To what degree do you go in for conspiracy theories?

To what degree do you go in for conspiracy theories?

short order, each and every single time...


Watching the bush regime is like knowing all the magic tricks when you see a magician performing.

You KNOW how that card floats in the air, you KNOW how those little lights float around, or how he guesses which card you picked.

Once you know the secrets, all the illusions become just simple amusements which fail to entertain... and worse, fail to SHOCK and AWE.

every single time, but it's getting to the point where I don't trust a single thing they say unless it's confirmed by a source I trust.

I totally distrust Bush and the whole crew, but I don't like to jump to wild conclusions without evidence.

It's really difficult for me to believe, for example, that Bush planned 9-11. I think 9-11 happened more because the administration was 1. not really focusing on terrorism and 2. they were instigating al Queda and the Taliban in Afganistan regarding the oil pipeline proposal. In other words, their stupid mistakes led to it, not overt planning on the Bush team's part. His reaction of total terror on the day it happened made it pretty clear to me that it was a surprise. Several people in both parties appeared far more confident and intelligent than he did that day (McCain, Hillary, Powell, etc.).
I would need a lot of evidence to convince me of a MIHOP scenario.\

The one conspiracy theory I do buy into is that Oswald didn't act alone.

:kick:

Very interested in the answers.

Whether they rise to the level of "vast" is the question.

The important conspiracies are the ones we don't know about, the ones we'll find out about years from now when things get declassified or someone starts talking.

Nothing surprises me, and I think anything's possible, so in that sense I certainly don't rule out conspiracy theories from the start. However, there's a difference between being open to a possibility and seeing only that possibility, bending and twisting all logic and facts to fit the storyline you want so badly to create. This drives me nuts, and while I realize it's pointless to try to reason with some people I still can't just let some of the crazier posts sit there with no response.

a bit skewed to the skeptical side. This is certainly not a tinfoil-hat site like rense.

Especially between work projects!

I did try to include every outlook, without pushing an agenda.

I'm somewhere in between the extremes myself. I only posted the poll because it seems the tinfoilers have gotten a bit shrill and crazed lately, to the point that some members have even left in disgust.

I wouldn't want to do so, since it skews the overall opinion even more to the tinfoil side. Engaging tinfoilers (at least the reasonably serious ones) is the best thing, IMO.

I'm not saying that all the theories aren't true. Heck, there might even be a God for all I know. But thus far I've seen no good evidence of him, and no conclusive proof that Berg was offed by CIA agents in Abu Ghraib.

Some of these DU polls I don't know how to answer -- I disagree with all of the choices. Yours actually showed something about DUers' views on conspiracy.

When common every-day good old fashioned human stupididity is enough to explain events. Frankly I think this administration has more than it's fair share of stupidity, and I doubt they have the wherewithall to plan an office birthday party, let alone some of the intricate plots they've supposadly committed.

Is that really the same as believing the President though? I don't know.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

I don't think this administration is competent enough to pull of LIHOP, let alone MIHOP, faking the Berg video, being behing the death of Carnahan, Wellstone, etc.

The only thing listed that needs looking into is BBV.

is more than one person and a crime. This article sums up what I feel is the source of them though.

Published on Saturday, November 9, 2002 by CommonDreams.org
Conspiracies, Plots and Other Anti-Democratic Notions
by Peter Phillips

Paul Wellstone's plane crash wasn't an accident. The CIA bought stock options on United Airlines before 9-11 making millions in profits. The military sprays low-level bio-weapons on the public through airtanker contrails. The tobacco industry plotted to deceive the public on the negative health effects of smoking. Lee Harvey Oswald alone didn't assassinate John Kennedy. The FBI deliberately caused the fire in the Branch Davidian compound. Planted bombs from within the structure destroyed the federal building in Oklahoma City. AIDs was created in a government research lab. Mass inoculations are designed for citizen mind control. General Motors and Firestone conspired to destroy public transit in the U.S. The Bush White House interfered with FBI investigations into the bin Laden family before 9-11.

Conspiracy theories abound in America and are directly related to the lack of investigative reporting by the mainstream corporate media. The public knows more about Winona Ryder's shop lifting trial then about the weather conditions and circumstances of Paul Wellstone's air crash. The Los Angeles Times printed 83 column feet on OJ Simpson during his trial, but has ignored for decades the deliberate and successful plot before World War II to dismantle LA's public transit system by General Motors and Firestone. Oliver Stone's interpretation of the Kennedy assassination has been mostly dismissed as "conspiracy theory" by corporate media. Questions regarding the veracity or falseness of seemingly important conspiracies and plots often go unreported by mainstream media.

The ten big corporations that now dominate media in America are principally in the entertainment business. While the corporate media is narrowing its content, with news reports often looking very much the same, the public's access to the vastland of the internet is amplifying, and informational snippets and unanswered questions leading to conspiracy beliefs are increasingly available on-line.

The First Amendment provides for freedom of the press and was established to protect our democratic process by guaranteeing an informed electorate. Yet we just completed a national election with an all time low voter turn out. Millions of voters refused to participate in the electoral process. We denigrated and blamed non-voters for being uncaring citizens, yet the corporate media has failed to address core issues affecting most people in this country. Voter participation levels are directly related to issues that the citizenry feels are important. Many people no longer trust the corporate media to provide the full truth. This opens people's susceptibilities to believing in conspiracies and plots to explain unanswered questions. Cynicism has deterred voting for many.

How can we free ourselves from this dilemma? First off, We can think of conspiracies as actions by small groups of individuals instead of massive collective plots by governments and corporations. Small groups can be dangerous, especially when the individuals have significant power in huge public and private bureaucracies, but they can not possibly be interlinked in a macro way bridging the gaps between thousand of corporations and government bureaucracies. Micro-plots may well be the answer to some of the conspiracies floating in our circles of cynicism. However, without accurate through investigations we only stew in our distrust and experience widening alienation from our democratic process.


http://www.commondreams.org/views02/1109-05.htm

are conspiracy theories often junk, yes again. Look, obviously politicians conspire and lie, that's kind of in the job description. But looking for a conspiracy in everything that happens is silly, precisely because its so easy to find one. You can connect almost any events if you try hard enough.

That's a bit of a push poll, isn't it? It seems to suggest that I can't simultaneously be skeptical of both Bush's statements and those of conspiracy proponents.

I am among those who believe that most conspiracy proponents are making things far more complex than they need to be. It seems to me that it's most often driven by a sense to believe that somebody is in control and can be held responsible. I don't believe any individual or group is actually in control, so it's easier for me.

as of last week, that's my new way to put it.

and "really weird ones" are in the eye of the pollmaster. the ones you listed are not so "weird" to me.

They claim that WTC had to have been destroyed by CIA bombs "because it fell straight down like a demolition"

That's pretty pathetic evidence IMO, and the Twin Towers also fell straight down. If anything, I think it' s much more likely that the Bushies knew SOME sort of attack was coming, dragged their feet in trying to prrevent it, and were surprised at the collapses. Even the engineers who built the damn things NEVER thought they would come down in such a fashion (of course tinfoilers would cite that as more evidence of bombs)

Anyway, the way the Bushies try to oppostunistically use everything that happens as a propaganda tool tends to make everything look like a conspirracy...

Is John Ashcroft gonna find out how I voted here?

and I stop asking questions. I don't want to look dumb.

/sarcasm off

How else could one go about them?

has taken on the connotation "deranged ravings", when all it is is a theory. There's nothing wrong with a theory, unless it's underpinnings are just to flimsy to support any kind of plausibility.

Honestly, I don't think the tinfoil hatters are kooks in the least. I just think they aren't thinking things through. "Yeah it fell straight down like a controlled demolition!" on its own is not enough to put George Tenet (or Dumbya) in jail even in the reomte chance that it was true...

When you have lived in US since JFK was murdered, through the Cold War, and have a fairly solid foundation of any of the following: history, politics, world affairs, and militarism, you would have to go through an exorcism to remove the instinct to associate blame on any or all of the following agencies:

http://www.worldnewsstand.net/history/ShadowGovt.htm

In spite of that, the need for survival and desire not live in constant depression and fear, keeps the door open that it could be a coincidence. Ya, right.

You mentioned in your survey those who constantly post "conspiracy theories" and how "you people" make DU look bad to FReepers.
Usually, they post on some RW board, taking a moral high ground, & never look back on all the threads they trashed with crazy "CT" generalization.

My take:
Those people have baggage or "closet issues" that "they" are avoiding like Limbaugh/Oxycontin.
They get some vicarious pleasure from pretending to have all the answers.
Finger pointing (they think) takes the heat off, like J. Edgar Hoover.
The more they argue, the clearer their motives become.

Investigating the suspected co-conspirators past history & experience, will give you the wisdom to know the difference.

"The Book" some claim to live by are full "liberals" and "conspiracy theories". Too bad it's "read only".

Don't let them get to you. In the movie, Conspiracy Theory, Mel looked like an idiot, but he was right on.

and making up my own mind.

when something seems strange, I put it in the "should have an investigation" pile, which is growing pretty large these days...

I'm skeptical when it comes to CTs and I am also skeptical with respect to what the administration has to say. There doesn't seem to be a choice there for me. In a way, it's sort of offensive, much in the same way if we had a "Liberal or Conservative" poll and have "Liberal flag burning anti-Americans" as the only liberal selection.

Conspiracy theorists do good research. But their conclusions are often VERY flawed. They get tunnel vision and refuse to admit the possibility that some things actually are unrelated coincidences.

I do read their work and take away a more "reserved" notion of possibility instead of certainty. It's also possible to "believe" in a cohesive theory, but not ASSERT it as a fact.

Finally, there is just "knowing" that the official explanation is bullshit. You have no better explanation, but the official one just isn't right (Kennedy assasination (both of them)).