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Marines admit abuse at second prison - Electricity used to torture inmate

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NNN0LHI

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Sat May-22-04 06:05 PM
Original message

Marines admit abuse at second prison - Electricity used to torture inmate

Edited on Sat May-22-04 06:09 PM by NNN0LHI

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/world/iraq/20040522-9999-1n22marines1.html

While world attention was focused on the scandal at Abu Ghraib prison, two Marines were court-martialed May 14 for abusing an Iraqi prisoner with electricity, it was disclosed yesterday.

Five more Marines have been implicated in the same early April incident at a Marine-run detention facility and might face charges, according to Marine officials in Iraq.

Andrew J. Sting and Jeremiah J. Trefney, both 19 and privates first class assigned to the 2nd Battalion, 2nd Marine Regiment at Camp Lejeune, N.C., pleaded guilty to charges that included cruelty and maltreatment for shocking an unruly prisoner, according to a Marine statement in response to questions from The San Diego Union-Tribune. snip

Sting, Trefney and three other Marines concocted a plan to shock a detainee with 110-volt electricity as he returned to his cell from the bathroom. The prisoner was targeted for punishment because he was loud and had thrown trash out of his cell.

"The Marines attached wires to a power converter and pressed the live wires against the body of the detainee to create a shock," according to the Marine statement.

more

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happyending

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Sat May-22-04 06:11 PM
Response to Original message

1. worse and worse

I wonder if the network news will cover this story.

Vote Torture.
Vote Bush.

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okcdem

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Sat May-22-04 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #1

2. Man, not the Marines

I really, really thought they were better than that.

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kalian

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Sat May-22-04 06:44 PM
Response to Reply #2

18. You're kidding, right?

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okcdem

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Sat May-22-04 07:18 PM
Response to Reply #18

26. No

I really believed this sort of abuse would not happen with Marines. Untrained Army reservists OK, but Marines, NO WAY! Guess I was wrong.

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UpInArms

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Sat May-22-04 07:29 PM
Response to Reply #26

27. this is what happens when

Edited on Sat May-22-04 07:29 PM by UpInArms

leadership fails.

We are all mourning the dreadful realities that have been revealed to be factual and much more widespread and worse than our worst nightmares.

Our country - what little was left - has disappeared before our eyes and we are horrified.

Does this make us all - and I speak even for those that have worked night and day to oust the usurpers - "Good Americans"?

edited to add: Welcome to DU okcdem!

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happyending

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Sat May-22-04 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #27

28. darn

You're right UpInArms.

I forgot.

Welcome to DU okcdem!

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jimshoes

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Sat May-22-04 06:13 PM
Response to Original message

3. More bad apples

or just a frat prank? BTW who ordered that punishment?

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xultar

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Sat May-22-04 06:49 PM
Response to Reply #3

22. When the apple cart tipped they sure rolled far...farther than Abu Grib

and there's sure a hell of a lot more than a few...

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maddezmom

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Sat May-22-04 06:14 PM
Response to Original message

4. must've missed this news...anyone else see it anywhere?

:eyes:

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maddezmom

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Sat May-22-04 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #4

7. is this the first mention of the Al Mahmudiya prison ? n/t

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NNN0LHI

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Sat May-22-04 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #7

10. Google search results for "Al Mahmudiya prison"

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=%22Al+Mahmudiya+prison%22&btnG=Google+Search

Your search - "Al Mahmudiya prison" - did not match any documents.

Suggestions:
- Make sure all words are spelled correctly.
- Try different keywords.
- Try more general keywords.

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gottaB

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Sat May-22-04 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #7

25. seems like a lot of things get disappeared in Mahmudiya

Farah Fadhil was only 18 when she was killed. An American soldier threw a grenade through the window of her apartment. Her death, early last Monday, was slow and agonising. Her legs had been shredded, her hands burnt and punctured by splinters of metal, suggesting that the bright high-school student had covered her face to shield it from the explosion.

She had been walking to the window to try to calm an escalating situation; to use her smattering of English to plead with the soldiers who were spraying her apartment building with bullets.

But then a grenade was thrown and Farah died. So did Marwan Hassan who, according to neighbours, was caught in the crossfire as he went looking for his brother when the shooting began.

What is perhaps most shocking about their deaths is that the coalition troops who killed them did not even bother to record details of the raid with the coalition military press office. The killings were that unremarkable. What happened in Mahmudiya last week should not be forgotten, for the story of this raid is also the story of the dark side of the US-led occupation of Iraq, of the violent and sometimes lethal raids carried out apparently beyond any accountability.

Farah tried to plead with the US troops but she was killed anyway....

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UpInArms

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Sat May-22-04 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #4

9. didn't see it earlier,

but went looking - only place quickly found was SignOnSanDiego

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/military/20040413-1926-ca-us-iraq-prisonerdeath.html

Two Marines to be court-martialed for assaulting Iraqi prisoner

CAMP PENDLETON � Two Marines will be court-martialed on charges including assault and dereliction of duty in connection with the death of an Iraqi prisoner in their custody, a Camp Pendleton spokeswoman said Tuesday.

Maj. Clark A. Paulus is to be arraigned on four charges and Sgt. Gary Pittman faces six charges in the death of Nagem Sadoon Hatab, a 52-year-old Baath Party member who died after he was allegedly mistreated at a Marine detention facility in southern Iraq last year, said 1st Lt. Amy Malugani, a public affairs officer for the base.

Maj. Gen. William Bowdon, the commanding general at Camp Pendleton, dismissed the most serious charge, negligent homicide, against Paulus and Lance Cpl. Christian Hernandez.

Bowdon made the decision on the courts martial Friday after receiving recommendations in March from investigating officer Col. William Galo, Malugani said. She said she did not know if the court martial arraignment had yet been scheduled.

Overall, five Marines were investigated during an Article 32 hearing in February. Bowdon dismissed all charges against two other Marines and the fifth faced administrative discipline. Article 32 hearings are the military equivalent of a civilian grand jury probe.

Hatab was killed June 6 when Hernandez grabbed him by the neck and accidentally snapped a bone in his throat, according to the Marine Corps. Hatab had been left lying naked, covered in his own feces, for hours when he was found dead at the detention facility near Nasiriyah.

...more...

But as I read the article, I realized that this was an entirely different incident - no mention of "electical shock".

WTF?????

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maddezmom

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Sat May-22-04 06:45 PM
Response to Reply #9

19. yeah, just found similar article...but different incidents

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/05/23/wirq23.xml&sSheet=/news/2004/05/23/ixnewstop.html

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UpInArms

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Sat May-22-04 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #19

24. dear god, forgive us for what we have wrought :(

The day after his arrest, Hatab, 52, was hooded and handcuffed, then kicked and slapped before being flattened by a kick to his chest, according to Col William Gallo, a military investigator.

The next day he was lethargic, had trouble breathing and was suffering from diarrhoea. On two occasions he apparently tried to throw himself onto barbed wire.

According to the report, Hatab was carried out of a holding pen and stripped. A medic concluded that he had either suffered a mild heart attack or was faking distress, but he was left to lie naked on the ground for several hours and was found to have died during the night.

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progressivebydesign

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Sat May-22-04 06:46 PM
Response to Reply #9

20. They dismissed the homicide charge against Hernandez??

Geez.. for someone to grab a man hard enough around the neck to snap a bone in their throat (we have bones in our throat? Isn't that is spine?), is murder. Naked, left covered in feces for days, left to die? And what do they call that exactly?? Inhumane bastards.

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mike_c

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Sat May-22-04 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #20

29. hyoid bone-- floats unattached in the larynx....

Breaking it usually closes the trachea due to swelling. Not a fun way to die.

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Just Me

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Sat May-22-04 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #4

11. This is definitely "new" news to me.

Hmmm,...is this an illustration of systematic dissemination *LOL*.

Man,...I wonder if the neocons are breaking shit *LOL*. I hope so,...grrrrrr.

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UpInArms

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Sat May-22-04 06:15 PM
Response to Original message

5. another "isolated" incident and a few more "bad apples"?

I don't think so.

A fish rots from the head down.

This entire mal-administration and all that it controls is starting to stink.

:(

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cornermouse

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Sat May-22-04 06:15 PM
Response to Original message

6. Its sickening.

Under Bush, we have officially become a nation that uses torture.

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lumpy

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Sat May-22-04 06:20 PM
Response to Original message

8. The result of Rumsfeld's watered down

Geneva Convention rules. Where does the buck stop ? Who's in charge of the troops ? Anyone ?

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ze_dscherman

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Sat May-22-04 06:23 PM
Response to Original message

12. "Horror chamber"

From a report on "Saddams horror chambers":

The interrogator would stand on the tyres while prodding the captive with the live cable. His own feet would be insulated from the high voltage by the rubber.

'Primitive, maybe, but a pretty effective and recognised form of torture in a lot of Third World countries.'

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/iraqwar/story/0,4395,181109,00.html

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Cocoa

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Sat May-22-04 06:23 PM
Response to Original message

13. did these Marines bring the torture equipment with them?

did they get it in a care package?

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ze_dscherman

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Sat May-22-04 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #13

14. No, they just recycled what the found

Please welcome the new torturers, same as the old ones ...

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Malva Zebrina

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Sat May-22-04 06:42 PM
Response to Original message

15. support these troops

Edited on Sat May-22-04 06:44 PM by Marianne

send them a care package from home.

It could include a gel that expedites electric currents.
apply to contact areas for optimum shock value.

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Don_G

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Sat May-22-04 06:46 PM
Response to Reply #15

21. Don't Forget The KY Jelly

For their police batons.

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maddezmom

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Sat May-22-04 06:42 PM
Response to Original message

16. another link: Iraqi prisoner 'was beaten, kicked and left to die by Marine

~snip~
Two US Marines face courts martial following the death last June of Sadoon Hatab, who was alleged to have links to the Ba'ath Party of Saddam Hussein, although earlier charges of negligent homicide have been dropped.

One of the marines, Major Clarke Paulus, has been charged with dereliction of duty, cruelty and maltreatment, and assault, and faces up to five years in prison in connection with Hatab's death.

Hatab, 52, died in a makeshift holding centre near the southern city of Nasiriya - an indication that prisoner abuse took place across the network of jails and detention centres established by US and British forces in Iraq.

Until now, attention has focused on Abu Ghraib prison near Baghdad, where guards took photographs and videos of the humiliation and torture of detainees.
~snip~
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/05/23/wirq23.xml&sSheet=/news/2004/05/23/ixnewstop.html

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thebigidea

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Sat May-22-04 06:42 PM
Response to Original message

17. I'm just outraged over our outrage over this outrage.

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xultar

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Sat May-22-04 06:52 PM
Response to Original message

23. Seems that BushCo forgot that WAR IS HELL...I guess they estimated

that all their RW consrvatism and neocon morality plays would override the obvious. WAR IS AWFUL...

As Wesley K. Clark said...WAR AS A LAST RESORT.

Wesley K. Clark is my President

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TacticalPeek

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Sun May-23-04 12:25 AM
Response to Reply #23

34. To the simple-minded, Clark and Clinton made it look easy.

Edited on Sun May-23-04 12:25 AM by TacticalPeak

(and others of course)

For aWol, looking at what they did in Kosovo is like looking at a chess game and thinking "Hey, that's like checkers, with funny looking checkers. I can play that."

For one as ignorant as Shrub, it probably was his last resort.

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Elidor

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Sat May-22-04 09:01 PM
Response to Original message

30. "I'm talking about people having a good time"

"This is no different than what happens at the Skull and Bones initiation, and we're going to ruin people's lives over it, and we're going to hamper our military effort, and then we are going to really hammer them because they had a good time. You know, these people are being fired at every day. I'm talking about people having a good time, these people, you ever heard of emotional release? You heard of need to blow some steam off?"

I wonder if Anal-Cyst Boy still stands by his indefensible words in light of all this?

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crossroads

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Sun May-23-04 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #30

45. Shocking behavior!

:kick:

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suegeo

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Sat May-22-04 09:19 PM
Response to Original message

31. Jesus help us

Seig Heil, we are the fascists now.

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jdj

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Sun May-23-04 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #31

43. Some of "us" always were.

It's a blessing that this is out in the open. Thank god technology has outstripped the diabolical ones and got pictures in the press. Now it seems the shit is rolling downhill and gaining momentum.

I'm sure there will be decades of unburndening for the veterans as they want to confess and clear their consciences. And the military has to be mightily pissed about the bad apple meme.

Scott Horton of the NYC law center was on NOW today and he was great, said the whole "bad apple" spin was prepostersous, and that the assertion that the Geneva Conventions don't apply to the detainees or prisoners is "disgraceful". Had never seen this man before, he was very dignified and composed, but didn't mince words at all when talking about this.

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daleo

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Sat May-22-04 10:22 PM
Response to Original message

32. Remember the photo of the man on the box, wires to fingers and penis

We were told that the wires never carried current, they were attached just to scare him (although having an electrical wire attached to you penis with an alligator clip is likely to be extremely painful, I suspect). I am not saying this proves that he was tortured with electricity, but it shows that is far from unlikely, for him and probably plenty of other prisoners.

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SOS

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Sat May-22-04 11:39 PM
Response to Reply #32

33. It is also possible

that the victim was placed on that box, told he would be electrocuted if he fell, in a sleep deprivation torture. No-one really knows how long he was standing there.
Hours? Days?

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ze_dscherman

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Sun May-23-04 03:19 AM
Response to Reply #32

36. He gives no testimonial he acutally was tortured with electricity

The Washington post published some testimonials by tortured Iraqis here: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/world/iraq/abughraib/swornstatements042104.html

I don't remember which, but one of them is supposed to be from the hooded man. He does not mention being tortured with electricity.

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daleo

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Sun May-23-04 03:29 AM
Response to Reply #36

37. Thanks for the update

I was only speculating, and I presume his deposition would be complete.

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Disturbed

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Sun May-23-04 12:36 AM
Response to Original message

35. Legally

"Naked, left covered in feces for days, left to die? And what do they call that exactly??"

The legal term is "depraved indifference". It is a felony.

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NNN0LHI

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Sun May-23-04 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #35

38. I think the term murder would cover it n/t

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NNN0LHI

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Sun May-23-04 05:43 PM
Response to Original message

39. kick

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Zomby Woof

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Sun May-23-04 05:52 PM
Response to Original message

40. The Few. The Proud.

The Ignorant. The Morans.

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saigon68

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Sun May-23-04 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #40

41. The Electically wired,

I wonder if they attached electric clips to the penises of the POW's

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NNN0LHI

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Sun May-23-04 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #40

42. I wish you still used the DK and Willy photo ZW. I really like that pic nt

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Zomby Woof

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Sun May-23-04 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #42

44. don't mind a revival, Don!

Here it is... :-)

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NNN0LHI

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Mon May-24-04 05:50 AM
Response to Reply #44

46. Thanks ZW. Willy and DK are now the background on my monitor n/t

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The Stranger

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Mon May-24-04 09:36 AM
Response to Original message

47. NPR, the new administration whore, led this morning's news with the Chimp

speech announcement.

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