Democracy Now!: Mumia Abu Jamal on Iraq Prison Scandal

Death Row Prisoner Mumia Abu Jamal On Iraq Prison Scandal

The photos from Abu Ghraib repeatedly show Spec. Charles Graner Jr. in photographs giving the "thumbs up" over piles of naked Iraqi men.

This same Graner reportedly worked as a prison guard in Virginia and at the Greene County state correctional institution. Prisoners there claim Graner beat and humiliated inmates while he worked there as a prison officer. This according to the Sunday Herald. SCI Greene is the notorious prison in southwestern Pennsylvania where political prisoner Mumia Abu-Jamal is held on Death Row.

AMY GOODMAN: This is Abu Jamal's latest commentary.

MUMIA ABU JAMAL: In the shadows of Abu Ghraib prison, the color photos coming out of the dreaded Abu Ghraib prison on the outskirts of Baghdad are racing around the world, silent yet eloquent testament about what Americans really think about the people they allegedly came here to liberate. The photos in the age of the Internet are racing through the Arab and Muslim world and showing a side of the American character that seldom gets to be seen, especially abroad. The photos of naked men, some posed with laughing jeering women is the height of humiliation and tells everyone who can see that Americans hold the Iraqis and by extension other Arabs in utter contempt.
http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=04/05/10/1417258

I mean, not taking sides on his guilt or innocence, maybe he's innocent. But there are 1000's of Abu Jamal's in our prisons....why does he get so much sympathetic press from the Left? Is it good PR?

Because he is our Mandela? By the way, what do you mean by great press? Thats a real stretch, even from whatever side you arent taking.
Free Mumia!

Rueben Carter. My question is why has he been able to elevate his case when there have been hundreds of similar stories that get no media oxygen. What differentiates his case?

BTW, I really don't know the facts above a cursory level. I don't have an opinion on his guilt or innocence. But it is my observation that his case has been amplified to near celebrity levels....why?

http://www.freemumia.org/intro.html

never has a miscarriage of justice been as evident, let alone so clearly explained. But because of the slightest Black Panther aspect, as well as the horrific MOVE angle, Mumia was an enemy to be dealt with. It would appear the rest of the world is easily fooled, because he is an international cause celebre. From Japan to France entire governments have spoken for his rights to a fair trial. he speaks clearly, eloquently and sonorously on subjects of social and international justice. He doesnt beg or plea his own case, simply brings up important facts that few people know or could synthesize into cogent arguments on a panapoly of subjects. Would that his opponents had half the intelligence, they would get over themselves rather quickly I think.

Who gives a fuck what this asshole says whether it be bad or good? He should have ridden the lightning a long time ago.

Justice for Daniel Faulkner!!

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My father was a cop for 30 years in Philly. He was working the night when Wesley Cook murdered Daniel Faulkner in cold blood. All I heard was that a cop was killed and my Dad wasn't home yet. I have personal feelings in this case, it could have been my father this fucking asshole murdered.

What they did was a classic Black Panther setup. Intentionally commit a traffic violation, when the cop pulls you over a third party, Cook in this case, ambushes the cop. I know all about the case and this scumbag is guilty, he should have fried a long time ago.

You can imply that I'm a racist but that just shows your ignorance. I don't give a fuck what color Cook is, I'm for justice for everyone and Faulkner deserves justice. This clown should not be allowed to write books and get media attention while his victim rots in his grave. Because of this jerkoff a woman lost her husband, kids lost their father and this city lost a good man and protector.

Yeah let's all rally around the cop killer and piss on this good officer's memory and his family.

is Arnold Beverly a psychopathic liar? The only classic Black Panther setups Im familiar with involve people like Fred Hampton being shot to death in their beds, people like Geronimo Pratt rotting in jail on bullshit convictions, people like... oh wait, Im wasting my time arent I? Cops are so dirty, by and large, that you simply cant give them the benefit of the doubt anymore. And if you want a million examples I dont think that would be too hard to do.

My father has over 300 commendations plus awards for valor, service and integrity. Sometimes, I wish he was a little dirty because for such a thankless job, you don't get paid shit. We weren't poor by any means but all my friends had a lot more because their fathers were in the mafia and shit like that. Of course, it didn't pay for them in the long run as most of them followed their fathers into prison or the grave. Be that as it may, you shouldn't let the actions of a few cloud your judgment. Most cops are good people who genuinely want to do public service and help others. I don't buy for a second that a majority of cops are dirty, for every one that is there are fifty who are real heroes. My Dad would have given his life to defend you or anyone from harm without prejudice, that was his job.

None of this changes the fact that Cook did indeed murder Danny Faulkner or that he should have the sentence carried out.

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It's a standard tactic. Currently I'm smoking some decent mid-grade Kentucky shit, since you asked.

were smoking something, but it's not laced with dust is it? Elsewhere you mentioned wanting to crash through your computer monitor. Stay away from the Elephant, man!

will accomplish what?

back in dey place! :evilgrin:

Us vs them. Hatfields vs McCoys. Arabs vs Jews. White vs black.

HFb, ya think the poster READ the link? Honest opinion, now.

hey why dont you come down here to texas you'd love it
we are frying and locking up lots of uppity blacks and latinos down here

The far left, no better than the far right. I'm sorry, I don't idolize cop killers.

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?

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But, back on topic:

"Many of the people who are now in Iraq, especially those in the reserves are cops and prison guards. The treatment of Iraqis at Abu Ghraib has the dark precedence in the prisons and police stations across America. According to journalist, Seymour Hersh of the "New Yorker" there have been cases of sodomy against prisoners and killing. Shades of Abner Luima, huh? If you hate someone, if you disrespect them, if you fear them, how can you liberate them? As we have said from the very beginning, the Iraq adventure is not and never has been about liberating the oppressed people of Iraq. Indeed, a recent "USA Today"-CNN poll suggests that Iraqis have come to that conclusion themselves, with 71% stating that Americans are occupiers. Americans may call it liberation but they're bringing torture, humiliation and domination. It is somehow fitting that these depraved events have happened in one of the most dreadful prisons of the Hussein regime. It shows the continuity of torture and terror."

deserves a new one. I also think the left-wing hero status is unwarranted. He's no Mandela or Peltier. But whenever I hear the hateful cries for Mumia's blood it fucking disgusts me. I used to live in South Philly, and it just always seemed to me that people saying shit like that just wanted to see the black man fry.

I'd be howling for their blood just the same. Same way I howl for the blood of the WHITE asshole who murdered little Carlie Brucia in Florida earlier this year, same way I howled for the blood of the WHITE pieces of shit who dragged James Byrd to death in Texas and the blood of Robert "Mudman" Simon, a WHITE biker dude who murdered his girlfriend only to get out on parole and then kill a cop. It's so easy to scream "You're a racist!" when the person who committed the crime is black and you believe in the death penalty. Believe me, this has nothing to do with race. He killed a cop and if you grow up in a cop family that means he killed a part of you.

Where in South Philly did you live?

were a racist, but like it or not, this is a racially polarized issue, and if you're from Philly, you know that as well as anyone else. If you are screaming for the blood of Mumia, you kind of leave yourself open for those assumptions. It may not be fair, but when you're in the middle of a racially-charged subject, reality is rarely fair. My suggestion would be for you to tone down the rhetoric a little. Take it or leave it, but you'd probably have a better chance at getting your viewpoint across without being instantly labeled hateful. Trust me, I get sucked into it on other issues all the time.

Yeah, I know Gray's Ferry and Philly is so parochial everyone hates each other pretty much. That's part of it's charm to me, heh. I have a hard time on this particular issue and I can't help myself, it's personal. You know the South Philly attitude, I want to jump through the monitor sometimes. I don't think I can ever come off as not hateful toward this guy so I'll just vent and be happy.

best to jump to a conclusion on this subject, but having seen the racial dimension of this debate with my own eyes-- it's kinda hard for me not to. It's been my experience that the same white people in Philly who really want to see Jamal fry don't like black people very much. Kinda like the lifelong South Philly Democrats who suddenly decided to vote for the Republican Sam Katz over Democrat John Street (gee, could it have anything to do with Katz being white and Street being black?). So when someone comes out and attacks Mumia aggressively, I tend to assume the worst. But I don't know you, and you're a fellow DUer (not that we don't have racists here), so I give you the benefit of the doubt. Also, I imagine coming from a Philly cop family, you're likely to have strong opinions on the subject.

For the record, I think he probably did it, but that's only my opinion-- I don't know. And I do think the trial was unfair-- he probably deserves a new one. I also don't agree with those that see him as some great political hero. But I also don't think killing a cop is worse than killing anyone else. Murder is murder, and so I can't say I care any more about Faulkner than anyone else who gets whacked. I also disagree with your assessment of the Black Panthers. I think they were a good organization, and that Jamal's association with them was fleeting and on the tail end of the organization's existence (they were already decimated by FBI attacks and had already turned from a leftist revolutionary organization into a black nationalist movement).

The racist attitude is prevalent throughout the neighborhoods and a lot of the people are motivated simply by the black on white aspect. I suppose it's far too easy to make that jump.

I do think it's worse to kill a cop because if you'll kill a cop, you'll kill anyone for any reason. It just makes you a more dangerous person. The officer is putting his life on the line in your behalf, to take someone away who might do you harm later on. If no one stops these maniacs, where are we as a society? Murder is murder at the end of the day but I think there are circumstances that raise or lower the level of acceptability. I think it's much worse when someone like Lauretha Vaird is murdered than someone like Philip Testa.

I don't know man, I've read a little about the Black Panthers and it's a fairly unflattering view considering that they started out as armed robbers and shit. Perhaps I'm getting a slanted view on it. I did read a bit about them in a book called "Monster" by Sanyika Shakur aka "Monster" Kody Scott, an ex L.A. gang member turned Black Nationalist but his view is really extreme as well. Somewhere in the middle lies the truth.

but I think you need better sources. The Panthers were started by Bobby Seale and Huey P. Newton in Oakland, CA as "The Black Panther Party for Self-Defense". Their members were not engaged in bank robberies at at that time-- that came later. The Black Panthers were a leftist organization that defended black neighborhoods against both criminals and police brutality (at the time, open carry was still permitted in CA). They also administered a hot-lunch program to school kids in the ghetto (the first of its kind ever).

Soon the gov't ganged up on the Panthers. California changed its gun laws to prevent open carry of firearms. Chicago police murdered Fred Hampton-- shooting several hundred rounds into his bed while he slepts. The FBI launched its COINTELPRO against the Panthers and started the spread of disinformation and drugs within the organization. Due in part to the FBI's activities, the Black Panther Party split-- the Bobby Seale wing was to focus on electoral politics, and the Eldridge Cleaver/Huey P. Newton wing focused on armed struggle (around this time they started robbing banks to finance the organization). Cleaver eventually fled first to Cuba, then to Algeria, where he eventually died. Newton, introduced to heroin through FBI plants turned into a junkie, and was killed in a drug deal years after the organization had lost its relevance. The remaining members of the Cleaver/Newton wing of the Panthers formed the Black Liberation Army, which engaged in the kind of violent bank expropriations you're thinking of.

And come on, don't be too hard on Philip Testa-- I mean it's hard to hate a guy nicknamed "The Chickenman"-- you gotta admit, it's kinda a cool gangster nickname.

given the facts of his "trial." Philly has quite a vile history when it comes to black militants. His words about the here and now, and about the relation between US actions against people (of color) in Iraq and against people (of color) in this country need to be judged on their merits. In my view, his observations about the role of racism can be critiqued only on the grounds of being all to obviously true.

position to state and substantiate the obvious, maybe?
Did you READ the piece?

He's a LIGHTNING ROD? Well GOOD! Please do read what he says and whom he places where and when. :SIGH: :freak: :SIGH:

makes some pretty interesting observations

Not unlike another well-spoken person I could name right about now...
;-)

baying and bleating for blood.

The shear force of reaction proves beyond a doubt
that Mumia is America's for most political prisoners.

Pointing out the fact that these prison torturers
received their training right here in a prison
system that operates with little over-site where
violence by sadistic guards is rampant.

Even when it is on video tape the DA's often refuse
to press changes because the prison guards "unions"
are a powerful political force protecting the policy
of state sanctioned terror against the poor and unlucky.

Human rights now!

Pavlovian response.