The Old Testament nails the Rich and *

Myself, I hate organized religion. (That is not to say
I have no regard for the numinous, but that's
a different topic.) At best it is, like Frank Zappa said,
a real estate scam. I have always felt the Bible
contained so much contradictory material it could
be used to argue both sides of any argument.

I neglected to realize that, therefore, it can
be used against the wowsers who are currently
at our throats.

Here is a lengthy passage with which to torment your
Bible-beltiing adversaries. Enjoy. This particular translation
is wonderfully colloquial. And, of course, who else
would it be other than worldly, cynical Ecclesiasticus?

Maybe we should print this on little cards and hand
them out.

----

The New Jerusalem Bible (Doubleday, 1989)
Ecclesiasticus 13:

Verses 3-8

The rich does wrong and takes a high line;
the poor is wronged and has to beg for pardon.
If you are useful the rich will exploit you,
if you go bankrupt he will desert you.
Are you well off? - he will live with you,
he will clean you out without a single qualm.
Does he need you?-he will hoodwink you,
smile and you and raise your hopes;
he will speak politely to you
and say, 'Is there anything you need?'
He will make you feel small at his dinner parties
and, having cleaned you out two or three times over,
will end by laughing at you.
Afterwards, when he sees you, he will avoid you
and shake his head about you.

Verses 16, 18-23

Every creature mixes with its kind,
and human beings stick to their own sort.
What peace can there be between hyena and dog?
And what peace between rich and poor?
Wild desert donkeys are the prey of lions;
so too, the poor is the quarry of the rich.
The proud thinks humility abhorrent;
so too, the rich abominates the poor.
When the rich stumbles, he is supported by friends;
when the poor falls, his friends push him away.
When the rich slips, there are many hands to catch him,
IF HE TALKS NONSENSE, HE IS CONGRATULATED.
The poor slips, and is blamed for it,
HE MAY TALK GOOD SENSE, BUT NO ROOM IS MADE FOR HIM.
The rich speaks and everyone stops talking,
and then they praise his discourse to the skies.
The poor speaks and people say, 'Who is this?'
and if he stumbles, they trip him up yet more.

is such among the fundies that they will take some of these passages the wrong way and either erroneously consider themselves rich or make it their life's obsession to become so. They will just ignore the parts seeming to cast aspersions on the rich. It'll just go right over their heads.

This in part explains the listenership of Rush Limbaugh. Many of them think themselves "rich" vicariously by listening to his rants day after day and vote his interests and not their own at the ballot box.

I have no idea how fundies deal with the modern thoughts
of Ecclesiasticus. Maybe you are right, they misconstrue
them completely. But, how can we go wrong handing these
verses out to Christians, and even Jewish folk? Some of
them have brain cells functioning.

----

You must either be over 50 or from Texas to remember/honor
Wright Patman. What was he, Chairman of the House Banking
Committee?

arendt

to the fundamentalist dregs who support *. It is not part of the Protestant canon. You might as well quote the Koran to them.

You are saying that Ecclesiasticus is not in the King James
Bible?

Now I might believe he is not in the insane Scofield Reference
Bible, or some other fundie propagnda sheet. But, to say it
is not in "the Protestant canon" stretches my knowledge base.

Please clarify.

arendt

"Ecclesiastes" is in the King James Bible, but "Ecclesiasticus" is not. The latter is part of the "Apocrypha" - books not recognized as canonical by the general Protestant churches, though I think the Anglicans and Episcopalians do include them. But as for Methodists, Baptists, Presbyterians, etc., neither Ecclesiasticus nor any of the other books of the Apocrypha has any scriptural value. In fact, I'm fairly sure they're viewed as heretical or forgeries.

I will go find a Bible with Ecclesiastes in it and see what
that looks like.

arendt

The Apocryphal books, however, because of their non-cannonical status , have been re-written less, and therefore contain more of the pre Roman material. Thus, they are closer to the original writers' intent, rather than the actual Bible's numerous re-writes to fulfill their interpreters' agendas.

Ecclesiastes has the "to every season" verse that
Bob Dylan used; and it is, like Ecclesiasticus, a
collection of worldly wisdom.

But, it is way less hostile to the powers that be, and
much more "life is inscrutable, and we are all dust
in the wind". It manages to avoid saying what a
bunch of parasites the rich can be. Just sort of
an Old Testament version of "Shit Happens".

And, now I can see that the fundies would never
hear the words of Ecclesiasticus. But they will
go on and on about their lunatic "rapture" .

arendt

I looked up Ecclesiasticus and found something slightly different:

http://www.tldm.org/bible/Old Testament/eccltus.htm


Ecclesiasticus Chapter 13

Cautions in the choice of company.

13:1. He that toucheth pitch, shall be defiled with it: and he that hath fellowship with the proud, shall put on pride.



13:2. He shall take a burden upon him that hath fellowship with one more honourable than himself. And have no fellowship with one that is richer than thyself.



13:3. What agreement shall the earthen pot have with the kettle? for if they knock one against the other, it shall be broken.



13:4. The rich man hath done wrong, and yet he will fume: but the poor is wronged and must hold his peace.



13:5. If thou give, he will make use of thee: and if thou have nothing, he will forsake thee.



13:6. If thou have any thing, he will live with thee, and will make thee bare, and he will not be sorry for thee.



13:7. If he have need of thee he will deceive thee, and smiling upon thee will put thee in hope; he will speak thee fair, and will say: What wantest thou?



13:8. And he will shame thee by his meats, till he have drawn thee dry twice or thrice, and at last he will laugh at thee: and afterward when he seeth thee, he will forsake thee, and shake his head at thee.



There are enough similarities, but I like your version better. :-)

And:


13:16. Take heed to thyself, and attend diligently to what thou hearest: for thou walkest in danger of thy ruin.


13:18. Love God all thy life, and call upon him for thy salvation.



13:19. Every beast loveth its like: so also every man him that is nearest to himself.



13:20. All flesh shall consort with the like to itself, and every man shall associate himself to his like.



13:21. If the wolf shall at any time have fellowship with the lamb, so the sinner with the just.



13:22. What fellowship hath a holy man with a dog, or what part hath the rich with the poor?



13:23. The wild ass is the lion's prey in the desert: so also the poor are devoured by the rich.




This time your version really stands out, this other version was written by a schizophrenic. I mean, I thought I spoke in riddles, but this is ridiculous! (I also looked at Eccles. 16:18-23 and found more goofiness...)

Thanks for the scripture, that 1989 print is one I might just seek out...