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When does the word "torture" deserve to be used ?

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BonjourUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:11 PM
Original message
When does the word "torture" deserve to be used ?
Just a question because "abuse" seems to be right for many of you. But I'm not fluent in English perhaps I don't perceive all the nuances of this language
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TrogL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. There is more to "torture" than beatings
Psychological torture is often more effective, especially if targetting torwards cultural norms.

In the case of the Iraq prison photos, showing Muslim men naked and taking part in homosexual acts would be much more damaging than a similar event in Western culture.
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TrogL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. The International Red Cross is calling it "torture"
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TrogL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Legal definition
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oostevo Donating Member (293 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:15 PM
Response to Original message
2. I prefer ...
Edited on Mon May-10-04 04:18 PM by oostevo
"crime against humanity"

But torture is appropriate for the situation as well.

By the way, since I assume you speak French natively, 'la torture' in French and torture in English have the same meanings.
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Jacobin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. I think "war crimes" would be the most accuate description
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Jacobin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:16 PM
Response to Original message
3. You won't see the word "abuse" used much on this board
"Abuse" is clearly a less damning word than "torture" and the right wing media likes to employ that word, as does the illegitimate "president" of this country.

From what I understand, the pictures which will soon be released, involving beating Iraqis nearly to death and soldiers raping an Iraqi woman will put all the quibbling about word usage to rest, at least among those who claim to have evolved even ever so slightly from the Neanderthals.

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ChickMagic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #3
11. They like to say...
..."having sex with" instead of rape.
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BonjourUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 06:54 PM
Response to Reply #3
18. "Abuse" is more often used here, reason why I needed an explanation
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willmcw Donating Member (9 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:21 PM
Response to Original message
5. Formal Language Defining Torture
http://www.apt.ch/un/definition.htm

Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment, 1984

Article 1

For the purposes of this Convention, the term "torture" means any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him or a third person information or a confession, punishing him for an act he or a third person has committed or is suspected of having committed, or intimidating or coercing him or a third person, or for any reason based on discrimination of any kind, when such pain or suffering is inflicted by or at the instigation of or with the consent or acquiescence of a public official or other person acting in an official capacity. It does not include pain or suffering arising only from, inherent in or incidental to lawful sanctions.

This article is without prejudice to any international instrument or national legislation which does or may contain provisions of wider application.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:27 PM
Response to Original message
7. torture is a method
that is applied only by the enemies of the American neoconservative movement.

Everything else is "abuse."


apparently.
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dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:27 PM
Response to Original message
8. The very first set of pictures
one could have made the case for only being abuse, though I felt torture was more reasonable a word. The second set no one could argue isn't torture and the dogs pictures are clearly torture.
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supernova Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
10. Yes, "Torture" is the right word
The debasing nudity, the dogs, the rapes, the humiliation are all forms of torture.

The administration is using the word "abuse" to minimize the pain and horror of these events, make them seem not so bad. :grr: :grr:
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
12. Never in the same sentence with Bush, Rummy or their gang
Edited on Mon May-10-04 04:37 PM by robbedvoter
Never about "our people" doing it - only about "them" - see Hamill: "They tortured me by telling me they would release me and didn't"

"Abuse" is WRONG. It's one of those memes that the media managed to drill in our brains as "Gore lost the election" or "Saddam=Osama"
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
13. definition
torture:
1.the infliction of severe pain in means of punishment or coersion. 2. pain or mental anguish

abuse:
2. to maltreat
3. to berate; insult


with the definition and seeing we havent gotten the rape pictures or murder pictures yet, i would take torture
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BonjourUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 06:33 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. In French "abuser" is to do something to excess
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 06:52 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. Yup. They obey orders. In excess. hence: abuse.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
14. When discussing the treatment Iraqis have received
and the hands of American troops who were the instruments used by Rummy,
Wolf, Feith, Meyers, Fast and the ever-popular Janice, the words TORTURE, RAPE, MURDER and ATROCITY are the proper terms to use.
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snippy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-10-04 06:15 PM
Response to Original message
15. I sometimes use the phrase "republican torture pranks."
Oxydittos! to Rush Limbaugh for this phrase. Shittoheads seem to dislike it though.
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