to worse health for all and finally to deaths many of those who undertake it.

But none of those facts makes the media and the shame sellers rich. None of those facts make the thin elite feel better for being 'inherently better' than 'fatty donut eater'.

But I found the last sentence in post #8 to be insightful and probably applicable beyond obesity / health issues.

obesity as metaphor?

hahahahahahahahahahaha
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=denial&r=67
de·ni·al ( P ) Pronunciation Key (d-nl)
n.
A refusal to comply with or satisfy a request.

A refusal to grant the truth of a statement or allegation; a contradiction.
Law. The opposing by a defendant of an allegation of the plaintiff.

A refusal to accept or believe something, such as a doctrine or belief.
Psychology. An unconscious defense mechanism characterized by refusal to acknowledge painful realities, thoughts, or feelings.
The act of disowning or disavowing; repudiation.
Abstinence; self-denial.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=denial&r=67

Who don't have the money for all the drugs and gyms that the rich have access to, or the time.

http://www.wgoeshome.com

be heavy due to diet. Cheap food is loaded with carbs and fats, ala peanut butter, mac and cheese etc.

wedge issue..Tommy Thompson was really heavy when Governor of Wisconsin.

a "professor of liberal arts, sciences and medicine" rather than a real medical doctor.

A doctor in this case only looks at the details of what's before him. Those with more general knowledge look at the whole picture. As we rapidly move towards specialization, their voices are becoming buried.

At least look at the patterns they point out and appreciate they might be onto something.

Fat is used as a marketing tool by the diet industry. If you want to be successful in marketing your product, it helps if you have a war. In order to have a war, you must have an enemy.

but I think the most detrimental effect of being fat is the stigma put on those who are overweight, the guilt and shame they feel, humiliation, alienation, fear, being an outcast, pressure to become more acceptable looking. There are many things in this social order that are bad to ones health. However, if one is fat, well, that is unforgivable. What has a fat person done to you recently that hurt you? Did they steal from you to bankrole their habit? Really, what? Most generally they are very timid and will let you go ahead of them in line. And if they die at a young age, how much does it cost you? In all you pay in taxes, how much of it is directly related to someone being fat?

Some people in this world are stupid, like little georgie bush.
Some people are greedy, like little georgie bush.
Some people are drug addicts, like little georgie bush.
Some people are ignorant, like little georgie bush.
Some people are fat.
Who would you rather hug? little george bush or a fat person who needs a hug, who is kind, gentle, loving, caring.

Being fat is not the worst thing in the world, nor is it the most unhealthy thing in the world. Unfortunately, some people just find it the most obnoxious. What a waste.

"Being fat is not the worst thing in the world, nor is it the most unhealthy thing in the world. Unfortunately, some people just find it the most obnoxious. What a waste."

I couldn't have said it better myself.

:puke:

Being fat is unhealthy and dangerous. PERIOD.

Being overweight causes more health problems than SMOKING for chirsts sake!!!

Please, people - I don't disrespect people who are overweight. Many of the greatest people in history have been overweight. It isn't about that.

It's about it being unhealthy.

No, you don't have to be pure lean muscle mass to be healthy, but we all know what fat is and fat is NOT healthy no matter how you try to spin it.

Trying to preach 'acceptance' is dangerous in the sense that it implies that people should just 'accept' themselves not trying to improve their health.

There are lots of people out there who are 250 lbs. and above and very healthy. I'm 225 lbs. myself, and I work on the staff of a college football team. All the linemen on our team weigh at LEAST 260 lbs., and they can all run the 40 in under 5.5 seconds, and bench at least 250 lbs. In other words, these guys who are at LEAST 60-70 lbs. overweight are healthier than myself, who's about 35 lbs. overweight. And I can only bench about 200 lbs. and run the 40 in 6.5 seconds.

And with these guys, it's mostly fat on them, not muscle.

the fact of life is you have an ideal weight, and because of the realities of modern eating that weight is most probably less than you weigh now. This ideal weight is not the same as the fatless moviestar image, but if you're a normal person living here and now you should be watching your weight.

I thought this article was bunk. The authors just used a lot of historical "shifting sands" arguments, begging questions of different historical conditions - whether, for instance, poorer eating habits long ago were balanced by higher activity levels, or whether the fact that when people really risked periodic starvation they idolized plump royalty has anything at all to do with a society with 50-cent fat-filled hamburgers availible on every corner with fries.

I could list as long as my arm things that people used to think were OK, so what?

The issues of people's reactions to a person's size are a side issue. People will turn any self-improvement into a personal morality issue, and they can't help seeing others in the same light. People are silly about things like that. But ignoring the scolds in the world, being aware of the dangers and ease of overeating can only help you.

The truth is your tastebuds will not make healthy choices, they were designed for another place and time entirely.

..of what people consider "obese." I too have worked with college linemen and know what they go through. True, much of their bulk is fat, but they have a good bit of muscle on them, too. They also go through cardiovascular workouts, stretching and other forms of conditioning to both help their heart and strengthen their skeletons to hold their girth. The average obese person, however, leads a sedentary lifestyle and suffers ill effects from carrying around the extra pounds.

Do the linemen work desk jobs, where the most exercise they get is walking to and from the parking lot? Maybe chase a lawnmower around before spending an evening eating "Takehome" while watching Tee-Vee?

No, I think not, not at MY school, anyway...

I met former NFL player Barry Krause once. We were both 6'4" and 250# at the time. Did I look ANYTHING like Barry, who spent his days at the training facility instead of a TV master control console?

Don't make me laugh....

hope you visit the doctor regularly so he can catch the diabetes you're gonna get before it does some damage...

Mine did.

Fat and health are NOT absolutely causally linked. The major "hidden variable" is physical activity. Fat people who are active and who do not indulge in self-destructive behavior (like excessive drinking, smoking, etc) are often quite healthy. When fat is associated with poor health, it is almost always accompanied by autoimmune disease, blood sugar regulation disorders, or smoking-related respiratory damage.

Obesity is probably a second-order effect of a sedentary lifestyle with high stress that can only be escaped by inactivity -- "freezing", not fight-or-flight. Cortisol, which is produced by the body in great excess during stress, is well-known to induce intense weight gain.

As for your disdain of self-acceptance, it's a sham, just like the conservatives' hatred of "self-esteem". Self-acceptance is impaired by believing that obesity is immorality -- the obese person who accepts themself is in a much better position to improve their health, and even lose the weight, than someone who has replaced self-acceptance with self-loathing.

Long-term underweight is far harder on health than obesity, but it receives scant attention from people who are as concerned for the health of the immoral. I wonder why that is.

Get educated. Don't deceive yourself thinking that human adipose tissue is imbued with the evil mojo. Fat is only incidentally a health problem. The real health problem is environmental stress and the disordered coping systems that are used to deal with it.

--bkl

Common sense says there is a link between stress and weight gain. It's certainly always been the biggest destructive factor in my weight battle. Yet I've never read a single damn thing about it until now.

Is Cortisol the hidden mechanism? Good god, if they can identify it, you'd think it would be easy to minimize it through treatment!

Coritsol is the marker for severe stress. It spikes in the case of depression, and it can be measured. But the weight gain usually happens after several years of stress.

Growing up in America subjects most people to high stress. One's survival is guaranteed, but there are so many intangible, uncontrollable stressors that children's metabolisms often do not survive intact.

These "stressors" range from long periods of enforced inactivity (TV, classroom instruction), fear of punishment, emotional bullying, large amounts of sugar in the diet, the poorly-studied effects of many food additives, scheduled feeding of babies, restriction of beneficial dietary fat, "peer pressure", bullying stresses, regimentation in other aspects of life (bedtimes, school weeks, pressure to participate in after-school activities), lack of sleep, etc. There are factors during childbirth and infancy that are less well-studied but that also seem to play a part, like whether the baby suffers anoxia during birth (most babies are born anoxic). Everyone has a somewhat different mix. For some people, Pop drinks heavily and comes home and whips the kids; for others, there is the pressure to develop that "competetive edge" in third grade. It varies a lot, but it's all destructive stress.

There's a classic study on obesity that involves mice. When mice have their tails pinched at random intervals, which produces a pain that is uncontrollable and unpredictable, the mice will gain weight rapidly, even with no change in their feed. And if they are allowed to eat as they wish, they gorge themselves and develop murine ("mousely") obesity. But even in those mice that never become obese, there is significant damage to the organs.

As an adult, the damage has been done, but reducing stress can, and does, help with weight loss. Minimizing stress -- and Cortisol release -- isn't all that effective in adulthood, though it is desirable.

This is why there are no easy solutions to obesity. Obesity is a response to a history of body changes caused by stress. It is far more effective to improve one's health by exercising and quitting smoking. And obesity will be difficult to control until such time as several of the loci of damage can be repaired or controlled -- sugar metabolism, cortisol release, "lipid bilayer" (cellular fat regulation) composition, and the emotional and mental factors that modern "skeptics" insist don't exist.

Weight-loss drugs can help a little, but only if you're already on some kind of weight-loss program, and if your physician is keeping an eye on any "collateral damage" that might be occuring. Redux (d-fenfluramine) was very effective, but it also has a bad tendancy to cause pulmonary hypertension. Ephedrine is also very effective when it's combined with caffeine or theophylline, but it's very inexpensive, so its risks have been over-represented.

Your best best? Exercise, stress-reduction exercises, and a well-planned calorie and carbohydrate restricting diet. Plus paying close attention to what makes you feel healthier and what makes you feel lousy.

Beyond that "advice," there is nothing.

Oh, wait, yes there is -- ignore the obesity moralists. They may not be full of fat, but they are full of shit, full of nonsense, and usually, full of themselves.

--bkl

"Your best best? Exercise, stress-reduction exercises, and a well-planned calorie and carbohydrate restricting diet. Plus paying close attention to what makes you feel healthier and what makes you feel lousy."

Stress-reduction exercises? You mean Yoga and Chanting and that stuff?

Oh, BTW, I should have said a LOT earlier that I fully agree that people who think my obesity is a sign of "moral weekness" have their heads up their asses. It ain't just failing to "do the push-aways at the dinner table", baby!

I can't change my life. Work is still the same, and if you think my personal life is stressing me now, just check it out after I shake it up and start drinking and smoking again.

Life in Bush Murka sucks, anyway you look at it.

so I work on what I eat and how much I move. THOSE I do have control over.

Now...If you want to lecture me on my "self-loathing", because I'm obese, and instead of accepting that all the way to the tag-along Oxygen bottle and Rascal scooter, I'm inclined to lose 80 pounds and maybe get off the high blood pressure and Diabetes medicine, bring it on. A crappy lifestyle and diet got me into this condition. Lifestyle changes can get me out of it.

See, I'm Obese. I already have the health problems younger large people don't have YET. So when I cringe when I see somebody post "I'm fat, and my health is GREAT!" it's not asthetics, it's health. I still think I can change that. THEN we throw in the paradox of how I know fat is unhealthy, but I think large women are SO sexy...Confusing...

I was a healthy fat man once, but now I'm sick.

She has exhausted heart surgeries. She has major blockages that cannot be repaired. I have never seen her a day in her life over a size eight, most of her life less. Honestly she has always watched her weight and diet. So how did the HD get started? Undiagnosed genetic HPB (long term) deformed arteries , make them so narrow that blockages occurred. Damage was done, surgeries done.

People that lead healthy lives die thin too, that is no spin. PERIOD.

Alittle over two years ago my Endocrinologist said to me " Don't worry about the weight, it won't kill you nearly as quick as those cigarettes you've been smoking."

I have CHF (deformities that have caused damage), T.1 Diabetes,
Mix Conn.Tissue Disease, RA,Thyroid, Etc.,. I have gained almost 50 lbs in the last 4 years because of my health. I have days I can barely function, and days that I have some mobility. I smoked for Years. Smoke free for two years now, but the damage is still done.

I go every month for treatments to somebody. EVERY doctor I have had will tell you the my being OBESE IS THE LAST one of my concerns.


SOME of us where thin, and still sick, Like me.. My health declined my weight went up. Believe me before I knew I had so many issues I spent a small fortune trying to "improve my health" so I could improve my looks. I was always thin before I got sick. But that really doesn't matter in the scheme of things now. People don't care what you looked like before or why you are fat now. They just discriminate. Would you discriminate or say something insensitive to somebody because they had a sexually transmitted disease, or lung cancer because they smoked, or melanoma(skin cancer) because they sun bathed. Of course not, but it is the same thing.. People make you feel like, the fat person must be a real pig to be that fat, what did they expect was gonna happen?

Weight gain is for many reasons. It would hurt no less if I created this or if I had no control. So should we not "accept" ourselves the way we are? Really if we don't except ourselves, nobody else is going to. My doctors say my HDL, LDL and Trig look good. Do you have a better take on this then my endo, cardio, nuero and rhuemy?

Look, their are tons of medical literature out there that will tell you genetically, people can be prone to being large, and be large, and still be as healthy as anyone thin. That might be hard to accept but it is the truth. You can do some research or call a doctor
the are plenty of documentation out there to prove it.

This can be a very sensitive subject that alot of people truly struggle with every waking moment. They need all the hope and acceptance they can get. I know first hand.

and thank you for sharing your post with us here. I especially liked your last sentence...blessings to you.

"Being overweight causes more health problems than SMOKING for chirsts sake!!!"

Smoking is much more dangerous than all but the MOST extreme obesity. I'm overweight (in itself, a judgement). I exercise every day, do free weights, I walk. I'm working on cutting out all trans-fats and high-fructose corn syrup from anything I eat; I think I'll be better off. Some of what people do to look thin is very unhealthy.

is a problem It isn't just that Americans are getting fatter as a nation, we're also getting shorter as a nation.

Though in the past, bad diets may have been an affliction of the poor, that isn't the case any longer. Fast food places are in every neighborhood, people live hectic lives and don't have time to cook, kids crave nutrient free junk foods.

I'v got a friend who is obese. I know she doesn't eat a great deal, so I'm sure it's partially due to genetics. I also know that what she does eat is usually cheap fast food (she's on disability), and that she never exercises. I worry that she won't be around to see her son graduate from High School.

I know that obese people are stigmatized, but I can't remember a time when they weren't, even before it became a national obsession.

maybe i'm just not understanding what you are saying....

is the last, great, acceptable prejudice. It's okay to laugh at people who are fat, it's their own damn fault if they are fat, they are fat because of their own actions (genes and circumstances be damned) and they should really just stay home and hide and not make the rest of us look at them.

Yes, obesity is a problem - a health problem - especially in those whose body weight places a strain on their heart. But there are plenty of size 14s out there who face a stigma that is painful and humiliating that has nothing to do with health. The "thin culture" that has 13 year old girls obsessing about their weight is more damaging and hurtful than a few extra pounds could ever be.

eileen from OH (a size 6, as if it matters)

who's struggling to add fat back into her diet. My doctors keep telling me I need to eat peanut butter, avocados, etc. -- but when I turn on the television, read a magazine, or approach pop culture of any sort I am told that fat is BAD and that we should all keep away from it as much as possible.

I am nearly 30 pounds underweight and you easily can count my ribs, yet these goddamned messages keep me worried that I still shouldn't ingest any fat.

Whatever happened to moderation? Why is it all or nothing in our society?

I am so glad you conquered your eating disorder! I struggled with one in my teens. It was not fun.

I totally hear ya about our culture. It's insane. Your doctors tell you to put on weight, but you turn on the TV, and all the actresses are borderline anorexic. And then you feel like crap when you eat the high calorie food your doctor tells you to eat.

adn I wish I could eat all I want and still keep the weight, but I can't. I have to watch what I eat and go to the gym.

I had no idea that all the Jews and witches faced was ridicule and people not finding them attractive. I wonder what they complained so much about.

On a serious note, fat people have relatively little to complain about. Other people have had their favorite vices criminalized; Call me when we start locking up people for walking around with a quarterpound of hamburger if you want my sympathy*.

*I say this as one who has spent most of his life overweight, not that that will prevent the accusations of me being an anti-fatite.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/weekend/story/0,3605,1200549,00.html

From the link above.


snip...

In almost all large-scale epidemiological studies, little or no correlation between weight and health can be found for a large majority of the population - and indeed what correlation does exist suggests that it is more dangerous to be just a few pounds "underweight" than dozens of pounds "overweight". So, let us look at the most cited studies for the proposition that "overweight" is a deadly epidemic in America today. Anyone who bothers to examine the evidence in the case against fat with a critical eye will be struck by the radical disconnect between the data in these studies and the conclusions their authors reach.

Over the past 20 years, scientists have gathered a wealth of evidence indicating that cardiovascular and metabolic fitness, and the activity levels that promote such fitness, are far more important predictors of both overall health and mortality risk than weight. Yet none of the studies most often cited for the proposition that fat kills makes any serious attempt to control for these variables.

snip..

If one were forced to come up with a six-word explanation for the otherwise inexplicable ferocity of America's war on fat, it would be this: Americans think being fat is disgusting. Fifty years ago, America was full of people that the social elites could look upon with something approaching open disgust: blacks in particular, of course, but also other ethnic minorities, the poor, women, Jews, homosexuals, and so on. Nowadays, a new target is required.

snip...

For upper-class Americans in particular, it's easier to deal with anxiety about excessive consumption by obsessing about weight, rather than by actually confronting far more serious threats to our social and political health. We may drive environmentally insane SUVs that dump untold tonnes of hydrocarbons into the atmosphere; we may consume a vastly disproportionate share of the world's diminishing natural resources; we may support a foreign policy that consists of throwing America's military weight around without regard to objections from our allies - but at least we don't eat that extra cookie when it's offered to us

He seems to be bursting out of his suit...

Anyhow, I apologize for the mutltitude of Groucho Marx quips to Margaret Dumont that go through my mind as I read this article...

in the world, why are people so concerned about the health of an obese person?

Yes, obesity is hard on one's health. And it would seem that the choice would be to lose weight, exercise (actually most people would benefit from more exercise) but why is obesity such a hot topic is my question. The obese know the health concerns; some try to loose weight, some don't care, some are just tired of all the concern focused on them, some are in denial. But why are we all so concerned about the obese.

So far as cutting a life short or make it more difficult, obesity is certainly of concern. But, people die due to all different things, why don't we focus on some of those for awhile and give the obese a chance to recover from all this tough love.

Maybe we could focus on death by:

violence
war
smoking
anorexia
drugs
alcohol
driving while intoxicated/on the cell phone
abuse
disease
pollution

I support a woman's right to choose concerning her reproductivity, I support a person' right to choose to smoke (I suspect I best add the disclaimer - so long at the second hand smoke doesn't endanger another :shrug:) and as of today, I'm supporting a person's right to choose to be fat.

Sometimes I think those who are most critical of another person's shortcomings, have shortcomings of their own they don't really want to deal with. It is a lot easier to find fault with others, than to look at oneself. IMHO anyway.

Says its 'concern' just helps the hater not feel like they are indulging in self praise.

..because obesity-related deaths are the #1 type of preventable death, ahead of smoking. That's why we should be concerned.

I understand that many deaths are caused by obesity, and it may in fact be the number one cause of preventable deaths. But, it just seems that obesity is getting way more attention than just honest caring for the health of another person. I don't mean this as an arguement or right and wrong type of thing, but there is something about this arguement that bothers me. This enormous concern for the obese doesn't fit in when I watch tv or drive somewhere. Everyone is so busy pushing and shoving and into their own needs and wants, and egos and then there is this great deal of concern over the obese. I think there is more to this than just general concern. I think that alcohol and drugs and smoking which sort of mix with one another quite readily probably amount to as many preventable deaths as obesity. The physical toll, 45 percent of highway fatalities are due to drunk driving, abuse and violence by a drunk person, murders due to getting money to buy drugs. But, let's say that obesity is still higher in preventable deaths, what causes more heartache in a family, a fat loving mommy who regretable will die too soon or the torment caused by an alcoholic?

I understand where you are coming from, but it just doesn't sit well with me.

criticism comes from a place of concern either, for the most part. If people are so concerned, why are they so nasty and judgemental when discussing the overweight?

I think the real issue is that people associate obesity with a lack of self-control, and since most people have issues of self-control in one area or another, they project their self loathing on to those where the supposed lack of self control is most obvious - the obese.

It is a health issue, that true, but there are numerous health risk factors that don't seem to get the same level and type of attention. I also agree with the stress factor, I think it plays a larger part than most people realize. Individual psychology is an issue as well. I have been anorexic and am now a healthy size 6-8 (seasonal), but I struggle with that societal fear of fat almost every day. I knew what to do to be healthier, but couldn't do it because I hadn't resolved the emotional issues.

The bottom line is, it's your body, it's your life, it's your health - aside from the health community, it's nobody's business but your own.

Like you, I'm bothered by society's obsession with being thin or fitting some kind of ideal. We have very much a dualistic society, one where our grocery stores prominently display high-fat items such as donuts a few aisles over from low-cal shakes and diet pills. Like our love-hate relationship with sex, we seem to enjoy grasping for something, then slapping our own hand when we do it.

It could also be said, however, that not enough is being done to warn people about the dangers of being overweight. Doctors don't tell overweight patients often enough that dropping the extra pounds would be beneficial to their health. We have an ever-increasing number of overweight citizens.

I don't want it to seem like I'm being critical of overweight people in the sense that I think they're less valuable. I think it important, however, that people who are overweight should try to slim down, much as I think the alcoholic in your example needs help. One of my friends' father passed away recently, primarily due to health problems from being overweight. He tried and tried to lose weight, but the strain on his heart was too much. His family was constantly worried, for they knew his weight was a ticking time bomb waiting to go off...and sadly, it did. Gary was a good guy and I wish he had taken better care of himself so he could see his son get married.

I know terrible stigmas are placed on the overweight. Such stigmas should still not be used as an excuse to engage in behavior that puts one's health at risk.

Fast food restaurant are just like CNN MSNBC and FAUX news.

They both claim to be healthy and fair and balanced.

Why do people have such a problem accepting that, in general, excess fat is UNHEALTHY AND DANGEROUS - PERIOD.

While we should NOT ridicule people that struggle with weight problems (it is NOT easy to overcome!) - We should also not encourage 'acceptance' of a health problem.

We should support people who may be unhealthily overweight to take measures to make themselves HEALTHIER - and not focus on the 'beauty' or superficial aspects of it. Focus on the HEALTH issue.

The fact is, it IS possible to be very heavy and technically 'overweight' while at the same time being in excellent health.

But, we all know that this is a small minority of heavy people. The majority will suffer consequences for being overweight.

in our local paper just recently. I was very surprised at the nasty tone.

Severe obesity is unhealthy, but its causes are not clear. Some scientists think that obesity is a symptom of other illnesses, such as bacterial or viral infections. According to this theory, people become ill first, their body responds with inflammation, and massive weight gain is part of the body's immune response.

We all know that it is extremely unhealthy for girls and women (and increasing numbers of boys and men) to diet obsessively, binge and purge, or develop eating disorders in the pursuit of the media's image of an ideal body.

It's not that simple an issue, and it certainly has nothing to with morality!

I live in an area with many African-American and Mexican-American women, and I must say it is refreshing to see how their cultures value women who are a little fleshier than the stick-figures in the magazines. They fine feminine curves to be sexy!

... the first is defining "fat". BMI is worse than useless, it is downright wrong.

Second, what is an unhealthy level of fat? You have to be way beyond what looks good cosmetically to be fat enough to be unhealthy.

I am a smoker, & when the PC crowd came after us, it was just a matter of time until the next target.

I have been sneered at, scolded, cursed out, & other pleasantries because I smoke.

When I am with people, I always ask if they mind if I smoke. I only smoke in designated areas, but I have still been cursed at.

So, get ready for taxes on high fat foods, & other inanities.

And yes, it is an elitist issue - I go to the health food store once a pay-day and try to find inexpensive healthy food to balance things out with, but many people I know can't even afford to do that. And many of the diseases discussed here as "fat-related" issies, could just as easily be linked to the additives and environmental pollutants (in which case obesity could be another symptom instead of the cause of these problems). But corporate America does not want people to find THAT link. They would much rather have people think it is their fault - that they can do something about it - than they would stop stuffing things with mysterious names like "pressed, processeD cheese food" down our throats. That would cost them money. Much easier to kill off the ones whose bodies don't as easily adapt to being poisoned. I agree with the person who pointed out earlier about Europeans having healthier food choices readily available. Have you ever read the ingredients on supermarket food? You can't even pronounce half of them. As long as 2 loaves of Wonder Bread at the day-old bakery are $1.00, though, you will not find the working poor cavorting through the aisle of "Nature's Finest Foods." And a person working 2 jobs to keep a roof over their head can't spend their "free time" pounding flax seeds and wheat into loaves of bread.

It's the same old song - the rich demonize the poor so they can continue to oppress them and make a buck at their expense.

Carol (another size 6 - if that matters)

On edit - corrected spelling error

What is with all of the denigration of people that are overweight?

I'm sorry, but if it does not affect you, why even worry about it? Are those that are not overweight suddenly threatened by those that are? Why does this matter to anyone, other than someone who is overweight and wants to lose a few #'s?

What is next? Are we to find out that everyone that doesn't "fit in" in the facial dept is suddenly frowned upon, because they are not "up to par"?

Do you all want a reality check, OK. No one is perfect. Some are endowed with certain traits that are deemed "desirable". Those that aren't naturally endowed, use different applications to enhance what they feel as "low point". Hence we have cosmetics. We have cosmetic surgery. We have stomach stapling, breast reduction, breast enhancement. Penis enhancement is the recent rage, soon there will be penis reduction...:shrug:

My point is...it has nothing to do with what a person looks like. Hell a person can be the most "beautiful person on the face of the earth", and still be a complete asshole as a person.

It is what the heart and mind feel. It is what beauty lies beneath the skin. It is the mind that makes a person what they are. A beautiful mind is far more acceptable, than than all of the "trophy people" that inhabit fantasies.

If an individual is not a direct threat to YOU, leave that person alone. What it comes down to, is it is none of your business.

OK...Flame me...I can take it.

O8)