Evidence mounts as Bush hails Rumsfeld

President George Bush's public backing for Donald Rumsfeld comes in the face of mounting evidence undermining sworn testimony by the US Defence Secretary and Pentagon senior commanders that abuses at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq were carried out by "a handful" of junior officers.

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So far, Mr Rumsfeld's pledge that the abuse of prisoners did not go up the chain of command has secured his political survival. But senators on the powerful armed services committee were yesterday due to hear testimony from the general who investigated the abuses at Abu Ghraib, Major-General Antonio Taguba. Numerous witnesses told him that shocking abuses, including sexual humiliation of prisoners, were encouraged by US military intelligence officers.

General Taguba's internal army report described "systemic" abuse at Abu Ghraib and said junior officers were instructed by military intelligence and private contractors to "set the conditions" for the interrogation of prisoners.

A lawyer for one of the military guards charged with abusing the detainees has told the US ABC network that photographs support evidence that military intelligence officers took part in sexually degrading prisoners, forcing them to strip and lie in groups on the floor of the jail. The lawyer, Guy Womack, said one photo showed an interrogation "done at night" where intelligence officers "ordered the MPs to undress" three prisoners, began interrogating them and forced them to pose for a photograph.


http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/05/11/1084041406835.html

Someone knew EXACTLY how to humiliate and shame the prisoners. The 20 year old MP's didn't come up with this by themselves. He thinks it came from higher up because they humiliated and shamed them in a way that totally goes against their culture.

I hope we aren't offered the young MP's as justice and that is the end of the story. That would just add to the shame we have already inflicted upon ourselves (courtesy of Rummy and co.)

Once again, very junior troops and brigadiers do not make policy in the army.

This came from very high, even if they also have to face the music

Lets draw this again

The Colonel for MI reported directly to Lt. General Sanchez, skipping Karpinsky who has pointed fingers

Insofar as intel is concerned, Sanches reports to Cambone, skiping his theater commander, Abizaid... Carbone reports to Rumsfeld and Rummy... well 1600 Penn Avenue

it was wrong and they knew enough to cover their tracks should they get caught.

If only the dipshit Rummy could have executed a post war Iraq plan as well as they executed this, maybe we wouldn't be in this mess.

I also read that Rummy is the text book definition of a micro manager, especially where intelligence gathering was concerned.

I watched most of the hearings on C-span today and was impressed with the coordinated testimony that pictured the whole abuse thing as a local matter.

The whole DOD crew gave orchestrated testimony that the abuses documented by Mgen Taguba were clearly outside the bounds of all written Army directives. MGen Taguba specifically stated that he found no "evidence" of influence from higher levels. The problem, per Taguba, was just a few folks who ignored the directives.

It's going to be hard to prove Rumsfeld involvement from DOD sources! The report from the current investigation of Military Intelligence personnel practices that is expected next month is not likely to be much different. Reports regarding CIA/contractor practices are likely to be classified to a degree that precludes public release.

The lack of corrective action in response to Red Cross reports seems, I fear, to be the only possible avenue that leads to Bush and Rumsfeld.

law enforcement too often has had investigations and cases of horrific crimes blocked by the shield of national security. This can't continue.

NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW.

Taguba said that the MPs were definitely "influenced" by those around them, however he could not prove they were "ordered". That is the distinction that he made today, and this is what I heard him say when I watched these hearings.

Rumsfeld is gone after November anyway, and hopefully he will never be back. He will go down in history associated with the torture and abuse at Abu Ghraib just like Goebbels is associated with Hitler's torture, whether he gets fired for this or not. I don't guess he expected anyone to put the neocon's basic philosophy on film, but now he will never escape it, and this is a fitting punishment.

Does anyone know the names of the three other prisons Taguba said had these systemic problems too?

And it is so funny how the development of problems keeps moving back. It went from March to January to November of last year and then August of last year. This is just the tip of the iceberg. And I will really be disappointed if some CACI people don't go to jail over this mess. I want to know who was on the other side of the camera giving orders.

about the culture of US Army MI and the Defense Intelligence Agency.
Specifically the influence of Col. Michael Aquino the former Church of Satan priest that replaced the Church of Satan with his own cult/religion the Temple of Set in 1975 while on active duty.

Col. Aquino was involved in the illegal Operation CHAOS in 1969.
Col. Aquino and his wife, Lillith, were implicated in The Presidio molestation case but never charged.

Btw, here is a bit of hidden history about the culture of US military intelligence, the influential Col. Aquino and the Temple of Set

Temple of Set Statement to the US Armed Forces (see Temple of Set)
http://www.nightspell.dhs.org/

Temple of Set history
http://religiousmovements.lib.virginia.edu/nrms/satanism/tempset.html

http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id163/pg1/

Think about that as you view tv today.

NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW.

soldiers are finally getting fed up.

that Rummy actually was very familiar with the interrogation "techniques" used to break down prisoners in Gitmo and Afghanistan and got briefings on the use of these techniques. Is there any reason to believe he also wouldn't have been following the process quite closely in Iraq? Rummy is a hands on, detail oriented, top down manager. It is inconceivable that he had no inkling as to what was going on.

The evidence contradicts Rummy's testimony made under oath. He's lying to Congress, that should be enough.

Isn't impeachment for elected officials and judges?

can be impeached also, same as the President.

And I also believe he has lost his mind. Randi Rhodes played some of his testimony on Monday, and I was shocked and amazed at his performance.

Also, I have some serious questions as to why this man is even involved in nation-building. Too many questions, too few answers.

....came directly from the School of the Americas interogation manuals.