HELP! My son is thinking of enlisting!

Here's the deal, my beautiful, compassionate, pacifist 18 year old son is graduating high school. We got his Financial Aid letter and all we are getting is $2500 in student loans, leaving us 12 grand short. I told him I'd have to dip into my meager IRA, but that was fine with me.

Well he started researching and thinks he may want to enlist to get college money. NOW, he isn't totally stupid and hayes shrubbie nearly as much as I, so he discovered the Coast Guard Reserve and figured that would be pretty safe, may help him with his goal of being a cop and would instill some discipline. (what 18 year old doesn't need some?)

Is anyone familiar with the Coast Guard Reserve? Any chance they could call him into an actual regular military unit? Anyone know how long a reserve committment lasts?

Any ideas on how to talk him out of it and/or for alternative college financing?

Thanks in advance!

On edit: Thanks to all of you for your gread advice in information, I knew I could count on this place. I sent this thread to my son along with some other info I found.

one that has vets that just got back from Iraq.

The military will promise him the world but when he signs on the dotted line they will do what they want! They need warm bodies in Iraq, if he signs he'll go.

This admin. has no morals, the don't keep their word.

I wouldn't put it past them to call in the Coast Guard Reserves for active on-the-ground duty. PLEASE convince him not to do it. No amount of money is worth it. Maybe AFTER the elections, when there is less of a risk. Just my 2 cents.

Hold off until after the elections and see what happens.

I remember during the first Gulf War, there were "Coasties" patrolling
the harbors and checking the ships that came in. I'm sure some were reservist.

a Coast Guard'er was killed

I just googled "Coast Guard" and Iraq and got his obit, he wanted to be in law enforcement too.

http://www.redding.com/redd/nw_world/article/0,2232,REDD_17546_2919380,00.html

Coast Guard Petty Officer 3rd Class Nathan Bruckenthal, 24, of Opa-Locka, Fla.


Big and boisterous, Nathan Bruckenthal followed a family tradition of public service. His grandfather fought in World War II, his father was a Long Island, N.Y., police chief and his stepfather was a career Army vet.

As a teenager, Bruckenthal became a volunteer firefighter. At 18, he joined the Coast Guard. After 9/11, he used vacation time to help out at Ground Zero. Eventually, he wanted a law-enforcement career.

One Coast Guard posting took him to Washington state, where the boisterous, 6-foot-2 Guardsman devoted his spare time to volunteering on the Makah Nation Indian reservation nearby. He served on its fire company, and coached kids in football. There he met his wife, Pattie, who was a college student studying the tribe.

The first Coast Guard member to die in combat since the Vietnam War, Bruckenthal was on his second Iraq tour when suicide bombers in boats tried to blow up an Iraqi oil terminal in the Persian Gulf on April 24. He and two others foiled the attack, but died as they did.

To honor Bruckenthal, the Makah tribe sent a special tribal blanket to be given to his wife. Three months' pregnant with their first child, the widow wrapped herself in it for comfort at her husband's graveside service May 7.

And since he want to get into law enforcement he very well could end up being one of those guards.

Sorry, but over $12K seems a bit much.

A GOOD EDUCATION comes from within the person, not from within what it says on the University walls.

It seems that all options haven't been explored yet.

An out of state school and one of the few to accept him (he was a goof off as a frosh/soph, low class rank, high honors since though.)

He has already picked his roommate, as friend from here and we have paid the deposit.

My daughter's friend who is graduating this year joined the reserves but in the military band.... actually two of her friends did.

BTW, two years of ComCollege he can STILL transfer when maybe things are better?

But then again, he's 18... and 'wait' or 'sorry' just isn't in his vocabulary... (if he's anything like my daughter! <wink>)

the military really changes you, and if he's a pacifist he'll have a creepy life in the miltary. Oh, they promise you the moon but I'll bet they'll start yanking more benefits away. A lot of college students work part time, and are there any scholarships available?

but is his choice worth his life?

and loved it. You pretty much are resucerers of people on the open water, Immigration patrol, stuff like that. I have never heard of US coast guard getting sent to Iraq. Plus if you live around the Great Lakes area, coast guard would be best bet.

I think he'd like that stuff but if bushco steals the election again, all bets are off.

There are so many really great community colleges in the Chicago area.

Years ago I did 2 years over at Harper College before transferring down to U of I. It was a good experience and I saved thousands of dollars.

I am looking into it but payments start almost immediately after the 1st semester and I am already in debt up the ying-yang. Are these better than say a home equity line up credit? (I was saving that to pay off the medical and credit card bills.)

The Air Force is pretty safe and also the Navy though there are some jobs in either that could be selectively borrowed for more hazardous duties.

Stay away from munitions, corpsman (Navy medics accompany Marines into combat) and military police. There may be others.

I just talked to a friend who's son is getting out after four years. He was in Iraq three times. The last time he was shot in the shoulder and has two pieces of shrapnel in his leg.

They are putting the pressure on him to re-enlist, but he told his mom he can't take it anymore. She told me he has seen too much misery and they will never talk him into staying.

No he would not be safer in the Navy, everyone associates big boats and lots of water with the Navy. The Navy has a bigger Air Force than the Air Force, they provide support and logistics to the Marines (a branch of the Navy). The first question out of a presidents mouth in a time of crisis is "What's the nearest task force".

NAVAL EXPEDITIONARY FORCES The Navy and Marine Corps provide naval expeditionary forces as part of a joint force. These forces are organized to ac- complish a specific objective in a foreign country.3 They are designed to project military power ashore from the sea, to in- clude the establishment of a landing force on foreign soil if needed, and thus to operate in the littoral regions. Naval expeditionary forces combine the complementary but distinct capabilities of the Navy and Marine Corps. Through attack aircraft, surface fire support, sea-launched cruise mis- siles, and special-warfare forces, Navy forces provide the ca- pability to attack targets in the littorals, and they provide the capability to deploy, land, and sustain expeditionary forces ashore. Navy forces contribute the seaward element of naval expeditionary power projection. Marine forces contribute land- ing forces, the landward extension of naval expeditionary power. Landing forces include not only ground combat forces but also Marine aviation and logistics elements that can oper- ate from expeditionary land as well as sea bases.4 In addition to projecting landing forces ashore, deployed Marine aviation forces can also strike targets ashore operating from aircraft carriers and amphibious ships. Naval forces operating in international waters can minimize military and political liabilities. Naval expeditionary forces are self-contained, able to conduct most military operations with- out external support. Operating from the sea, naval expedition- ary forces can maintain a presence in an area almost indefinitely, eliminating the need for ground-based staging and reducing the influence that host nations or other local powers can exert on U.S. policy initiatives. Naval expeditionary forces are unencumbered by the treaties and access agreements that land-based forces require to operate overseas.5 Through forward presence and deployability, naval expedi- tionary forces provide a rapid response to many crises or po- tential crises. Naval forces are typically the first to arrive at the scene of a crisis. As part of a joint force, they can serve as ena- bling forces by stabilizing a situation and preparing for follow on operations. Naval expeditionary forces offer the combatant commander a flexible range of options in the support of national interests, covering peacetime missions, crisis, and conflict. They can of- fer a visible deterrent presence in full view of potential aggressors or can operate from over the horizon to minimize political provocation or gain operational surprise and security. They can perform missions ranging from humanitarian assis- tance to forcible entry. They have the flexibility to project power inland to a significant depth at the time and place of their own choosing.
http://www.tpub.com/content/USMC/mpdpub3/css/mpdpub3_69.htm

He just got back from Iraq. They deployed him for about 9 months.

He says everybody there hates us.

What you said about college aid just doesn't sound right. My son graduated from a great high school with slightly above average grades, yet managed to get a lot of help. If I were you I would check into the aid thing again. Perhaps you missed something.

Scuba

He was in the bottom quarter of his class, on top of that last year my business had it's best year in decades and the profits went on my taxes, I have no idea where the money went to though. High 5 figures nullified and chance of grants. Even though 2 years ago I made less than half that and have had over 25k in medical expenses that last 5 years or so. They only look at the last year.

I hope your business keeps on improving and you send him through no sweat.

Let's hope Kerry gets elected and fixes the economy.

Scuba

It's a small architectural office, we had one very lucrative job but in general have just limped along for the most part. That's the damn thing about it, it's like fishing, ya never know whan you'll hit the next school.

"Full Metal Jacket" and have him watch it with you.

So, far, I also agree with all the other replies as options. Wait until after the election or even spring of 2005 no matter who get elected. Then make a decision.

Start him on one to a few courses that you might be able to afford without matriculating into a full program for the time being.

If this is all of his own initiative, and he's smart enough to know what's going on with this current regime, then maybe he knows what he doing?

If there is a recruiter involved, he's being given a hard-sell routine. That's something to beware of. Ask anyone about military recruiters.

He did his research online. A year and a half ago he found out the marines would send you a free pair of cool shades, he sent for them and they wouldn't leave him alone for many months, he knows recruiters now.

it was the twice-a-week phone calls and the "friendship" of the recruiter that gets them in the end.

But there are no 100% guarantees. Military service helped me, I have no regrets. I have never had a problem getting interviews having the military background. I have never been turned down for any job that I have applied for. I joined by because of economical reasons as well, and it paid off in my case.

Coast Guard Must Play in Overseas War Plans
By Paul A. Yost Jr.
Proceedings, October 2003
A Department of Defense study contemplates removing the Coast Guard from combat roles overseas—such as this patrol off Iraq by the USCGC Baranof (WPB-1318). But why duplicate manifestly effective forces that have answered the nation's calls since 1790?

Although Kipling's famous poem is about the British soldier in the late 1800s, it might well describe the U.S. Coast Guard today. A current Department of Defense (DoD) study on restructuring the U.S. armed forces has engulfed the service in controversy over wartime roles. The controversy centers on Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld's suggestion that the Coast Guard be removed from war plans for forward combat operations. The recent acknowledgment that foreign military assistance is needed badly in Iraq should give pause to any such decision.

The long history of the service in time of war is instructive and impressive. For example, it earned distinction as the only U.S. naval force in the War of 1812. During World War II, the service posed a major threat to German subs and ran landing craft in the Normandy landings. Further, it provided more than 30% of the naval interdiction forces in the Vietnam War and contributed to Operations Desert Storm and Iraqi Freedom. These actions obviously are not sufficient reason to establish a wartime role for the Coast Guard. But the DoD study should not be guided by the perennial competition for budget dollars or roles-and-missions rivalry. The Secretary of Defense must be the honest broker in these interservice battles and not stir up fights among cabinet-level secretaries.

In the late 1980s, Secretary of the Navy James Webb discussed removing all Coast Guard high-endurance cutters from Navy war plans because they had women on board. With a 600-ship Navy still on his drawing board, he believed he could do without them. The Coast Guard's strong stand against his proposal quickly caused its demise.<snip
http://www.military.com/Content/MoreContent1?file=NI_CG_1003

Also on March 12, the Pentagon announced that the total number of reserve personnel currently on active duty in support of the partial mobilization for the Army National Guard and Army Reserve is 130,142; Naval Reserve, 8,744; Air National Guard and Air Force Reserve, 27,737; Marine Corps Reserve, 18,770; and the Coast Guard Reserve, 3,199. This brings the total Reserve and National Guard on active duty to 188,592.
http://www.cdi.org/iraq/forces-update.cfm

U.S. Coast Guard
Deployed: Persian Gulf
Personnel: About 600 active-duty and reserve personnel
Cutters: Eight 110-foot Island Class cutters
Units: Port Security Unit 305, based at Fort Eustis, Virginia, and Port Security Unit 309, from Port Clinton, Ohio, and Coast Guard elements of the Navy's Harbor Defense Command Unit 206, from Jacksonville, Florida. Deployed are Coast Guard Cutter (CGC) Wrangell, from South Portland, Maine; CGC Grand Isle, from Gloucester, Massachusetts; CGCs Adak and Bainbridge Island, from Sandy Hook, New Jersey; CGC Aquidneck and the crew of CGC Block Island, from Atlantic Beach, North Carolina; CGCs Pea Island and Knight Island, from St. Petersburg, Florida; CGC Baranof, from Miami; and the crew of the CGC Sapelo, from Key West, Florida.
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2003/iraq/forces/coalition/deployment/coast.guard/coast.guard.html »

Or Brethren Volunteer Service? Or Christian Peacemaking Teams?

He won't earn money for college, but he may find something he likes to do with one of those outfits that beats learning how to participate in crimes against humanity.

Also, if he doesn't mind beginning college for a year or two (and if he's only 18, there really is no great, thundering hurry), a couple of years of such service might bolster his resume sufficiently to qualify him for a few more institutions of higher learning.

beginning to understand.

If you can't swing it, don't send him. It will ruin your relationship if he goes and has to come back home because you've found out you can't cut the financial side of it. Perhaps if he goes to a junior college he can go the final 2 years. Even if he went to an in state school it would save you a bundle and give you a little more time to figure things out.

My son went to a local school. Even then tuition was $16,000/year. He was lucky in that he got some small scholarships for going to school within the Catholic system. His grades were great, he just graduated Magna Cum Laude. He worked hard at grades, and it payed off big.

Scuba

It won't be easy but between my wife and I we have enought in our IRAs to cover 4 years if it comes down to that, no penalties, we just pay the taxes.

My main goal is to do whatever it takes to raise my kids right and give them the proper start into adulthood. I figure I'll never retire anyway, by the time this boomer gets to that age SS will be gone as well. No matter, my goal is now and for them.

Jesus H Christ - I'm glad I live in Australia.

Most of the world encourages and subsidizes their secondary education.

This is a state school too (albeit not my state), not private, those gat get REALLY expensive.

a non private place costs that much?

Australia's been following a dodgy path in relation to university funding - we have HECS, which is a debt accumulated by the student depending on how long/expensive the course is, and it's paid off once the student starts working, it comes straight out of your pay as a extra couple of percentage points on your income tax.

It sucks (particularly as it was introduced by the "left" wing party and is suported by all the pollies who got THEIR degrees free)but it's not the full cost of the actual course and it doesn't need to be paid up front.

What does a middle income family with a couple of kids do to be able to affod that - let alone low income families who I assume just forget about it?

Northwestern University in Evanston, Il., they're not ALL this costly but some are even more.

http://ug-finaid.northwestern.edu/components.html

Student Expense Budget 2004-05


Tuition: $29,940



Room & Board: $9,393



Books & Supplies: $1,353



Personal Expenses: $1,611



Transportation: varies



Total Budget: $42,297

Totally working class people with very little money. So, it went like this. Graduate from high school and go to the junior college. If you don't like it, get a job and work and go to the State college (if you can get in) or University (for even more).

It ended up taking I believe it was almost 17 years to do it.

I would not have wanted my family to take out home equity loans or hit their IRAs for me to go to college. No way.

Enlist? Yeah right.

My mom was a single mom (my dad died when I was 13). So we had a little money for college, but not all. I'm not sure what his grades are like, but I was in the top quarter of my class.

Go to your local large library. There is a set of books there that have every scholarship known to mankind in them. Any semi-decent librarian should know what I'm talking about. You could be a Gay Son of a Daughter of the American Republic and there's probably a scholarship for you!

Try every possible avenue. Try some of these examples below:
Research your genealogy: Are you Norwegian? American Indian? Black?

Religion: Are you Lutheran? Methodist? Episcopalian?

History: Can you prove descendancy from an original settler? A member of the Confederacy? An original settler of Texas?

Union Affiliation: Has anyone in your family been in a union that gives away scholarships?

Was someone in your family an Elk, Kiwani, Lion or one of those types of clubs?

What does your son want to major in? Often there are special scholarships for that major.

What about the university? Check the department your son wants to go into and see what type of scholarships they have.

You'll be amazed at the absolutely amazing variety of scholarships, contests, writing awards, etc. And it will keep your son alive and true to his principles.

My big thing was writing essays. I wrote 2 the summer after my senior year of high school and won $1500. My father had been a member of the National Federation of Federal Employees, and I won an award from them. The other I got from the Society of Mayflower Descendants. I knew nothing about either topic before I started, but managed to bullshit pretty effectively to win. (This was before the internet--an absolute goldmine of research information!)

During the summers, I worked in a record store to get money for books and supplies for the next semester.

I hate to advise you to help him, since it should be his work, but if you have to, help him write it. This is a little more serious than when I was in school.

Worst case scenario, you may have missed deadlines for this year, but he could save up a little more money working for a couple months and apply for next year to see if he can get any of these types of awards.

I wish you luck!
Please let us know how he's doing!
FSC

Unfortunately he had a bad case of know-it-alls the first two years of HS. His grades were BAD, then he got serious Jr. and Sr. year and has made high honors consistently but still has a mediocre GPA and class rank. You need a B average these days to even make top half.

If you're like my mom you'll have to berate and bitch til your lips turn blue, but HEY! It worked!

FSC

I, too, was in the Navy and you know, once a young man gets that particular wild hair up his ass, there doesn't seem much way to talk sense to them. The military DEPENDS on it as a matter of fact. They have since we first started gathering up in armies.

You have to understand boys ... in certain situations, they're stupid.

Simple as that. Get a couple of them together and their aggregate IQ drops by 25%.

The CG Reserve probably won't feed the bulldog for college $. To get decent bennies for school, it would probably take an active duty committment. The Navy minimum is 4 years. I do not know about the Coast Guard but I suspect it is similar.

there are unsubsidized federal loans that aren't based on need. also, there are private lenders that will also give your son with your cosigniture a non-need based loan (key bank comes to mind.) also, there are federal PLUS loans (parent loans) that are also not need based. the way the government calculates need is so screwed up, he really won't receive any substatianal aid unless you were extremely poor or after he turns 23.

Tell him our story. My husband has been hospitalized for clinical depression, I am being seen by a counselor for extreme depression, we are both on meds, we wake up every morning having panic attacks, we both see a counselor once a week, we can barely get thru the day because underlying everything is the reality that we have a kid in Iraq, and we havent seen him since January and even tho we want to believe we will see him again we always know thats not a gaurantee
Tell him the depression has reverberated thru the family..my other son is having extreme panic attacks, my oldest son also, my middle son doesnt even deal with it because he can hardly talk about it, and the family is wounded , very wounded.
Add to that the daily everyday stresses which become magnified a thousand times because you know a loved one is in a war zone, no matter how much you try and push the thought away.
Its hell for the families, I cannot tell you how hellish it is.
Tell him please dont do it.
www.calltoconscience.net

I have been following your threads and don't post much because I so wish I could say something to make you feel better or comfort you but feel I don't have the verbal skills.

I pray for Michael's speedy and safe return, and a return to normalcy for your family!

I'll break your frigging knees before I let you enlist in a military where GWBush is Commander-In-Chief.

Their great great great....grandfather was a general in the Revolutionary War. He was killed on Bunker Hill. He was really fighting for freedom, not one asshole's ego trip.

MzPip
:dem: