What the Hell is Wrong with Our Democratic Leadership

I just went to a meeting where Congressman Harold Ford of Memphis Tennessee was speaking. He basically was saying how we Democrats need to talk about faith more and how we had to get right on values. He also said that he supported a constitutional ban on gay marriage. I get really pissed off when someone brought up Ohio irregularities and he basically said "We Lost now we have to get over it." I was so pissed off I walked out. He mine as well have been George Bush up there talking.

:grr:

sounds like a tool.

He was speaking in Chattanooga which is very red territory. His House seat is in Memphis, which is very blue (Shelby County was one of the few blue TN counties in '04). In order to have a chance at the Senate in '06, he has to appeal to the red areas in East and Central TN, otherwise , he has no chance.

I've met Rep. Ford a couple of times, and he's a really good guy. He's a politician that actually listens, and looks out for his constituents. He'll listen to a constituent's concerns, and follow up on it. He could probably stay in his House seat for the rest of his life, but wants to move up to he Senate.

TN is a weird state, in that it keeps Dems in control at home (Gov and State Legislature), yet sends Reps to D.C. We are a notch in the Bible Belt. To have any chance at the Senate, he has to draw voters from the right, or switch parties (which I don't think that he will do).

Some folks see him as a moderate, but the Americans for Democratic Action gave him an 80% for his 2003 voting record: http://www.adaction.org/2003housevr.htm

The ACLU gave him a 47% rating for his 108th Congress voting record ( http://www.adaction.org/2003housevr.htm ). While this is low, he has the second highest TN score.

Here's Project Vote Smart's of Ford's interest group ratings: http://www.vote-smart.org/issue_rating_category.php?can_id=BC042346

If he's running for Frist Spot he will practically have to turn republican to win. Although tonight in Chattanooga I think there were a few progressive democrats present. I think he could of respond better to some of the question thrown at him. He doesn't have to buy into the conspiracy theory the election was stolen but he should of at least said that we need to make sure every vote is counted and voter suppression should not be tolerated.

He's looking to '06, and not back at '04. I know, if we can't have fair elections in '04, what makes him think that we'd have fair elections in '06? He's just being very careful about what he says, so that he won't give the Repubs ammunition against him. He's going to have a tough enough time in the primaries, he doesn't want to shoot himeself in the foot before then.

it's like the joke about the medieval doctors: After a patient bleeds to death from too much bloodletting, the learned doctors say, "Nonsense; what happened was he died because the cure was not applied hard enough."

but never fear, they will be dragged, kicking and screaming if necessary to the forefront of this war against subverted elections and government manipulation....When the people lead the leaders must follow.

Makes more room for a strong third party.
If the Demos want to stay in business they need to move left instead of trying to copy the GOP.

leaving the democratic party. But I have hope that the grass roots can change it. I'm hoping that he said this because he happens to be a southern conservative democrat but it still made me mad and I'm not giving any money to his campaign or the DNC until things change. I don't want my money going to any candidate that supports bigotry and hypocrisy.

Not because they are right or moral but because they won. We must sell our souls to the RW devil. Even they stand against everything that we hold dear. We must lie about our faith and wear it on our sleeves while keeping those little sexual affairs and corporate schemes hidden in the closet. We must talk about Christianity while we don't live it. We must pretend to be patriotic by supporting unjustifiable wars and sending other people's children off to fight and die while we profit from the war machine. We must smear honest decent true heros while making up fake heros whose only claim to heroism is "being there." That's what the Dem leadership is saying.

I'm now for a viable third party formed from the rubble of the last two elections and made up of honest, progressive, populist people who want to get along with the rest of the world, work for peace and prosperity over the globe and safety and security, economic justice, and freedom from religious persecution at home.

So sad.

He seems rude and comes off reactive. In the past, when he was running against Pelosi for House Minority his sense of entitlement reminded me a little of Tom Delay.

but honestly, the only reason ford gets away with it is his race. i mean, who's ever heard of a black dixiecrat?!? he doesn't fit the profile, as george clooney would say in confessions of a dangerous mind, and everyone thinks of himas a progressive or, at worst, a centrist

if you read transcripts of his interviews, he's worse than zell in a lot of ways.

and he frequently appears on haniity's show and they talk about what great friends they are and how they go out to dinner all of the time. that, if no other reason, is a reason not to trust the guy

Death penalty, school prayer, abortion rights, crime and punishment, taxes, energy.

It would be a mistake to say that Ford is far to the left of Miller, but there is a discernable difference.

http://www.issues2000.org/House/Harold_Ford.htm

http://www.issues2000.org/Senate/Zell_Miller.htm


"not to sound like a rightwinger...."--that's the sort of disclaimer that should make you stop and think, and think again.

I was in disbelief about what he was saying and did not realize how he really was. I was shocked when I heard him say some of things he said. But from what you tell me it makes sense. I just hope the rest of the democratic leadership does not follow suit.

Offer alternatives or die as a party. It is that simple. The repubs moved to the right instead of adapting the dem lines like they previously had before they went hard right. We need to move more left or at least come to the realization we will alienate or lose millions if they move any further right. And the party will always lose copying the right. People always go for the original. There are millions that want someone to take a stand for the constitution with amendments as they now stand and for the Bill of Rights. People want some sort of a modicum of a safety net and affordable health insurance. Many people do not want a 25 year war for hegemony. Tell and inform people of the issues. Present a PLAN for the future.

Isn't that an oxymoron?

eom.

Based on your account of what he said, I agree with Representative Ford Jr. on everything except the irregularities in Ohio.

As for the rest of the Democratic Party, my phrase for this week is "political cowardice." I think it well applies to many Democrats on Capitol Hill.

is real simple. They are tired of losing as well as the party as a whole.

The bottom line on Ohio is the majority of the democrats in the country have moved on.

Ohio is not the tipping point many on this forum thinks it is.

We need to build bridges to people with a message they understand.

Bush (GOP) is evil doesn't cut it.
Red state people are dumb doesn't cut it. (think I'm a dumb ass, and see how fast I vote for you)
Unlimited abortions rights don't cut it.
Love affair with Hollywood doesn't cut it.

The party can build a very inclusive message with the right leadership

We represent you better because we have social moral values
We are a people that accepts all people from all parties, even if we don't agree on all issues
Abortions are a right until a festus can survive outside the womb
Hollywood doesn't represent our party values, the American people do.

I can go on, but won't

So, why bother being a Democrat?

but, please don't confuse the message with the delivery.

We can bring a strong democratic message to the people, but it's going to have to be delivered by people that are believable and by people who can be connected with.

I'll probably get flamed for saying it, but Micheal Moore, Hollywood, MoveOn.org turned off a lot of people.

We brought Micheal Moore to the dance and the GOP painted him as the ugly anti American slob. Whether or not that's fair is immaterial.

When we let Micheal Moore be portrayed as the front man for the party, we are taking a very dangerous strategy.

To win back the moderate democratic voters, we will need the Harold Fords of the world.

After all, if we don't win, we can't change anything.

Welcome to DU. There were so many instances of voter suppression around the country, Ohio in particular, that it represents a threat to the universal right, one fought for for years, the right to vote and have your vote counted.

If Ford, you or anyone else is ready to move on from that, you are sorely mistaken. What makes you think it's OK to under-resource black precincts in down town Cleveland and make people wait 3-9 hours to vote? What makes you think it's OK to have more votes than registered voters for the state of Ohio? What makes you think that it's OK to have 10-14% turnout rates in Ohio *only in urban districts*? What makes it OK to have statisticians from major universities look at exit polling and outcomes and say that the probability of vote fraud is great given simple, non biased statistical analysis.

Give me a break with the list. I agree with much of it. But one thing that's fundamental is the right to vote freely and have no doubts that it will be counted.

Ford and anyone else who runs away on this issue blows all the other issues because without the right to vote and have them counted fairly we, the Democrats, will never get elected to anything again.

You and Ford and the other new old Democrats may think it's time to move on but just wait until the entire Bush house of cards comes falling down about the time indisputable truth on voter suppression and fraud emerges. These Democrats will lack any serious credibility, and with good reason.

But, I'm a realist. Until any of the allegations about Ohio are actually prove, it a moot point.

I for one, cannot for the life of me, understand why the DNC is not on this issue if there was anyway turn it into a winning position.

Either people who think like you are missing something or the people who run the party know it's a dead issue.

We may or may not be able to prove that the election was "stolen." I think that the forensic statistical work done is solid but that's really not going to work when there are votes to count (many of which are not there!)

To me the vital issue for every Democrat is to make sure we get verified voting through paper trails so recounts eliminate the possibility of fixing voting software (not that hard a task, ask any really good hacker) and to make sure that everybody that wants to vote can do so with equal access.

If we don't get verifiable elections, i.e., clean, and equal access, we'll never have another congressional majority or presidential victory.

I think this is a ground up issue. I'm not a tin foil guy but I do know a fair amount about statistics and computer software and I'm persuaded that the problems this year will be with us every year.

Enjoy DU, see you around.

is the only real issue to me. Until that issue is resolved, every election can have some serious questions to it's legitimacy.

Since they is a equal representation on the canvassing boards, I tend to think most things are on the up and up. Not perfect, but as good as it's gong to get when humans are involved.

Thanks for the welcome.

without problems then there is no reason why in the US of America we can not have an election process where every single vote that is cast is counted accurately. I'm sorry but this is not as good as it is going to get.

is the only real issue to me. Until that issue is resolved, every election can have some serious questions to it's legitimacy. "

Did you miss that part of what I said?

As for as good as it going to get, I was talking about current elections.

He likes to tell everyone how "too liberal" every other Democrat is.

Maxine Waters, Pelosi, Kucinich, Dean, et. al. probably wouldn't have a chance of getting elected dog catchers in TN, much less to a House or Senate seat. You can only go as far to left as your constituents will let you (in TN), especially if you want to run for the Senate or Governor. If you don't represent the interests (and views) of your constituents, you don't get (re)elected. If Rep. Ford lived in a blue state, I'm sure that he would be much more to the left.

I will be one of his constituents. Tonight I went to listen to his ideas hoping to be inspired. Instead it was like a punch to the gut.

Who else is there on the Democrat side? John Tanner? Bart Gordon? Al Gore? Tim McGraw? Phil Bredeson (who will most likely seek re-election as Gov.)?

While on the Republican side there is: Marsha Blackburn, Ed Bryant, Bob Corker, Van Hilleary, Zach Wamp, etc.

While there doesn't appear to be an end to the list of Republicans looking to replace Frist, the Democrat list (at this point) is verrry short.

Who else do TN Democrats have to support for the '06 Senate race? Ford has to start courting the independent and RW voters now. Just keep in mind that any Republican in the Senate in '06 will be worse than Ford.

Sorry, first I refuse to believe that there is more than 30% of the retistered voter population and more than 20% of the voting age population that supports vote fraud and vote suppression. How controversial is this? Ford does not have to say that Kerry won or that Bush/Rove are tricksters. He can just do the right thing, something all good citizens agree on, and that is insist that we have fair voting -- verifiable and accessible.

I'm sorry but this IS a litmus test -- it takes no risk to advocate for fair and honest elections. If he won't do it, he's not a serious politician. Ford is not alone in his naive approach to this. There are Democratic leaders all over that forgot we're the party of the Voting Rights Act.

I didn't want him to say that the election was stolen or scream voter fraud. But at least he could have acknowledged that there are problems and we need to work harder on ensuring voter rights. I just don't understand.

Since that seems to be about how many passes you litmus test.

I'm not sure if I can adequately explain this, but I will try.

a) There doesn't appear to be those voting problems in TN, which is Ford's concern.
b) While voting rights a national concern, There is no federal requirement (that I know) mandating voting equimpment specifications. If a state has voting problems, it is up to that state and its leaders to fix the problems.
c) Rarely do politicians of one state criticize another state.


"it takes no risk to advocate for fair and honest elections."

To call for fair and honest elections, is to say that you don't have fair and honest elections.

"he's not a serious politician."

Yeah, right. He's not saying anything that may hurt his next election , or that may be used against him. That sound's like a serious politician to me.

"Ford is not alone in his naive approach to this."

It's not the politicians that are being naive here.

backbone, conviction and steadfast principles to do the right things even in face of losing their seat.

The problem is the leadership is in bed with the very people we are SUPPOSED to be working against.

Wasn't it nice how our people were so buddy buddy with the bush family? Seeing the footage on CNN really opened my eyes. The leadership is corrupt.

At the Texas convention, for example, it was not even allowed to run against the party chair. (even though it was SUPPOSED to be that way) Delegates were expected just to vote for who the higher ups wanted. Seems like the leadership looks out for number one.

Don't convict all of them because of Ford.

the trend in Dem leadership seems to be one of moving to the center, center right........in order to get more people voting for them. Forget what we stood for, that's just passe'

What won't these wanks do to stay in office???????

You know, I can relate to some issues the "moralists" complain about ie: I can't see any real art value in a feces replica of the Virgin Mary for example....(LOL LOL<--oops sorry)

What the RW is engaging in is "SELECTIVE MORALITY"; our leaders want to appease those sensitive types in the religious right by blindly giving in to this selective morality. I'm sorry, that dog won't hunt.

There are two hot button issues (that are really just pumped up wedge issues): Gay Marriage and Abortion. This is so ridiculous I can hardly find words to express how hypocritical these issues are in terms of morality!

Morality??? We've got priests and pastors molesting children in their churchs--over and over and over again. We've got senators fondling interns and staffers--all the time. We've got RWers NOT paying their fair share of taxes. We've got RWers addicted to gambling..spending the kids inheritance at the crap tables. We've got Fundie ministers schtooping the deacons wife--in every community. We've got other RW leaders going to orgies/SM clubs. We've got rabid NEOCON/fascists wanting to gut any entitlement programs that help aging citizens and the disabled keep body and soul together. These "moralists" have failed to support the fatherless children that DO get born.

"A Laborer is worthy of his hire", yet the RWer/Moralists want to keep people from earning a decent wage....or keep jobs here for that matter. Most of those "moralist" leaders take bribes and "gifts" of an uncertain legality. Kerik is involved in Mob dealings.

Sooooooooo, they can BITE ME when it comes to gay marriage and abortion. The Dems that can't see this hypocracy are NOT WORTHY OF RE ELECTION nor leadership. THROW THE BUMS OUT!

It just seems like this is the game plan. Our politicians have already decided and now they want to take out Moveon and Michael Moore. It just seems like they don't want the progressives anymore. Well I'll have to do some soul searching and see what happens in the coming days but I'm seriously thinking for the first time in my life about abandoning the party.

Unless * get's impeached (hardy har) or takes a nose dive off an aircraft carrier, we've got four years to work diligently with the DNC and Dem leaders...Urging them NOT to abandon the left wing. If so, they may be in for a huge surprise coming voting day in '06/'08

I've read countless posts here by those saying they're switching also, if the leadership doesn't find it's ass soon.

Sorry you're depressed, but I do understand. Hang in there for awhile longer. ;-)

"He's so well-spoken. He speaks so well. He's so well-spoken."

Shades of when Centrists here wanted to line up behind Colin Powell.

White people- "He speaks so well. He is so well spoken, he speaks so well"
Chris Rock- "Speaks so well is not a compliment.. Speaks so well is what you say to retarded people, that can talk!"

;)

The same thing that is wrong with the Republican leadership.

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

Democrats!!

I'm sure he is being paid by the far right to stir up trouble.

He is pathetic. and always will be.

On the so called "Value Issues" and demonizing the grass roots, MoveOn and Michael Moore. I think the Republican Party will just start labeling us the "Flip Flopper" party because we don't know what the crap we stand for. The sad thing is they'd be right and middle America will see it that way too and keep voting the same way.

And longer. They are in the same bed as the Republicans, and both are controlled by the same corporate masters. It is simply becoming increasingly obvious to more and more people that we are living under the two party/same corporate master system of government.

Neither major party cares about the ordinary person anymore. Sure, they pay lip service and mouth pious platitudes about how they are working for the ordinary American, but when push comes to shove(and often times before), politicians of both stripes will put the interests of big business before the interests of anyone else. Granted, there are a few exceptions to this, like Kucinich and Wellstone, but they are a rare breed, and getting scarcer by the day.

Corporate money trumps constiuents' interest every time, which is why we need to disassociate ourselves from this vicious circle we're in. Instead of feeding the beast by donating, working for, and voting for either major party, we need to either form our own party, or better yet, go join the Greens. Their values and platform are a match for ninety percent of what virtually any Democrat cares about, and they are working for publicly financed election campaigns(which this country desparetly needs) and they take no corporate cash, meaning that they are beholden to nobody else, just their constituents.

There is a definition of insanity that I think applies here, ie insanity is when you keep doing the same thing over and over, yet expect a different result every time. We as Democrats have been engaged in a massive act of insanity for the past thirty years, voting for the Dem canidates over and over, and expecting our voice to be truly heeded. Instead we're increasingly locked out, shunted aside, our voice ever more muted. It is high time that we stopped the insanity friends, and go put our voice, muscle, effort and vote where it is most appreciated. Let the Democratic party collapse under the weight of it's own corruption.