MSNBC: Is Bush getting apocalyptic advice?

This is from their 'gossip' seciton, so I'm not sure if this qualifies as LBN, but I'll go ahead and post it anyway.

Link

<snip>
VAN IMPE is the author of such books as “Israel’s Final Holocaust” and “The Great Escape: Preparing for the Rapture, the Next Event on God’s Prophetic Clock.”
       He has predicted that the end of the world will strike somewhere between 2003 and 2012 and one reviewer has called his TV preaching show with wife Rexella “a fantastically loopy apocalyptic take on the week’s news.”
       The issue of the alleged involvement with the Bush administration came up on his Web site when someone asked Van Impe, “Do you think that President Bush, apparently a Christian man, believes and knows he is involved in prophetic events concerning the Middle East and final battle between good and evil?”
       “I believe he is a wonderful man,” Van Impe responded, and goes on to say, “I was contacted a few weeks ago by the Office of Public Liaison for the White House and by the National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice to make an outline. And I’ve spent hours preparing it. I will release this information to the public in September, but it’s in his hands. He will know exactly what is going to happen in the Middle East and what part he will have under the leading of the Holy Spirit of God. So, it’s a tremendous time to be alive.”
</snip>

Holy crap!!!

It finally made mainstream (okay, okay, it's only MSNBC)news.

I wonder how mainstream protestants will feel about this?

I wonder if the WH will take steps to deny the request?

This could bring the whole "God told me to" episode into play.

God I'm happy about this!

:bounce:
edited for spelling/typos

Jack Van Whimpy swore up and down the world was ending in 1973, with the oil embargo,

Then, Whimpy said it was 1981, 7 years after the European Parliament came into existence, he kept humming about the 10 toes of Daniel...

...Then he said it was 1988

...then he said it was 1991 with the New World Order

...then he said it was 1995

....1996

....1997

....1998

....1999

....2000 was going to ben the end because of the Y2K bug...

....2001

....2002


Well, with an incredible track record like this, will ANYONE believe him?????

this isn't the first I've heard of this...Bushs "personal pastor" is an end times nut from Houston I believe.

Basically in all the right wing churches this is standard fare. It's common belief we're in the end times " for real this time"

Bush often includes a code tidbit in his speeches to placate these folk; it's generally a biblical reference or a hymnal line which would only be known among "true believers"

That this guy has his finger on the buttonis too scary to comprehend :scared:
:nuke:

that "I" am so important that the world most come to an end during my life time.

The End is always just a few years away with the Armageddon crowd.
No-one ever says "By my Bible calculations, the world will end in the year 2675." Can't sell many books with that prediction.

OF that day and of that hour know one knows no not the angels in heaven not even the son but the father only. I find it funny theese people knwow more than our Lord. St. Peter said a day is like a thousand years and a thousand years like a day with God. And their will be false teachers exploting the fears of people. 2Peter chapters 2-5 lass supper passages in Matt, Luke,Jhon. There will be signs in heavean and in the sky earthquakes sun darkend locus with human faces and all other kinds of stuff. So Iam assuming theese people must be on DRUGS becasue I don't see any of this stuff happening so they must be hallucnating.

A reletive of mine uses the end times to convince herself she will not be around to suffer the health problems of smokeing like a freght train for years and she wont get other health problems from eating a pound of surgar daily.

sonme Church going COnservitives use this theroy (the world will end soon so I will just stick my head in the sand and do nothing but watch nd talk about it. instead of trying to do something about the problems of society

That he really is. Ya think?

I think it was a DU-er who discovered this tidbit in Van Impe's literature. There was a thread a couple of days ago.

....that the government's calling him a liar?

"“My investigation into it is that there’s no truth to it,” National Security Council spokesman Sean McCormack told The Scoop, “but I’m continuing to look into it.”

on Monday, and he has followed it along.

Today: "Hey, we managed to get this story into the gossip column at least..."

atrios is cool: atrios.blogspot.com

It's important to get these things right. :-)

How fair of you :-)

And we should do everything possible to prevent them from carrying out their self-fulfilling prophecy.

I found it on Eschaton's blog. As I live in the Bible Belt of Lancaster County, PA, and as anything on the End-Times is just about required reading, it really caught my notice. The whole series "Left Behind" is big bucks here. We also have a huge production company called "Sight and Sound Theater" that just featured the story of Daniel, from the Old Testament. My Catholic friend went to see it and it ended with the Rapture, Apocalypse etc. with helicopters bombs....whole present day Middle East scenario. She was appalled at what she felt was a push for Bush's foriegn policy agenda.

Didn't Adolph Hitler seek this sort of advice from a variety of seers, crackpots, and pseudo-mystics?

Nice precedent if he did.

as a basis for foreign policy. Take a gander at excerpts from various Reagan speeches that Hal Lindsay quotes in "The Late Great Planet Earth." Its frightening to me to know that a U.S. president took apocalyptic literature into account when forming foreign policy.

so that he can have it carried into battle in front of the glorious advancing US troops?

...but unfortunately for Bush, it's in Bill Clinton's pants.


Thank You! Please tip your waitresses generously! Good Night!

of the arc of the covenant. And I hope it's televised, so we can all see the melting faces.

:puke:It's incredible how these people are fooled by that evil bastard in the Whitehouse. I can not and I WILL NOT believe that God would use that devil's spawn as a tool for his return. This is outrageous....that anyone would actually go along with all the corruption going on in this administration and tout it as a "good" thing.I hope God will help us all....and let something happen soon to expose this idiot and his cronies for what they REALLY are!!! :argh:

She really is !!!

You realize there is a huge difference between god telling you something and BELIEVING god tells you something.

Many of the hardcore religious nuts believe that god talks to them. It is either a sign of psychosis, or something they create themselves unknowingly to further send them in to extremism.

People are NOT saying that he thinks god is talking to him to say "Oh look, he's doing good".

There saying it to say "Holy shit this guys nuts"

Well, it's true.

"He will know exactly what is going to happen in the Middle East and what part he will have under the leading of the Holy Spirit of God."

So * really IS the Anti-Christ.

:nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke:

I don't think most people will be able to understand the implications of such a revelation. When you begin to understand the Illuminist's plan (of which Bush and his father are a part), along with the Southern Baptist and their ilk who all believe in the immanentization of the eschaton (controlling world events as to bring on the second coming of Christ), you have a recipe for disaster. I hope people will wake up to what is truly happening in our world today.

Do you have proof that Bush Père & Fils are Illuminati? I'd love to see it.

On "Bush and Illuminati". There's plenty written on it.

I Googled it, as you suggested. What I got was a bunch of articles either by wacko fundamentalist Christians or tinfoil hat conspiracy theorists. Many of whom singled out a photo of Bush at the Olympic festival, in which he's holding a torch. They claim that the torch, the 'cauldron' and his white Stetson and black coat are symbols of the Illuminati. This is absolute cherry-picking hogwash! Another site claimed that Bush and his crew participated in ritual human sacrifice! (Not including the wars he's waged, by the way)

C'mon! Bush is an ideologue and an idiot----but he's no Illuminatus!

I asked for proof, not far-fetched conjecture!

If you don't believe that * is going to use the information from Van Impe for some purpose that most people would have to put a tinfoil hat on to believe? Maybe I'm missing something. Also in the amount of time between my post and your response I would say that you probably had time to look through the first few pages of information, when there were 28,500 results. Perhaps you should look a little further into it before you start attacking the messenger.

I did what you said. I Googled your exact words and read the results. The first ten or so were all utter lunacy. I'm afraid I don't have time to delve much deeper. So, if you have proof--as I originally requested--I would be delighted if you'd provide it.

Listen, I think GWB is a RW fundie loon. That seems pretty apparent. This article feeds that assertion--plus I found it somewhat amusing. Suggesting that he's part of a 500-year-old secret cabal of 'illuminated' new-world-order types is quite another.

Next, you'll be saying he's a Knight Templar, kissing Baphomet's ass.

I would like to see some real proof of what you say. Since you said it, could you select the most convincing of the 28,500 Google results pegging Bush as Illuminati and present it to us? That would be so nice. Remember, it's your postulation.

Right near the top!

<snip>
According to Luciferian tradition, Jenna and Barbara Bush should have been flown to Belgium by their parents to take part in their Mothers of Darkness 'Sealing Ritual' on schedule. The optimum date would be around May 1, the satanic holiday of Beltaine. They were, however still attending college at the time (Jenna in Texas and Barbara at Yale). This event would therefore have to be postponed to approximately one month later.
</snip>
Wow. School comes before Satan for the Bush twins! Who'da thunk it?

I compiling the proof that you asked for. Most of the information that would cause me to hold that belief has been gained through reading and research and I will have to go back and find the various sources that I have. However, I do have other things to do. Why are you being so antagonistic? I thought the whole BFEE, skull and bones, and Bohemian Grove thing were widely held beliefs around here.

Amazing. Let's hope this story grows legs.

Just so other DUers can see it

:kick:

So they DO really have an exit strategy for Iraq. The world will end. Right, Got it.

So the "adults" are in charge again, too bad they are all FRICKIN' INSANE.

nt

Noo-kyoo-luhr.

Yes, folks. The end-timers are in charge! We'll all be riding the big one to ground-zero, like a collective Slim Pickens. Yeee haaaaww!

truly believe that only when Israel possess Jerusalem will the Second Advent of Jesus occur. According to what I can discern, our President believes this also. That is why this administration has taken the posture on Israel-Palestine that it has and why the entire Muslim world feels it must declare a jihad on us. This latest makes a lot of sense to me...

for something in OUR belief system? Shouldn't they be using their own?

using Bush and all the other seriously deluded people who not only believe an apocalyptic scenario, but are also, yes, engaged in a self-fulling prophecy.

Long ago I heard the phrase "useful fools" used, not as Mona Charen did, but in relation to Israel and fundamentalist Christians.

One thing that is essential to end times prophecy, btw, is that the temple mount will be rebuild. There is a mosque on top of the mount now. There was a plot by a radical Israeli to blow up the mosque previously.

Now, whether Bush actually believes this stuff, or is pandering to the endtimers...who knows.

I cannot believe that Bush wants to lose all those oil profits and all that money from deficit spending via his bonds, though.

But maybe he does believe it, and he, too, is being played by Perle and Wolfowitz and Cheney and Rummy.

Who knows what these people really think.

All I know is that they are a danger to this country and should be removed from office immediately, by legal means available in this country to dismiss a president who is mentally incompetent.

The neo-cons should be tried for crimes against humanity for lying about Iraq's connection to 9-11 and for killing Iraqis and sacrificing American troops.

These people are truly, truly scary.

:freak:

And, now this?!? But, at least she didn't lie about it!

It is interesting that Mr. Van Impe "...has predicted the end of the world will strike somewhere between 2003 and 2012...".

Hmmm. Looks like that likely would be sometime during Shrub's second term...or, at the end of Jeb's first term...if all goes according to Rove's plan.

Wake up, people! This 'my Bible told me so' president is either mad as a hatter...or, he IS the Anti-Christ!


http://mirrors.meepzorp.com/geocities.com/george-bush-antichrist/

:evilfrown:

I get the feeling ol' Colin's gonna stumble into an end-timer ceremony at the WH, just like Tom Cruise in Eyes Wide Shut. It's strange about Condi, though. I never pictured her as an apocalyptic rapturephile.

"I will release this information to the public in September, but it’s in his hands."

What with David Kay's WMD announcement and the coming apocalypse. Maybe it's time for a new 'do or a body wax or something.

about Skull & Bones. They claim to have the only video clip from a S&B initiation. It reminds me of "Eyes Wide Shut". Also there is a link to a German documentary on S&B. Interesting stuff.:scared:

http://www.propagandamatrix.com/archive_skull_and_bones.html

We have Paul Bremmer stating he will release WMD in Iraq info in Septemeber, we have the 2 year anniversary of 9/11, and now we have Van gimp Impe stating he too will release info to the public in September. Clear your calender next month guys, it's going to be one wild ride.

I've known the human scum know as Jack and Rexella Van Impe all my life. Her parents were the best friends of my parents. I know enough dirt on them that I could blow them right out of the water.

You can't make a statement like that and not spill the beans! That's just mean.

Just as a sample I can tell you that the house they live in is nothing short of a manison. They are clearly not hurting for money. But they would send her mother over to the City of Troy Michigan offices once a month to stand in line to geet a free block of cheeses and other food supplies that were passed out to the elderly and the needy. The food was then given to her daugher and scum-in-law who were to cheap to go out and buy their own food.

That in and of itself is a shock to me, a Warrenite, former Detroiter, yet loyal Nordstrom shopper.

I have heard that Jack and Rexella live in luxury, a big house and fancy cars, so like Marion Robertson, they've found a way to get that camel through the eye of a needle.

He'd be too preoccupied hitting up for $20 to think about what he might do.

My Mom lived in Somerset Apts up untill about a year ago when she went into aa assisted living home. There were a number of senoir citizens in her area of the complex that survived only on retirement and Social Security. By no means well off. But she did love to go down to Somerset Mall and spend time.

Any of you remember this story from back in February? I think the book's author had written a letter to the NYT stating that he had given a presentation on Bible Code prophecies to the Pentagon brass, and then the AP followed up on the letter verifying that he really did give a presentation, at the request of Wolfowitz. In light of this prior bible code story,I find this Van Impe story totally believable.

New York Times, Editorial Desk
March 11, 2003

The Bible Code

To the Editor:

I am the author of "Bible Code II: The Countdown," mentioned by Bill Keller in his March 8 column.

My Pentagon briefing about the Bible Code took place on Feb. 21 and was attended by top military intelligence officials.

Both American and Israeli intelligence are now using the Bible Code to hunt for Osama bin Laden. What possible loss is there in that?

Why do United States and Israeli intelligence take the code seriously? Not, as Mr. Keller writes, because "we're all a little too desperate these days," but because the Bible Code keeps coming true.

We have a real enemy to find and fight, the one who attacked us: Osama bin Laden. Discouraging top American intelligence officials from checking out information that might lead to the Qaeda leader is bad for our country.

We are in a war that must be won.

MICHAEL DROSNIN

to have worked - still no Osama.

Certifiably INSANE, Bush needs to be THROWN out of office and FAST

http://www.iraqwar.org/Armageddonupdates.htm

Thanks for the link. The push for Armegeddon has been going on for 50 years, at least. George believes this stuff, and so the entire world is in mortal danger.

comes to age.

You might get fed to He Who Walks Behind the Rows!

The CEO of the last company I worked for was a dispensationalist and let me tell you he was/is one scary dude. If Dubya is in that camp, we're in deep kim chi.

The Busheviks are mad as shithouse rats. Apocaylpse nuts who love Israel because it must exist for the Rapture and the Second Coming.

"Woob woob woob!"
--Curly Howard

New book on the runup to war, Thirty Days IIRC, says that Blair supported * on the war because he shared his Christian belief system about it.

21st century Christians.
How stupid are people?
People have said the final battle between good and evil will happen soon for ages.

Con men making money and a name from Christianity.
What did Jesus say when he threw the moneychangers out of his father's house?
Obviously, these people missed that part of the Bible.

TYY :kick:

Those of us that follow such things kknow that, NO ONE knows when the End Times are coming, which will culminate with the return of Jesus.

For those that believe the words of Christ, he was explicit that no one knows when that time will be. There would be signs, but all of those signs have happened at different times since the Crucifixion.

What I am saying, is that we were warned about false prophets, and those that would use the Scriptures for their ownm purposes.

While it is indeed possible, and ever slightly probable, that bush might well set the earth on fire, this does not mean that the end is coming within 10 minutes, or ten centuries. Many thought that WWII was the harbinger of hellish times for the eazrth, but mankind survived. God would not use bush as the precursor of the end; van Impe is an idiot, and he is in some deep shit with God.

A rational Christian speaking logically and from the heart. It's good to be among intelligent and thoughtful people.

(I think)... :)

:hi:

figurative language, NOT to be taken literally.

simply because there were not ways to describe exactly what was being seen. How do you describe a helicopter, if you don't know what it is?

Or what exactly is a 'horse' under those conditions? Or 'bees' that spit fire?

Today, we can fathom what was described, but still cannot be sure of what was exactly described.

However, some of the things discussed have been shown to be possible/probable, i.e. a fault was discovered under Jerusalem, where it was prophesized the hill would split in two. There was little chance this could have been known when Revelations was written.

But what is really frightening, is that there are those that would interpret some of these things to try and bring about something horrible, (not the return of Christ, but the war that would annihalate untold millions). If that is the case, God will ot be happy. I would not like to be in someones shoes that is trying to explain that the deaths of 50 million people was necessary to attempt to bring back the Christ, and it didn't work. This is not a good idea.

Whether one is a believer or not, the notion that some people think they can urge God into doing something, should raise flags all over the planet. The question is, "Does bush believe he can urge God into doing something"? The notion is chilling. :scared:

"Whether one is a believer or not, the notion that some people think they can urge God into doing something, should raise flags all over the planet."

Isn't that what people who believe in prayer are doing? I personally think it is only so much bullshit, but if it floats your boat, have at it.

n/t

...and besides, Bush may be able to bring about the total end of civilization, but he can't make Jesus come back if he doesn't want to. So the prophesy is only half self-fulfilling.

in 2000....remember the expectations??

Theres some fascinating articles on millenialist anger and angst on this site

www.mille.org


done by Boston University researchers...
anyway, thats another reason I avoid religion, except as a study of Mythology.

and it's just not funny anymore.

BeHereNow had a thread in the old DU where this was heavily discussed the day he landed on that carrier quoting the Isaiah verse announcing the arrival of the anti-Christ.

Whether you believe in anti-Christ or not- what is scary is that he and his friends are making it all a self-fulfilling prophecy.

People interested in this would do well to start looking at all the stuff buried in F/A because the road map, the false 2-yr peace, the blowing up of Al-Aqsa to rebuild the Temple now that a red heiffer has been genetically engineered for the dedication- all of that ties directly into this.

Fundies everywhere working to make this horror a reality. Why do people think there's been so much traffic between government representatives of the fundies in Israel and the fundies here lately.

And now with Sharon threatening to attack Iran? No things are not looking good and they're unfolding according to script. Been following this for 2 years. This is why I feel our only chance to stop this is to elect Kucinich- we desperately need someone who understands the importance of peace and ending the imperialist bend we've been on for decades.

Israel's Red Flag on Iran

By Jim Hoagland
Wednesday, August 13, 2003; Page A27

A grim warning from Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon to President Bush that Iran is much closer to producing nuclear weapons than U.S. intelligence believes has triggered concern here that Israel is seriously considering a preemptive strike against Iran's Bushehr nuclear reactor.

Sharon dramatized his forecast by bringing Maj. Gen. Yoav Galant, a three-star army officer who serves as his military secretary, to a meeting with Bush in the Oval Office two weeks ago, U.S. and Israeli sources tell me. Galant showered a worried-looking Bush with photographs and charts from a thick dossier on Iran's covert program.

<snip>

But Sharon's presentation to Bush challenges the assumptions and viability of the emerging U.S. nonproliferation strategy on Iran. U.S. intelligence estimates that put Iran's covert nuclear weapons drive about four years short of being able to turn plutonium into a workable nuclear warhead overstate the time factor by at least 100 percent, Sharon argued. One to two years is his projected timeline.

To be sure, Sharon would face formidable logistical and political problems in trying to update Israel's successful preemptive 1981 strike against Iraq's Osirak reactor. His Oval Office briefing may have been designed to pressure Bush to move more forcefully on Iran rather than to advertise an impending Israeli action.

<snip>

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A52278-2003Aug12.html

Never post when you're tired!

Anyone else an X-Files fan?

"Come the rapture, can I have your minivan?" Santa Cruz, CA 2003

I saw a sticker in the phone booth encouraging me to "Get Ready" because "Jesus is coming back December 15, 1987"

Darn, I guess I missed out on that one.

How many times do you have to be wrong on a prediction before you stop trying to predict?

:kick: