EXECUTION: FOUR ARRESTED

Breaking at Sky

Four people have been arrested over the beheading of US businessman Nicholas Berg, whose decapitated body was found 10 days ago in Baghdad.

http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30000-1135751,00.html

McDonalds?

said they were not notified that anyone was arrested..said it's not true...Kermit and what's his name, the blonde guy...

2 hours, 36 minutes ago

BAGHDAD (AFP) - Four people have been arrested over the beheading of US businessman Nicholas Berg, whose killing was shown earlier this month in a video on an Al-Qaeda linked website, a senior Iraqi source said.

Asked if more than one person had been arrested in connection with the killing, the source told AFP: "Yes, four people."

-snip-
story--
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=1512&u=/afp/20040518/wl_afp/iraq_us_beheading_arrest_040518142410&printer=1

see my post later in this thread

Can't believe any of the shit this malAdmin pipes thru the media.

They need a scapegoat quickly.

Are they pale-skinned with weird accents?

in a Dallas movie theatre?

What's Arabic for "I'm just a patsy"?

The link is absolutely stunning!!!!

,...and there is a warning that it is graphic (although, it's really not anything worse than what I have seen on tv):

http://www.aztlan.net/berg_abu_ghraib_video.htm

Check out the guy's head ("pale" skinned with a military cap) that pops into the corner of the video. It is stunning.

is the "leader" with the leg that grew back? (can never remember how to spell his name so I have given up on trying)

wasn't caught. I had thought the same thing.....everyone would be caught except al-Zarqawi. Makes me wonder if the people they did catch were 4 innocent people off the streets.

"But it was understood that none of the four included Abu Mussab al-Zarqawi, who US authorities believe carried out the killing of the 26-year-old who was in Iraq (news - web sites) to drum up business for his small telecommunications company."

in some way?

,...to the same folks who included Berg's company on an "enemy" list.

:grr:

I didn't intend to offend anyone.

Is that like a racial slur?

It's like "whitey" or "honkey." It can't really be a racial slur, cuz white folks still have the power in our society. Racial slurs are not slurs in principle, but rather because they produce and reinforce an unethical and unequal power relation.

If African-Americans ever achieve equal power, nigger will become acceptable?

expected to take insults, but never be allowed to throw them. :eyes:

is not a racial slur in my neck of the woods, where plenty of crackers live, but the above explanation is bogus. If one applies that standard, it would be permissible to call Joe Lieberman a kike. The fact that such a slur is repugnant, even against a member of a group with access to power demonstrates that racial slurs are independent of power structures.

However do you think KleverKittie was referring to historical Georgian cattlemen when he/she said "fat crackers"? Or do you think he/she was just referring to white folks?

But even if she wasn't referring to the group for whom the term cracker originated, I don't see it as in insult. Burt Reynolds used to refer to himslef as a cracker, and I don't think he was ever a rancher.

eternal victims...

And, interestingly enoughly, terms like "cracker," "redneck," and "white trash" are always directed at the least privileged white people, the rural poor. It seems that we don't have any such race and class-specific terms to apply to the class of people who steal elections, start wars, etc.

You might want to check out a Boston Globe article from a few months back, called "Losing Hope in Appalachia," that details the lives of privileged white people in Appalachia: grinding poverty, longterm unemployment, drug abuse, and a life expectancy lower than in much of the third world. The article is in the pay section of their site, but if you will PM me I will be glad to email it to you. It's a real eye opener.

Class remains very real in this country, even though we never talk about it.

For instance, I have always referred to Donald Trump as "New York white trash".

And I'm not going to hold my breath waiting for it to, given how most Americans revere the wealthy.

I'm not fond of terms such as "trailer trash" and "hillbilly" for all of the reasons you point out. They are offensive and they are classist.

Having said that, I am also not fond of hearing white folks complain of being picked on because of their color, as one contributer to this thread attempted to do. It isn't OK to belittle anyone based on skin color. Folks shouldn't try to compare modern classist slurs with historical racist ones.

with historical racist ones."

Obviously they have different histories and such, but all group slurs attack people based on their status, not their actions, and are used to keep disadvantaged people "in their place." That's close enough for me to consider race, class, sex, or other slurs out of place in liberal discourse.

I can understand why the Right likes to pretend that there's no such thing as class in America, but I'll never understand why what passes for a Left in this country has bought into that myth.

Just one long scream of pain, oh, the misery, the dispair of so much suffering at the hands of other, envious groups of humans.

"personal offense," "hurt feelings," or any other such bourgeois nonsense. It is a question of power. Does the term "cracker" reinforce a social system that severely limits the life possibilities of some segment of the population? No. It does not. Your precious feelings notwithstanding.

To tell me you don't give a shit if I am insulted by what I perceive as a slur! Oh, now I'm bourgeois if I don't like that term.

If it was not meant as an insult, why did the person remove it?

You're bourgeois if you think that such terms are directed at personal feelings or your personal perceptions (which are shaped by social relations in any case). Whether the original poster perceived it as an insult after the fact has nothing to do with my argument. It may manifest itself as an insult, but that is not its primary or even most important function.

Stop your whining. If you are a member of a privileged class, you must take responsibility. This is not the so-called "liberal guilt" (also a bourgeois fantasy that turns social problems into personal feelings), but rather a clear-eyed approach to social forces and power in our society.

HISTORY continues to function, and that such 'equal power' would be consistently threatened by historical forces, probably not. We don't get to turn off history (and I expect that this answers your Lieberman canard below as well).

Although I can hardly speak on behalf of the Black community, I believe they might indeed be more than willing to accept having superior economic positions, educational and professional opportunity to whites in exchange for allowing us free use of the term 'nigger'.

The concept sounds callous & irrational. The reality is: no such deals are out there.


Top-shelf item as of 8:00 AM, Tuesday Sept 11 '01: Reparations

Back of the bus - maybe not. Back burner - yes for sure (with no pilot).


The neocons, with their installments from a $30 billion reparation package from Germany (and then some) are firmly opposed to even considering the records on slavery in America.

Blacks don't 'count' to them. Has anyone else noticed this?

- Q: How many black neocons does it take to make a martini?
- A: Both of them (or - 'Olive' 'em)


Someone's rotting in Deutch Mark

This is why race relations will never ever get better in this country......



Peace? :hippie: :smoke: :freak:

That's why...:eyes:

Just an equal field of exchanges...:eyes:

Scots-Irish descent.

It's not really a slur. It's an ethnic group. Colin Powell is now officially a cracker, it appears, now that he has claimed his Scots lineage.

Thanks for the info...do you think that is what was referred to in the original post by KleverKittie?

was a name given to white people by black people in reference to the slave overseer of the 19th century. The name is derived from the one who "cracks" the whip...

on edit: Just saw post #22. Thanks for the correction...:hi:

even among the most exquisitely sensitive liberals.

Consider how "redneck" and "white trash" are used here everyday, and how those of us who complain about it are accused of being overly sensitive.

cracker refers to someone from Georgia....

...in georgia and florida. They were mostly cattle raisers. The term 'cracker' came from the fact that they all carried whips to drive the cattle. It was the sound the whips made as the snapped them.

Just a bit of history.

I never heard that before. But I wonder if the person who initially used this reference had that in mind. Do Georgian crackers only wear white tennis shoes? Is your wife a man?

Curious minds want to know.

The term 'cracker' is non gender spacific. Both men and women drove the cattle. They were mostly family herds with just a few hired hands.

I cannot speak to the fashion sense of georgians.

And you'll have to ask the original poster what he/she/it meant.

Sorry you didn't catch it. As I recall the video of the abductors only included men, some hefty and wearing white tennis shoes. Thus the "crackers" referred to in above post.

I don't think anyone would believe white men or women from Georgia were actually participating in that beheading. Or would they?

I grew up in Florida and not many people understand wehre the term came from......

It has, however, evolved into a less-than-desireable term.

I've heard they got the name from the whips or the idea that they deep-fried everything in cracker meal when cooking...just another version I heard

Can't you use something more modern like wigger...

2 large males now instead of 2 fat crackers.

What did you mean by "cracker?" I assume "white" since you identified the first as "2 brown ppl..."

it was meant to be sarcastic and in line with
the * admin's ongoing habit of grouping. Rather
than viewing people as individuals, they have
been lumped into religious groups, ethnic groups,
etc. Again if I thought it would detract from the
real story, I wouldn't have posted it in the first place.
Apologies to all slighted.

What were we talking about anyway?

BTW I wasn't offended.

Even CNN is casting doubt on the video for gawd's sakes.

Round up the Usual Building Blocks.

on the chance that they did get the right guys...I told you they would find them.

You love to be in the minority on this!

I want to believe this Admnistration is capable of doing at least one competent thing during their term. I'd like to believe they have recognized that it's now or never.

On their hands or their sneakers?

Well it went like this......

The good guys (US) were just strolling down the streets of Baghdad and, lo and behold, one of them looked up in the sky and noticed that there were passports and visas and diagrams of "how to decapitate a hostage with a sword"....just floating down from the sky.

Oh yeh, there was also a copy of the Koran and some graduation certificates signed by Osama and Saddam and...and a wooden leg!!

No link to this story yet but look for it in tomorrows NYT with a byline by Judith Miller.

"Round up the usual suspects"

They'll torture them until they "confess".

All tidied up now.

Proper english is important.

Weapon of Mass Distraction.

Hey guys! Don't look at the overall disaster Iraq is, we can arrest "suspects" for one questionable atrocity!!

getting predictable, isn't it?

I can't find anyone else reporting this.

what do they know the others don't??? :shrug:

Jonbenet Ramseys killers...........

BAGHDAD (AFP) - Four people have been arrested over the beheading of US businessman Nicholas Berg, whose killing was shown earlier this month in a video on an Al-Qaeda linked website, a senior Iraqi source said.


AFP/HO Photo



Asked if more than one person had been arrested in connection with the killing, the source told AFP: "Yes, four people."


Berg's beheading was shown on a grainy video posted on the Islamic website linked to Osama bin Laden (news - web sites)'s terror network, days after his body was found in Baghdad on May 8.


"We have made good progress," the source added, referring to the investigation, but declined to give any details on the identity of the four people held in detention.


But it was understood that none of the four included Abu Mussab al-Zarqawi, who US authorities believe carried out the killing of the 26-year-old who was in Iraq (news - web sites) to drum up business for his small telecommunications company.
~snip~


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=1515&ncid=1515&e=3&u=/afp/20040518/wl_mideast_afp/iraq_us_beheading_arrest_040518142250

can't have the one-legged, captured, dead, resurrected bogeyman in custody ~ who would be responsible for all the bad things happening in Iraq?

But it was understood that none of the four included Abu Mussab al-Zarqawi

Abu Mussab al-Zarqawi - the new Emmanuel Goldstein

over half an hour ago, but haven't mentioned it again yet.

All they really said was that the arrests were announced by Iraqi authorities.

BBC first mentioned this just before 3pm GMT, and I'm positive they said the news was from Iraqi authorities, but they didn't mention it again for over an hour which is odd (being rolling news things are regularly repeated of course, even if unconfirmed, they'll just repeat that it's unconfirmed). At 4pm they briefly mentioned "reports" of arrests which they'd go to later, then another brief mention at 4:34 of "unconfirmed reports" that 4 have been arrested. No more details.

Seems a "senior Iraqi source" revealed these arrests, senior enough that the BBC cited "Iraqi authorities", but they've backed off because coalition authorities won't confirm it or are disputing it.

they said they got it from AFP

Report of Arrests in Nick Berg's Murder

There are some unconfirmed reports of arrests being made in connection with the beheading of West Chester, Pa. native Nick Berg in Iraq.
ABC News says the report is coming from a French news agency that four men have been arrested in the slaying that shocked the world for its brutality.

http://www.kyw1060.com/news_story_detail.cfm?newsitemid=37691

"trial"...No journalists invited.

Were they walking around with a "Beheading for Dummies" book?

Were they still wearing their hoods and one of them still wearing his white sneakers?

Did they try to return the chair to the Baghdad Walmart?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Now comes the retaliation for their capture. :scared:

How many WMDs stories has Sky News "scooped" everybody on? A dozen now?

Obviously, this hasn't been confirmed by anyone else.

Rupert Murdoch, Chairman
Lord Rothschild OM GBE FB, Independent Non-Executive Deputy Chairman
James Murdoch, Executive Director

http://www.corporate-ir.net/ireye/ir_site.zhtml?ticker=BSY.UK&script=2200

are they connected to the BFEE?

That article was written at about a second grade reading level.

At a briefing in Baghdad, Kimmitt denied rumors that suspects had been arrested Tuesday in Berg's death.

``We have no information from the coalition that any arrests were made today,'' he said.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-4104479,00.html

The masters and the puppets disagree.

http://www.aztlan.net/berg_abu_ghraib_video.htm

(warning: graphic images)

In addition to the rest of the analysis, the guy with a military cap and obvious "pale" skin in the video is quite stunning!!!

aztlan.net is May 16 - not LBN - but feel that this should get additional exposure also.

I find it to be a very good analysis. Maybe a shorter thread on poor Berg will appear and this can be posted.

Someone really did some work on this. Great evidence, changed my thoughts about the incident completely.

is the fact that the guns that most of the "terra-ists" are holding appear to be Heckler and Koch MP5's. These are of course the smg of choice for counter terrorism groups like the Navy Seals, Delta Force and the other special forces. I am not saying that terrorists couldn't get ahold of these but when was the last time you saw a terrorist pic or video without a couple of AK-47s in someone's hands or leaning against the wall.

Also, I don't think those guys are wearing flak jackets or bullet-proof vests but rather chest worn ammo pouches similar to those seen here...
http://www.usmilitarysurplus.com/surpluscatalog/product_info.php?products_id=776

Typical hits for the story:

Four arrested over US man's beheading
http://www.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,4057,9603636%5E2,00.html

Four arrested over beheading of US businessman in Iraq

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/afp_world/view/85608/1/.html

Iraq Arrests 4 Suspected of Role in Berg's Beheading, AFP Says
http://quote.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000103&sid=awbpuXq1ESHE&refer=us

Four held for beheading
http://www.news24.com/News24/World/Iraq/0,,2-10-1460_1528829,00.html


The denial is typically appearing in a widely posted story entitled "Iraq Cleric Urges Groups to Leave Cities":

.... At a briefing in Baghdad, Kimmitt denied rumors that suspects had been arrested Tuesday in Berg's death. "We have no information from the coalition that any arrests were made today," he said ....
http://www.rapidcityjournal.com/articles/2004/05/18/ap/Headlines/d82l3a5g0.txt


Any bets on whether this is the usual Administration game (circulate rumors and reap rewards from voters who don't follow the news closely)? Found WMDs (oops: retraction), found Berg's killers (oops: retraction) ...


<edit:> I wonder if recent publicity about Iraqi prison conditions is encouraging petty criminals to accuse their neighbors of terrorism? ("We caught you stealing and we're going to send you to one of our prisons if you don't tell us who killed Berg!" "It was my landlady, I swear! She's always mumbling on the telephone!")

Nicholas Berg's killing wasn't an execution--it was murder. Executions (at least ostensibly) have the rule of law and the power of the state behind them, whether such killings are just or not. The Al Quaeda thugs have neither the rule of law behind them nor the power of the state. I hope the Al Quaeda thugs get the traditional Iraqi short shrift dealt out to meddling outsiders whose efforts are unwanted and unappreciated.

shot at the Abu Garib prison--
!!!!!1
Heard this on Bernie Ward Show last night and he presented ALOT of evidence-
Scientific analysis frame by frame even shows the profile of a man in a US military cap stick his head for out for one second.
There is alot more to it-

That's just part of what he went into last night on KGO.com
Listen in tonight --call in on the air if you don't believe me !
Bernie Ward show--10pm- 1 pm pacific time M-F
http://www.kgo.com


Berg wasn't even killed-
they did have a funeral but never said they had his body-

c'mon... get a grip. There's no US military cap in the video.

Don't shine it yet --unless you're one of those who still believes everything that comes out of this malAdministration's corporate media machine--
if that's the case then there's no convincing you of anything, so later-dude--!!

but if you have even a slightly open mind, feel free to
listen to Bernie Ward tonight and call in with any questions-
I guarantee you will walk away with a different perspective.

The original copy was analyzed and there
"is" a frame (that can't be seen at real speed)of the guy with the cap.
The walls were analized and they are WITHOUT a doubt the same walls as the abuse videos from Abu Garib prison.
I could type for 20 minutes here expiaining the details but I'm at work right now.
Why don't you smirk at and Aw Haw Bernie yourself-
He gets alot of know it all callers and he loves poeple like that...
Call in, and he'll likely put you in your place in about 2 seconds if you think you're so well informed.
"Get a Grip"?
you're pretty rude- are you a real smart guy?

Smart enough to recognize a pinky when I see one.

I live in the SF Bay area... I listen to Bernie all the time. You contend that a radio talk show host is the definitive authority on what's on that video? He claimed last night he hadn't watched it.

him not watching the video himself and relating the account of the frame by frame analysis are 2 different things--

and yeah you do seem like a real "smart" guy--
call him up--challenge him- I'll be listening

I briefly studied the video,...while it was available (and had to tolerate being called "sick"). I DO VALUE this young man's life,...so much that, I want to reveal his killers. I would "STUDY" that video, over and over and over again,...if I could discover the identity of the "evil-doers" who exploited this young man's life.

Hm, that article provides a lot of useful information.

Hooking up memes with false phrases and Fox News.

Come on, kids, don't you remember this time last year when Faux News was reporting almost weekly that the WMDs were found?

I'm a former member of the Straight Dope Message Board. If you're a paying member, you can go there, do a search on the phrase "ignoramus feed" in their Great Debates forum and find a post where I detailed at least a dozen separate instances in 2003 where Rupert's goon squad reported--incorrectly--that WMDs were found.

By June of 2003, one third of all Americans believed that the WMDs were already found--including Dick Cheney.

http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2003/06/266430.shtml

This is the exact same thing. Murdoch is running unconfirmed stories for the idiots out there who believe everything they hear the first time and then tune out.

Don't believe it. This story will be dead, buried, and uncorrected by the end of the week. But you can bet your ass you'll hear Condoleeza Rice use "Berg," "terrorists," and "captured" all in the same paragraph.

...and, since independent confirmation by any other source has not been forthcoming, probably erroneous (Sky has a tendency of this)...

Locking...