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Mz Pip Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 06:06 PM
Original message
Push polling againt Clark

"Allegations of "push polling" against Clark surface in NH."

http://www.politicsnh.com/archives/pindell/2003/september/10_8pp.shtml

So it begins. What seemed to work so well for Dubya against McCain is being against Clark. I don't know who is doing this. It could be a rival Dem; it could be the GOP trying to make the Dems look bad. It could be anybody, but it stinks. It's no wonder people get turned off to politics when the water gets poisoned like this.

I hope someone uncovers the source of this.

MzPip
:dem:
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 06:12 PM
Response to Original message
1. If A Dem's Fingerprints Are On This That's Bad News .....
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CarlBallard Donating Member (512 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Well yes
But it's a sloppy push poll that's getting out into the media. It looks like Rove to me, but obviously I don't know. Having candidate A who looks like Dean makes it look like they are trying to discredit both Dean and Clark. I wouldn't think that Dean would conduct this poll if for no other reason than he's got a sizable lead in NH at the moment and his biggest rival there is Kerry not Clark. But yeah no matter what it stinks, and it stinks even more if it's a Dem.
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Mz Pip Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 06:23 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. I don't want to believe Dean
would personally be behind this. What would he have to gain unless his internal polling is different from what's out there? Maybe some staffer. Still it would be a very dumb move.

MzPip
:dem:
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Dean did it against Gephardt, Edwards and Kerry in Iowa.
Edited on Mon Oct-13-03 06:37 PM by blm
Why would he make an exception for Clark?


"First phone attack

Straight-talking Democratic presidential candidate Howard Dean is testing his attack message in Iowa. Political operatives say Dean's phone polling is probing for weaknesses in support for Sens. John Edwards and John Kerry and Rep. Dick Gephardt. For rookie pol Edwards, it's about experience. For Gephardt, it's his alliance with Bush on key issues. Questions about Kerry test Iowans' reaction to his vote backing the war in Iraq."

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/issue/archive/030512/12whisplead.php
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CarlBallard Donating Member (512 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. That isn't push polling
I don't think we should be going negative so I don't like the fact that he was trying to find the most effective way to do it. But it wasn't an annonimous firm, and it was information gathering, "testing his attack message" rather than attempting to put facts into the voter's minds.

Also since the article you linked to would make me pay, I can only assume that the quote was taken in context or even at all.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. It's been archived, but the quote is accurate.
Another poster here bought it and put it up a few months ago. Many of us remembered it from when the story first broke.

Push polling isn't necessarily anonymous. The point of push polling is to reinforce a negative perception of your opponent while conducting a poll.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. Sounds gross to me...
no matter what it is....

Sometimes I wonder if any of them deserve
to win.
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hedda_foil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. Thanks, Carl. blm knows it isn't push polling.
She's been refuted on it endlessly, since she has posted the same thing at least 20 times in the past several months. Apparently she couldn't resist the chance to post it again in the hope that it would fool a few Clark supporters who hadn't been around the merry-go-round with her on this before.
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CarlBallard Donating Member (512 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 06:39 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Me either
I mean it strikes me as odd that Clark is being push polled in a state where he's running significantly behind, and doesn't seem to be trying to make serious inroads (as he is in AZ and SC). That's what makes it seem like a Republican trick from just having read the article. At the least, when Republicans get caught push polling Dean or Clark, or Kerry or whoever wins the nomination, they can point to this and say all sides do it.
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RandomUser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. I don't know
who's behind this. But in the expectations game, it seems that if Clark finishes in the top 3 in NH, it will be considered an extremely good showing. So even if Clark is not leading in NH, his rivals have an incentive to keep him from finishing in the top 3.
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wyldwolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 06:13 PM
Response to Original message
2. Either way - they fear Clark...
whether it be a dem or a rethug.
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RandomUser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #2
19. yep, only thing we're sure about
even if we never find out who did this. They've at least proven this much.
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kiahzero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 06:13 PM
Response to Original message
3. But... but..
I thought it was Clark that was running a negative campaign?
:eyes:

That's really sleazy.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 06:21 PM
Response to Original message
5. With Caller I D
why would it be hard to find the source of a push poll?
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Julien Sorel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Calling from a lot of phone systems would block caller ID.
My company's phone system blocks caller ID from working, for example; you just get a message saying 'Unable to retrieve phone number' or something like that.
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ithacan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 08:26 PM
Response to Original message
11. sounds like Young Republicans to me...
they learn their lessons from the Rove master well and are preprogrammed...
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devinsgram Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. Absolutely repugs,
they must be afraid as hell. Bush's brain must really be frightened. Couldn't win an honest fight if he tried.
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RandomUser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. I hope so
I'd hate to find out that a rival Dem did this. But I doubt we'll ever find out. Anyone who's underhanded enough to do this, whether Rove or Dem, would definitely not step forward. And they'll be almost impossible to track down. The only thing we can tell from this is that someone is VERY afraid of Clark.
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jburton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 09:47 PM
Response to Original message
18. You can find out in a few days
FEC reports due Wednesday...

...should be online a few days afterwards.

Just "follow the money"
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DoveTurnedHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-13-03 11:41 PM
Response to Original message
20. This Is Bullshit. I Hope It's Bush. But If We Discover It's Dean...
...how would Dean supporters feel about that? I'm honestly curious.

DTH
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