I have had enough of this BS

While watching television this weekend, I have noticed something about the right-wing apologists and the new lows they have stooped to.

They are somehow trying to accuse us of being the unpatriotic ones for having the gall to ask what the fuck happened over there? It seems like their catatonic response is : "All is well, pay no attention to the crooked shit going on behind the curtain." Democrats are the ones putting the troops at risk for daring to speak up against the propaganda machine of the Fatherland???!!! Is this so convolutedly fucked up that normal people don't see this?

Maybe, just maybe, if a culture of humiliation, torture, rape, and murder hadn't been fostered by American commanders in that prison (and I don't care what anyone says--they either encouraged it or ignored it, which in and of itself is a form of encouragement) the rest of the world wouldn't be so outraged.

Oh, but wait. The rest of the world is pissed at Ted Kennedy for speaking up about it. People actually believe this shit? I am so damn sick and tired of being called everything under the sun for questioning out government's policies, and now we are trying to be portrayed as the ones who are putting troops in danger, and we are the unpatriotic ones for expecting that all our troops--not some, not most, ALL--serve with honor and integrity???!!! God, I can't even believe that has to a topic of discussion. I just assumed it was EXPECTED of our soldiers---from both sides.

I am not ashamed to be an American, or a serviceman, but I am ashamed I used to be a Republican. :cry:

Excuse me while I fume...and thanks for letting me rant.

:wtf: :grr: :grr:

Even my RW loon in-laws tonight said they think Rummy has to go - at least that's a start. And we haven't even seen the worst of it yet.

they see that Rumsfeld has to go? I think this might be a good time to try and work some logic in to sway them:

The pro-military party trying to disgrace a war hero

The small government party violating House voting rules to pass the largest entitlement program in 40 years

And, of course, this Abu Ghairb business.

industrial complex.

Rhetoric matters much in these times.

much too easy way out. After (what I heard of) his testimoney yesterday, I changed my mind. And this CLINCHES it >>
<snip>
Vice President Cheney, who was defense secretary under President George H.W. Bush, said through a spokesman that Rumsfeld "is the best secretary of defense the United States has ever had."

"People ought to let him do his job," Cheney said.
<snip>
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A11164-2004May8.html

LET HIM DO HIS JOB??? What the frk has he BEEN doing for the past three years? This is his track record! Rumsfeld's legacy!
Yes, he can be the FIRST one out. But not the LAST.

Did you watch the CBS evening news tonight? They interviewed people on the street somewhere in Pennsylvania, known as swingville. Sorry I don't have specifics because the transcript isn't up yet. But one guy, a contractor, just returned from Iraq said that the prisoners were vicious killers and deserve what they got. Another woman said that no one was hurt like the guys hung on the bridge, just humiliated.

I can't believe Americans think this way.

I saw NBC, and the whole 30 minutes was pretty damning, if that's any consolation.

However, I did just have to shake my head at the "Last Word" piece at the end. Brian Williams taking the stock "its just a few, its just a few bad apples" bit, and yet not twenty minutes before reporting on thousands of images being received not just from Abu Ghraib, but elsewhere in Iraq. Open your eyes here, this is a systemic and ongoing problem.

on another thread.

It's the natural reaction.

We aren't there, because we've been past denial on the whole Bush thing for years.

It was horrifying. Even my 18 year old kid, who isn't up on anything in the news right now, was shocked at these people. The one woman who said "we should just get on with it" and "we can't take a chance they'll attack us", or some crap like that. It was absolutely nuts. 3 people from "swingville" who all sounded like they could take over for Limbaugh tomorrow. Bullshit.

They interviewed a guy from the military (I don't remember who- a soldier I guess)who was more upset that someone snitched than at the atrocities themselves!!!

Who are these people?

you have seen the light and gotten away from that hypocritical party of Nofuckingaccountability!

I am very proud of you! :)

I've actually been a liberal for awhile (didn't know it) and voted Republican out of habit and because I felt disenfranchised by both parties. I still feel disenfranchised to a large extent, but I will not vote Republican ever ever again.

BIG HUGS, dude. You stopped drinking the kool-aide. As someone said to me earlier, taking this simple step requires courage.

And hope enough people are as outraged as the rest of us so we can get Bushco out of the White House in November.
By the way...I always read your posts when I run across them, it gives me hope that there are many more former Republicans out there who have figured out what is really going on in this country, and want to do something about it.:hi:

That they even try this thinking it might work. It just goes to one of my core pet peeves--the gullability and apathy of the average American.

I've been through this for over 30 years now. After a while, your stuffings start to ravel.

You sure you wanna sit here?

It takes a whole lot of fortitude.

Kanary

I want to bring America back to what it could be, not be repsonsible for taking her over the edge into the abyss.

Just curious, and I don't mean this in any negative way, but you seemed so surprised and disgusted at the ugly digs towards us "libruls" that you quoted. Before you made the "switch", how did those digs sound to you then? Wondering if something sounds different now, or you heard it different, or........

Kanary

Can't believe I ever voted R, since I'm rabidly pro-environment, pro-choice, pro-women's rights, pro-gay rights...what was I thinking?? I live in Texas, if that's any consolation. :P

However, I got to thinking about your question: exactly what did I think about the right-wing attacks before my conversion? Yep, I was an avowed Fox watcher. Honestly, I was basically politically unconscious. I knew what I believed in, but had voted R anyway. This started way back in Regan's second term, when I first cast a vote. All my friends voted Repub. I did, too, and never thought about it.

I credit * with my conversion. His first day in office, that fucktard reimposed the gag rule. I was horrified, ran screaming from the GOP, and never looked back.

Today, you'd never know I was anything but a progressive. After all, that's what I've been. I just didn't realize it.

:dem:

RV

Damn glad you found us, X.

Believe it or not, I thought that Republicans went way over the top in asking for impeachment with Clinton. Censure, yes, but impeachment? I thought it was a lot of wasted taxpayer money for a blowjob. So much for the party of small govt.

And I never bought the "treason" label, unless someone was actually spying on us. That's what really started to rankle me, because I have a lot of relatives that were (and still are) democrats when I was a republican, and we disagreed on stuff, but I knew that they loved America as much as I did, our views were just different. And they were very supportive of the military, because several had served. Which, of course, was against the laws of nature if you believe republican dogma--democrats serve in the military???

And one of the final things that set me against my former party was how much they love to trumpet guys that served in the military....unless they were democrats. What they did to Max Cleland in 2002 and what they're tryiong to do to Kerry now is just sickening. If the roles were reversed, treasonous would be the kindset thing democrats would be called.

So, to answer your question, I don't know that I heard things differently, maybe it's just that I'm listening differently now, if that makes any sense.

We need to get this stuff out of our system so we can begin to channel our anger to constructive purpose.

That means others have as well, and we only need a sliver
of the folks who voted for Bush last time to vote for Kerry
this time and we win.

You know the saying about how ex-smokers are the most
militant about being anti-smoking? Could it be that ex-GOP-ers
become the most anti-Republican?

Glad you made it here.

:hi:

those cameras in an asylum ..they are completely unaware of reality.

at risk?

How about the Pentagon and the Administration??? Our troops' greatest threat is the insurgents; they don't play by the Geneva Convention (of course, apparently, neither do we). With the disgusting acts of a few of our own, and the ignorance or even approval (ORDERS, even?) of the command, our troops are in their greatest danger.

We need to call our outspokenness protection and concern--and see that the media does as well.

If you didn't "support the war" you were putting the troops at risk and trivializing loss of soldier's lives.

People were shot and killed on campuses protesting the war.

It's the same tired old tactic and they use it when they are desperate.

Think about it for a minute. If there were a good reason for this war, EVERYONE would be lining up to fight. e.g. WWII. There would be little dissent from Quakers and such, but the mainstream would be solidly behind the effort.

The fact that support for this illegal invasion is now less than fifty percent is its own indictment for starting the invasion to begin with.

They are desperate, so they sling the "unamerican" clod of dirt. That's all they have left.

They are screwed and they know it.

That you were liberal before you quit voting Republican. That's an interesting phenomenon, and I think I went through something like that in about 1968. I'm also seeing this phenomenon right now in a guy at work who has become pro-union, thinks Bush is awful, sees the mess we're in in Iraq, but still listens to Rush and says he's going to vote for Bush because he can't bring himself to vote for a flip-flopping hypocrite like Kerry. (I challenged him to name some flip-flops & he couldn't, but just knew that about Kerry without any examploes). What is it that keeps people voting the old way after they have largely seen the light? Is there a way for an outsider (friend, family) to speed up the conversion from Repug to Dem voting? What are your thoughts?

don't do it in an accusatory way. Your friend at work believes that Kerry has flip-flopped on several issues. I would challenge Kerry flip-flopping to begin with, but, just for the sake of argument, to at least get him to listen to your point of view, concede something. Not everything, but something. Whatever the issue is, I'm sure Republicans have been even worse. Say something like "well, maybe Kerry has been a bit inconsistent on issue X, but what about the Republicans stance?" To wit:

Smaller govt?: Dept of Homeland Security Creation/Medicare drug bill

Lower taxes?: Federal maybe, but the cost burden pushed to the states has caused many peoples taxes to go up.

Pro-Military?: Slashing vet benefits, evisceration of Kerry, Cleland, and any democrat who has served.

Respectful, reasoned logic works every time. Maybe not right away, but eventually, as long as you have truth on your side, which you do, you cannot lose.

Pay as you go. Lower taxes AND lower spending. Libertarian in social actions. The breed is dead.

no one wants to admit they were wrong, especially not to the person who is pointing it out...

come to their senses as this whole thing unravels. This is what I am trying to do. There is no shame in what is corrected. :hug:

I can sense it unravelin, too. At least some days I think it is. Some days, I'm not so sure.

freepers. But there are more of you out there. There's one in my own family. He's not voting Bush again. Be proud that you didn't buy into any of this B.S. they are trying to feed us. That in itself is all the absolution you need. :hi:

You know that.

Its what happened ever since the repubs went neo nuts. They really dont have a choice since 98% of what theyve done has been total failures. I get pissed occasionally --only when some ignorant idiot actually buys that spew

Congratulations to you for working to expand your mind and your heart.