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Why would a Jewish man and a guy from the UK supply SAM's to terrorists?

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NNN0LHI

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:10 PM
Original message

Why would a Jewish man and a guy from the UK supply SAM's to terrorists?

Edited on Wed Aug-13-03 07:11 PM by NNN0LHI

I don't get it. Something is very wrong here.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=519&ncid=716&e=2&u=/ap/20030813/ap_on_re_us/missile_plot

FBI: Suspected Dealer Sought 50 Missiles

<snip>Abraham's four children, his rabbi and about a dozen other supporters attended the arraignment but did not speak to reporters afterward.

Abraham's lawyer Larry Krantz told U.S. Magistrate Andrew Peck that his client is in poor health. Arguing for a lower bail, Krantz noted the charge against Abraham does not say his client knew he was dealing with terrorists.

According to the FBI affidavit, the probe began in December 2001, when a "cooperating witness" under federal law enforcement control began talking to Lakhani about obtaining anti-aircraft guns and missiles.

Lakhani is not believed to be connected to al-Qaida or any other known terrorist group, federal officials say. Authorities also stressed that there was no specific, credible threat to shoot down an airliner in the United States.

more

http://www.voanews.com/article.cfm?objectID=43F74928-D9DC-491E-A4CDF388A2E92285

US Arrests 3 Suspected of Missile Smuggling

The FBI Tuesday arrested three men in Newark, New Jersey on suspicion of attempting to smuggle surface-to-air missiles into the United States.

Law enforcement officials describe one man as a British national of Indian descent. The other two men are described as Afghans. Their names were not released. The British man allegedly sought to smuggle a Russian-built surface-to-air missile into the United States.

more

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QuietStorm

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:19 PM
Response to Original message

1. Something is very wrong here.

Edited on Wed Aug-13-03 07:24 PM by QuietStorm

Not surprising but very wrong. There are a number of ways to go with conjecture here. Go back to your favorite 9/11 time line. Pull up articles on Captain Defina and pay attention to references to Ronald Reagan National Airport. Strange call on a possible crash landing Runway 1-19 which was immediately amended with crash site changed to the Pentagon.

A weird vehicular accident involving a diabetic run amok in one of the parking garages at Ronald Reagan National Airport wherein all that responded had their backs turned to this runway 1-19. One of the Defina articles I believe if memory serves me references various agents that were picked up and/or in one of the towers at RRNA. Might want to read through the Arlington County After Actions report too. Feels almost like something may be in the wind. For those who have been riding this particular drift. Funny this would come back around.

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NYC

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:21 PM
Response to Original message

2. $$$$$$$$

The charge against Yehuda Abraham was supposed to be money laundering, arraignment to take place this afternoon. I didn't follow it.

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Don_G

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:22 PM
Response to Original message

3. Strictly Greed

Some men respond more to their mistresses than their family or their country.

I guessing that their "Puss-Of-The-Month" was more valuable to their ego than the long-term concerns of our Nation as a whole....

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short bus president

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:30 PM
Response to Original message

4. maybe the thrill of operating beyond the reach of law,

while it lasted, transcended political and centuries-old religious conflicts... and maybe monkeys might fly outta my butt. I have a lot of trouble buying the story that the "terrorist" just openly told the arms broker what he was planning to do. I can a imagine a terrorist being asked, "what exactly do you plan to do with this shoulder-fired anti-aricraft missile?" But I cannot imagine a terrorist answering right back "I'm going to shoot down Air Force 1" or "Take out a commercial jet liner." It just doesn't make pragmatic terrorist sense.

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IranianDemocrat

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:34 PM
Response to Original message

5. Actually it wouldn't suprise me...

A lot of palestinians buy their arms directly from jewish Israelis.

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slackmaster

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #5

7. Amazing how often you see photos of Palestinians with M16 rifles

They seem to be more common than Kalashnikovs. I'm sure the US government has never authorized sales of M16s to the PLO, but we've sold hundreds of thousands of them to Israel.

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papau

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #7

10. Under Oslo we built up 30000 man PA Police force

and we did not supply them with Russian guns.

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IranianDemocrat

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #7

12. Exactly.

Same with UZI's.

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molly

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:39 PM
Response to Reply #5

8. How do you know?

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IranianDemocrat

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:45 PM
Response to Reply #8

11. Several CNN interviews, and just logic.

When you see hordes of palestinians carrying UZIs and m16s that's not a very good sign, plus the palestinians have even said on CNN that they buy their weapons from jews in Israel.

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DoYouEverWonder

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Wed Aug-13-03 10:11 PM
Response to Reply #11

20. Same reason why they polish

the blood diamonds, that the terrorist trade for arms to attack them with.

The whole set up has never made sense to me. Why would any sane person sell their enemy arms in order to make money, just to have the same enemy turn around and kill them with the arms that they just sold them? Humans can be incredibly stupid.

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slackmaster

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:37 PM
Response to Original message

6. Same reason all dealers of illegal items or substances operate

To make money.

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papau

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Wed Aug-13-03 07:41 PM
Response to Original message

9. 2 Afgans getting USSR Sams viar "legit" Indian w/Jew clearing checks

The "legit" Indian with Brit passport was a small time weapons trader. The Afghans were getting the Sam's from Russia. The Brit Indian was selling to FBI "terrorist".

And the Jewish fellow is clearing checks for the Brit arms dealer.

So he is a "money lauderer". .. "Yehuda Abraham, 76, of New York City, ..had handled the funds for the initial missile purchase..but did not know he was he was dealing with terrorists"

Your headline "JEWISH MAN ...SUPPLY SAMS TO TERRORIST" is not supported by article.

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NNN0LHI

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Wed Aug-13-03 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #9

14. That will be a relief to those sitting in federal prison on conspiracy...

Edited on Wed Aug-13-03 08:25 PM by NNN0LHI

...charges for laundering drug proceeds. They had no idea it was drug money that they were handling so we will just have to let them all go then. No harm, no foul.

Don

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papau

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Thu Aug-14-03 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #14

23. Citi-Bank laudered drug money - and no prison time!

Using the same excuse -

indeed the police testified that the Steet knew which employee's at which location would accept large cash deposits without recording any notice to Treasury -

but still no jail time.

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DuctapeFatwa

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Wed Aug-13-03 08:00 PM
Response to Original message

13. Why would an arms dealer send a dud missile all the way to the US?

Doesn't seem like a very sound business practice, or a very wise one.

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htuttle

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Wed Aug-13-03 08:33 PM
Response to Original message

15. This is the 'sting' story. It's propaganda.

And here:

According to the FBI affidavit, the probe began in December 2001, when a "cooperating witness" under federal law enforcement control began talking to Lakhani about obtaining anti-aircraft guns and missiles.

The 'cooperating witness' was a snitch who was up on drug charges and looking for a break.

FBI agents asked Lakhani to get them some SAMs. Russian undercover police got in contact with Lakhani and offered him SAMs. Lakhani and 'network' get busted when fake missile is shipped to them by Russian police. Lakhani had no contacts to buy SAMs other than the Russian undercover police.

What terrorist? Who?

Do they think al Queda has to go to part-time arms dealers selling out of their garage like Lakhani to get SAMs?

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QuietStorm

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Wed Aug-13-03 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #15

16. Okay it's propaganda...

how about an articulation of conjecture on that. Who originated the propaganda and for what reason?

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htuttle

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Wed Aug-13-03 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #16

17. Here's a link from ABCNEWS

Edited on Wed Aug-13-03 09:45 PM by htuttle

Less Than Meets the Eye?
U.S. Government Sting Operation Criticized as Setup
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/wnt/World/missile030813_sting.html

Aug. 13� Administration officials are leaving out key facts and exaggerating the significance of the alleged plot to smuggle a shoulder-launched missile into the United States, law enforcement officials told ABCNEWS. They say there's a lot less than meets the eye.
(more at link, and there's several threads on this in LBN and GD)

(on edit)
I hear it's going to be covered on Nightline tonight, too.

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QuietStorm

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Wed Aug-13-03 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #17

18. cool

Edited on Wed Aug-13-03 10:06 PM by QuietStorm

Thanks for the heads up on nightline too. Does it look like the media is starting to look with more scrutiny at this Admin? It is beginning to look that way to me. Am I the only one that has noticed this? Or is it still too early to tell?

Look at that wording in the lead in, "exaggerating the significance of the alleged plot". It almost sounds as if the Admin wants it to look like a sting. Or at least that is what the little snatch from the first sentence implies.

edit: for spelling error and typo.

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QuietStorm

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Thu Aug-14-03 09:11 AM
Response to Reply #17

22. Question

did you catch nightline? I half fell asleep. I heard Koppel once again try and ask some pionted question, but it seemed to me in my half asleep half awake state he wasn't getting anywhere. And as I fell off to sleep I remember thinking Koppel's focus was all wrong.

I remember thinking his angle on the rationale, gave them to much room to avoid the hard questions, but for the life of me because I was falling asleep at the the same time. I do not remember any specifics. The last thought I remember having was that the angle on the segment is all wrong. Why bother fighting the sand man.

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Zero Gravitas

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Wed Aug-13-03 10:09 PM
Response to Original message

19. There were no terrorists

The FBI sold this guy a fake missile that he was going to then sell to the FBI. THere were no terrorists, so this old Jewish man was not in any way dealing with terrorists. Obviously this Indian/British guy is an idiot, and if he was willing to traffic in SAMs he deserves to be in jail, but most of this "plot" was concoted by the FBI not terrorists, don't believe Rove's spin on the story.

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theboss

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Thu Aug-14-03 09:00 AM
Response to Original message

21. The world is a weird place

I once helped defend a right-wing militia member with a Chinese wife and black weapons suppliers from inner-city Cleveland.

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