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wubbathompson Donating Member (211 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 07:59 AM
Original message
France says 35-hour week is failing
PARIS -- The French government Monday described the 35-hour working week as a financial disaster that was costing the state billions of dollars and promised to reform the system despite fierce union opposition.

The finance minister, Nicolas Sarkozy, said that the 35-hour week had burdened the state with additional social charges and that it had demoralized millions of workers.

"The Socialists made a decision which is not compatible with our responsibilities to Europe," he said. He suggested a system whereby those who wanted to stay on the 35-hour week could do so, but those who wanted to work and earn more had greater latitude.

The 35-hour week came into effect in 1997, as the Socialists' idea for reducing unemployment. Unemployment now is just under 10 percent

http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-france18.html
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trotsky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 08:12 AM
Response to Original message
1. That's too bad.
I read that German firms are struggling too, with their reduced work week. I was really hoping that would work, so that there would be the slightest chance it might catch on in the U.S. Looks pretty unlikely now.
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rooboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 08:15 AM
Response to Original message
2. Strange...
we in Australia have a 38 hour working week (I think) and it doesn't seem to be causing any special problems here. I don't know if I could cope with the US system of working your butt off all week for only 2 weeks a year vacation...
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 08:18 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Vacation? Surely you jest!
I don't honestly know anybody who gets a paid vacation, two weeks or otherwise. You might be able to wrangle some unpaid time off now and then here in the states, but the underclass doesn't get paid vacations (or healthcare or retirement benefits, etc...).

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Nicholas D Wolfwood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 08:30 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. Maybe I picked a good profession...
But 3 weeks paid vacation is pretty standard in my field. Upper level guys get 4.
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 08:32 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. If you are fortunate enough to have a 'profession' instead of a 'job'
Then I'd say you ARE lucky. You are also in the minority in the US.
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Nicholas D Wolfwood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 08:48 AM
Response to Reply #7
10. Luck didn't have shit to do with it.
Not to belittle anyone else's efforts, but I busted my ass to get where I am today. My career wasn't handed to me by anyone in any way.
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. Didn't say anyone handed it to you
But at the taxi company where I work, we're up to our eyeballs in post-graduate degree holders and former IT workers. Luck may indeed have something to do with it nowdays, especially when it comes to keeping that profession.

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Pithlet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 11:14 AM
Response to Reply #10
23. Some people work their ass off
and still don't have professions. My husband counts himself very lucky that he has a good job in the IT field right now. In this economy, luck plays a big hand. There are a lot of educated, highly skilled people working at WalMart these days.
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beyurslf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 08:36 AM
Response to Reply #3
8. I actually get 3 weeks too. And we have to take ours or we lose it.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 08:44 AM
Response to Reply #3
9. My brother gets six weeks paid vacation per year
He works at a limestone plant owned by Pfizer. Has been there for 31 years. Makes somewhere around $25 an hr plus time and a half after 8 hrs per day and double time for holidays. Has medical and stock shares provided by the company and will receive a substantial monthly amount when he decides to retire. He is one of the lucky ones.
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Yupster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #3
14. You don't know any schoolteachers?
or cops or firemen, or government workers?
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 09:46 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. Not personally, no
:shrug:
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BonjourUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #14
19. School teacher in France
Max 29-hour week for a school teacher (less for a prof in college or hightschool) :

vacations:
Februar : 2 weeks
April : 2 weeks
Summer : 9 weeks
November : 1 week
Christmas : 2 weeks
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HFishbine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #14
20. I don't know about your community
but teachers here don't get two weeks paid vacation.

When school is out for the summer, they are off the clock and not getting paid unless they teach summer school or have their ten-month pay amortized over twelve months.
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rooboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 09:48 AM
Response to Reply #3
18. Four weeks paid with 17.5% additional loading for most Aussies. n/t
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nonconformist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 08:18 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. 2 weeks vacation a year... if you're lucky
My husband works 60-67 hrs a week and gets one week off/yr. Well, he's supposed to... but due to lay-offs, he hasn't had a week of paid vacation in 3 yrs.
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NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 08:22 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. i am taking my first vacation in 5 years over Memorial Day
1/2 day Thursday, Friday, 1/2 day Tuesday

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ProfessorGAC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 08:56 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. I Get Five Weeks
And it's not allowed to sell back more than one of them, and you are STRONGLY encouraged to take the time you're allotted. (More like required.)

It's 2 weeks after one year, 3 after 5 years, 4 after 12 years, and 5 weeks after 20, plus one day per 5 years beyond 20. So, i get 26 days this year.

The company firmly believes that people should NOT work continuously, since productivity drops and people get burned out, so taking vacation time is more than encouraged, it's practically insisted upon.
The Professor
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theboss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 09:29 AM
Response to Original message
13. I'm up to four weeks a year
Next year it's five.

I actually like working so I rarely take any; usually one week a year with a few long weekends. I can sell the weeks back to the company at set intervals.
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Minstrel Boy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 09:38 AM
Response to Original message
15. This is a conservative paper parroting a conservative government's
Edited on Wed May-19-04 09:38 AM by Minstrel Boy
badmouthing of the legacy of its Socialist predecesor.

Just thought I'd point that out.
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BonjourUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 10:50 AM
Response to Reply #15
22. That is not completely wrong,
because the law is too stiff and more latitude is a necessity for many jobs. The cost of this stiffness is too heavy and it must be to reduce
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BonjourUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 09:46 AM
Response to Original message
16. I couldn't tell you how many weeks of paid vacations we get in France.
Between 6 mini to 8 or 9 (more in some public jobs).

I don't believe many French will choose to work and earn more. The life is too short and we have now bad habits. The restaurants, hotels... work during a longer time per year.

Sarkozy forgets a point : the French productivity is one of the best in the world with these 35 h because we have to do the same in less time without more employees, and they have had no effect for reducing unemployment
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NCLib23 Donating Member (97 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-19-04 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #16
21. I figure the firms will start hiring the 40hr/week workers
and drive the 35 hr workers out of jobs due to a competitive advantage.

The current employees will be safe, but all new hires will IMHO be competitng with 40 hr workers, and may get "crushed beneath the wheel of progress" as Herman Hesse put it.
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