I'm A Misogynist

I discovered this disturbing fact only recently.

My niece was offered an opportunity to open for the Texas Tornados at the Texas Music Hall of Fame. I volunteered to baby-sit my young nephews so that my brother and sister-in-law could better enjoy this rather special event. My sister-in-law was good enough to grab take-out food before they left, so that I wouldn't have to cook while managing her obnoxious brats. I thought this was a nice gesture. They live outside the delivery range of the pizza joint, and I'd much rather eat breakfast cereal than corral my nephews long enough to pick up fried chicken.

Unfortunately, her choice of food vendors was not a good one. After eating, I was stricken with significant gastric upset, including severe gas. To be blunt, I've been burping and farting for the last three days. So by recent definition (I guess I know who I am), I am now a Misogynist. True, the recent definition requires that I also be a knuckle-dragging Neanderthal, but the Neanderthal race has been extinct for some time, and in forty-odd years I've yet to encounter a human who was physically capable of knuckle dragging. So I assume that part of the definition was simple literary embellishment. Hence my assumption that the remaining elements of this new definition apply to me.

This comes a something of a shock. Anymore. I've always made an effort to interact with people with no regard for their race, religion, or gender. In truth, classifying people based on complexion, blood chemistry, or mythological orientation seems foolish and more an indicator of the observer than the observed. I'm human (rather than Neanderthal), so surely I've made mistakes in my social interactions, but I do make a sincere effort to judge people on their qualities, not their classification. I've worked with, and for, a number of females in my life, and I've yet to find any embarrassing attitudes toward gender-based competence lurking in my soul. Active soul searching has not revealed a significant sexual double standard to stain my being. In fact, I find I use the term "slut" or "whore" in a gender-neutral way, to indicate any person with limited sexual dignity. I honestly believe that I award respect or disdain as it is earned rather than basing my perception of an individual on any kind of physical or cultural classification. I don't suppose that I've been entirely successful, but I've always thought I was doing okay. Until I ran into that bad barbecue the other night. (Brrrp)

So I guess it's time for a confession. There is one social class that I find I resent as a group, with no consideration for individual qualities. This rapidly growing social aggregation seems to have no gender, racial, or religious definition. It is composed of bitter females and their Stepford-husband supporters who view males as the ultimate source of all things "wrong" and "bad". They are the Misandrists. These people treat me as morally and mentally suspect because I don't have to squat to pee.

A perfect example of the misandrists attitude was demonstrated in a recent post on this board. A (very) regular (female) poster spewed out a hate-filled, inarticulate, and threatening diatribe by way of lashing out at an earlier post that used thoughtless and inaccurate phrasing to lambast a prominent female figure. The post that triggered so much hate-filled backlash was in extreme poor taste, possibly sexist, and demonstrated limited thought for the topic and limited literary skill. In short, it was a typical GD post. The misandrists leaped on the utter lack of profound insight displayed to once again disparage all things male. And the attack itself was a sterling example of the attitudes under attack. The misandrists are at least as narrow, angry, and thoughtless as the misogynists they see hiding behind every inarticulate or mindless exposition.

So I want to get a few things off my chest.

I don't like to ask for directions when I travel. In the last couple of years, I've questioned several males and found out that my position has merit. The overwhelming consensus is that: The clerk at the convenience store LIES! In thirty years behind the wheel, the only times I remember being lost or being significantly delayed on a trip was due to absolutely horrible directions given by a stranger. I have started arguments in checkout lines as multiple courses competed for my acceptance. I have lobotomized clerks by asking "Can you tell me how to get to ...?" The variety of experiences I've had in asking for directions is limited only in that I don't remember an instance of clear, concise instructions that took me to the desired destination. I don't ask for directions, because frankly, I'd rather be lost than go through that kind of crap. So my self-reliance and confidence makes me a target for the misandrists. Hmm...

Because I'm male, it is assumed that I have had a significant number of sexual partners. Someone please explain how males are banging everything that doesn't run from them while females are completely virtuous. Homosexuality and bestiality provide a partial solution to this enigma, but that's a limited explanation at best. If men are so promiscuous, doesn't that imply that females are too? I caught my first wife in an "embarrassing" situation before we had been married three months. I received several midnight phone calls over the years from irate wives accusing her of fooling around with their husbands. I broke my vow of monogamy in reaction to the third time my first wife broke down in a tearful confession of multiple affairs. I decided then, and believe to this day, that "one night stands" are demeaning and disgusting. My second wife required panic stricken pregnancy tests, on two different occasions, in spite of the fact that I'd repeatedly verified the effectiveness of my vasectomy with laboratory testing. If you've been keeping count, that's two for two, folks. The assumption that men are naturally more promiscuous than women is a misandrist myth. My experience, both personal and as an observer, indicates that the opposite may be true.

I was in the Army for six years. I separated as a Staff Sergeant. I've yet to meet a woman who knows what "clean" is. Testosterone has in no way impaired my abilities with a broom, mop, or polishing cloth. And yes, I wash dishes and do laundry. Regularly. I don't give a damn who you are, I can cook better than you can. I can stock kitchen shelves with more nutrition, for less money, than anyone I know. I can select tasteful furniture and matching drapes. That's not my opinion. The claim is based on numerous complements over the years. I can sew my own clothes, make my own curtains, and in recent years, I've had several opportunities to counsel women on fabric and notion selection in the fabric store. My testicles in no way impair my ability to manage a home.

I'm sick of showing up for a dinner date in two hundred dollar Italian slacks and a handmade silk tie to escort a woman who's wearing jeans and a T-Shirt. Ladies, if you aren't comfortable in stylish clothes, don't wear them on the first three dates. That's false advertising, plain and simple. I'm sick of the misandrist myth that men become bored or disinterested at the drop of a hat. My experience has been that too often, women go to extremes to create a false image of themselves, then feel insulted when a man is disenchanted with the real thing. Yet when a male presents the reality from the beginning, he is a tasteless, farting Neanderthal. Under no circumstances would he be considered simply "honest".

The point behind this rambling diatribe is that there is an increasing undercurrent of hostility on this discussion board. The Misogynist / Misandrist arguments are simply a visible, and irritating, example of a more general tendency towards combat tactics in debate. I suspect that the recent GD restrictions experiment was an indication that I'm not the only one who notices this. In short, it seems that the ghost of Rush Limbaugh is infecting DU. Political debate has been eliminated in the U.S., in favor of combative polarization of various viewpoints. This trend is damaging our ability to function as a democracy. I doubt that anyone would argue this point. But DU exists as a focal point for opposition to the failing political system in this country, not as a focal point for opposition to Republicans, opposition to Greens, or opposition to men. If you are simply looking for a no-holds-barred, vitriolic argument, hang out on USENET. I'd like to believe DU has a higher purpose.

I was off the board for several months. Since I've returned, there seems to be a significant drop in the number of extensive, carefully considered, and carefully crafted topics that arouse thoughtful debate. The trend seems to favor short, often incoherent posts that showcase the writers inability to spell, compose a sentence, and state an opinion. Many of these posts merely serve to prove that the writer knows language that would embarrass a sailor. I did see one recent post that had perhaps three words that one would unselfconsciously use in front of one's mother. It was a response to a public statement made by a high government official, and I thought it entirely appropriate and to the point. But that is a rare exception to the recent trend in profanity. But the vulgarity, literary incompetence, and incoherence is only important in that it is linked to the troubling lack of content in more and more posts. The trend is toward juvenile "look at me!" posts, political "you are invalid!" posts, and the more general "I keep my brain in the refrigerator!" posts.

The problem is, DU is an important resource in increasingly troubled political times. If the current trends continue, the one-line zinger topics and "you suck because..." attacks could degrade the board to the point where it is just another internet server catering to bored social cripples who can't type fast enough to hang out in Yahoo chat rooms. So the next time you post, ask yourself: "Do I really have something to say?" And before you blast away at the idiot, indulge yourself with your favorite beverage, and consider whether anything you might say will make a difference. The future of DU as a dynamic political resource might depend on it.

just not to use the word "slut"?

Much easier than constructing some very elaborate defense of using the word.

for a misogynist.

interchangably. Some of the biggest sluts I've ever known of course were men.

Just my .125

Julie

And yes, I wash dishes and do laundry. Regularly. I don't give a damn who you are, I can cook better than you can. I can stock kitchen shelves with more nutrition, for less money, than anyone I know. I can select tasteful furniture and matching drapes. That's not my opinion. The claim is based on numerous complements over the years. I can sew my own clothes, make my own curtains, and in recent years, I've had several opportunities to counsel women on fabric and notion selection in the fabric store.

All that, and a brain to boot!

j/k

YD, thanks for saying much more eloquently what many tried to get at yesterday.

but I already have a husband. He too refuses to ask directions. He would rather spend a half an hour in Home Depot trying to find Gorilla Glue than to ask one of the staff. I always thought it was a "male" thing and what I say to my husband is "I'm the girl - I'll ask".

I hate to clean - love to cook - I do laundry, but I hate to fold and put away.

Women's Lib has not only liberated women, it has liberated men.

With regard to the specific Home Depot situation, you need to
understand two or three things:

1. The Home Depot workers often have absolutely no idea where
   something is, or even WHAT it is. Try this test: Ask for
   "hardware cloth". (This is the industry-standard term for a
   rolled-good material made of galvanized wire on a 1/4" or larger
   grid. Any hardware store worth the name carries it.) The Home Depot
   droids will direct you all over the shop trying to help you. As far
   as I can tell, Home Depot doesn't actually sell the stuff. I've
   certainly never found it with any HD sales droid's help; asking
   them is often as pointless as was cited in the previous post.
   
   
2. I shop Home Depot like some women shop for clothes: It's fun,
   cheap entertainment.
   
   I like to wander around, look at the items, and touch some of them.
   I'll often be shopping for a specific project, but I'm often
   percolating the next half-dozen items on the "Honey-Do" list as
   well, thinking about how I might use the stuff I find at Home
   Depot to accomplish these projects (and just what HD material
   I might use in place of the elusive hardware cloth).
   
   
3. Even for the immediate project, I don't necessarily have a
   firm idea of what I want in the store, and even if I do, there's
   no guarantee that Home Depot has it. I can march in and say that
   "I want a GE PAR-30 50W Wide Angle Quartz-Halogen Reflector Flood
   Lamp; where are they?" but, in fact, after I did an extensive
   comparison (say) last month and determined that these were the best
   lamps for my kitchen's downlights, THIS MONTH Home Despot
   discontinued them and I might as well have just wandered the light
   bulb department myself, 'cause I'm going to get to re-make my
   decision anyway.
   
   

Atlant

I rarely (about 1/4th of the time) stop to ask for directions. I almost always (about 3/4th of the time) allow time to wander. I consider it "discovery."

Why?

Much of what I've accumulated in my brain pan over the years was serendipitous -- encountered while looking for something else (or nothing at all).

I've never been lost. I've always known where I was (right here, dummy!) and take very little responsibility for the location of the rest of the world.

Over half of the world is female and (in some chromosomically-linked fashion), as every husband knows, obsessively relocates "stuff" at whim. It takes a lot of browsing to keep up.

:silly:

(Yes, it's supposed to be humor.)

But I don't do marriage anymore. It doesn't work out for some reason. :)

that this was not an isolated incident but just one of many times where sexist slurs have been objected to and those objections met with "lighten up" and accusations of language police and PCism.

it's only natural that the objecting party's patience might be wearing thinner as time goes on. i know mine is.

are terms almost guaranteed to irritate me severly. It's called invalidation. But that was the gist of my message. Those of us who sincerely try to purge the vestiges of their sexist upbringing get very tired of the constant accusations of "misogynist" that get hurled around. And more, there is a strong undercurrent of male bashing in these posts that wear at patience and understanding as much as the sexist jabs do. Both sides of the fence are guilty. It's time for some widespread civility. As much as I love (some of) the viewpoints on DU, and the ready access to news, I'm almost ready to go back to the bad old days of trolling BBC World and Slate to get my news.

.

You'll convince many. But you won't convince the self-appointed,
self-annointed "language police" (who seem to always speak in the
plural).

As far as I can tell, they'd much rather win their small battles,
even if it means losing the larger wars.

By the way, this is a dynamic that all electronic discussion
groups follow. It's been true since CDC's Plato ('way back in
the early/mid 70s) and it will probably be true forever, at
least until we have video, whereby conference participants
would have to show their faces while making ludicrous statements
and claims about other people who have real faces too. I
imagine that might shut some of these folks up. But as
anonymous, faceless agitators, they feel empowered to say
things they'd never say face-to-face and argue points they'd
never bother arguing face-to-face with other real human beings.

Thanks for your posting!

Atlant
(my real name, BTW)

The misandrists will bash you in one sentence posts, but you said what lesser debaters couldn't. Republicans/women come out swinging and take us democrats/men by suprise. We need to debate better, Republicans/women cannot define the debate all the time.

Not to worry, I alerted myself to the mods on this name-calling post.

And a request that they LOCK it the same way they locked threads yesterday. We will just SEE if the admins around here wield their power for censurship even-handedly.

and eloquent.

crafting your witty little response to having your little biddy self offended and oppressed......

And surely don't deserve any serious response.....cause you don't really WANT to talk about this.

Did your mom let you get away with guilt-inducing diatribes?

*

when 50% of congress is female
when the USA has a female president
or when hell freezes over...whichever come first.

having said that, stupid gender stereotypes are just stupid. i know misogynists/misandrists who are male and female, and of course, caring, self-aware, responsible people of both genders.

and....why is THIS thread acceptable, DU censors?

who posted this yesterday. I thought it was an excellent description of the problem.

**

There was a thread a while back about having 50-50 representation of men-women in Congress, and quite a flap about it. And now there's this one, just because some women got tired of hearing gender-specific insults. If only the men who are so indignant about this (and that's not all of them) would wake up one day in a different world, perhaps they'd understand?

A world in which no man had ever served as president, nor bothered to run, because he'd know he couldn't be elected. A world in which 90% of the elected representatives are women - and most of the judges are women - and they are all making life or death decisions about his body (yes let's extend this role reversal to men being the ones who bear children.) Even basic reproductive costs are not covered by insurance - birth control - yet a pill to increase arousal of women is covered. He's making less than women for the same work. His bosses have been mostly women, and if not, then it's for sure that their bosses are women. Women run most of the companies and control most of the wealth. Men are pictured in the media a full 25% below normal weight, and the odd thing is, most of the time the majority of their clothes are off (while women are fully clothed.) And many of these emaciated men have implants to make them look more desirable to women. Little boys are fainting in elementary school because they aren't eating - they think they are too fat. He's afraid to walk to his car after dark, even in nice neighborhoods, because he fears he might get raped. Rapes of men occur in alarming numbers every minute of every day. There was one male hero in the bible who was left in by the females in the past, but only because they changed him into a prostitute. All the other men in history were pretty much wiped off the record, until a few men decided to get together and create Mens Studies programs (that are now being dismantled by female legislators.) It seems like the female president and the 90% female congress and all of those female judges don't understand what it's like for him as a man - but what can he do to make them understand? Not very long ago, men couldn't vote or own property, and in too many places in the world today, similar inequalities exist between men and women - in some countries men can't leave their house, and in some they must be covered from head to foot (in case a woman might find them arousing.) In others, their genitals are being cut off just because they are men (and they won't stray from their wives this way.) Oh, yes, and there's a whole set of sexually demeaning insults set up to put men down that are still tolerated by some women who just don't get it. These women say, lighten up and you're just throwing a hissy fit (another one of those put down insults - oh, well.)

none of the things you block copied are my fault. Nor do I support them. I did vote for Ann Richards for Governor of Texas, and I'd happily vote for Hillary for president. In the last 15 years, all of my bosses have been women. All your terribly eloquent arguments do is make me wonder if maybe misogyny is so bad after all.

Take the time to read what I actually said. When it comes down to it, I'm not the ultimate source of all evil. The "Misogynist" claim was satirical.

I don't recall any comments on yesterday's threads directed at you specifically.

"All your terribly eloquent arguments do is make me wonder if maybe misogyny is so bad after all." (yella_dawg)

More satire?

Is how many women are serve in Congress. Since they are half the votes, that is up to them. Clearly, even the women think they are voting for the best candidates.

At least you didn't waste your time.

It is a well written response to the 'blame men' attitude that has begun to grow in DU as of late. It seems that one can not challenge women on any issue anymore as it is immediately labled as flame bait and never actually discussed.

I believe women should register for the draft.

based on gender,race,religion,sexual orientation,etc,etc.

that is a necessary approach if equality is what i eventually hope will be achieved.

and the female gender is in no way exempt from this 'hatred' based behavior.

This was really discussed enough yesterday. I still think we need a break.

Skinner
DU Admin

I tried to honor your request, poured myself a cup of coffee, and thought about it before responding.

"Do I really have something to say?" yes. "Will it make a difference?" probably not. But I feel the need to say it anyway, so here goes:

One simple three letter word in the first paragraph tends to wipe out any disclaimer/defense that follows.

Yes, I did read the entire post anyway, but have to admit that the single tiny little word stuck with me and tainted your otherwise carefully thought out and well written post. It made it really difficult to see the bigger picture you were painting, just because that one word and everything implied by your choosing to use it reeks of male chauvinism.

Then again, maybe mentioning it points to bits of misandry/males as superior resentment lurking in myself.

In case you're wondering, the word is her. "managing her obnoxious brats"

and the battle goes on.