Which Democrat from history is your favorite

I will probably leave off some great ones, but this is off the top of my head.

Also, I am trying to include a wide range of people.

For those who don't recognize many of the names here, or do not know anything about them.

I suggest....

Party of the People: A History of the Democrats

My favorite Deist of all time.

FDR is almost up there with Lincoln--perhaps matching President Jefferson--, and certainly surpasses Progressive Republican Teddy Roosevelt.

However, Truman needs some props. Truman was courageous, progressive, a very uncommon "common man," set us up to win the goddamn Cold War, and was simply the kind of Democrat that we need more of in this Party.

Truman might have had greatness thrust upon him, but he handled it very well.

I don't know how anyone could list the greatest American presidents in any order orther than FDR, Lincoln, Washington in places 1-3.

After that, you'd have to say, Jefferson and Jackson. And then the fortunate accident of TR. I don't think he's all that great, but American would be a fascist nation if McKinley and Mark Hannah had continued unabated on their project which McKinley interrupted.

It was more than not being McKinley. He busted the Trusts, and help end McKinleyism. He also started the national parks, which became a model for the entire world, and are really just an American treasure.

As for Jefferson, two HUGE things: the Louisiana Purchase, whose importance ranks equal to independence itself, since it secured the United States as a nation not at the mercy of Europe; and the Era of Good Feelings, which allowed the political consolidation that an infant nation needed to occur in an era of relative peace and calm and progress.

It's hard to rank the top four in your list for me, except to say that LINCOLN IS NUMBER ONE. He was a genius, and he was truly the best man in the entire nation for the job. His achievement was amazing, under the most horrible of times.

TR did, but he was a racist and an imperialist and did some sick things to convince America to engage in his imperialist BS.

However, America would have been dramatically worse if not for his presidency.

If Jefferson hadn't been President, Hamilton's BS oligopoly would have taken hold and America would have been a much less democratic country.

Washington had to call Jefferson back from France just so that he had someone who liked Democracy offset Hamilton's anti-democratic impulses in Washington's cabinet.

I really think Hamilton gets a bad rap. He did a LOT of good for this country, especially in his early role in Treasury.

Then he went nuts and then he got shot...

gov't controlled by wealthy interests. Hamilton practically devoted his professional life to the consoldiation of the wealth and power of wealthy NY financiers. Jefferson had some crazy ideas about democracy, himself, and, for sentimental reasons, felt that the small agrarian farmer was the most important member of society, but the fact that he fought to preserve their political power rather than concentrate it in the hands of NY financiers resulted in a lot of good for America.

Also, Hamilton had anxieties about his humble roots and overcompensated for them by ingratiating himself upon and serving the interests of the wealthy.

He was insecure and kissed plutocratic ass, but he also did believe in the Horatio Alger BS at a time where many people thought it improper for a man to climb in social status so much.

That's no insubstantial.

Also, the Wall Street folks weren't as bad as you think. He thought that without a capital market (such as existed at the time), it would be harder to increase investment and industrial development and internal trade.

Moreover, apart from his particular political beliefs, he was VERY competent. He just did a great job, whatever his beliefs.

wanted to take the country that he called Jefferson back solely for the purpose of serving as a counterbalance.

And Lincoln wasn't all he was cracked up to be, either...he was a racist, political opportunist and proto-fascist who did things as President next to which the worst actions of the Bush administration pale in comparison (including among others suspension of habeas corpus, having elections in border states "monitored" by Federal troops to make sure they turned out the right way, and jailing newspaper editors who were critical of him). All our idols have feet of clay.

America was going to split in two and it would have been terrible for everyone to have continent divided between two competive powers willing to resort to violence.

Lincoln did what he had to do to keep America together, and he did. What other president could say he did that?

Yes, many qualifiers attach to that statement--granted. But, apart from his personal genius he--one more time--

FREED THE SLAVES

and

SAVED THE NATION

What more do some people want? What we're going thru is goddamn peanuts to what was happening then.

Lincoln was, next to Jefferson, the most brilliant articulator of American values and ideals in history.

in those states "still in a state of rebellion as of January 1, 1863" (over which he had no authority) if I recall the Emancipation Proclamation correctly. Not in Maryland, Delaware, or Missouri. Your second point I won't argue with; see my response to AP below.

The emancipation proclamation wasn't perfect, but the fast majority of slaves were freed (as soon as the Union got down there), and it virtually guarateed that the remainder would be freed thereafter.

In fact, one might have to say that of our indisputably great Presidents (Washington, Lincoln and FDR) Lincoln is the greatest, in actions and influence. He redefined what America was and what it meant, established once and for all the idea of America as a nation "indivisible". Just pointing out that not all of the actions he took to do so are necessarily admirable in themselves.

Just as not all of Theodore Roosevelt's actions are admirable, but he DID break up the trusts which dominated America's economy, firmly established the US as a global power, made great strides in conservation through creation of national parks, etc. Next to their acheivements, either man's considerable flaws are more than forgivable.

for dinner at the white house, resulting in much outcry from southern representatives.

Either a brave or simply brash act for the time.

The first national park in the US (and the world), Yellowstone, was established in 1872 under the Grant administration. The second national park, Sequoyah, was established in 1890 under the Harrison administration.

The National Park Service was established in 1916 under the Wilson administration. TR was the one who got the ball rolling with the Forest Service in 1908.

Ironically, Republicans were responsible for the creation of the first national parks in the US, but they have been mostly fumbling the ball since.

n/t

FDR will never be the greatest in my eyes, because of what he did to the Japanese.

As opposed to which other President in time of stress?

- Slave holding Washington and Jefferson?
- Imperialist Teddy?
- Half-way "Free Soil" habeas-corpus Lincoln?
- Racist Woodrow Wilson
- Hiroshima Truman

By the sheer virtue of their power, no matter what a President does s/he will committ grave wrongs. The question is whether the President tries to minimize those wrongs and tries to do great Rights.

There is a new biography coming out soon about FDR.

The early hype that I have heard from the book rep that visits our store is that it is amazing.


Franklin Delano Roosevelt: Champion of Freedom

Right-wing Canadian Media mogul, oddly enough. But I'm looking forward to reading it nontheless.

While it is written by a right winger, it is supposed to be a very unbiased, or slightly biased in favor of FDR.

Here is a blurb from the book description:

Conrad Black rises to the challenge. In this magisterial biography, Black makes the case that FDR was the most important person of the twentieth century, transforming his nation and the world through his unparalleled skill as a domestic politician, war leader, strategist, and global visionary--all of which he accomplished despite a physical infirmity that could easily have ended his public life at age thirty-nine. Black also takes on the great critics of FDR, especially those who accuse him of betraying the West at Yalta.

He will be the second person I've read two biographies of. :)

edit: If its a RW spin deal like the poster above intoned, I might skip it.

Don't really understand the author's motivations, but it's very pro-FDR. What FDR Book have you read?

I'm looking for one

by Frank Friedel. Good overall book. It could've been written better.

And yea, the book is subtitled "Champion of Freedom", I might still pick it up.

What FDR book have you read?

But I have "FDR And the new deal" and I'm thinknig of picking up "Freedom From Fear" which is about the depression the wwii time.

The latter won the Pulitzer and looked real good browsing thru it

That was a book I was going to pick up a few months from now. The explanation in my current book about the New Deals and it's policy just wasn't satisfactory (though it is a Bio, not a New Deal analysis, so I forgive. This book coming out might set it back a few weeks.

Freedom from Fear sounds interesting, as well.

That the 3 Volume series by Arthur M. Schlesinger Jr. is great

Vol I

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0618340858/ref=pd_bxgy_text_1/103-7738262-9911062?v=glance&s=books&st=*

Vol II

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0618340866/qid=1065415630/sr=2-2/ref=sr_2_2/103-7738262-9911062

Vol III

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0618340874/qid=1065415720/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/103-7738262-9911062?v=glance&s=books

Those three are going on my urgent list!

I'll settle for a thanks instead of a kiss

:-)

Here is a list of FDR books


http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/listmania/list-browse/-/15W5F1RP5TXPI/qid=1065415720/sr=5-1/ref=sr_5_1/103-7738262-9911062

In terms of achievments for this country and his contributions to the modern Democratic party, he is unmatched.

FDR had moderate intentions that were dragged left due to Eleanor and what he saw about him. Beyond that, he was an excellent strategist. While significant parts of the system were crying out that he was a Dictator (not so absurd in those times) or that he was a Bolshevik, he weathered those waters, made changes (through his struggles with the supreme court, the congress and senate) and enacted laws that still affect society in a most positive manner today!

In a manner comparable to Washington, Jefferson or Lincoln. Glad we're on the same page, though I think you underestimate FDR's natural progressivism.

The 30s were FUCKED UP. Talk of revolution, violent social change, the collapse of capitalism. FDR was not perfect, but think of the following three things:

* Social Security
* Was against Hitler, as much as he could be given the politics
* The FDIC

That last one is unbelievably important, and he does not get enough credit for it.

He was a good whack-a-fascist player.

But like whack-a-mole, they came back, rearing their ugly heads in the '50s with McCarthyism; then with the Nixon administration; then back again with Reagan and have been with us since.

held back the fascists until today. America still might survive W. If it does, we'll owe it to FDR, probably. If it doesn't, we'll beat fascism again, and we'll do it in FDR's name.

and picked LBJ. Yes, he is a mixed bag overall (ie. Vietnam escalation out the wazoo) but he was very liberal and many of his policies are with us (Headstart for exmple).

But what he amazingly did was really push for civil rights when any other president coming after Kennedy could have ignored and canned the subject. LBJ is a true champion to minority rights and with out him the US would of been worse off in the long run.

The south wielded and does wield such ridiculous power. Through incoporating blacks into his New Deal relief systems he drew much fire, but he also met with NAACP members to give them encouraging words about his sentiments.

Thank god his Warm Springs deal gave him the illusion of a Southeerner to many voters.

If I can recall by memory, a certain southern Senator said that FDR's support of Negroes was "confirmation that he was a Communist."

I cannot believe people that dumb get elected, my dog is thinking of running for Congress.

but it is so easy to focus on Vietnam.

... many years ago while researching the family tree I discovered a link to an established DAR tree that documented that I am a great-great-great-great grandson of Andrew Jackson. (By way of his illegitimate daughter, which makes me a great-great-great-great grandbastard.)

goes to Pres. Kennedy......he mobilized the youth of our country like no other before him. That said, I have to mention Jackson for the same reason, Fiziwig.......I, too, am a great, great, ever so great on my Mother's side. PM me and we'll chat.......

Jenn

FDR was the greatest, but RFK was my favorite.

... and make gentle the life of this world.

Hearing recordings of RFK saying that makes so angry that he was shot and Nixon took RFK's rightful place.

"And as long as America must choose, that long will there be a need and a place for the Democratic Party. We Democrats can run on our record but we cannot rest on it. We will win if we continue to take the initiative and if we carry the message of hope and action throughout the country. Alexander Smith once said, 'A man doesn't plant a tree for himself. He plants it for posterity.' Let us continue to plant, and our children shall reap the harvest. That is our destiny as Democrats."
Robert F. Kennedy

Two great men who, if they had served as President, would surely have done much to change things for the better.

50+ votes, and nobody has picked JFK

I know he was not around long and did not accomplish much

Still, with all the books and movies made about him, you would think he would be a little more popular

And with RFK Jr opposing wind farms...man.

It's probably just temporary.

i wanted to vote for Teddy Roosevelt.

"Which Bull Moose from history is your favorite"

But that would be rather limited, eh? :)

I like TR, too.

Until one of our fabulous ten knock out smirk. Then I have a new fav. For four to eight years.

Cuz 57 years after his death the very thought of him still makes Republicans cry, foul their pants and start lying. That and he led us through the Depression and single-handedly beat Tojo, Moussilini and Hitler at the same time, one hand tied behind his back and sitting in a wheel chair. He laid the foundation for the American Century, gave us Social Security, Labor Unions, a world economy based on the dollar, etc. etc.

Credit for the victory over the forces of evil and darkness has to go partly to Winston Churchill and Britain, and to the twenty million (!) Russians who gave their lives and broke Hitler's war machine doing it.

Just in the Russian assault, alone. Watched the Stalin special on the Hi(tler)story Channel. Anyone else enjoy it?

Edit: lol, I typed in Berlin instead of Russia... damned sunday nights.

refers to the number killed, and it turns out I was off a little: 30 million total Russians killed in WWII, of which 14 million were combat fatalities. (More than the number for all other combatants combined.)

That Stalin was one Fucked Up Mofo. It's amazing to see how much the very people he impoverished and tortured held him up as a demigod. Stockholm syndrome on a vast scale? Or maybe it was just that he filled a place in the hearts of Russians that only a Tsar could have held before the revolution.

Russian history is... interesting. In the Chinese curse sense of the word interesting. I'm very grateful that my Great Grandfather had the sense and dedication to get the hell out of Russia before WWI, and bring his family over as fast as he could, one or two people at a time. He's my favorite relative, and I never met him!

Jackson is right up their with Chimpy with all time worst Presidents. Trail of Tears, ignoring SCOTUS rulings, single handingly destroying the economy of the time...he belongs on a list of those roasting in hell.

president who, if a fascist or conservative was in office at the time, America would have been dramatically different. As for the Trail of Tears, it's highly unlikely their fate would have been any different, whether a conservative or liberal been in office.

so much as he let the Bank of the United States charter expire (after a bitter feud with Nicolas Biddle). Then he encouraged the proliferation of "wildcat banks", which were fly-by-night operations out in the boonies that would set up shop then high-tail it out of town once they had suckered depositors out of their money. Or, these banks would demand gold or silver in deposits, and pay out their own paper money which was not worth the paper it was printed on. Jackson also demanded payment for government loans (which he had encouraged) in specie (gold and silver), often from the same people who had been fleeced by the wildcat banks. These irresponsible actions led to the Panic of 1837, which occurred just after Jackson was safely out of office.

As for the Trail of Tears, Jackson defied a Supreme Court order by forcing the Cherokees out of Georgia (where gold had been discovered). I doubt another president at the time would have done that.

Jackson is also the one who started the "spoils system", where he would dole out offices and contracts to his cronies.

In short, as another poster alluded, he was a 19th century Duhbya.

Wow.. Lots of Democrats are to rave about. I voted George McGovern. His efforts at hunger, the war. This is a difficult question.
From Michigan.. Sen. Philip Hart, Adlai Stevenson was the leader who effected my interest in liberal ideals. How could you not include Eleanor Roosevelt. Her work establishing the United Nations and the ADA. Walter Reuther was a Democrat and reformer.
I am smitten by reformers who do not go along and demand change that improves upon our democracy. If only Ralph Nader would work from within the Democratic party and demand change, he would be a favorite.
Female Democrats we admire- Bella Abzug. Your poll is much too lacking to include all of the Democratic history that need be remembered.

beyond a doubt.

No Not Truman but FDR himself and Truman I too wish old FDR had lived to see that VE and VJ day. I admire that man so much. I admire all these guys so much. FDR has my heart the biggest though.

what a stupid thread this turned into.

How do people like Lincoln and TR even get mentioned in here? Do you people not read the thread title? It very clearly says Democrat - big D. Not Republican.


Most of the arguing is over "importance" rather than "favorite, which is alos part of the thread title.

FDR has an unfair advantage over all other Presidents, as he held office the longest, and so had the most time in which to shape the nation.

However, the question was favorite - not most important. So, I chose carter - I don't think he was the best, or most important, in terms of effect on the nation. He is my favorite based on his ability to live his beliefs. For four years, he was head of the most powerful nation in the world. When his term was up, he walked away, and has done very impressive service for the PEOPLE of this country (and the world) ever since.

The guy builds houses for poor people...got my vote

BUT if not him, then Andrew Jackson...can't have a Jacksonian Revolution without one

I have a soft spot in my heart for George McGovern; I wasn't even born whenever he ran for President, but I've read about what he fought for back then and am still glad to see him standing up for his principles to this day. I feel similarly about Carter; he may have left office an unpopular man, but he's possibly the most moral, good guy we've had as President.

And yeah, FDR is great... goes w/o saying. Perhaps he is really my favorite, but I like helping out the underdogs I guess. I will say, FWIW, I also think LBJ deserves more credit than he gets. I know it may seem weird for me to love McGovern but defend LBJ at the same time, but I just feel Johnson did a lot of great things for this country domestically, and I really think Vietnam broke his heart. Certainly the extent he pushed American involvement over there can be considered to be a mistake, but I don't believe it was at all the sort of crass, politically-calculated "war" we've experienced under *.

And I should also add William Jennings Bryan... one of the most fascinating figures in American politics of all time. I'm doing my (twenty page miniumum) major research paper in my Historical Research class this semester on his role in the Scopes trial, so I'm certain I'll be finding out much more about him very soon!

He's the greatest. Period.

hence my DU name. But I voted for FDR!