Local Hamas Military Chief Killed

On Edit:

The other title was misleading and I am updating it to reflect the true nature of the story.

Local Hamas military chief killed
From correspondents in Gaza Strip
21may04

THE local head of the armed wing of the radical Hamas movement was killed today in an Israeli air strike in the southern Gaza town of Rafah, Palestinian medical and security sources said.

The body of 37-year-old Khalid Abu Anza, who was killed in the early morning, was recovered by medics in the evening.

(more)

http://www.theadvertiser.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,9621630%255E1702,00.html

what's the life expectancy of a Hamas leader? Seems to be about a week now....

of what the Israelis are doing.

If they can kill the leadership they do several things.

1) Force the body of Hamas to find someone willing to lead with a target on their back. This takes more and more time, the deeper into their ranks they go.
2) It seriously tests the depth of commitment to the cause in any leadership left in Hamas
3) It forces Hamas to spend more time looking for the people leaking the name/location of their leadership than bombing Israeli targets.

A good strategy, though I am not saying it is right. It certainly beats the strategy of bulldozers and bombing civilians.

Later,
JM

Not as far as I can tell. These are connected demaoralization strategies.

In any case, this article says "a leader," not "the leader." It is pretty clear that Hamas is desperately seeking their mole.

,...but has become very fuzzy for the rest of us. What do you mean?

after the last round of assasinations is textbook counter-intelligence. A small number of people receive the information. If the information gets out, then one looks to those with the information as the leaks. This is a process of elimination in looking for a mole.

Better?

Would you please state your position?

I seriously don't understand what you are asking or implying. At all.

Is your position here a holdover from yesterday's exchange? I'm lost.

Just take one moment,...just a moment,...and stand in the shoes of those who are being damaged. For a moment, just a moment,...toss aside any and every thing you take for granted as "true",...and LISTEN to the suffering of children who are NOT you.

Just take a moment,...to try that on,...

Then, maybe, just maybe,...both your humanity and your creativity and your ability to be "innovative",...will shine through the smoke and mirrors.

It's an awfully presumptious position you are taking here. You seem to assume that I need to be told to feel empathy with the Palestinian position, that I need to be cajoled to imagine their perspective. I can't imagine where you got such an idea.

For the record, I have been a supporter of the Palestinian position for the majority of my adult life.

You have obviously developed a picture of my political positions which is totally erroneous. Rather than telling me where you stand, could you please tell me where you imagine I stand. I expect that you are totally wrong about this, though I'm not sure how that might have happened (unless you took tom_paine's rhetoric yesterday seriously?).

No more, no less *LOL*!!!

Moreover, I can't take anything in this life too seriously, since it delivers a death sentence to us all,...

You just like to fight.

I did read up on your mentor. I don't think he had the trademark, patent or copyright on "truth", either.

None of us do.

So, we are left with one fundamental choice, really: either we embrace one another in face of the unknown or we continue to destroy eachother in fear of the unknown. That's my take. I accept my take is worthless to you. That's okay.

Why would you think your take is "worthless" to me? Where are you getting these ideas?

As for Foucault, you certainly didn't read very far if you think he would claim to have the "patent or copyright on 'truth'"!!

And do you mean to tell me that Madness and Civilization is no longer standard reading in graduate programs in psychology?!?

The Likud party needs terrorism to survive so they incite it with the bulldozing and bombings. These actions are not to fight terror, it's meant to further hatred and cause more terror.

but I don't think they are connected by organization.

The Israelis are targeting Hamas leadership. The homes they are bulldozing I think are those of rank and file Palestinians, likely oriented more toward Fatah and Al-Aqsa. Do I have proof? No. Just a guess since the Israelis can't go after the PA leadership.

JM

,...and I am really confused by your comment. I'm sorry,...but, please explain.

Sharon and the Likud do not seem to be discriminating,...as they KILL any Palestinian who opposes them. At least,...I am not witnessing any discrimination,...except that ALL Palestinian people are a target, which is a Nazi-like genocidal horror.

Did you watch the damn video from yesterday's latest Sharon/Likud inflicted horror?

There was absolutely NO excuse or validation for such violence!!!!

...that there is no excuse for such action.

I am in no way trying to justify or excuse death in any manner. There is a fundamental difference, however, in the two approaches. One targets those who are avowed combatants. The other targets larger groups who may or may not be be in the former group.

JM

,...of retaliation. Have you failed to pay attention to everything that the Vietnam war exposed about human desperation to maintain an identity, a WORTH,...in this world,...against "superior" forces?

Damn!!!

*sigh*

,...damn,....

to differentiate between the recipients of Israeli action, just the methods.

Second, I would ask something else but it is touchy and belongs in I/P so I will refrain. Suffice it to say though, it has to do with Palestinians, desperation, worth, etc.

JM

equating what occurs in Israel and the occupied territories the actions of the Nazis is just hurtful. Criticize the actions and decisions made by the Israeli leadership, but invoking terms like "Nazi-like genocidal horror" is misplaced. There is much that is wrong in the region and the way both sides are conducting themselves, but this is a far cry from the systematic extermination of the Jew of Europe. Equating the two, therefore, is more hurtful than helpful for any discussion about this issue.


I anticipate a response to my message that will attempt to liken the horrors faced by Palestinians to those faced by Jews of World War Two. I will unlikely respond to any such comments because I have heard and read such arguments many time in the past and feel such debate often devolves into a futile effort. What I am merely asking for here is to retain some civility and consideration to the feelings to those who lost loved ones in the Shoa - not to open a debate about the mis-treatment of the Palestinians in relation to past atrocities.

DO UNTO OTHERS.

The moment anyone equivocates from fundamental principles,...they are moving towards an evolution of their worst enemy.

This is humanity. Welcome to being human.

I feel I must following yours....

First of all, what sort of arrogant and self-righteous comment is it to say to someone "Welcome to being human"? Since you don't know me, my beliefs, my views or my opinions who are you to cast such sanctimonious judgment on me or anyone else for that matter?

Second, what are you trying to say by "equivocates from fundamental principles"? Who is doing that? I’m not going to get into a tit-for-tat discussion about the entire I/P issue, but your credo of "do unto others" is applicable to either side of the conflict - whether it be the IDF’s killing of protesters in Gaza or the Palestinian suicide bombers blowing up buses in Tel Aviv. So who are you claiming is "equivocating" from fundamental principles? Both sides I hope.

While you might easily draw a correlation between the violence in the Middle East and the Holocaust, the deaths of innocent people is where such similarities pretty much cease. I will refrain from an item-by-item discussion of how Nazi Germany and Israel - even under the Likud - are greatly dissimilar. However, if you’re insistent on retaining this linkage or "moral equivalence" idea, keep it off DU since the guidelines for discussion of Israeli/Palestinian affairs are clear: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=124x21970

Specifically: Do not compare Middle East regional leaders and parties to Hitler or the Nazis. Use of these terms is considered inflammatory and should be avoided.

,...as some kind of "self-righteous" standing,...was the moment that you proved how little you value those of us who sincerely care about all human life.

Moreover, you cannot stop me from comparing one evil leadership from another. You cannot deny one evil act by any individual from another evil act. You will never, ever catch me doing a broad brush stroke of one's "evil" act across a people or nation or religion. But, I will call an evil act for what it is.

and then rant a bit about evil acts to prove your point....

As for stopping you from doing anything, that is not my intention. I'm merely trying to convey to you some of the fallacy in your comments, and to impress upon you that drawing the linkages that you do is inflammatory and wholly inappropriate when trying to discuss a complicated issue such as the I/P issue. I suppose you're one of those who sincerely cares about human life but not feelings or has a want for intellectual discussion.

By the way, you actually did, in essence, paint a broad brush stroke of "one's 'evil' act across a people or nation or religion" precisely by likening the acts of Sharon and Likud to the Nazis. One of the most disturbing realities of Nazi Germany was the complete acquiescence and even approval of most, if not nearly all, the citizens of Germany for the actions of the Nazi party. Thus, by saying something like the "Nazi-like genocide" directly implies that there is complicity across the broad Israeli population and a nationwide effort to eradicate Palestinians. If this is what you believe, the you clearly do no have an understanding of the region, the issues, or the people.

allowing a group of strategies to function together becomes de facto coordinated strategy. One can't run from their coordinated effects by saying they address different areas or segments of a problem. They have an emergent logic which can be stopped, and if it isn't stopped, is implicitly endorsed as a coordination. That's the bare minimum, and addresses the notion that these strategies are merely coordinated by timing.

I would still argue that they are coordinated in fact, rather than by mere inaction. However, I have no definitive proof of this.

Please? Just keep in mind WHO has the greatest resources, economic and political,...and HOW those resources are being used.

Just keep those identifiable, very real, quite proven facts in your mind,...as you analyze towards your conclusions.

<on edit - I do not know who is in that picture of a man appearing to be in total frustration,...but, I identify with that icon>

of the Israeli State Apparatus.

I don't know why you are frustrated, or what you are trying to say.

The man in the photo is Michel Foucault.

I don't know Michel Foucault. I will look him up.

I certainly hope you do not view me as your "enemy".

I just,...I want to understand and solve,...from the core.

I don't understand even one of your posts on this thread.

,...by leaderships,...you are treating me as an enemy.

(since I couldn't decipher it), I guess we are not enemies.

I despise Sharon and Likud. I have not indicated support for their action or positions at all in this thread, and I would appreciate it if you would stop imputing that I support Sharon or Likud. I have stated explicitly numerous times that I support the Palestinian position. I condemn Sharon and the Likud party openly. Either you can't read well, or you are being duplicitous.