***Agency: Chalabi Group was FRONT for Iran***

:nuke: BOMBSHELL REPORT!

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/ny-uschal0522,0,340595.story?coll=ny-top-span-headlines

Newsday - May 21, 2004

WASHINGTON -- The Defense Intelligence Agency has concluded that a U.S.-funded arm of Ahmed Chalabi's Iraqi National Congress has been used for years by Iranian intelligence to pass disinformation to the United States and to collect highly sensitive American secrets, according to intelligence sources.

******** "Iranian intelligence has been manipulating the United States through Chalabi by furnishing through his Information Collection Program information to provoke the United States into getting rid of Saddam Hussein," said an intelligence source Friday who was briefed on the Defense Intelligence Agency's conclusions, which were based on a review of thousands of internal documents. *********

Isn't this a bomshell?????

The Defense Intelligence Agency is saying that Bush and the neocons were DUPED into the attack on Iraq by Iran!!!!!!!!

This explains the whole weapons of mass destruction charade. Bush and the neocons fell for the deception of the Iranians.

Far from going to war to protect the world from WMD, or to "liberate" the Iraqi people, Bush was fooled by the willing neocon dupes into doing Iran's dirty work. Eight hundred American troops and thousands of Iraqis have been killed because Bush, unlike President Clinton, fell for the bogus 'intelligence'!!!!

In addition, the neocons, as the biggest boosters of Chalabi and the Iraqi National Congress, were supporting a group that was SPYING on the US and passing intelligence to Iran! Doesn't that make them sympathizers and enablers of enemies of our country?

This story, it seems to me, is enough, in and of itself, to make Bush and his neocon cronies into such fools that they simply have ZERO credibility.

I am posting this story on my web site: www.Earthside.com as a BOMBSHELL story.:nuke:

and that's all I have to say about that .

Just think about it. You mean to tell me that our intelligence is so bad that Chalabi could be able to get away with this? Why are we holding hundreds of Iraqis and Afghans in prison and abusing them based on intelligence sources that have been proven to be so poor...including our own? I just don't buy this crap. It's an effort to divert attention away from the real culprits who have been misleading this country and a veiled attempt to cast some blame toward the Clinton administration. Iran has done no more than Irsrael to push the US toward removing Saddam. This is an effort to divert your attention from this fact because so much has been coming out in the news lately about Americans getting fed up with being heavily influenced by Israel.

It won't work!

If it is true, they look like complete fools, and look like they;ve gotten us involved in this war as a pack of dupes.

I think it is more likely, and more chilling, that they are setting up Iran for the next attack.

and it will probably get rolling before the election.

iran will be fingerprinted as the culprit for some "terror attack". and off we go.

This is a set up all the way. I think it may be a combination, they can lay the blame for all the questions in the murikans minds now about the bad intel on chalabi AND they can maybe use it to set up Iran for the next attack. They couldn't very well go after Iran if the sheeples were waking up and discovering the truth now, could they?

The truth is they heard what they wanted to hear from chalabi and paid him well for it. He is now making a power play and knows too much, time to discredit him, pick up an excuse and maybe rally the flag wavers into step three of "total war."

I think this is how Mr. Colin Powell fucks his enemies.

... about the 'change-over' (command options) that won't get heard about from him - while he's behind bars.

Not that the guy doesn't belong there anyways, but maybe he was actually positioning to make a package deal the coalition wasn't even in on - such a possibility doesn't contradict his job description - and it wouldn't have taken more than about two hours from the time some rat squeeled on the side-communication 'til the home/office raid was in full swing.

I think he was about to actually extricate himself from alot of his bad associations in the eyes of the general Iraqi population with a new public appeal - by offering to both distance himself from the US in future, and seek friendly (non-aggression) alliance with a neighboring country.

Robbing Hood auditions as Riding Hood and gets ambushed by wolf in standard coat-and-tie undercover wear while trying to cross town.

It wouldn't surprise if he was busted by a wolf 'disguised' as his own coalition-appointed bodyguard.

He is totally expendable at this point. Dead man walking.

that they were blindly and gladly ridden as dupes - their ideology led them like sheep to betraying this country's security.

Slapping my head!

We may not buy it, but enough will to make the *shrub admin seem the victim, not a great position, but better than the alternative.

Chalabi only told the neocons what they wanted to hear. They were so delighted with him that they funded the INC with loads of our taxpayer money and all but promised him a prominent place in the new Iraqi government.

What they didn't realize was that while they were duping the American people, they were themselves being completely duped by Chalabi and the Iranians.

There is an enormous problem though. If Chalabi somehow manages to influence Iraqis (most of them despise him now), and he also hangs onto Iranian support, we're hosed. Really hosed.

This story is so twisted. On the one hand I want desperately to believe we aren't that dumb to be paying him $$$ to screw/con us like that, yet some of the stupid blunders I have seen recently leaves that possibility open. It has all gotten so wacky lately!!! I did see *red flags* at the mention of Clinton's name, yet... I just don't get it...not sure I understand it... hmmmmm... ?????????????????????????????????????????
:wtf:

Why should we believe a government that has been lying to us about everything for nearly 4 years? The neocons knew they lied. They knew there was no yellow cake uranium from Niger, yet they lied about it anyway. This is nothing but a cover story to fool the easily-fooled into thinking that Bush & Co were deceived by the evil Iran and their stoolie Chalabi.

That's what my gut is telling me -- Bush & Co. haven't been stooged by Chalabi at all.

I would say they ALL are liars, but just in different and distinct ways.

Beside should it really matter what Chalabi says, he is just another sucker set up by Bushco who are proven liars (at nausea, I would like to add).

Bushco is not going to weasel out of this one, *'s signature is on all of the paperwork

Good someone got the message straight and clear early on THIS thread.

Spys amongst us - duh.


Thank YOU, keithyboy!

What the fuck is going on?

bush dismissed American Intelligence
for this sham of a felon Chalibi ..

played for the fool he is.

But he actually has some well-educated people surrounding him, and you'd think maybe just one of them would get a clue. The combination of stupidity and gross arrogance is tragic.

:eyes:

..about how the US dealt with Iranian intelligence after the bombing at Cobar (?) Towers in Saudi Arabia in 1996 (they were behind it).

He don't go into details about US actions, but the effect was clear, the Iranians got the message. Probably the same message iraqi intelligence got after the assassination attempt at Bush 41 in 1993. They never did that again.

If the Iranians are now back doing old tricks it's extremely serious. And this time around the stakes are an order of magnitude bigger than in 1996.

It's one thing to con the present clown in Chief at Pennsylvania Avenue 1600 (child splay), but it's nothing but suicidal warmongering for the Iranians to fuck with the deal struck in 96.

If this is true the US could be forced into a war with Iran, and everybody but their great great grandmother knows that the timing could not be worse...

They probably agreed to not sponsor terrorist attacks on us, not to forswear peddling bogus intel. Everybody does that shit.

Bush cannot use 'they played me for a fool' as cassus belli. There are limits, even with this electorate. This is the kind of thing you try to bury because it cannot be spun.

Can you think of a better way to get us into Iran before the election?

Bush has destabilized this country like nothing anyone's seen since 1861.

"We'll agree to not send terrorists to you country if you agree to let us feed you intel."
In a perverse sort of way, it makes sense, but we're missing something here... namely a motive.

Any guesses on that?

If this is true the US could be forced into a war with Iran, and everybody but their great great grandmother knows that the timing could not be worse...

We broke up a spy network. Countries spy on each other. They don't go to war over espionage.

As I said, the stakes are now that much higher.

If this is true it cannot possibly be anymore serious, and Iran is not Iraq by any definition. They actually have WMDs.

This is truly BAD

that the misadminstration felt it was okay to work with a felon in order to go to war with Iraq.

OPEN the RECORDS of the Energy Task Force.

Yup, the paper trail starts right there...which is why Cheney is shitting a brick at the thought of handing them over.

Cheney should be forced to hand the papers over! Where is the outrage?
:kick:

Cheney and Chalabi are the CC Twins

They are Crooks and they are CONS!

Cheney should be impeached today!

Rush to war before the world knew for sure there they were telling a pack of lies

to that argument that any conservative you talk to will undoubtedly bring up. They will use it as proof that Bush didn't lie, but they don't think much deeper than black and white, which would preclude the possibility that it was brought in after the war or simply a complete fabrication by the liars that be.

Blame Chalabi

They knew the WMD info was bullshit. They wanted to go into Iraq, and go in they did. Didn't Wolfowitz say that the only reason they could give that would make the war seem necessary was the WMD threat? This is to lay it on Chalabi and get the Bushies off the hook.

Every last one of them took the bait. The Iranians must be laughing their asses off.

Wow, if true...game over.

"His biggest success came in 1998. That year a group of influential conservatives wrote an ``Open Letter'' to President Clinton calling for ``regime change'' in Iraq to become the official policy of the United States. Those signing the document included many of the men who came to dominate the top ranks of the Bush administration three years later: Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, Douglas Feith, Richard Armitage, Elliot Abrams and Zalmay Khalizhad, among others."

http://www.duluthsuperior.com/mld/duluthsuperior/8723366.htm

Disgusted, stunned, appalled, sickened, horror-stricken, surprised, dazed, upset, shakened, taken aback, horrified, enraged, offended, fearful, outraged, frightened, alarmed, worried, startled, nervous, bothered, troubled, vexed, angry, annoyed, irritated, displeased, cross, heated, maddened, fuming, frustrated, disturbed, discouraged, depressed, furious, and just plain ole fuckin pissed off.

x( }( :mad: :puke:

:kick:

Welcome to DU Tight_rope!
:hi:

:pals:

TREASON

idiots.

who gave Chalabi state secrets?

Maybe we can impeach someone if they find a blue dress in Chalabi's closet?

How in hell Chalabi even had "highly classified" US secrets to pass on to Iran. If indeed any of this for real. I'm somehow suspicious. In some ways it's convenient for Bush to have this WMD 'out', even if it does paint him as a fool.

A stupid, incompetent fool. Or a tyrant dictator who is a lying thief.

Unfortunately, in this case he is both.

for $40 million over 4 years by Chalabi who deliberately passes misinformation to us, and gave the Iranians top-secret US information.

This is bigger than huge. It's humongous!

Thank you for making my weekend. I'll be very disappointed if this isn't top story on Sunday morning shows!

WOW!

:toast: :beer: to you!

Chalabi better be glad he is still alive. He better stay out of planes,boats,cars and shoes.

He is going to be a dumb man who knew too much.

He also better stay away from WEDDINGS!

we spent on the goddamn war?

And won't the families of 800+ dead Americans be happy!

And while we are pondering this clusterf*ck, won't this play very well with the Iraqis? What will this do to Middle East stability?

David Allen
www.thoughtcrimes.org
Distrusting the Government Since 1984

That's exactly what they're counting on - Americans incensed enough at Iran's "trickery" to support an attack on that country.

Will We The Sheeple fall for this trap?

Chalabi is Bush's boy.
This charade is being played out in the hope that
the Iraqi people will be duped into accepting him
as a patriot. They will not. This guy is a Bush calibre bastard.

The DIA is rummy's outfit, rummy and cambone. Is this a massive pass the buck/get rid of a no longer useful, embarassing source? They have been trying to distance themselves from him as of late.

The only thing holding me back is that if they wanted this out, why the late friday info dump.

The DIA is rummy's outfit, rummy and cambone. Is this a massive pass the buck/get rid of a no longer useful, embarassing source? They have been trying to distance themselves from him as of late.

Rummy's outfit is Office of Special Plans, which was set up in order to basically bypass the normal intelligence process.

They call themselves, self-mockingly, the Cabal—a small cluster of policy advisers and analysts now based in the Pentagon’s Office of Special Plans. In the past year, according to former and present Bush Administration officials, their operation, which was conceived by Paul Wolfowitz, the Deputy Secretary of Defense, has brought about a crucial change of direction in the American intelligence community. These advisers and analysts, who began their work in the days after September 11, 2001, have produced a skein of intelligence reviews that have helped to shape public opinion and American policy toward Iraq. They relied on data gathered by other intelligence agencies and also on information provided by the Iraqi National Congress, or I.N.C., the exile group headed by Ahmad Chalabi. By last fall, the operation rivalled both the C.I.A. and the Pentagon’s own Defense Intelligence Agency, the D.I.A., as President Bush’s main source of intelligence regarding Iraq’s possible possession of weapons of mass destruction and connection with Al Qaeda.

*snip*

W. Patrick Lang, the former chief of Middle East intelligence at the D.I.A., said, “The Pentagon has banded together to dominate the government’s foreign policy, and they’ve pulled it off. They’re running Chalabi. The D.I.A. has been intimidated and beaten to a pulp. And there’s no guts at all in the C.I.A.”

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?030512fa_fact


What's fishy to me is that this is coming out now. Apparently Chalabi's ties to Iran have been known for a while, so I'm just wondering how/why this wasn't known/leaked earlier. (Like, before the war would've been nice.)

It is part of the Dept. of Defense. Cambone is the UnderSec for Intel. I know about the OSP which was really NOT a part of DoD but an advisory group. The DIA is part of the DoD and under rummy's aegis.

...of the Neocons began relying on the OSP for their intelligence data. The CIA was treated the same way.

Now, they're getting more than even.

I just cannot trust anything put out by this admin. Who releases info to the media from tthe DIA and does it have to be cleared with the higher ups in DoD? For the past 3 1/2 years the only truth coming out of any gov't. depts. has been leaked, not in an official press release.

This is the most political admin in history, NOTHING gets out that they don't want out unless they can't contain it, and they have managed to contain most.

:eyes:


Just because it's in the DoD doesn't mean it's "Rummy's outfit." We all know Rummy isn't all that popular in the Pentagon, and we all know the entire US intel community - which includes the DIA - has been bullied and ignored by Bush on all matters related to Iraq.

The DIA may have been more sympathetic to Chalabi than CIA or State were, but they're hardly "Rummy's outfit."



edited spelling

This bunch of unscrupulous scoundrals used Chalabi like a napkin...to DUPE the American people. They were toppling Saddam regardless...one way or another.

Perhaps what they didn't count on was Chalabi being outed as an Iranian spy.

not because he was bush's girlfriend, but because he's a crook.
there was an Iraqi poll some time ago, who would the Iraqis want as their new leader...Chalabi scored less than Saddam...

Even if it is one inspired by Iran. I have serious doubts about this claim.

what's accepted by everyone--Chilabi is indeed in trouble with us because he passed US intel to Iran. Nobody questions that he did. That much is a regular mainstream news story. (The juicy question is who gave him the intel in the first place)

:kick:

Now they have an excuse to go after the next "axis of evil".

it's not a crime to let someone make themselves look stupid. You can't attack Iran because of Bush's bad judgement.

The whole story is bullshit anyway. As if Iran would want a bunch of trigger-happy neocons setting up camp next door...

rather bizarre.

What were the odds of Iraq becoming an Iran-style theocracy two years ago?

What are those odds today?

but Chalabi's not the reason. Al Sadr's getting money and support from Iran, and there are apparently lots of Iranian infiltrators throughout the country.

I simply think that Chalabi's "gone off the reservation" and the Bush Crime Family needs to find a way to cut him loose.

is now minimal. He was only valuable as a mole in the Pentagon. He's nothing in Iraq. They all laugh at him.

It was supposed to be Chalabi who set up camp next door.

Iran gets the US to take out Saddam and install their friend Chalabi. The US then quickly realizes it basically just gave Iraq to Iran.

D'oh!

Fucking brilliant, though.

going to attack Iran's nuclear power plant just as they attacked the one in Iraq in 1981. Condi was visiting Russia not too long ago . This probability of an attack by Israel on the plant most likely was discussed, if not the focus of the meeting. It was never clear to me why Rice went there in the first place.

Should anything , even the slightest shot fired, happen in Iran due to the incompetant stupid, delusional idiot we have occupying our house, it surely would be the start of WWIII

We have Iran hemmed in--fourteen new bases being set up in Iraq--and now this tension. Who knows what is going on here. It could be a real situation, or it could be another lie--and a set up and an excuse for Israel to attack the plant, or Bush to invade after he invades Syria first. Bush, and all of them are madmen, including Sharon.

This scares me also, because with this, it is imperitive that Bush be elected and he will do anything t o get elected.

This has gotten so fucking Byzantine, I don't know what to think.

If somebody's getting played here, would you want to bet on our cast of dimwits?

been staged from the beginning. Maybe this is the last act which isn't quite finished. The curtain is still up. They are going to blame Chalabi. Point their fingers and say, See, It wasn't our fault, we were duped. Bush will never take responsibility. I will be glad when this play is over and folds overnight.

This story is huge because it says that Bush was duped by a spy for Iran which he paid millions of dollars to, and who his guys pushed for being our leader of Iraq. We went to war because Bush was duped by a con man. Do you think Bush would make this up????

It plays right to the incompetence argument that Pelosi raised this week. These guys are idiots.

Watch the media tomorrow. Let's see where this story goes.

REMEMBER: Iran was one of Bush's "axis of evil."

How sweet.

It isn't. There are no master plans anymore.

For instance, Tommy Franks described Doug Feith on the record as "the fucking dumbest person on the planet."

Powell said, on TV, that he was fed *intentionally misleading* information (presumably by the vice president's office)

This is panic and chaos. These people are not... very... bright. That's a bitter pill for the conspiracy minded, but it's true. (That's more a general observation than a comment on asjr)

I'd like to add... there is also a reason we have criminal conspiracy statues on the books. When one says the word "conspiracy," I start looking for violations of the law.

He's still loyal to the BFEE - maybe they WANT us to think Feith, and the rest of them, are stupid, and had Franks drop that tidbit for us?

I would never, ever, ever underestimate the evil and long-range planning of these men. Rumsfeld and Cheney are anything but stupid.

Iran actually has a decent population of America supporters and reformists, and I highly doubt Bush thinks he can politically survive any kind of war with Iran. If he thinks he can find the WMD's in Syria, he might go there, but I think he has pushed the tolerance of war within his own political base to the limit already.

This is bound to put Bush in the victim roll, get him some sympathy and give him an excuse to try out the new missle defence system on Iraq. This is a plot.

:eyes:

no words to describe this.

The CIA was by-passed and now we know why.

This will go down as one of the greatest intelligence failures in history.....and the most damaging.

But, BushCo wanted Iraq come hell or high water. They would have gotten WMD "evidence" somewhere else if not Chalabi. However, consider another angle--this little story may allow Bush and company to invade Iran.

I'm referring to Monday's news of the sarin shell

couldn't this also be diversionary tactic on Chalabi? I think this whole thing is about driving Chilabi from the playing field.

Chalabi gets greedy about Iraq and starts pissing of his US partners -- after all, it was to be his personal fiefdom -- and the US plays hardball to take him down and get him out of the way. This isn't to imply mean Chilabi is some innocent - he's clearly as big a bastard as painted, but as long as he was a bastard playing nice with the US he was safe (like every other US puppet state head we support around the world).

The story that Chilabi is an Iranian toady "clears" them of being responsible for the SHIT information they gave to push the war. They KNEW it was shit, but now they can point to Chalabi and say "But we trusted him!"

This general story is legit. I can't speak to the exclusive details of this post's link but the story that Chalabi had funneled us intel to Iran 'that endangered US lives' is solid.

is the Defense Department's intel group who are the ones reporting this -- you know, the guys that work for Rummie? NOT the CIA?

As I said, I have no doubt Chilabi is involved with some deeply bad things, BUT I still feel it would all be overlooked by our government so long as he was playing nice with us.

Something BIG has changed on the playing field, and we are witnessing the results.

"The intelligence source briefed on the Defense Intelligence Agency's conclusions..."

So essentially, "someone in CIA or Sate Dept. rushing to the phone after a DIA briefing"

the investigation IS the DOD:

"The Defense Intelligence Agency has concluded that a U.S.-funded arm of Ahmed Chalabi's Iraqi National Congress has been used for years by Iranian intelligence to pass disinformation to the United States and to collect highly sensitive American secrets, according to intelligence sources."

"Iranian intelligence has been manipulating the United States through Chalabi by furnishing through his Information Collection Program information to provoke the United States into getting rid of Saddam Hussein," said an intelligence source Friday who was briefed on the Defense Intelligence Agency's conclusions, which were based on a review of thousands of internal documents."

That "intelligence source" who had been briefed could be any schmuck in Rummie's group, not necessarily CIA, putting the story out as ordered. Heck, it could be someone with the OSP.

From another DUer's post, it's clear that Chalabi was known to be playing footsies with the Iranians, but it was TOLERATED, so long as he played well with us.

That is the point I'm making. The DOD is clearly trying to take out Chalabi for some reason (not being Iran), and perhaps set the stage for future action.

...they were bypassed just like the CIA was when the NeoCons in the Pentagon set up the OSP.

We also know that some senior military officers have recently been speaking out in the mainstream press against the policies put into place by the NeoCons.

And we all know that the CIA has been highly incensed following the exposure of Valerie Plame and her network.

What I think I'm seeing is the DIA, the senior military officers, and the CIA working together to ensure that the NeoCons do not retain the centers of power in November. All three groups have been blasting away via the mainstream press because of the relationship that the CIA has with the press through Operation Mockingbird.

Bottom-line? IMHO, this is VERY damaging to the NeoCons.

but I doubt it's DOD that wants it publicized. And even if it's a DIA leak most DIA are uniformed military and civil service. Either way I don't assume this is released with Rummy's blessing. I don't think Rumsfeld controls DOD anymore.

95% of people that work in the pentagon want Wolfie and Feith fragged. Probably 85% want Rummy fragged.

If DIA concludes Chalabi is a double agent they have a serious obligation to inform CIA and State. I doubt Rummy has the will to block that at this point. He's a 'survivor' so he's probably trying to figure how to pin this on Wolfie, knowing it can't be contained in DOD. (Especially if Chalabi's given Iran intel on CIA assets, which may be the case judging from how L Stahl was talking tonight)

I reject the idea that DIA has always known everything there is to know about Chalabi because that would be the only topic in the world we could say that about. These people make broad, grotesque mistakes.

Most importantly, nobody pro-Bush, even these idiots, would come up with this story intentionally. It's really damaging.

I'm not surprised to see these machinations against him coming out of DIA. After all, he was trying to undermine the Agency by establishing his own private intel network. I know some DIA folks and they loathe Rumsfeld and are incensed at everything that's going on.

If you are in a position to know details and won't reveal them, why would you post something like that?

Every newscast tonight has stories on Chalabi giving Iran damaging intel. Leslie Stahl had the juiciest report. It's probably on CBS website.

they believed him, in the face of clear and convincing evidence that he was lying.

No way this gets BushCo off the hook.

David Allen
www.thoughtcrimes.org
Distrusting the Government Since 1984

"And the rockets red glare, the bombs bursting in air". President Kerry come November.

The sad fact is, though, the corporate media won't cover this very much at all. And even if they do to some point, the sheeple won't care; they'll vote Chimp come hell or high water.

Is this story credible?? If so it could bring down not just this Administration but much of the US government besides.

Bush's mother has that same insane stare.

Hersh's other great articles in the New Yorker, these related to the way the admin totally bypassed the established intelligence process in order to collect the info it wanted to justify war. (Does the fact that I've developed a huge crush on this guy make me a hopeless political junkie geek?)

The Stovepipe, from October 2003.

Selective Intelligence, from May 2003.

Last October, an article in the Times reported that Rumsfeld had ordered up an intelligence operation “to search for information on Iraq’s hostile intentions or links to terrorists” that might have been overlooked by the C.I.A.

Too bad they missed the links to terrorism sitting right in their office.

I would suspect the DIA and CIA aren't going to be shy about spilling the beans on this one.

Won't he look just dapper in an orange jumpsuit? Cheney, on the other hand, will still look like a well fed vampire, no matter how they dress him up.

I'm just wondering if someone in the Clinton administration is somehow going to get blamed for getting us involved with Chalabi, and that Bush will be exonerated as just continuing the relationship "in good faith" since Team Clinton vouched for him.

I'm not SAYING this is the case... I'm hoping it's not, but I wonder what the timeline is.

They will find some way to blame Clinton.

Hey, welcome to DU!
:hi:

The INC and Chalabi started getting paid in 2000, but our intelligence officials were always wary of him and didn't trust him. Fortunatly, or good pals in the Bush administration, did, so they put him on the payroll, used his phony intelligence, and ignored the warnings about him.

...that he had with the PNAC-laden Bush admin. Besides, this probably goes back to Bush I.

Charles Krauthammer said Clinton is the one who started funding Chalabi.

Nina Totenberg pointed out that Clinton also cut him off in 1997.

:)

...Chalabi to buttress their case for attacking Iraq while Clinton was President. Clinton was not swayed by the NeoCons and refuded to do as they asked. When Clinton learned about Chalabi he ordered that Chalabi be cut-off in 1997.

Of course this is Clinton's fault. Who else?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x1643886

AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA

This is a major fuck up. You would really understand if you read Clarke's book. Iran was our enemy. They really were our enemy up to a few years ago. They were after us the way the Soviets were, just without the resources. We have lost an embarrassing battle to Iran here. This is HUGE.

to have a puppet Government installed.

The irony here is too rich.

http://broadscapeventures.com/weblog/dfme/archives/000537.html

In private meetings, Brooke reassured Iranian officials that the Bush administration is not thinking of attacking Iran or of changing its regime so long as Iran acts responsibly and cooperates with the United States in effecting a smooth transition to democracy in the region. On March 16, just two days after Iran officially rejected America’s war on Iraq, the Iranian National Security Council decided to adopt a position that tallies with US strategy. It quietly decided to participate in American efforts to effect “regime change” in Baghdad. That was how the enigmatic Francis Brooke succeeded in laying the groundwork for a new Iranian-American relationship in the post-Saddam era.

...the neocons, the Iranians, and the Likudniks all collaborated on lying to achieve a common goal. Congratulations to them, and to Bush, for also doing Ossamas bidding in the process.


TREASON! TREASON! RUN THESE SONS A BITCHES OUT ON A RAIL BEFORE THEY GET US ALL KILLED!!!!

Truer words have not been spoken. Bush is going to get us fucked up!

went she reported this tonight. She said they had CREDIBLE sources that Chalabi gave intel to Iran.

who gave US intel to Chalabi (a non-US citizen) in the first place?

Sources have told Stahl a high-level investigation is underway into who in the U.S. government gave Chalabi such sensitive information in the first place.

In addition, sources told Stahl that one of Chalabi's closest confidantes — a senior member of his organization, the Iraqi national congress — is believed to have been recruited by Iran's intelligence agency, the Ministry of Information and Security (MOIS) — and is on their payroll.

According to Talking Points Memo:

Much of the charges we're seeing here have been out there for some time, though not with quite the specifics or with such gravity. Chalabi's ties with Iran have been known (and winked at) for years; claims that he was sharing sensitive US info with them have been out there for at least a few months.

So the fact that Chalabi has been passing info on to Iran isn't necessarily new. However, this idea that Chalabi was part of a long-term Iranian intelligence operation, possibly one that deliberately tried to get the US to take out Saddam for Iran...holy fucking shit.

U.S. officials say Ahmad Chalabi, the man some American officials had considered a potential leader of post-war Iraq, may have passed secret information to the Iranian government.
The revelation comes during a week in which the Iraqi Governing Council member's home and office were searched and his monthly $340,000 Pentagon stipend abruptly cut off.
The officials say there is evidence that Mr. Chalabi, a secular Shi'ite Muslim who heads the Iraqi National Congress party, and some of his aides, supplied Tehran with highly sensitive information on U.S. security operations in Iraq.
A report by U.S. television network CBS quotes senior American officials as saying the information was so sensitive it could "get Americans killed." CBS says a high-level investigation is under way into who in the U.S. government gave Mr. Chalabi such classified information in the first place.
<snip>
http://www.voanews.com/article.cfm?objectID=51F7713B-0472-4E5A-95ADFFDA95A9BC4F

Members of Iraq's Governing Council condemned a raid on the house and offices of Washington's former top Iraq ally Ahmad Chalabi and said on Friday it was orchestrated by the U.S.-led administration.
Three officials who attended a meeting of the U.S.-appointed Governing Council told Reuters its members held the Coalition Provisional Authority (CPA) responsible for Thursday's raid.
The council would demand an explanation from the CPA, two of the officials said.
<snip>
Some members of the council, which is to be dissolved on June 30 when Washington formally transfers sovereignty to Iraqis, were set to resign over the raids, people who attended the meeting said.
http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=5223003

I guess the CPA originally packed the Governing Council with Chalabi's friends.

If the CIA is leaking this, perhaps it's true that they are working with the DIA's info on Chalabi.

Still, the PNAC Klan knew the claims of WMD/Osama ties were bullshit. Hell, I knew the claims were bullshit. If Iran did pass any info to Chalabi to be passed to the U.S. - which I'm not sure I believe - it still wouldn't matter, because b*shco knew the intel was useless.

Of course, this makes a wonderful setup for invading, or at least attacking, Iran. Perhaps the latter, to draw Iran into a fight and widen the war.

Gee, there's a fun thought.

letters from Nigeria - you know the ones that begin.."I am the wife of the former Minister of Oil and he had $45 million in an account before he was tortured to death etc etc.

For a cut of $10 million all you have to do is provide our bank account information and a blank signed letterhead. You would have to be terminally idiotic to even begin to believe it.

The Bush administration got their Nigerian letter from Chalabi and swallowed it hook, line and sinker.

:)

Just a new kid on the block.

...is saying that Bush and the neocons were DUPED into the attack on Iraq by Iran!!!!!!!!"

Read what you posted again, remembering that the DIA is the DOD personal intel organ -- the DOD, where Rummie and every other civilian Defense Department employee who has gotten us into this mess resides.

Now, which is easier to explain away?

That our very own DOD was solely responsible for LYING to us to get us into an illegal invasion of Iraq?

Or

That our intel guys fucked up and were "duped" by that Iranian-loving Chalabi?

I suspect the administration would prefer the second.

There is NOTHING about Chalabi that the DIA didn't know about him before the invasion.

The idea that a memeber of the axis of evil played us to enter an unpopular and probably losing war is an incredible coup for Iran.

There is no way to spin this. Maybe they lied to us for our own good, but it's impossible to argue they were duped by Iran for our own good.

I believe Rumsfeld got his intelligence from the Office of Special Plans. I am under the impression that what has angered our domestic intelligence agencies so much is that Bush* and Cheney ignored their intelligence and made decisions based on selective intelligence processed by the Department of Special Plans, tailored to influence Americans to believe what the Administration wanted them to believe.

Looks to me like today's revelations by the DIA is an I-told-you-so the Administration doesn't want to hear. Could this be what prompted Colin Powell's earlier apology -- the knowledge that this story was going to hit big?

<http://www.dia.mil/This/index.html>

Excerpt:

"The Defense Intelligence Agency is a Department of Defense combat support agency and an important member of the United States Intelligence Community. With over 7000 military and civilian employees worldwide, DIA is a major producer and manager of foreign military intelligence. We provide military intelligence to warfighters, defense policymakers and force planners, in the Department of Defense and the Intelligence Community, in support of U.S. military planning and operations and weapon systems acquisition."


Also, please read my post #100...I believe our thinking is very similar on this topic.

hahahahaha

PS Chalabi met with "nefarious" Iranians

This is some crazy stuff, I can't get past how much shit Bush and Co. are in.

While I am convinced Chalabi and Company are cons, crooks and would sell their grandmothers to the highest bidder, what is now page one?

While I know the DOJ under Rumsfeld is despicable and treasonous, what is now on page one?

Anybody notice a Rovian pattern yet again? Surely they have known for some time that Chalabi is a rat bastard who would sell them out. But they kept paying him and patting him on the head until they needed a big diversion. It's not like they haven't thrown people to the wolves before when they needed a diversion from some cluster fuck they couldn't duck responsibility for.

They were on the ropes about the prison abuse, the Berg 'beheading' was getting dicey and magically there is evidence that Chalabi is a lying cheat? Hells bells, we've been saying that all along. But they sure changed page one when they needed to, didn't they?

Bush & Co. "got played" thing doesn't set with me -- this is about something entirely different.

Diversion?

Double-double cross?

Who knows, but it stinks to high heaven.

IS CHALABI A TRAITOR?

Mansoor Ijaz is going total apeshit.

despite warnings from the State department and CIA.

Good job Bush!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x1643886

If I heard Mansoor Ijaz correctly, he said Iran now knows who and where they are, where our troops are, our plans and intentions.

Total FUBAR. And potentially mortal, as reported earlier. Unfortunate that there is so much "How to Torture in 10 EZ Steps" video going around.

and now they are all in danger because our stupid neocon administration had their heads up their asses.

Way to do the axis of evil's work, Bush!

Goddamn neocons.

plans to keep operataing when Kerry is president. He will sell out anyone. (Remeber when he was a big Clinton supporter? I do. He's gross.

Business partners with James Woolsey, source of the "Sudan wanted to turn over bin Laden but Clinton refused" myth, and involved in the chain of events that led to Daniel Pearl's death.

Read more on the guy here: http://globalresearch.ca/articles/KUP310A.html

to initiate a war in Iran. Nothing in politcs happens by mistake, things are gonna get ugly folks.

:kick:

it's not looking to good at this moment. *feeling very uneasy lately*

I've suspected for quite some time that Bushco is deliberately "fucking up" in Iraq -- shutting down Sadr's paper, fanning the flames of the insurrection, leaking out the abuse pictures ...

in order to lure Iran into the fight, and why?

So Bush can nuke Iran.

This is why we need to take the keys away from the crazy driver before anyone else gets killed.

They can easily stage attacks anywhere they want (even here) and blame it on Iran.

Bushco needs a new war, a new enemy, in order to stay in power.

This is just the ticket

Karim, according to a 2001 article in the respected Intelligence Newsletter, had been selected by Washington to help prepare for the overthrow of Hussein. He is the son of the former secretary-general of the Democratic Party of Kurdistan.

Shortly after the Ayatollah Komeinei assumed power in Iran, Karim began espousing fundamentalist Shia ideas and fled Iraq to take refuge in Iran.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/ny-wochal213812290may21,0,2706636.story?coll=ny-top-span-headlines

SEPTEMBER 1999, pages 17-18

Special Report




Using “Secret Evidence” Based on Translation, Transcription Errors, U.S. Orders Two Iraqi Kurds Deported

By Betty Molchany
In October 1996, over 6,500 Iraqis were flown by the U. S. government to Guam, and then in March 1997 to California, to escape President Saddam Hussain after U.S. Central Intelligence Agency efforts to build up an anti-Saddam network in Iraqi Kurdistan collapsed with the appearance of Iraqi troops in the area. Upon their arrival in Guam, the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service (INS) imprisoned some of these same Iraqis, despite their having worked with the CIA, and put them through exclusionary proceedings, based upon secret charges, secret evidence, and secret witnesses. Among these imprisoned Iraqis were two brothers who were subsequently ordered to be deported to Iraq, where both have been sentenced to death.


Background Prior to Arrival in the United States
Dr. Ali Yassin Mohammad Karim and his brother, Mohammad Yassin Mohammad Karim, Iraqi Kurds, were brought to California in March 1997 by the United States government and placed in an immigration detention center there, where they continue to be imprisoned.

In Iraq, Dr. Ali Karim had served with the Iraqi National Congress (INC), a group formed and working with the CIA to depose and replace the president of Iraq. Dr. Karim provided medical care to the INC and the CIA. He also wrote and delivered daily political commentary on the INC radio broadcast system, of which he was the manager. Never in his life did he carry or use a firearm, nor did he serve in any military capacity.

Mohammad Karim, not being in a profession, was compelled to serve in the Iraqi military, but as a non-combatant. During the Iraq-Iran war, he witnessed atrocities committed against fellow Kurds. He was so traumatized by his experiences that his family had him given eight electrical shock treatments which ultimately caused the loss of much of his memory. He suffers from severe clinical depression and is now more like a child who needs continued medical care and the assistance of another. He and “Dr. Ali” are fluent in English.

more
http://www.wrmea.com/backissues/0999/9909017.html

Chalabi to CPA: "Relationship is non-existent."
BAGHDAD — By now, many of you know about the raid today on Ahmed Chalabi’s house and two offices of the INC in Baghdad at about 9:30 a.m. local time. Some evidence and weapons were confiscated, senior Coalition officials said, and “several” people were arrested. There was no resistance, officials said, but footage after the raid showed that the place had been trashed.

The official line is that this was an Iraqi police procedure, with search and arrest warrants handed down by an Iraqi judge after CPA head Paul Bremer referred an allegation 10 months ago to the Central Criminal Court of Iraq. The charges include fraud, kidnapping and “associated matters.” (No expansion on that.)


There have been some crimes and incidents that have been acted by Iraqi personnel, and those incidents took place against Iraqis. A small group of people were detained by these criminals and tortured. And also, there have been a number of incidents of kidnapping and also killing someone because — for personal purposes. And in addition to that, they have also captured — or they have just took over some of the government facilities. And those people have been — there was a warrant of capturing and seizing those people, but unfortunately, it was not possible to capture them. They are now — away from the law — they are outlaws.

Abdullah Araji

Azid Samir Aziz

Amar Mohammed Raib

Vafir Mohammed Raib

Aras Habib — possibly Aras Habib Karim, a colonel in the FIF and close associated of Chalabi. He may have been the man in charge of the INC’s quest to hunt down former high-level Ba’athists in Iraq

Dezi Mavi

Hassan Mahad

Dr. Hamam
Senior Coalition officials mentioned that several people listed in the arrest warrants involving the INC offices were not arrested because they were not there; the above list is apparently those people. Judge Al-Moathin took no questions.]

People on the scene of the raid report U.S. tanks being used to back up the Iraqi cops. Senior Coalition officials, in a background briefing, said they had no knowledge of this and referred all questions to the investigating officers of the Iraqi Police force. At today’s 6 p.m. briefing chief CPA spokesman Dan Senor resolutely refused to address any details about the raid, also referring reporters to the Iraqi police force and the investigative judge.

Chalabi, predictably, was pretty pissed off. “When America treats its friends this way then they are in big trouble,” Chalabi said on CNN. “My relationship with the Coalition Provisional Authority now is non-existent.”

“Let my people go,” he — incredibly, and tastelessly — said at his press conference. “Let my people be free.”
http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:4MnPJALKd5IJ:www.back-to-iraq.com/+Aras+Karim+Habib&hl=en

NIELS FRENZEN: The government collected these allegations and then stopped -- accepted these allegations as true. There was no investigation done. They gathered raw information; they put it down on a piece of paper; they improperly and perhaps illegally stamped "secret" on this piece of paper, and then they condemned our clients.

JEFFREY KAYE: The defense points to newly released accusations against Dr. Karim, which they say show government misunderstanding and confusion. The government says Dr. Karim deceived them by not revealing his true last name is "Al-Ufayli." Government records show that nobody with the Al-Ufayli name was supposed to be processed to come to the U.S. to avoid admitting relatives of this man - Aras Habib Mohammed Karim, now living in London. The government believes he is an Iranian agent, a charge he denies, and that is real family name is "Al-Ufayli." Although Dr. Karim admits being related, he says he never lied about his last name, which is at the center of the government's case against him.
http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:DJ6cNWBUrGMJ:www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/middle_east/july-dec98/iraq_9-4.html+Aras+Karim+Habib&hl=en


Convicted in absentia in Jordan for his part in an massive embezzlement=20
> scandal, Chalabi received up to $12 million from Washington after the firs=
t=20
> Gulf war.=20
>=20
> He will be working with Reilly (see power-brokers) on broadcasting and=20
> communications in the new Iraq. Often referred to as "Cheney's prot=E9g=
=E9'',=20
> he is unpopular in Iraq and loathed by Colin Powell's state department. He=
=20
> has also fallen out of favour with the CIA, which in the early 1990s funde=
d=20
> the INC to the tune of $325,000 a month. However, in a recent trip to=20
> Israel, organised by Jinsa, he tried to warm up relations regarding Iraq's=
=20
> post-regime change. Other Iraqis involved in a future government -- at the=
=20
> behest of Wolfowitz -- include INC members Salem Chalabi (Chalabi's nephew=
)=20
> and Aras Habib. Habib's cousin, Dr Ali Yassin Karim, a former medic with=20
> the CIA, was nearly kicked out of the agency but was saved by the CIA's=20
> James Woolsey. Wolfowitz also wants jobs to go to Chalabi's friends Tamara=
=20
> Daghestani and Goran Talebani.=20
>=20
> Zalmay Khalilzad=20
>=20
> Afghanistan-born Khalilzad is Bush's special envoy to Afghanistan and Iraq=
=20
> and has a wide variety of oil interests. He co-wrote an article on Saddam,=
=20
> entitled Overthrow Him, with Wolfowitz, his former boss. A consultant with=
=20
> the oil company Unocal, he was pushing for a natural gas pipeline in=20
> Afghanistan during the Taliban regime, and worked under Condoleezza Rice=20
> when she served as director of Chevron. He is also a close associate of=20
> George Shultz, and encouraged Schultz to use Iran to help topple Saddam. H=
e=20
> is a former Rand Corp employee and a charter member of the PNAC.=20
>=20
> (In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, this material is=20
> distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in=
=20
> receiving the included information for research and educational purposes.)=
http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:BE0iuIO5MzoJ:www.uwsa.com/pipermail/uwsa/2003q2/036803.html+Aras+Karim+Habib&hl=en

He will be working with Reilly (see power-brokers) on broadcasting and communications in the new Iraq. Often referred to as “Cheney’s protégé”, he is unpopular in Iraq and loathed by Colin Powell’s state department. He has also fallen out of favour with the CIA, which in the early 1990s funded the INC to the tune of $325,000 a month. However, in a recent trip to Israel, organised by Jinsa, he tried to warm up relations regarding Iraq’s post-regime change. Other Iraqis involved in a future government – at the behest of Wolfowitz – include INC members Salem Chalabi (Chalabi’s nephew) and Aras Habib. Habib’s cousin, Dr Ali Yassin Karim, a former medic with the CIA, was nearly kicked out of the agency but was saved by the CIA’s James Woolsey. Wolfowitz also wants jobs to go to Chalabi’s friends Tamara Daghestani and Goran Talebani.

http://www.veteransforpeace.org/The_power_brokers_041303.htm

This story has got my grey cells reeling.

BuschCo and his Media pals will spin it to their favor somehow unless as some people have been saying that the Media is taking a negative turn toward BushCo.

progress, very good progress, and, yes, Chalabi was last in the country as a young boy in the 50's, but he is first, was, in the thoughts, he understands the Iraqi people he never knew, and, anyway I have always listened to my mother and you should too, god bless this country we are making up progress, making it up as we go.........we interrupt this platitude for further platitudes.
PIECES IS AT HAND. Abu me your grhaib! Go USA Go USA.

<end>>>

Better get him strung up, and good, before November!

Can it?

is it the Ayatollah's Revenge?

If this weren't so damned serious, I swear the DNC hired John Le Carre to write this scenario for them. This is just the kind of "twist" he'd incorporate into his plot.

As a Le Carre fan, it's positively delicious! As an American I am pissed and nonplussed.

The Iranians got us to do their dirty work for them! They got rid of Hussein, threw Iraq into chaos, got the US to waste hundreds of billions of dollars while antagonising the rest of the world, and set up the perfect scenario for creating a Shiite state in Iran controlled from Teheran.

Do these guys know how to play chess or do they? Brilliant, absolutely brilliant... damn it!

-------------------------------
EVWorld.Com -- The Future In Motion(sm)
http://www.evworld.com

Their record over the past few years is that they can't do anything competently and plotting anything convoluted is way beyond them. They have been blinded by ideology from day one and they've believed everything and anything that they wanted to be true.

In contrast, Chalabi may be a major league sleazebag but he's also smart and isn't blinded by ideology.

This means that Saddam was deposed at Iran's behest.

Somehow lacks that ring, with Shrub's Jesus-coated brain and all.

What was the President told, and when was he told it?

Nah.

It's just hard to make the buck stop at a child in emperor's clothing.

Have the idiots in charge and the mouth breathers that empower them ever read any history of the region? Of course not.
If this story pans out, then tip your hat to the Iranians, thank them for the lesson, and get the fuck out. Ac 130 gunships and cluster bombs are no match for good old fashioned espionage.
America, you've been punk'd.

Just gave em an excuse.

After reading all the previous messages since my original post, a few thoughts occurred to me.

* I do not believe that the Bush regime will get away with saying something to the effect that "We believed Chalabi, don't blame us." The whole concept underlying Bush's claim to the office is that he and his followers are guided by great moral principles, that, therefore, if they do make any mistakes, they are so inconsequential as to be not worth remembering. Blaming Chalabi is an admission of a tremendous mistake, an error in judgement. It would be the final, humiliating confession that WMD do not exist and never will be found.

* Recall the things Bush said after his first meeting with Putin. How he look into his soul, blah, blah, blah. Admitting that Chalabi fooled him is something that will devastate Bush's self image ... this is personal - George cannot be suckered, right? ... He'll continue to live his delusion and insist that what's important is that he means what he says and stays resolved.

*Chalabi, as I recollect, is 90 percent a PNAC creation. And his detractors have been pointing out his fraudulent nature, his Jordanian conviction, for years. It is not like Perle and Cheney and Wolfowitz couldn't have known about him. They wanted to be fooled ... they were ... And if and when we find out what kind of "highly classified" intelligence found its way to Iran via Chalabi -- they stand within an eyelash of TREASON!

*I too, am concerned that the corporate media will not pay sufficient attention to this -- photos of torture make a 'sexier' story. We all need to spread this story around; post it, e-mail it to every web site we can think of ... it is a matter of showing that real people understand how important this is.

You are right - it is HUGE!!!

:kick:

He looks SOOOOOOOOOOOOO Iranian that this came as NO shock to me. Didn't anyone else see the Iranian features?? My knowing this scares even me. It's not easy being right alllll the time.

Get busy, missy! I am dying to find out what you think is really going on...

It's still 9:00 in Cali. She should be up.

Part of this is about the tectonic power shifting going on in DC now.

Three-legged racers bumping and tripping one another.


OT - Woodward on Charlie Rose now.

Or am I wrong?

the NEWSDAY article will have to be verified by everyone before they run with it. The "we were punked by Iran" stories may get going in the Sunday papers. I want to see if Chalabi cancells his MTP appearance.

I'm not aware that he's an american citizen. Trator to Iraqi's for getting rid of Saddam?

Just asking. :)

(insert tongue to cheek here)
:shrug:

various parts of the government, particularly those relating to intelligence, foreign policy and the military have decided that they are going to do their utmost to sink the neocons and by default, the Bush administration.

They've seen their work and their professionalism negated by a bunch of out of control idealistic lunatics and it's time for revenge.

Josh Marshall has some interesting takes on this today as well as in previous posts.

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/

Next time a repuke says anything about Pelosi owing an apology she ought to just hold up this Newsday article and say not unless you can explain this.

Also if the Iranian Intelligence was playing the OSP, Cheney, Rummy, Feith and ultimately Junior*, who ELSE has been playing them, huh?

reported that Pelosi said Bush's POLICIES are incompetent.

HEY NPR!!!! HOW DO POLICIES GET IMBUED WITH A HUMAN CHARACTERIZATION?????? LIKE INCOMPETENCE???

HOW DO THE WORDS "BUSH IS INCOMPETENT" SOUND LIKE SOMETHING ELSE TO YOUR EARS, NPR???

REPORT WHAT PELOSI SAID YOU NPR SCUM!!!!!!

The story seems to achieve three things

- get rid of troublesome Chalabi.
- pin the war on Iran (and thus not Bush).
- set up cause for next war (they cost the U.S. lives, money, and international reputation, so let's get 'em).

Sure, it looks like they are saying they got played, but after a while they will spin it as the big reason to invade the perfidious Iranians.

It seems like standard PNAC stuff. I guess I don't trust any agency of the U.S. government to tell a straight story anymore. The idea that Chalabi and the Iranians talked Bush into invading Iraq against his own judgment seems laughable. Read the PNAC document - they have been advocating this for years.

In an article about the oil-for-food scandal on Monday, Times reporter Judith Miller wrote with co-author Susan Sachs that there was a "practical question of access to thousands of documents that remain in the hands of individual Governing Council members 'like Ahmad Chalabi ... a former exile who returned with the strong backing of many Bush administration officials.' "

Was this an effort by Miller, E&P asked, "to distance herself from the Iraqi National Congress (INC) leader with whom she had such a close working relationship during the long period of her misreporting on weapons of mass destruction in Iraq?"

Chalabi, E&P explained, "had been not only the favorite of the Pentagon to govern Iraq; he was Miller's as well."



E&P wondered who at the Times is protecting Miller from the consequences of her allegedly flawed reporting.

She was, E&P charged, "up to her eyeballs in hyping misinformation resulting from a highly suspect intelligence operation run by a foreign exile group," which the magazine said had led to the U.S. invasion of Iraq.
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/5/20/145600.shtml

The story failed to note that Chalabi was a key Times source, however.

It's that simple.

Whistleass goes to GOP Congress, sez it's under control. Whistleass scheduled to make some sort of announcement on Monday, after we've been chewing on this for a weekend. And by "we've" I mean the sheep and the media--which is about the same, come to think of it.

They had to do something. Who ya gonna fry? Rummy? Generals? Tenet (who has some major hole card--that's not going to happen)? Or just claim they've been duped, and, oh, by the way, our axis of evil buddy Iran did it. Line up that shot.

Expect a big WTF from Iran, and maybe even from other country's spooks.

Iran is hands off with this whole fucking thing. (They seem to have the good sense to remember that old adage: don't get between a drunk/crazy/stupid man and his nuclear arsenal rapture.) A lot like Kerry (the next president, I might add). Why attack your enemy when he does such a good job himself? Or in this case, why gather intelligence when there is none to be found.

Here's where Rove is at: Heads needed to roll. That's been clear since their "torture is thumb's up" got public; Bushco was playing a long shot that "we" and the sheep were so complacent that it would lose legs to news cycles like the boy who punched the alligator or swarms of locusts and what not.

That horse didn't place or show. The dog didn't hunt either (in case anybody's keeping track).

Bushco is pretty damn screwy with applying the axe. They fear firing anybody, ever, because that contravenes their absolute guiding principal which is also the neo-first-commandment: "we are never wrong." This is notably unlike how most conservatives run big business, or other Presidents have run the White House. The axe should have been falling since 9/11. The axe is rusty, the axeman split for Vegas. No one knows for sure where he left the fricken' axe. Maybe Paul O'Neil or Ari made off with it.

This is not to say that Rove is incapable of getting in over his head--he's in pretty damn deep for an ambitious fat boy. And, there's an undertow: some part of the CIA, some part of the old guard GOP, and some part of DoD. Hint of riptide from State, but just maybe.

So, the surf is up. Does Chalabi and evil evil Iran get stuck holding the tiki torch, while Cheney on down to Rummy make off with the clams? What happens to Feith and Wolfy and the OSP crowd? Are they no longer the cool kids? Well, we have to wait for the next fricken episode because no one has told us, yet, who so conveniently waxed Chalabi's board.

Yeah, we, the we I don't put in quotes, know the whole story about that already, but maybe by Monday we get to see if Rove can float. That Fucker.

Right, done with metaphors, back to (maybe also badly) mixing drinks.

I'll drink to that!
:toast: :kick:

Something about being fooled into the war by Iran....and we said that this was going to be their excuse to invade yet another country.

Whether you're Saddam Hussein or his mortal enemy, eventually these guys turn on everyone.

They have been playing BushCo like a violin....they will have an Islamic government in Iraq on our dime, and bleed the beast too.

God they are idiots. If Osama could vote, he's be Bush all the way!

Just look at what it says.

The entire reason for invading iraq was not only false, it came not from our intel agencies, but from an enemy.

In spite of what our intel said, they took the word of a convicted felon over all our professionals.

The entire administration was led by the nose into doing not what was best for america, but what was wanted by iran.

As a result, iraq looks like it will be not a democracy, but a satelite of tehran.

It cost almost eight hundred american lives so far, and enough money to give every american health care and put all our children thru college.

And there is a traitor in the administration who gave top secret intel to our enemy, which likely cost american lives.

America is not only a pariah in the eyes of the world, it is an idiot pariah.

Folks this will not go away. This cannot be spun away.

This is the kind of thing that brings down governments.

ministries in Iraq. This means that Iran has their fingers in most of the Iraqi pies already. Have we handed Iraq to the Iranians on a plate?

Oh, the tangled webs that we weave.

We pretend to distance ourselves from Chalabi so that it gives the appearance of independence once he takes over Iraq. In truth, Chalabi will be Carlyle's puppet (like Saddam was) until we find we no longer need him.

Sad thing is people will fall for this.

It's so obvious - that's why they raided Chalabi's place.

This smells of a set-up.

We can barely maintain the troops we already have in Iraq, and then only by "drafting" folks who have served their time. It would take a larger assault force for Iran than it did for Iraq.

We could bomb them, or we could nuke them, but invading them ain't an option.

If this is true, Iranian Intelligence ran an operation with access to the highest levels of our Government, sponsored by Cabinet-level officials, and WE PAID FOR IT!!

If true, this will make Watergate look like a minor indescretion...

If true, this will make 9/11 a minor intelligence failure.

If true, we are all wearing a blue dress now...

....and see what Kerry makes of this.

He DOES have the best foreign policy minds in his camp. Holbrooke, Joe Wilson, Rand Beers, Wes Clark, etc.

I'll take my cue from them.

And glory be, Richard Perle was on Nightline tonight dissing chalabi when Chalabi has been his own groomed main man.

Drop the Chalabi!

Shouldn't this prompt another look at the possibility the anthrax attacks were intended to goad us into invading Iraq two years ago??

Wolfowitz has wanted an invasion of Iraq since at least 1992...


http://www.tompaine.com/articles/the_chalabi_plot.php


The Chalabi Plot?
May 21, 2004


Could it be, could it, that the U.S. attack on the portly fraud Ahmad Chalabi, will—intentionally or not—help Chalabi emerge as a hero in post-June 30 Iraq? Maybe not exactly, but there is more to the story than meets the eye. Certainly, Chalabi seems guilty of maintaining a secret relationship with the intelligence service of the Islamic Republic of Iran, and many news accounts report that Chalabi passed highly sensitive information to Iran that, CBS reports , could “get Americans killed.” That’s enough to get the CIA, which apparently led the raid against him, to hit him hard. But there is more. Let’s look at some of the pieces.

-more

I hope not, because that'd be just about the stupidest theory I've heard all day. After all, the strain was proven to come from inside America, and it got sent to Democrats.

if the anthrax attack was an attempt to set Saddam up right after 9/11. The chances of the anthrax coming from Iran are nil, but it's acquisition, the attempt to reproduce it (resulting in the clumpy, inneffective samples in Florida and New York), and the final deployment of the remaining original sample could have been directed from there.

-This sort of info in a PRESS RELEASE?
-Fox reporting on it at length?
-It is well known that Bushco needs to find a way to give Chalabi some cred with the Iraqis. What better way than connecting him to Iran? Especially with the Shi'ites.
-What about the reports coming out of Tehran about the US planting WMD in Iraq? Bushco on the offense here?
-Desperate to get the torture photos off front pages? What the hell happened to the NORAD portion of the 911 hearings? Joe Wilson? Do we now have another country to invade/bomb? Part of a pullout strategy?
-When the going gets tough, pugs ALWAYS play the victim.
-A way to prop up Rumsfield or a way to throw the dirty bathwater out with him?

Stinks to high heavens, IMO.

I may be wrong, it won't be the first time, but seems to me that the political "hit" they take by having an Iranian mole picking their (our) pockets, literally and figuratively, outweighs any minor credibility Chalabi might gain. Iraqis didn't flock to him a year ago, and haven't since.

They are smarter than Chickenhawks, they don't trust him.

Chalabi, Aristide and maybe Chavez are on their way!


and

Will the American people wake up now? Will they realize that bush and his cohorts are chickenshit idiots?

These boards sure do move fast. I am new but posted quite a lot overnight. The earlier threads here on the same topic get lost track of really soon. Here is the link to what I posted earlier about how Syria and Iran have always been the next targets and were announced as such in Israeli newspaper in February 2003 by US Undersecretary of State John Bolton:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x576294#576319

By Bob Drogin Times Staff Writer

WASHINGTON — Ahmad Chalabi, the onetime White House favorite who has been implicated in an alleged Iranian spy operation, sent Iraqi defectors to at least eight Western spy services before the war in an apparent effort to dupe them about Iraqi President Saddam Hussein (news - web sites)'s illicit weapons programs, current and former U.S. intelligence officials said.


U.S. investigators are seeking to determine whether the effort — which one U.S. official likened to an attempt to "game the system" — was secretly supported by Iran's intelligence service to help persuade the Bush administration to oust the regime in Baghdad, Tehran's longtime enemy.


Officials said other evidence indicated that Chalabi's intelligence chief had furnished Iran's Ministry of Intelligence and Security with highly classified information on U.S. troop movements, top-secret communications, plans of the U.S.-led Coalition Provisional Authority and other closely guarded material on U.S. operations in Iraq (news - web sites).


~snip~

Because even friendly spy services rarely share the identities of their informants or let outsiders meet or debrief their sources, it has only in recent months become clear that Chalabi's group sent defectors with inaccurate or misleading information to Denmark, England, Italy, France, Germany, Spain and Sweden, as well as to the United States, the officials said.

~snip~
more: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=2026&ncid=716&e=29&u=/latimests/20040523/ts_latimes/suspicionofchalabideceptionintensifies